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Is Studio Downgrade an actual trend?
Old 4 days ago
  #61
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eternalsound's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAH View Post
Any children to support/educate?
Here in America money to spend on a child's education is more likely to go to into one's own alcohol and football (soccer) game funds.
Old 3 days ago
  #62
Gear Guru
 
Thomas W. Bethe's Avatar
 

Verified Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Olhsson View Post
It was also looking pretty bleak right before the Beatles blew the industry up. People worship Sgt Pepper's and the notion of "playing the studio" but that exercise was not what broke the Beatles. What broke them were recordings of riveting performances that had been made quickly and mostly live in a studio with minimal overdubbing. The next Beatles will probably also break on stage. Thay will need an actual recording studio as opposed to a laptop and a MIDI keyboard. At that point, there will be a real need for studios again for the next generation of performers.
I really hope you are right.

I live and work in a small college town literally in the middle of a corn field. (Population - 10,000). People here seem to be living in the 1940s or 50s when it comes to what they are willing to pay for anything and not just for audio - video services. They all seem to be living in a WalMart world where everything is top quality but prices are super low. I think this is the new mind set for a lot of people when it comes to music or music related services. They want super quality but are unwilling to pay for that quality. I have seen over the past few years more and more music related companies go out of business. This is for many reasons including too many of them providing parallel services, the whole DIY movement for musicians and the cost of rent, equipment and software. Ten years ago we sent out a mailing to over 500 recording studios with in 100 miles of my facility. These were addresses that came out of telephone books and the internet. We were going to do a similar mailing and could only find less than 100 studios that now exist. Quite a difference 10 years can make.

I hope that something will turn around the music business as you suggest but I am fearful that it will not and things will continue to go down instead of up.

One can only hope for the best.
Old 3 days ago
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eternalsound View Post
Here in America money to spend on a child's education is more likely to go to into one's own alcohol and football (soccer) game funds.
Huh?
Old 2 days ago
  #64
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Jerry Tubb's Avatar
 

Verified Member
For me, Downsize is amore appropriate term than Downgrade

which sounds like a lower quality.

Downsizing just implies a reduction of physical facility, overhead, and workload,

which could actually improve one’s quality of work.

working 6-8 hours per day,

doing a few singles, or a couple of EPs, or just one full length spread over a couple of days is a good thing!

i do hear through the grapevine, that reducing size and overhead is a trend among real MEs...

cheers, JT
Old 2 days ago
  #65
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is the situation between the ME studio and a recording studio can be reconciled ?

is the situation between the recording studio dedicaded to classical music and an EDM studio can be reconciled?
Old 2 days ago
  #66
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eternalsound's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by scraggs View Post
Huh?
You have to look at his post. I was saying would-be college funds would be more likely to be put into a parent's beer, TV subscriptions, and football game funds before they went to a kid's college fund. Just sayin'.
Old 2 days ago
  #67
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eternalsound's Avatar
I run a thin mastering heard myself. I recommend ME's do trim down - as technology gets smarter listeners get dumber, and having extra gear for the sake of nuances in sound is far from worth its return. I'm considering running a small digital modeling amp instead of a full tube rig in my band because the modern tipsy audience is non the wiser anyway. Less bull work for me.
Old 2 days ago
  #68
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Mr. Bars's Avatar
In time made clarification, Jerry. Since you hear through the grapevine, then you can find through it four levels of any studio being:

1/ Amateurish — any upsizing downgrades your workflow and degrades quality of your sound.
2/ Years of trial and error — any downsizing downgrades your workflow and degrades quality of your sound.
3/ Mindfulness — any upsizing upgrades your workflow and improves quality of your sound.
4/ Wisdom — any downsizing upgrades your workflow and improves quality of your sound.

Best,
DK



Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Tubb View Post
For me, Downsize is amore appropriate term than Downgrade

which sounds like a lower quality.

Downsizing just implies a reduction of physical facility, overhead, and workload,

which could actually improve one’s quality of work.

