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Wavelab 10, the major update nobody is talking about.
Old 4th September 2020
  #181
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melgueil View Post
That was where I was leaning, just wanted to see if I was overlooking something. As I've already purchased Elements, it another 200€. So pretty much crazy not to do it.

Cdlt
Right. With WaveLab Pro, you'll feel MUCH less restricted and have more and better metering and analysis options.

I personally think that Steinberg should either make Elements less restricted and bump up the price a touch if needed, or add an Artist version that is between Elements and Pro but with the current WaveLab Pro pricing, it's a no-brainer if you have been on the fence.
Old 4th September 2020
  #182
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Melgueil's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin P. View Post
Right. With WaveLab Pro, you'll feel MUCH less restricted and have more and better metering and analysis options.

I personally think that Steinberg should either make Elements less restricted and bump up the price a touch if needed, or add an Artist version that is between Elements and Pro but with the current WaveLab Pro pricing, it's a no-brainer if you have been on the fence.
Yep, gonna do it. The metering options alone, not to mention all of the other things. Just dowloaded the manual - yikes ....500+ pages.

Cdlt
Old 4th September 2020
  #183
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melgueil View Post
Yep, gonna do it. The metering options alone, not to mention all of the other things. Just dowloaded the manual - yikes ....500+ pages.

Cdlt
WaveLab does have a bigger learning curve than other DAWs, and a unique way of working. If it didn't, we might not need it!

If you're on Facebook, feel free to join us in the WaveLab Users Group:
https://www.*********************WaveLab/

And remember that PG who invented WaveLab and still develops WaveLab is very active on the public forum:

https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewforum.php?f=297

And for those who may have missed it, here is a rare and recent interview with PG:

https://new.steinberg.net/stories/ph...iew_pg_wavelab
Old 5th September 2020
  #184
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Melgueil's Avatar
 

Purchased the Pro Version - however ....

I cannot activate it without this silly USB licenser - and the text in my confirmation email says that delivery of USB licenser is delayed or may not happen at all due to COVID. I'm receiving packages all the time from all sorts of places - what's up with that?

Worse, no shipping confirmation, in the dark. Still worse yet - the Steinberg account.
I created one, purchased Elements - so should be good?. Nope. So went to purchase the upgrade - had to reinitialise my password. Did that. Purchased the upgrade.

Discovered I can't launch it? Oh well.

Went to register. Asks me to login in again. Use my new password (the one they just let me in on not 15 mins ago). Nope. Kept trying - verified, copied right out of my password manager. Nope.

Now locked out of my Steinberg account.

Great start to a relationship. Is it that hard to deal with this company?

Cdlt
Old 5th September 2020
  #185
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin P. View Post
WaveLab does have a bigger learning curve than other DAWs, and a unique way of working. If it didn't, we might not need it!

If you're on Facebook, feel free to join us in the WaveLab Users Group:
https://www.*********************WaveLab/

And remember that PG who invented WaveLab and still develops WaveLab is very active on the public forum:

https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewforum.php?f=297

And for those who may have missed it, here is a rare and recent interview with PG:

https://new.steinberg.net/stories/ph...iew_pg_wavelab
Thanks Justin, my request for FB group is pending.

Question: Since I’m new to Wavelab (coming from Cubase) do you know if there are any basic video tutorials to start with?

Vlad
Old 5th September 2020
  #186
Deleted 49af092
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melgueil View Post
Purchased the Pro Version - however ....

I cannot activate it without this silly USB licenser - and the text in my confirmation email says that delivery of USB licenser is delayed or may not happen at all due to COVID. I'm receiving packages all the time from all sorts of places - what's up with that?

Worse, no shipping confirmation, in the dark. Still worse yet - the Steinberg account.
I created one, purchased Elements - so should be good?. Nope. So went to purchase the upgrade - had to reinitialise my password. Did that. Purchased the upgrade.

Discovered I can't launch it? Oh well.

