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Where are all the Remote Projects
Old 15th April 2013
  #1
Gear Head
 

Where are all the Remote Projects

Hey Guys,

What has happened to all of the remote truck projects? Its gone real quiet since the beginning of the year. Everyone given up?

Cmon get those pictures on here.

Steve
Steve Barrett-WHite
CanburySound.com
Old 16th April 2013
  #2
Gear Head
 

Guess the silence says it all
Old 17th April 2013
  #3
Lives for gear
 
Roland's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundhunter View Post
Hey Guys,

What has happened to all of the remote truck projects? Its gone real quiet since the beginning of the year. Everyone given up?

Cmon get those pictures on here.

Steve
Steve Barrett-WHite
CanburySound.com
Running a remote truck is an expensive business at this time. With rules on driver hours, staff hours, tighter project budgets, etc. There are a few, but they are dealing mostly with top level productions where there are thousands of pounds in production costs and the recording trucks fee is a very small drop in the overall budget. Also when you factor in that the truck is unlikely to be in use on a regular basis this also puts up the costs. Most of the trucks that I know of are mostly tied into broadcast and video, for location recording, flypack systems and the sort of hybrid system Steve Remote is doing are the main thing these days, even these can cost the best part of £1,000 a day if they have travelling and two staff involved.
Old 7th July 2013
  #4
Super Moderator
 
Remoteness's Avatar
reading this thread made me think of this old thread from 2004...

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/remot...-business.html

167 or so posts. It's a must read if you haven't read it yet!
Old 9th July 2013
  #5
There were one or two remote trucks active in Cleveland mostly catering to rock and roll clients that were doing shows in clubs and wanted them recorded. I don't know what has happened to them but I think the same thing is going on here as elsewhere. The DIY craze has hit big time and many people don't have the money to get things recorded by professionals since they are not making any money as musicians.

Back in the 80's I wanted to get a remote truck, outfit it right and get on the road and make some money. I kept looking a what I wanted in a truck and equipment and made numerous trips to truck dealers, RV dealers and equipment suppliers. After all this work I did a profit and loss sheet and decided that a truck was NOT in my future. Boy am I glad I make that decision.

One of my good friends had a very nicely outfitted remote van. I used it on numerous occasions to provide remote recording for bands and orchestras and provide feeds for radio stations. It was fun while I was doing it. I talked to my friend the other day and he told me that he had to sell off the van since it was parked more that it was on the road and was a large liability. Too bad!

I was at a concert recently and noticed that there was a JoeCo recorder sitting in the rack next to the FOH console. I went up at intermission and talked to the engineer. He said that they record every show and take the direct outputs of the console directly to the JoeCo recorder. That way if they get something good they can "work on it" later in the studio. I guess this maybe the wave of the future. I understand that some of the newer breeds of FOH consoles have build in digital recorders so they can do the recording while they mix the concert. This too maybe the next wave.

All I can hope is that all the remote trucks don't go out of business sometime soon. It would be the end of a very good era and one I was proud to work in for a while.

Best of luck!
Old 10th July 2013
  #6
Gear Addict
 
Bibster's Avatar
 

Thomas,

Don't we all agree that reinforcing a band, and recoding a band require different approaches and techniques? Hence, the remote trucks will keep on existing.

On the other hand, I think the joeCo's etc. are sort of the same thing as the shavers: they'll not replace a *real* recordist.
(But they do make quite a dent in some people's bread-earning!)

P.
Old 10th July 2013
  #7
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Roland's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bibster View Post
Thomas,

Don't we all agree that reinforcing a band, and recoding a band require different approaches and techniques? Hence, the remote trucks will keep on existing.

On the other hand, I think the joeCo's etc. are sort of the same thing as the shavers: they'll not replace a *real* recordist.
(But they do make quite a dent in some people's bread-earning!)

