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Weiss EQ1 is now a plugin
Old 3 weeks ago
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hippocratic Mastering View Post
I try to be objective in my listening, level-matching to 0.01db LUFS when doing comparisons between processors (and I know LUFS isn't perfect but it's very useful for these kinds of comparisonsa, IMO)...
Not here to argue, but I wonder about the utility of LUFS as a level matching standard in these situations. I’ve always used Peak, and in certain cases with compressors, also RMS as a second match. I understand ”equal loudness” comparison, but to me, LUFS adds frequency dependence to amplitude averaging in a situation where you’d want the objectivity of an exact, instantaneous match.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vze26m98 View Post
Not here to argue, but I wonder about the utility of LUFS as a level matching standard in these situations. I’ve always used Peak, and in certain cases with compressors, also RMS as a second match. I understand ”equal loudness” comparison, but to me, LUFS adds frequency dependence to amplitude averaging in a situation where you’d want the objectivity of an exact, instantaneous match.
I can see the logic of RMS over LUFS, although I would argue that peak has no value at all in comparisons, really.

Personally I think LUFS works best in terms of giving an objective view, although obviously no method is perfect.

To be honest, if the setting are similar I'd expect that two digital processors would return similar readings for both LUFS and RMS anyway.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hippocratic Mastering View Post
For experimenting with FIR, I find impulse length set to 32k and padding to x2 is a good balance between quality and latency. If I use it in FIR mode I typically increase both those to maximum when printing.
Large impulse length does not give you better absolute quality. It's a trade off. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBnnXbOM5S4

Printing with a large window without considering the context, the music, seems very strange to me.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philip View Post
Large impulse length does not give you better absolute quality. It's a trade off. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBnnXbOM5S4

Printing with a large window without considering the context, the music, seems very strange to me.
You are probably right. I did do some tests on this back in the day and I preferred the longer lengths, but I should probaly revisit it at some point.

I should add that I tend to use this EQ pre analogue chain, so I do actually hear the results: this isn't offline rendering.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robb Robinson View Post
Are you suggesting that all IIR EQs sound the same as long as they were programmed with the correct math?
They should I think, right? But the difference comes down to analog phase response, oversampling, cramping towards nyquist, filter shapes. I think anyway.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thermos View Post
They should I think, right? But the difference comes down to analog phase response, oversampling, cramping towards nyquist, filter shapes. I think anyway.
Weiss does sound unique to me the more I use it. It has that frequency 'filling' effect similar to the Sontec which is how I explain its apparent smoothness when boosting, especially up top.

Am I tripping? Do all IIRs sound this smooth up top?

Maybe it is the Weiss bias stemming from simply knowing that Ludwig used it on literally everything. I will do another AB with Equilibrium in IIR mode to be sure.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #67
Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
@ TanTan , I cannot comment on audio digital coding, as that's really not my thing, but this is the most true to the source EQ plugin I ever tried as far as I'm concerned. I don't hear any "flavor" or anything, more like you are moving the elements of the mix almost as if you had some faders in front of you. Amazing to gently rebalance a mix. But for exemple I wouldn't use that eq to do a high shelf boost on a song to add something extra.
Thanks Pand, I'll check it out !

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hippocratic Mastering View Post
I think you're probably right that a lot of it is in the shape of the curves themselves and the proportionality of the Q, as well as how the user interperets these controls. In a field like mastering, though, where first impressions and making quick decisions are everything (assuming I'm not going to get someone loudly admonishing me for suggesting that), those things can make a huge difference.
That's fair, but 500$ difference ?

Wouldn't it be more effective to create templates on Equilibrium which has so many different Curves and provides the deepest control on a digital EQ behaviour on the market ?
Basically, unless I don't understand the basic math behind IIR EQ's, if Dave ever adds the Weiss curves to Equilibrium and your use it on IIR mode you have a 100% Weiss (assuming you already have it)

Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
Now, even when matching the curves by the numbers, this Eq is way more transparent a natural sounding to me than my good old APEQ for exemple. So would it be possible that the sound difference I hear actually comes from a "better" coding of those filters...Meaning am I actually hearing the loss of sound quality in my APEQ, making the Weiss sounds "better" to me ?