Went to register. Asks me to login in again. Use my new password (the one they just let me in on not 15 mins ago). Nope. Kept trying - verified, copied right out of my password manager. Nope.

Now locked out of my Steinberg account.

Great start to a relationship. Is it that hard to deal with this company?

Cdlt
I can't speak to this as it's more on the admin side, but I would suggest posting this experience on the WaveLab forum so that somebody at Steinberg is sure to see it and respond.

https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewforum.php?f=297
Old 5th September 2020
  #187
Deleted 49af092
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solic View Post
Thanks Justin, my request for FB group is pending.

Question: Since I’m new to Wavelab (coming from Cubase) do you know if there are any basic video tutorials to start with?

Vlad
There are some 3rd party tutorials but really all the ones I've seen are just somebody reciting the WaveLab manual in video form which I don't find to be helpful.

There is a WaveLab channel on YouTube and Dom Siglas has done a handful of basic WaveLab videos.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCaz...IXr91x6uCUJA9g

My goal is to make a proper tutorial series but I can't seem to clear the time from mastering work to do it properly.

In the interim, I did a live on YouTube walk through of some basic points of interest and common points of confusion that seems to be helping some people for now.

Hopefully I will have more to come, and something that is more structured, edited, and in more bite size pieces.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yH8-ZFSfFk
Old 5th September 2020
  #188
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin P. View Post
There are some 3rd party tutorials but really all the ones I've seen are just somebody reciting the WaveLab manual in video form which I don't find to be helpful.

There is a WaveLab channel on YouTube and Dom Siglas has done a handful of basic WaveLab videos.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCaz...IXr91x6uCUJA9g

My goal is to make a proper tutorial series but I can't seem to clear the time from mastering work to do it properly.

In the interim, I did a live on YouTube walk through of some basic points of interest and common points of confusion that seems to be helping some people for now.

Hopefully I will have more to come, and something that is more structured, edited, and in more bite size pieces.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yH8-ZFSfFk
Excellent, this should keep me busy for some time. Hope to see more videos or sort of paid course coming from you soon. Thanks Justin, you are amazing person.
Old 5th September 2020
  #189
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Melgueil's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin P. View Post
I can't speak to this as it's more on the admin side, but I would suggest posting this experience on the WaveLab forum so that somebody at Steinberg is sure to see it and respond.

https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewforum.php?f=297
Well, I reset my password (again for the 3rd time) and got in that way and opened a support ticket. Pretty crazy. We'll see.

Cdlt
Old 6th September 2020
  #190
10.4 update is out with some bug fixes which are nice.

file:///C:/Users/glenn/Downloads/Steinberg/WIN64/WL%2010.0.40%20-%20Version%20History/WaveLab_10.0.40_Version_History.pdf
Old 6th September 2020
  #191
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mljung's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenn Bucci View Post
10.4 update is out with some bug fixes which are nice.

file:///C:/Users/glenn/Downloads/Steinberg/WIN64/WL%2010.0.40%20-%20Version%20History/WaveLab_10.0.40_Version_History.pdf
10.0.40 I believe. Just installed the trial, my first WL10 test ever. Opened a WL9 project (Montage) I've been working on. Had 3 crashes with it. Probably some plugins incompatibility, (which WL9 didn't have) but I can't be sure as there was no explanation. Not the most uplifting start unfortunately.

::
Mads
Old 6th September 2020
  #192
Deleted 49af092
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Normally crashes are from 3rd party plugins. If you post the crash report on the public forum, PG can usually analyze it and help pinpoint the issue.

https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewforum.php?f=297

Until the plugin developer can fix the issue, using the VST2 version instead of VST3 or vise versa can be temporary fix. Too many plugin developers don't take the time to test in WaveLab.
Old 7th September 2020
  #193
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Wolf LeProducer's Avatar
 

