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Song playback different in the club Drum Machines & Samplers
Old 24th December 2010
  #1
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Song playback different in the club

Hello,

I'm a DJ/producer. Mainly into house dubstep and other electronic based music. Getting to the point.

Been producing for quite sometime. Trying to get ahold of mastering so I can post these songs.

All my songs sound great on my studio monitors, iPod speaker, computer speakers, in the car etc everywhere i check them out they say sound well. However when I play them in the club. The low end hits a tab bit too hard and the mid high and highs are a bit muffled. Like the sound you would get if you boosted a low level input and through a high output. All my levels look well on my production programs and on my DJ program (serato) looking for tips in the final mastering phase. Let me know if it would help to post up the song.
Old 24th December 2010
  #2
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misjah's Avatar
 

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typical problem with nearfield or headphone mixes...usually easy to solve during mastering session if you have the equipment, room and knowledge
Old 24th December 2010
  #3
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acorneau's Avatar
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by misjah View Post
typical problem with nearfield or headphone mixes...usually easy to solve during mastering session if you have the equipment, room and knowledge

... or, the club's sound system just sounds like that.
Old 24th December 2010
  #4
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Jean Doe's Avatar
 

Tracks with too much limiting can often sound muffled on big systems. If you play out regularly you should have a couple of tracks of which you know that they work really well on a variety of systems. Use those for ABing your tracks in the studio and get inspired by their frequency balance and dynamics. Before you know it you won't need ABing and this will all become 2nd nature...


Some random thoughts on too much bass on big systems:
Things like low end sine waves without harmonics can be a typical problem. You'll often not hear them clearly in a badly treated home studio but they will often take up space and will be very noticeable in clubs. That's one of the reasons to add harmonics where applicable.
Bad seperation between low mids and bass is a very common problem too, which can cause dissonance in the lows that can sound boomy and uncontrolled on big systems.


The best you can do is to optimize your studio acoustics so that you can hear the low end clearly (minimize peaks and dips) and get a pair of speakers that extend low enough (or a good subwoofer). And of course, keep playing out and fine tuning your mixes subsequently...
Old 24th December 2010
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acorneau View Post
... or, the club's sound system just sounds like that.
i assumed he tested in in more than 1 club with same result in each club...
Old 24th December 2010
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by misjah View Post
i assumed he tested it in more than 1 club with same result in each club...
..or against commercial release's in the same club. I think as said it comes down to having a full range system and knowing how to judge the frequency balance.
Old 24th December 2010
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Waltz Mastering View Post
..or against commercial release's in the same club. I think as said it comes down to having a full range system and knowing how to judge the frequency balance.

most likely yes...
Old 24th December 2010
  #8
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JTransition's Avatar
 

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Jack of all trades

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bevrlykills View Post
Hello,

I'm a DJ/producer. Mainly into house dubstep and other electronic based music. Getting to the point.

Been producing for quite sometime. Trying to get ahold of mastering so I can post these songs.

All my songs sound great on my studio monitors, iPod speaker, computer speakers, in the car etc everywhere i check them out they say sound well. However when I play them in the club. The low end hits a tab bit too hard and the mid high and highs are a bit muffled. Like the sound you would get if you boosted a low level input and through a high output. All my levels look well on my production programs and on my DJ program (serato) looking for tips in the final mastering phase. Let me know if it would help to post up the song.
Simple;
Concentrate on production pay a pro to master your songs and attend the sessions, Form a relationship(non sexual)with the ME and learn from your mistakes.
Enjoy the frustration
Larry
Old 24th December 2010
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat larry View Post
Simple;
Form a relationship(non sexual)with the ME and learn from your mistakes.
Larry
Ah......so THAT's where I've been getting it wrong.......thanks for the tip Larry....you're a gem brozza......
Old 25th December 2010
  #10
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Song playback different in the club

All above is correct. My 808 kick layering was far too loud. And my four kicks that are layered together wasn't tuned right. I made a chord of the kicks now they sound like one. Also used a little more sub harmonics to smooth somethings out.

As far as the mid high and highs sounding muffled maybe I limited them too much. I work again this weekend going to bring my studio laptop and tweak it there after the night is over.

I'll post up the results I get. Hopefully there will be just some minor adjustments. Looking forward to this not being a issue anymore
Old 26th December 2010
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat larry View Post
Form a relationship(non sexual)with the ME and learn from your mistakes.
Enjoy the frustration
Larry
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackthebear View Post
Ah......so THAT's where I've been getting it wrong
Someone was bound to say that. tutt

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bevrlykills View Post
All above is correct. My 808 kick layering was far too loud. And my four kicks that are layered together wasn't tuned right. I made a chord of the kicks now they sound like one. Also used a little more sub harmonics to smooth somethings out.
Mmmh. There's no such thing like too loud of an 808. But it's a matter of taste eventually. I dunno how it is over there, but round here clubs are *very* 50-60Hz heavy and nothing much below. Had an opportunity to mess around with some Ecler 18" subs about to be installed in a club. Played your typical dance track, they'd make the dishes dance in the kitchen sink. Played some hip-hop (more specifically "Make it Rain"), the only think i would hear was air, lots of air escaping each and every imperfection in the box. And that track only hits 48Hz, nothing lower.

Maximum kick, minimum fuss... the spectrum ends at 60Hz for some people, so i don't see how subharmonics would help, since you already said that your 808 kicks were too loud.
Old 26th December 2010
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat larry View Post
Simple;
Concentrate on production pay a pro to master your songs and attend the sessions, Form a relationship(non sexual)with the ME and learn from your mistakes.
Enjoy the frustration
Larry
Has anyone got any audio of sexual relationships between client and ME?

Double blind test?
Old 26th December 2010
  #13
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807Recordings's Avatar
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe_caithness View Post
Has anyone got any audio of sexual relationships between client and ME?

Double blind test?
Plenty but I am held by confidential client relationships j/k



Back to topic at hand:
I use on kick drum and never had problems with club translations.
The kick I use are often from a 909, 808 or more recently 999 Jomox.
Quality in = quality out; good monitors (full-range) need apply.

:-)
Old 29th December 2010
  #14
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leave some headroom

Recording into a digital domain, believe it is better around -18dB and will = 0VU in analog circuitry. Digital clipping doesnt produce any harmonic overtones, just noise. In my experience, having a recording with plenty of headroom before mastering, works out better.
Mastering Engineers arent listening to the song for enjoyment, they are making adjustments based on initial observations. and have a room thats acoustically treated and tuned to their monitors.
They have never heard the song prior to mastering most likely, so at first listen they can pinpoint what its excessive or lacking sonically and make adjustments as they notice the discrepencies in the mix. The limiting or hard compression (10:1 ratio) alone brings out sibilance and can get the crunchy muffled sound if you limit too hard.
A multi-band compressor can help gain control over frequencies that you can group together. if you can share the gain reduction between a limiter and a multiband compressor it tightens up everything a little better ive found in my experience. Also on the limiter, set the output right under 0db at least by -0.5dB
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