Is that possible ?
I don't know the APEQ but yes, theoretically this is possible, or the curve shapes of the Weiss gels better with the way you like to EQ

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robb Robinson View Post
Weiss does sound unique to me the more I use it. It has that frequency 'filling' effect similar to the Sontec which is how I explain its apparent smoothness when boosting, especially up top.

Am I tripping? Do all IIRs sound this smooth up top?

Maybe it is the Weiss bias stemming from simply knowing that Ludwig used it on literally everything. I will do another AB with Equilibrium in IIR mode to be sure.
I use a Sontec MES-432D9 here, I also use Equilibrium, although the Sontec is on the clean side I don't find it to be interchangeable with an Equilibrium,
But my good friend Matt Gray has found a way to make them really close by addressing the delta between L and R on analog gear which certainly has an effect on the music and the stereo field when using an analog EQ.

For me the MES-432 has the perfect balance between musicality and precision, This is my favourite mastering EQ, it surely has a tone I don't get by just using an IIR filter though.

I hear you regarding Ludwig and most 90's and 00's mastering heroes, I respect the legacy and understand it comes with a price, but IMO the price tag here is a bit strange in the context of what this EQ does.

I consider buying it for the dynamic section where I'm not a 100% satisfied with what I use:
- Pro-Q3 has the best GUI and some great options but the dynamic section doesn't have attack, release or ratio control, it's a kind of a "trust me I know what I'm doing" dynamic section

- iZotope Dyn EQ, one of my favourite brands, their new stuff is simply brilliant (especially low end focus and Mastering Re-Balance) the dyn EQ sounds great and has more control but you can't see all the filters at once but only one at a time (aka Pro-Q3) so it's a bit slow to work on although the sound is there and so is the control

The EQ1 has all the bands on the screen and has all the control needed so I'd probably enjoy using it it if I had it
Old 3 weeks ago
  #68
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$500 sounds like a lot but it really isn’t, seen over the lifetime of a full-time mastering business. You’re maybe right re: an Equilibrium preset but the Weiss does have the advantage of being able to immediately make a previously static band dynamic, which is a really useful function from time to time.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #69
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I should add that if I could only use one EQ plugin it would definitely be Equilibrium. Just that I’m open to trying other stuff as well, and on this occasion I do hear something interesting (for whatever reason).
Old 3 weeks ago
  #70
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I like it and went ahead and sprung for it. The discount really helped with that decision....
Old 3 weeks ago
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OTRM View Post
I like it and went ahead and sprung for it.
The discount really helped with that decision....
Hey Jeff, I feel like i’ll definitely buy it soon,

whenever my schedule looooooosens up a bit so i have time to focus on it.

Maybe you can give me some tips on your favorite settings!

They had me at “Weiss”.

Cheers, JT
Old 3 weeks ago
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TanTan View Post
Thanks Pand, I'll check it out !

- iZotope Dyn EQ, one of my favourite brands, their new stuff is simply brilliant (especially low end focus and Mastering Re-Balance) the dyn EQ sounds great and has more control but you can't see all the filters at once but only one at a time (aka Pro-Q3) so it's a bit slow to work on although the sound is there and so is the control
I was under the impression there wasa button you can press to reveal all bands at once - will check.

Overall i know what you mean, but there is the Sonnox, also the Melda which is VASTLY underrated. Nova from Tokyo dawn labs also great.

I think Izotope is def a company that doesn't get enough praise for its EQ's, which are brilliant. I have to agree with others though, Equilibrium is king. I still haven't found an EQ that can sound as good as that thing. Add to that it is far and away the most configurable.

Once you get to know the different modes and how they work, you really can choose the right mode for each application.
For example, the earlier post about setting impulse length to 32k is totally erroneous. That is not always preferable at all. With any eq type, no matter what, there are benefits and weaknesses. Some cause phase shift, some cause temporal smear, etc etc etc.

I use a different EQ type on my channels (IIR with varying compensation)
Different type on my drum buss (generally FIR 4k impulse length and in 'Analog Zero Latency' mode
Using Equilibrium has taught e a hell of a lot about EQ and it has made me get rid of so many others.