Must be a 3rd party plugin. Wavelabe 10 is rock solid here on Win 10 pro... Which, imho, says a lot, cause Win 10 is just about the buggiest operating system that Microsoft has ever released....
Old 7th September 2020
  #194
nkf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin P. View Post
Normally crashes are from 3rd party plugins. If you post the crash report on the public forum, PG can usually analyze it and help pinpoint the issue.

https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewforum.php?f=297

Until the plugin developer can fix the issue, using the VST2 version instead of VST3 or vise versa can be temporary fix. Too many plugin developers don't take the time to test in WaveLab.
The funny thing is: plug ins running absolutely flawless in Nuendo 10.x and Cubase 10.5.x cause different problems in Wavelab 10 until today. Mostly problems are sluggish graphics etc (on Mac Mojave).
I do some editing and sometimes Mastering in Wavelab, but shifted most mastering work to Nuendo, which I have anyway, and made a mastering template for it. Processing is much smoother in Nuendo, plug ins react snappy and external processing (digital hardware) is already set up.
50% of my work is multi-channel based and Wavelab can't process with multi-channel plug ins. There is no Ambisonics support etc.
Wavelab has its benefits for certain tasks, but is still lacking in several areas.
Old 7th September 2020
  #195
Deleted 49af092
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Yes, but WaveLab is WaveLab, not Cubase or Nuendo. They have some pretty big fundamental differences even though Steinberg owns them all and plugin developers inherently do not test WaveLab as thoroughly for various reasons.

And yes, WaveLab is not very well cut out for 5.1 work although I've heard of some workarounds to make it possible. I don't really do any 5.1/multichannel work so I haven't explored that area myself.

For stereo mastering of singles, EPs, and albums, it really shines though. That's 100% what I use it for and use it all day everyday with a nice group of reliable 3rd party plugins (FabFilter, Plugin Alliance, DMG, UAD, Goodhertz, Leapwing, Tokyo Dawn, Soothe, and a few others).

It's surely not too hard to find an oddball plugin that struggles in WaveLab but 99% of the time, the fix has to come from the plugin developer.
Old 7th September 2020
  #196
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mljung's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin P. View Post
Normally crashes are from 3rd party plugins. If you post the crash report on the public forum, PG can usually analyze it and help pinpoint the issue.

https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewforum.php?f=297

Until the plugin developer can fix the issue, using the VST2 version instead of VST3 or vise versa can be temporary fix. Too many plugin developers don't take the time to test in WaveLab.
Right Justin, I believe it is. But to me it's strange that things that workes without hiccups in WL9 doesn't in WL10!? (Wavelab 9 is hardly Cubase, nor Nuendo).

Moreover, it crashes without making a report, unless it's hiding somewhere?

::
Mads

Last edited by mljung; 7th September 2020 at 11:55 AM..
Old 7th September 2020
  #197
Deleted 49af092
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mljung View Post
Right Justin, I believe it is. But to me it's strange that things that workes without hiccups in WL9 doesn't in WL10!? (Wavelab 9 is hardly Cubase, nor Nuendo).

Moreover, it crashes without making a report, unless it's hiding somewhere?

::
Mads
It is strange but for those who have been following WaveLab for a long time, it's how it is. I don't think WaveLab has any more 3rd party plugin issues than Sequoia, Pyramix, Triumph, HOFA, or Sound Blade.

These mastering programs just do not get as thoroughly tested by 3rd party plugin developers as the big multi-track DAWs. That's the reality.

If you are on Mac, the crash reports will show up here:
/Users/user name/Library/Logs/DiagnosticReports/

I need to do more research to find the Windows location.

Also, if you hold the OPTION/ALT key when hovering over or pressing the GLOBAL tab in preferences, you'll see a Diagnostics tab appear that has some options to make the crash dumps have even more specific info.
Old 7th September 2020
  #198
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mljung's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin P. View Post
It is strange but for those who have been following WaveLab for a long time, it's how it is. I don't think WaveLab has any more 3rd party plugin issues than Sequoia, Pyramix, Triumph, HOFA, or Sound Blade.