Last edited by Mr. Bars; 19 hours ago at 02:03 PM..
Old 2 days ago
  #69
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eternalsound's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Bars View Post
In time made clarification, Jerry. Since you look through the grapevine, then you can find through it four levels of any studio being:

1/ Amateurish — any upsizing downgrades your workflow and degrades quality of your sound.
2/ Years of trial and error — any downsizing downgrades your workflow and degrades quality of your sound.
3/ Mindfulness — any upsizing upgrades your workflow and improves quality of your sound.
4/ Wisdom — any downsizing upgrades your workflow and improves quality of your sound.

Best,
DK
There are no mutually exclusive ties to the items listed in your observation. Meaning, "Mindfulness" is not bound to up-sizing anymore than "Wisdom" is bound to downsizing. These could be flipped and show in the same way. That list is just arbitrarily ...strange.

Old 2 days ago
  #70
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Mr. Bars's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by eternalsound View Post
I run a thin mastering heard myself. I recommend ME's do trim down - as technology gets smarter listeners get dumber, and having extra gear for the sake of nuances in sound is far from worth its return. I'm considering running a small digital modeling amp instead of a full tube rig in my band because the modern tipsy audience is non the wiser anyway. Less bull work for me.
Each mastering engineer chooses an aesthetic and philosophical connection with what he is working on only himself. And here we are all so different — I don't compromise just because "listeners get dumber" (never play this game), I rather try my best to motivate the musician to proceed from the opposite to preserve the superiority of art over huckstering.
Old 2 days ago
  #71
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAH View Post
I see the сlimax of the no studio needed approach in hip-hop which is as we all know about the best consumed genre by the youth. Beat ITB, vocals in USB, mixed/slammed - streaming. No Scorpions/Marley anymore.
Interesting observation Dah. In Hip Hop world the person making the beats is more often than not the artist, arranger, producer and engineer in one so this role in itself does away with certain other roles in recording. As a Hip Hop producer myself I found that I didn't need to use big studios as using samplers doesn't require the expertise of recording engineers for micing up instruments in a decent recording space as you may if you were an aspiring new four piece indie band with real instruments and good songs but no knowledge of recording.

Being as Hip Hop or Hip Hop style production with samplers and sound modules became prominent in the mainstream I guess the investment in a personally owned studio is the natural way to go for producers who got deals and become more prominent rather than paying for studio time. It's a natural progression if you already know how to use a desk and recording gear plus gives you a potential future job with your studio once you're no longer 'relevant' - as the music business would put it.

Gradually over the years I've built up my gear to the point that i'd never need to use another place to record and I assume i'm not at all unique in this respect throughout the world and know many others who do rouhgly the same. I do not record vocals in my studio but find that many vocalists have their own recording set up with good vocal chain so with the internet you can file share and cut out the need for studios. Consequently the only point that productions such as mine need professionals is when it gets to mastering. Vinyl mastering naturally requires a lathe and unique expertise so only deal with pro's there but for digital I use a good friend of mine who happens to be a home studio Hip Hop producer/engineer who does incredible stuff via a mainly ITB set up. He's one of those guys who has the ear and his digital masters I think sound as good as or better than many professional digital masters so i've no need to use pros.

Also, when bands like Pink Floyd, 10cc, etc... famously set up their own studios in this manner that showed others that it was possible plus can give you an income while you're not using it. Lots of fascinating factors to consider in this thread that contribute to more private or small studios opening but the really large ones closing.
Old 2 days ago
  #72
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eternalsound's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Bars View Post
I don't compromise just because "listeners get dumber"
You already are ..unless you're still only cutting tape and vinyl.
Old 2 days ago
  #73
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ionian's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by eternalsound View Post
Here in America money to spend on a child's education is more likely to go to into one's own alcohol and football (soccer) game funds.
Sounds like you had sh!tty parents.
Old 2 days ago
  #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eternalsound View Post
You have to look at his post. I was saying would-be college funds would be more likely to be put into a parent's beer, TV subscriptions, and football game funds before they went to a kid's college fund. Just sayin'.
Yeah I read his post just fine. And you've just repeated the same thing you said before, and it's just as dumb now as it was the first time. I know a lot of parents who wouldn't agree with you.
Old 2 days ago
  #75
Gear Nut
 