That said, i am always open to different processors if they offer me something irresistible. I recently got the SSL X-EQ because the sound is incredible, it is fantastic to automate and is zero latency, all while being insanely low on CPU - so this is a great channel EQ for me.

I could concieve of buying something fancy for the 2buss/mastering and will prob try this later tonight....but 480 on something that is 'clean' and modelled after 90s hardware....
I just can't help but think Equilibrium is still going to be king for me, with the Sonnox being king of dynamic (also has brilliant GUI)

Will monitor this thread to see how others are getting on, seems im not the only one that feels like this.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Carlyon View Post

I could concieve of buying something fancy for the 2buss/mastering and will prob try this later tonight....but 480 on something that is 'clean' and modelled after 90s hardware....
I just can't help but think Equilibrium is still going to be king for me, with the Sonnox being king of dynamic (also has brilliant GUI)

Will monitor this thread to see how others are getting on, seems im not the only one that feels like this.
I think this is exactly what are thinking a LOT of people almost "bashing" this Eq on the "new product alert" post for the EQ1 (I'm not saying YOU are bashing it of course, I'm quoting your post but please don't take it for you). People are basically shocked by the price tag. That's the main reason.
Almost ALL of the plugins right now are modeled after "old" analog gears, isn't it ? So, what's wrong with the 90's lol ?
Some of the best hardware in their respective domain were created in this area : Weiss, AMS Neve, Lexicon, TC Electronics, the very mixing console made by Sony wich the Dynamic Eq you mentionned and all the Sonnox series is derived from.
Even Eq plugins that aren't modeled after anything often propose curves wich are directly inspired by the like of Pultec, Api etc.
And unfortunately most of those "emulation" plugins are basically pretty interfaces that often sound miles away from they hardware counterparts.
And that's why they are priced around 200 bucks for the most part, and litterally going down to a few 30 bucks when "on sale".
Here the devellopers, Softube in partnership with Daniel Weiss himself, are showing you that this plugins NULLS with the hardware. That's the first thing they show on the trailer. A hardware piece that cost close to 7000€ all option included, and wich must figure on at least 50% of all the Albums we have listened to.
Again, don't take it personnaly David, but that's what I would like all the "bashers" to hear. That if 480€ is too much for their wallet, then it's perfectly understandable, but don't bash an amazing product because it is priced what it should be, or because it is modeled after an "old" unit, when 80% of todays plugins are.
That was my grumpy morning coffee post
Old 3 weeks ago
  #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
I think this is exactly what are thinking a LOT of people almost "bashing" this Eq on the "new product alert" post for the EQ1 (I'm not saying YOU are bashing it of course, I'm quoting your post but please don't take it for you). People are basically shocked by the price tag. That's the main reason.
Almost ALL of the plugins right now are modeled after "old" analog gears, isn't it ? So, what's wrong with the 90's lol ?
Some of the best hardware in their respective domain were created in this area : Weiss, AMS Neve, Lexicon, TC Electronics, the very mixing console made by Sony wich the Dynamic Eq you mentionned and all the Sonnox series is derived from.
Even Eq plugins that aren't modeled after anything often propose curves wich are directly inspired by the like of Pultec, Api etc.
And unfortunately most of those "emulation" plugins are basically pretty interfaces that often sound miles away from they hardware counterparts.
And that's why they are priced around 200 bucks for the most part, and litterally going down to a few 30 bucks when "on sale".
Here the devellopers, Softube in partnership with Daniel Weiss himself, are showing you that this plugins NULLS with the hardware. That's the first thing they show on the trailer. A hardware piece that cost close to 7000€ all option included, and wich must figure on at least 50% of all the Albums we have listened to.
Again, don't take it personnaly David, but that's what I would like all the "bashers" to hear. That if 480€ is too much for their wallet, then it's perfectly understandable, but don't bash an amazing product because it is priced what it should be, or because it is modeled after an "old" unit, when 80% of todays plugins are.
That was my grumpy morning coffee post
this!