P.
Not really.

Outside of live broadcast situations, as long as levels are kept sensible (not difficult with the quality of digital kit these days), if a few audience microphones are also put up there really isn't any difference. Certainly with things like Venue, the signal is extracted pre processing and gives almost, unlimited post production options. It's rare that double miking is used for recording purposes and I think it was Huub that mentioned often, even when a broadcast truck is involved, the mix can be just the FOH mix with added ambience and commentators microphones direct to the broadcast truck.

The improvements in kit means that a FOH mix can be very sophisticated these days and with boxes like the JoCo and other dedicated virtual soundcheck systems, it eradicates the issues we commonly faced 20-30 years ago.

The fact that there are fewer trucks around these days and that those that do survive are much more geared to broadcast, unfortunately, proves this point.

That being said, I don't think that we will see a situation where live sound recording will not sometimes still need a mobile truck, but the cost and ergonomics will mean that only large scale budget productions will need this.

As an aside, it should also be looked at how many organisations like the Royal Opera House, Marinsky Theatre, Berlin Philharmonic, etc, now have purpose built in-house systems, traditionally there broadcasts would have been covered by trucks, not now.
Old 10th July 2013
  #8
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Bibster's Avatar
 

Point taken, Roland. But I was not targeting that high end, but rather the lowish end, R'nR, clubs etc.
(Which I should've stated.)
Old 10th July 2013
  #9
I did Cleveland Opera for years dragging all my equipment into the venue, setting up a nice little control room (or in the beginning recording the opera from the balcony with headphones on for monitoring) and then I started to work with a radio station and was able to use their truck. Very nice. I did not have to drag in my equipment, the radio station had some very good equipment including a good audio console and a good monitoring setup that was always the same AND I got two radio students to help with the setup. The setup time was reduced and I was able to get some very good recordings. Then the opera stopped doing recordings due to budgetary problems and the radio station's remote truck stopped running and they abandoned the idea of having a remote truck altogether.

I need for "audio only" trucks is also going down in usage since a lot of the record companies that use to foot the bill for live recordings no longer have the money for such operations.

I also think that a lot of video production trucks are now doing double duty by recording both the audio and the video in one truck negating the need for a separate, audio only, truck. Some of the video trucks I have been in recently have very nice 5.1 monitoring setups, good audio boards, a nice selection of outboard equipment and some very music savvy engineers. Maybe this is the future of on location recording.

IMHO the need for on location remote audio trucks will probably always exist but the "golden age" of those trucks has long since passed.
Old 10th July 2013
  #10
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huub's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe View Post

I also think that a lot of video production trucks are now doing double duty by recording both the audio and the video in one truck negating the need for a separate, audio only, truck. Some of the video trucks I have been in recently have very nice 5.1 monitoring setups, good audio boards, a nice selection of outboard equipment and some very music savvy engineers. Maybe this is the future of on location recording.
Yes, this is my business, our equipment is generally nicer than a lot of audio only trucks.
Old 10th July 2013
  #11
Super Moderator
 
Remoteness's Avatar
It's true, many video trucks, especially entertainment production trucks have seriously awesome audio departments that (sorry to say) do not help the cause and affect of stand alone audio trucks.

NEP Denali and AMV in the States have proven that.
Great gear and an even better crew makes it happen on many production ventures, but some producers still understand the dynamic of having an autonomous audio department.

That said, I have worked on NEP Denali Silver and that's a great truck with an outstanding audio department! They knew exactly how to handle my needs. And, their attention to detail made me feel right at home!

Quote:
Originally Posted by huub View Post
Yes, this is my business, our equipment is generally nicer than a lot of audio only trucks.
Old 10th July 2013
  #12
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huub's Avatar
It's obviously better to have a dedicated truck, it's just way nicer to concentrate on audio quality only, no compromise, in a quiet environment, but this is just the way the business is heading I think.
Old 10th July 2013
  #13
Super Moderator
 
Remoteness's Avatar
I'm afraid so, huub.