I think it’s really depends on each studio and what they do.
I wouldn’t say I’ve downgraded but maybe just “crossgraded” over the last few years. I no longer use a board or hardware on the mix buss but have bought A LOT of high end analog for tracking. With the amount of songs we have to finish daily it made more sense to go for the correct sound on the way in and then mix ITB. The fact that most everything still hits good analog somewhere in the process let’s us get great sounds but allows edits and mixing be much faster! We do more production than mastering so I could understand things being different there.
In fact I actually do plan to invest back into some nice mixbuss and mastering analog soon. I just don’t think I’ll ever see the need to have a large board anymore
Old 2 days ago
  #76
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eternalsound's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ionian View Post
Sounds like you had sh!tty parents.
Does it? Then you too, I guess??

Actually it was a generalization and much to your dismay my parents were not this. It's called "getting lucky".


Quote:
Originally Posted by scraggs View Post
Yeah I read his post just fine. And you've just repeated the same thing you said before, and it's just as dumb now as it was the first time. I know a lot of parents who wouldn't agree with you.
So you respond "Huh?" to question something you already understood? You're a wise-man indeed.

Good. Maybe plan a dinner with them??

Old 2 days ago
  #77
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Mr. Bars's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by eternalsound View Post
There are no mutually exclusive ties to the items listed in your observation. Meaning, "Mindfulness" is not bound to up-sizing anymore than "Wisdom" is bound to downsizing. These could be flipped and show in the same way. That list is just arbitrarily ...strange.
Sorry dude, but the order in my original post is more than correct. It’s not surprising that you reacted like you did — your answer speaks for itself at what level you are at the moment.


Quote:
Originally Posted by eternalsound View Post
You already are ..unless you're still only cutting tape and vinyl.
Hey, it sounds like some kind of trolling. I have never considered the work of mastering engineer simply as a business set of expenses and income. Never. For me, it's the technical art. And where art is, there must be a sacrifice — such is the historical principle of this relation. It is a personal choice.
Old 2 days ago
  #78
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eternalsound's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Bars View Post
Sorry dude, but the order in my original post is more than correct. It’s not surprising that you reacted like you did — your answer speaks for itself at what level you are at the moment.




Hey, it sounds like some kind of trolling. I have never considered the work of mastering engineer simply as a business set of expenses and income. Never. For me, it's the technical art. And where art is, there must be a sacrifice — such is the historical principle of this relation. It is a personal choice.
I'm not trolling. This has all went over your head. Carry on.
Old 2 days ago
  #79
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matucha's Avatar
 

Verified Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plush View Post
Those studios not tied and associated with big ad agencies, cinema, film studios, gaming are in the toilet.
If I can see some way to higher rates, it's the gaming world, but you often need to do/know many things to make it work. Depends on the scale of the project though, the larger the more specialized one can be of course.

Sincerely, most of my HW processing is just for fun and a bit different sound when there is time to experiment. It's not necessary really. Some of it is great to have for tracking not doubt.

No way around great rooms and monitoring setup.
Old 19 hours ago
  #80
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Jerry Tubb's Avatar
 

Verified Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Bars View Post
In time made clarification, Jerry. Since you look through the grapevine, then you can find through it four levels of any studio being:

1/ Amateurish — any upsizing downgrades your workflow and degrades quality of your sound.
2/ Years of trial and error — any downsizing downgrades your workflow and degrades quality of your sound.
3/ Mindfulness — any upsizing upgrades your workflow and improves quality of your sound.
4/ Wisdom — any downsizing upgrades your workflow and improves quality of your sound.
I don’t think i’ve understood a single thing you’ve said!

“grapevine”? what?

perhaps it’s just a totally different (180 degree) viewpoint.

no need to clarify though. i’m not asking a question, just stating my viewpoint!

cheers, jt
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