it's indeed ill-adversed if not misguided to think of a plugin being too expensive only 'cause it isn't dirt cheap! - i assume those folks don't remember or haven't ever bothered about prices of hardware counterparts?!

i feel lucky i got to buy the weiss hardware eq and comp/lim maybe 20 years ago from a studio which went out of business - it's clearly amongst the best investments i ever did and i have no reason to believe that the gear will stop to serve me very well for years to come; i like it as much that i'm even schlepping it to live gigs!

btw, the touch sensitive knobs were revolutionary at the time: no more switching between windows/screens via cursors (except for basic settings), watching the (somewhat smallish) display became obsolete. not getting distracted by the surface/hardware/interface, just focus on the sound - brilliant!
Old 3 weeks ago
  #75
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Carlyon View Post
I think Izotope is def a company that doesn't get enough praise for its EQ's, which are brilliant. I have to agree with others though, Equilibrium is king. I still haven't found an EQ that can sound as good as that thing. Add to that it is far and away the most configurable.
I couldn't agree more David !

Sometimes It's funny how these things works..
I have full respect for heritage but if we're talking about modern high quality innovative codes, iZotope are the ones to beat !

Ever since the Low End Focus plugin has been released I've only used my GML 9500 analog EQ once or twice.. the Master Rebalance plugin has almost eliminated the need for parallel compression (if the goal is make the beat punchier), it's almost ridiculous how good and efficient this thing is, iZotope is an amazing company and they did some of the best codes around.

I agree Equilibrium is the king of digital EQ's
It allows such a deep under the hood control over the EQ behaviour that I think I don't really need any other digital EQ.

I for one don't understand the LP concept, it sounds kind of MP3'ish to me.

I thought the Weiss would be a good contender for Dyn EQ but I'm not so sure about it anymore because of the frequency steps in the EQ, I'll try to test the Sonnox soon !
Old 3 weeks ago
  #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hippocratic Mastering View Post
$500 sounds like a lot but it really isn’t, seen over the lifetime of a full-time mastering business. ...
usually, plugins don't work a whole "lifetime".
who knows where softube is next year or in two years.(?)
Old 3 weeks ago
  #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the fxs View Post
usually, plugins don't work a whole "lifetime".
who knows where softube is next year or in two years.(?)
A fair point, though I struggle to think of any plugins I have had to abandon due to lack of updates, and I've been mastering for about a decade.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #78
Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
Almost ALL of the plugins right now are modeled after "old" analog gears, isn't it ?
Not the main plugins I use for mastering, like:
Equilibrium, Limitless, Pro L2, DynOne3, Low End Focus, Master Rebalance etc.

We could only dream about being able to manipulate music so transparently and efficient without leaving a sour aftertaste on it in the 90's.
Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
Again, don't take it personnaly David, but that's what I would like all the "bashers" to hear. That if 480€ is too much for their wallet, then it's perfectly understandable, but don't bash an amazing product because it is priced what it should be
Well, I have some studio gear that has a higher price tag than a 480€, that still doesn't mean this product is priced right.

480€ for a plugin that would give me more options like DynOne3, Low End Focus, Master Rebalance, Equilibrium is fair !

But paying this money to buy something I can already achieve with other tools I have for the last 10 years is not necessarily worth it even if I have the budget.

Good modern IIR filters are good modern IIR filters mate so paying 480€ for a set of slightly different curve shapes and a nice white GUI is a lot of money actually.. it's expensive mainly because of the Weiss brand and its fancy heritage which I totally respect.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TanTan View Post
Not the main plugins I use for mastering, like:
Equilibrium, Limitless, Pro L2, DynOne3, Low End Focus, Master Rebalance etc.
Pro L2 is based on the same principle than the Waves L2 brickwall limiter wich is a hardware unit released in the late 90's (harware version of the L1, and then became a plugin as the "L2" aswell). Equilibrium employs some curves inspired by the like of Api, Pultec etc (that's the one I was refering about in my previous post) and DynOne3 (although not a direct emulation) is inspired by the JUNGER D01 and the Dolby 740 processors wich are both Hardware from the 90's.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TanTan View Post
We could only dream about being able to manipulate music so transparently and efficient without leaving a sour aftertaste on it in the 90's.
Exactly, and with the Weiss Gambit EQ1, you could. Wich, amongs other reasons (devellopment, prices of the components like shark processors etc), justified of it's price tag.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TanTan View Post
Well, I have some studio gear that has a higher price tag than a 480€, that still doesn't mean this product is priced right.