Quote:
Originally Posted by huub View Post
It's obviously better to have a dedicated truck, it's just way nicer to concentrate on audio quality only, no compromise, in a quiet environment, but this is just the way the business is heading I think.
Old 11th July 2013
  #14
Gear Addict
 
RMJAZZ's Avatar
 

Where are all the remote projects???

Well- I see a ton more live records/cd's/downloads etc...being released than ever before. Maybe it's just me, but I think the work is there...folks are just getting into all the new tech that's enabled live sound guys and gals to track live shows from FOH (Avid/Midas-Klark/SSL Live)....There are a ton of bands that are recording every show they do. So the recording IS taking place, its just changing in how it is implemented.


The key for us is to figure out how we fit into this new paradigm.

1. Why should they hire you (or me)? What is the true benefit? can you make life easier on your client in some way?

2. Is your gear really better than tracking off one of the new digital consoles? Or did you skimp on pre amps because at the time you thought they weren't that important? How is your split? Can you interface with video easily?

3. Is your skill level something desirable to potential clients?


The work is there...but I am seeing none of the middle of the road gigs, it's either real high end serious input and integration stuff or really low end "record my band for a couple hundred bucks" type of stuff.

So maybe it doesn't make sense to build a new truck right now.

Not a sermon, just a thought...
Old 11th July 2013
  #15
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Roland's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMJAZZ View Post
Well- I see a ton more live records/cd's/downloads etc...being released than ever before. Maybe it's just me, but I think the work is there...folks are just getting into all the new tech that's enabled live sound guys and gals to track live shows from FOH (Avid/Midas-Klark/SSL Live)....There are a ton of bands that are recording every show they do. So the recording IS taking place, its just changing in how it is implemented.


The key for us is to figure out how we fit into this new paradigm.

1. Why should they hire you (or me)? What is the true benefit? can you make life easier on your client in some way?

2. Is your gear really better than tracking off one of the new digital consoles? Or did you skimp on pre amps because at the time you thought they weren't that important? How is your split? Can you interface with video easily?

3. Is your skill level something desirable to potential clients?


The work is there...but I am seeing none of the middle of the road gigs, it's either real high end serious input and integration stuff or really low end "record my band for a couple hundred bucks" type of stuff.

not a sermon, just a thought...
That there are plenty of recordings being done, isn't necessarily being disputed, however, many of these are not generating income directly, i.e. the tracks are given away, used as promo, or broadcast. The general rule of thumb, is that if it doesn't directly make money, it has to be either free, or low cost. A recording done front of house on Pro Tools, JoCo, Nuendo, etc, is likely to sound pretty good technically and the idea that using 30 boutique mic amps on a split, is going to make an appreciable difference is mistaken. From a hiring point of view, logistics and cost are going to be a far bigger factor in the decision to pay you than anything else. The fact that the FOH engineer can run one of these systems with little extra effort makes the additional labour cost unjustifiable, let alone factoring the cost of the equipment hire and transport.

On a similar thread a while back I offered up some quick sums as to the cost of running a truck for an event, things like drivers, fuel, depreciation of the kit, engineering staff and even a fairly modest set-up could easily run £1,000 + a day in costs, even more for a full artic rig with drivers to cover the hours, engineer, assistants, fuel, accommodation, etc.

Fly-pack rigs, that are far more common these days are still not a low cost option, certainly not if they are using quality kit. The virtual soundcheck system is by and large a NO COST option. You can record every show, cherry pick the best stuff and even if you give it away you are not out of pocket.

All this means in real terms, the work for location recording pretty much comes down to a commercial project with an income at the end, i.e. live DVD or CD. Projects where the tour is not carrying it's own recording system. Broadcast, where things need to be monitored separately to the FOH sound or are going out live.
Old 13th July 2013
  #16
I did a live radio show for a year. It was broadcast live, recorded in two track and multi-track for re-broadcast and video taped. I also did the house sound. I did all the audio for a while and then hired someone else to do the house sound. It can be done but it is not easy. Trust me.
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