480€ for a plugin that would give me more options like DynOne3, Low End Focus, Master Rebalance, Equilibrium is fair !

But paying this money to buy something I can already achieve with other tools I have for the last 10 years is not necessarily worth it even if I have the budget.

Good modern IIR filters are good modern IIR filters mate so paying 480€ for a set of slightly different curve shapes and a nice white GUI is a lot of money actually.. it's expensive mainly because of the Weiss brand and its fancy heritage which I totally respect.
And here I completely disagree. Wich plugin (eq) do you own from the last 10 years that can give you the Weiss Eq1 transparency ??
I'm sorry but there isn't.
Or everybody here would know about this if it was the case.
Even the Algorithmix RED and Orange were very ,very good, (1000€ plugins) but still not as transparent as the weiss.
And last but not least I also disagree when you say it is priced too high, at 480€ because of the brand. If it was priced because of the "name" only, without taking the other plugins prices into consideration, it would be priced double "mate", and still worth it. Look at the Weiss line of gears, it is some of the finest digital harware ever made, by one the most talented coder that we have in Audio today. 480€ is cheap if you consider that.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hippocratic Mastering View Post
A fair point, though I struggle to think of any plugins I have had to abandon due to lack of updates, and I've been mastering for about a decade.
interesting.
are there any plugins in your arsenal that are 10 years old (or close) by now?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the fxs View Post
interesting.
are there any plugins in your arsenal that are 10 years old (or close) by now?
Probably not any that I use regularly. I still use Waves L2 very, very occasionally and that is much older than 10 years.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
Pro L2 is based on the same principle than the Waves L2 brickwall limiter wich is a hardware unit released in the late 90's (harware version of the L1, and then became a plugin as the "L2" aswell). Equilibrium employs some curves inspired by the like of Api, Pultec etc (that's the one I was refering about in my previous post) and DynOne3 (although not a direct emulation) is inspired by the JUNGER D01 and the Dolby 740 processors wich are both Hardware from the 90's. (...)
glad you're mentioning these: in fact, these are (almost) exactly the pieces of gear i'm using (for stereo mastering):

weiss eq1
weiss ds1
waves maxx bcl
jünger accent 01

(plus drawmer 2476, tc finalizer 96, quantec 2496, lake lm44, cranesong hedd192, studer vista, wavelab).

maybe worth noting that mr weiss himself never made a big fuzz about his eq; all he mentioned was something along the lines that the eq was properly designed (can't find the quote).

i'm really wondering why some folks are after the latest and seemingly greatest but cheapest stuff: physics haven't changed since the 90's... - the only thing i'm missing is a multichannel, multidynamics hardware device for 5.1 (and beyond); maybe i should ring daniel up?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #83
Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
Pro L2 is based on the same principle than the Waves L2 brickwall limiter wich is a hardware unit released in the late 90's (harware version of the L1, and then became a plugin as the "L2" aswell). Equilibrium employs some curves inspired by the like of Api, Pultec etc (that's the one I was refering about in my previous post) and DynOne3 (although not a direct emulation) is inspired by the JUNGER D01 and the Dolby 740 processors wich are both Hardware from the 90's.
Sorry but that's almost funny, I used to have the L2 box back in the day and it's nothing like the FF by any mean,
Very different code and way of operating, certainly not like comparing two digital IIR filters.

API's and Pultecs are analog EQ's. I have a 5500 and a pair of EQM-1S3's.
Equilibrium is a controllable digital EQ using IIR and FIR filters, very different implementation,
only the curves are similar, not the guts, not the tone.

DynOne3 is inspired by the TC6000, I still have my Juenger Accent 1 (although it's in storage now), they work on some very different principles, DynOne is multiband, Juenger upward compression is broadband, DynOne3 allows amazing control and options while the Juenger is very simple and straight forward.

Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
Exactly, and with the Weiss Gambit EQ1, you could. Wich, amongs other reasons (devellopment, prices of the components like shark processors etc), justified of it's price tag.
Right, I can also do it with my FF Pro-Qx, this wasn't available in the 90's and we are having this discussion in 2020, if you suggest I should reward Weiss for a 480 Eur in 2020 for what they came up with in 9x, that's something to consider, I do have respect for heritage.
Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
And here I completely disagree. Wich plugin (eq) do you own from the last 10 years that can give you the Weiss Eq1 transparency ??
I'm sorry but there isn't.
Or everybody here would know about this if it was the case.
Theoretically almost any.. Pro-Q3, Equilibrium, iZotope, TDR etc.

As I've said I don't use LP EQ's because they sound like MP3 to me most of the time, so if we discuss MP EQ, an IIR filter is an IIR filter.. same code.
Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
Even the Algorithmix RED and Orange were very ,very good, (1000€ plugins) but still not as transparent as the weiss.
Never tried MAAT EQ's, they have advertised that they are making a new fancy LP EQ that doesn't have pre ringing, of course it measured as much pre ringing as iZotope, Equilibrium or any other LP EQ.

In that moment they have lost me as a potential client, there is a limit to what I can accept as marketing BS, they have claimed they re invented the digital EQ, they lied, bye bye.
Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
And last but not least I also disagree when you say it is priced too high, at 480€ because of the brand. If it was priced because of the "name" only, without taking the other plugins prices into consideration, it would be priced double "mate", and still worth it. Look at the Weiss line of gears, it is some of the finest digital harware ever made, by one the most talented coder that we have in Audio today. 480€ is cheap if you consider that.
English is not my first language so I apologize if ״mate" is not an appropriate term to use, didn't mean to dis you.

I agree Weiss did some of the finest mastering digital hardware gear,
I also have the DS-1 plugin which is very good and I've used it on hundreds of masters.

How does this change the fact that an IIR filter is an IIR filter ?

What does this EQ has to offer that the EQ's I already have doesn't ?
(except for different curve shapes and Q proportions as I've already wrote)
Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah View Post
i'm really wondering why some folks are after the latest and seemingly greatest but cheapest stuff
I always buy only the cheapest stuff !

Last edited by TanTan; 3 weeks ago at 03:16 PM..
Old 3 weeks ago
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TanTan View Post
Sorry but that's almost funny, I used to have the L2 box back in the day and it's nothing like the FF by any mean,
Very different code and way of operating, certainly not like comparing two digital IIR filters.

API's and Pultecs are analog EQ's. I have a 5500 and a pair of EQM-1S3's.
Equilibrium is a controllable digital EQ using IIR and FIR filters, very different implementation,
only the curves are similar, not the guts, not the tone.

DynOne3 is inspired by the TC6000, I still have my Juenger Accent 1 (although it's in storage now), they work on some very different principles, DynOne is multiband, Juenger upward compression is broadband, DynOne3 allows amazing control and options while the Juenger is very simple and straight forward.
Mmm you are turning things around here. You quoted me to say that the Plugins you are using for Mastering are NOT modeled/inspired by any hardware. Well The FF Pro L is based on the same brickwall principle than the Waves L2, (that they released wayyy before everybody else) so, a hardware piece.
Equilibrium is a digital eq of course, but, as I mentionned before, it is ALSO emulating hardware curves, like Api or Pultec (because they sound dope). So again, hardware inspired. And finally DynOne, if inspired by TC 6000, (I really thought I read that it was inspired after the Junger and Dolby processors, but I may be wrong) but anyway, Tc 6000 ? Hardware, again.


Quote:
Originally Posted by TanTan View Post
Theoretically almost any.. Pro-Q3, Equilibrium, iZotope, TDR etc.
But those were NOT available 10 years ago. That is why I quoted you on this in the first place, when you said "from the last 10 years".
And I would add that we don't hear things the same way if you tell me the Pro Q can sound as transparent as the Weiss..Sorry but far from it (to my ears at least)



Quote:
Originally Posted by TanTan View Post
Never tried MAAT EQ's, they have advertised that they are making a new fancy LP EQ that doesn't have pre ringing, of course it measured as much pre ringing as iZotope, Equilibrium or any other LP EQ.

In that moment they have lost me as a potential client, there is a limit to what I can accept as marketing BS, they have claimed they re invented the digital EQ, they lied, bye bye.
I was not talking about Matt digital, but Algorithmix, from back in the days, with ugly grey GUI lol.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TanTan View Post
English is not my first language so I apologize if ״mate" is not an appropriate term to use, didn't mean to dis you.
Don't worry really, no offense here, I was just beeing a bit sarcastic

Quote:
Originally Posted by TanTan View Post
I agree Weiss did some of the finest mastering digital hardware gear,
I also have the DS-1 plugin which is very good and I've used it on hundreds of masters.

How does this change the fact that an IIR filter is an IIR filter ?
I never said otherwise...
(that beeing said I'm no coder, and how an IIR filter can be coded might differ, hence a different sound ? Here I don't have an answer, as I simply don't know about this)

Quote:
Originally Posted by TanTan View Post
What does this EQ has to offer that the EQ's I already have doesn't ?
(except for different curve shapes and Q proportions as I've already wrote)
And here you are loosing me...If you think that way, why do you even bother looking at it, if you already have equivalent at your disposal ? Come on, you know you want to buy it Tantan

Quote:
Originally Posted by TanTan View Post
I always buy only the cheapest stuff !
If you have an Api 5500, a pair of EQM-1S3's, an accent 2 by Junger etc at your disposal, than this statement isn't true
Old 3 weeks ago
  #85
Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
Mmm you are turning things around here. You quoted me to say that the Plugins you are using for Mastering are NOT modeled/inspired by any hardware.
It's a misunderstanding really
Almost every audio processor is inspired by another audio processor,
Like every master I do is inspired by all the masters I ever did.

BTW I keep a plugin emulation of most of the analog processors I have,
Sometimes I master ITB for some reason or want to use the closest version of one of my favourite hardware units while mixing.

I've bought the Scarlet4 which was the closest to my MES-432D9,
I've also got the UAD Elysia Alpha which is a fair emulation of the hardware I use the most these days etc.

All very good and justifies its price.
Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
But those were NOT available 10 years ago. That is why I quoted you on this in the first place, when you said "from the last 10 years".
Ten years ago I was using the Sonoris mastering EQ, I didn't use it in a while but as far back as I can remember it sounds pretty similar to the modern EQ's
Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
And I would add that we don't hear things the same way if you tell me the Pro Q can sound as transparent as the Weiss..Sorry but far from it (to my ears at least)
Maybe my ears are not as good as yours, I seriously doubt I could pick which is which in a blind test, given they don't use the same curve shapes and Q proportions I believe I'll pick the EQ with the "better settings" for the music rather than the higher quality EQ, FF sounds amazing and a lot of top notch billboard mastering guys are using it on many if not most of their masters.
Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
I was not talking about Matt digital, but Algorithmix, from back in the days, with ugly grey GUI lol.
It was very good when it came out !
I remember installing it in 2006 (or 7 ?) in the years where the Q10 was the king and it sounded much cleaner than the Q10, but my computer couldn't handle it at the time..
Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
Don't worry really, no offense here, I was just beeing a bit sarcastic
Oh.. cool mate !
Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
I never said otherwise...
(that beeing said I'm no coder, and how an IIR filter can be coded might differ, hence a different sound ? Here I don't have an answer, as I simply don't know about this)
The answer is different curve shapes and Q proportions..
there is no better or worse in this, therefore, the EQ you'll make the setting on will always win the shootout against the EQ you will copy the settings to
Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
And here you are loosing me...If you think that way, why do you even bother looking at it, if you already have equivalent at your disposal ? Come on, you know you want to buy it Tantan
Very true !
I want to buy everything and obviously the Weiss brand is appealing to me too..
But still, the purchase has to be somehow justified..
Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
If you have an Api 5500, a pair of EQM-1S3's, an accent 2 by Junger etc at your disposal, than this statement isn't true
Maybe :-) I was trying to make deedeeyeah feel better with his purchase by approving that the reason why I'm not buying the Weiss is because I'm cheap and can't appreciate quality as he stated, or in short, a good deed for deed(eeyeah)
Old 3 weeks ago
  #86
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Verified Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by TanTan View Post
(...) I was trying to make deedeeyeah feel better with his purchase by approving that the reason why I'm not buying the Weiss is because I'm cheap and can't appreciate quality as he stated, or in short, a good deed for deed(eeyeah)
lol - no one 'needs' any of these über-toys, especially not when one already has some alternatives...

...but daniel is such a nice and knowledgeable bloke (i know him a bit as we got to jam a few years back) that you'll want to buy some of his gear! - while other companies have long dropped support for their old gear, relocated production overseas and moved tax domicile to offshore tax heavens or sold their company, he's still around, answers every phone or mail, supports old gear etc. - seriously, he's one of the good guys in our industry and deserves to make it through these rough times!

(i'm not affiliated with him/his company!)
Old 3 weeks ago
  #87
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thermos's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Pand Sound Mastering View Post
I think this is exactly what are thinking a LOT of people almost "bashing" this Eq on the "new product alert" post for the EQ1 (I'm not saying YOU are bashing it of course, I'm quoting your post but please don't take it for you). People are basically shocked by the price tag. That's the main reason.
Almost ALL of the plugins right now are modeled after "old" analog gears, isn't it ? So, what's wrong with the 90's lol ?
Some of the best hardware in their respective domain were created in this area : Weiss, AMS Neve, Lexicon, TC Electronics, the very mixing console made by Sony wich the Dynamic Eq you mentionned and all the Sonnox series is derived from.
Even Eq plugins that aren't modeled after anything often propose curves wich are directly inspired by the like of Pultec, Api etc.
And unfortunately most of those "emulation" plugins are basically pretty interfaces that often sound miles away from they hardware counterparts.
And that's why they are priced around 200 bucks for the most part, and litterally going down to a few 30 bucks when "on sale".
Here the devellopers, Softube in partnership with Daniel Weiss himself, are showing you that this plugins NULLS with the hardware. That's the first thing they show on the trailer. A hardware piece that cost close to 7000€ all option included, and wich must figure on at least 50% of all the Albums we have listened to.
Again, don't take it personnaly David, but that's what I would like all the "bashers" to hear. That if 480€ is too much for their wallet, then it's perfectly understandable, but don't bash an amazing product because it is priced what it should be, or because it is modeled after an "old" unit, when 80% of todays plugins are.
That was my grumpy morning coffee post
Nah, I'll pay $1000 for a definitively superior product.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #88
Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah View Post
lol - no one 'needs' any of these über-toys, especially not when one already has some alternatives...

...but daniel is such a nice and knowledgeable bloke (i know him a bit as we got to jam a few years back) that you'll want to buy some of his gear! - while other companies have long dropped support for their old gear, relocated production overseas and moved tax domicile to offshore tax heavens or sold their company, he's still around, answers every phone or mail, supports old gear etc. - seriously, he's one of the good guys in our industry and deserves to make it through these rough times!

(i'm not affiliated with him/his company!)
That's great to hear ! Daniel Weiss is brilliant, there's no doubt about that !
I'm using the DS-1 almost every day and also the Softube Weiss De-Esser which is ridiculously good !

I'd buy the EQ1 instantly if I thought it would provide me with some useful options I don't currently have
Old 3 weeks ago
  #89
Lives for gear
 

Verified Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by TanTan View Post
That's great to hear ! Daniel Weiss is brilliant, there's no doubt about that !
I'm using the DS-1 almost every day and also the Softube Weiss De-Esser which is ridiculously good !

I'd buy the EQ1 instantly if I thought it would provide me with some useful options I don't currently have
it's a bit like food: how many different salt, pepper, curry, pasta, rice, tea, beer, wine etc. do you have? - imo one can NEVER have enough different flavours...
Old 3 weeks ago
  #90
Lives for gear
 
X-Pand Sound Mastering's Avatar
 

Verified Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by thermos View Post
Nah, I'll pay $1000 for a definitively superior product.
Not sure what you mean here, that the Weiss isn't worth it's price tag ?
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