These mastering programs just do not get as thoroughly tested by 3rd party plugin developers as the big multi-track DAWs. That's the reality.

If you are on Mac, the crash reports will show up here:
/Users/user name/Library/Logs/DiagnosticReports/

I need to do more research to find the Windows location.

Also, if you hold the OPTION/ALT key when hovering over or pressing the GLOBAL tab in preferences, you'll see a Diagnostics tab appear that has some options to make the crash dumps have even more specific info.
Thanks for your reply Justin. Since Wavelab 9 works for most 3rd party plugins, I may just stay with that - I'm on Windows 10 BTW. For me working almost exclusively in the box (when I'm not recording that is) I need to be able to use all kinds of specialized plugins. I use WL for sound design and not just mastering duties. Just hoped WL10 was mature enough to handle at least what 9 was capable of. It even says on the what's new list: "Improved third-party VST plug-in support" - that simply doesn't make sense.

And it's unfortunate, I really think WL is a wonderful program, I would love to be the user that could say that version 10 was just as good as 9, and then more. But there needs to be a substantial update before I can say that with confidence. Hope that substantial update is just around the corner.

::
Mads
Old 7th September 2020
  #199
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mljung View Post
Thanks for your reply Justin. Since Wavelab 9 works for most 3rd party plugins, I may just stay with that - I'm on Windows 10 BTW. For me working almost exclusively in the box (when I'm not recording that is) I need to be able to use all kinds of specialized plugins. I use WL for sound design and not just mastering duties. Just hoped WL10 was mature enough to handle at least what 9 was capable of. It even says on the what's new list: "Improved third-party VST plug-in support" - that simply doesn't make sense.

And it's unfortunate, I really think WL is a wonderful program, I would love to be the user that could say that version 10 was just as good as 9, and then more. But there needs to be a substantial update before I can say that with confidence. Hope that substantial update is just around the corner.

::
Mads
I understand. I don't know much about Windows but the developer of WL just told me that unlike Mac, Windows doesn't automatically store crash dumps in a special folder. He says:

On Windows, one can activate a "WaveLab crash dump". In that case, it is available in a popup dialog, at the time of the crash.
But there is nothing saved on the drive.


I would suggest reporting any repeatable crash steps and crash dumps (if you get any) on the WaveLab forum and the WaveLab developer can look at them. It doesn't get more direct than that.

I bet the crash can be traced to a certain 3rd party plugin. For me, WL10 is working great 24/7 day after day.
Old 7th September 2020
  #200
Deleted 49af092
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mljung View Post
Thanks for your reply Justin. Since Wavelab 9 works for most 3rd party plugins, I may just stay with that - I'm on Windows 10 BTW. For me working almost exclusively in the box (when I'm not recording that is) I need to be able to use all kinds of specialized plugins. I use WL for sound design and not just mastering duties. Just hoped WL10 was mature enough to handle at least what 9 was capable of. It even says on the what's new list: "Improved third-party VST plug-in support" - that simply doesn't make sense.

And it's unfortunate, I really think WL is a wonderful program, I would love to be the user that could say that version 10 was just as good as 9, and then more. But there needs to be a substantial update before I can say that with confidence. Hope that substantial update is just around the corner.

::
Mads
Additional info from the WaveLab developer:

Under Windows, you can generate one crash dump from WaveLab if you do so:
While pressing the Alternate key (press first and maintain), select "Global preferences" from the WaveLab menu with the mouse.
In that case, there is a new tab called "Diagnostics". There you can activate several functions.
Activate the option "Enable crash report". Quit and relaunch WaveLab.
If a crash happens, one crash dump is generated and a dialog proposes to save it.
Old 7th September 2020
  #201
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mljung's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin P. View Post
Additional info from the WaveLab developer:

Under Windows, you can generate one crash dump from WaveLab if you do so:
While pressing the Alternate key (press first and maintain), select "Global preferences" from the WaveLab menu with the mouse.
In that case, there is a new tab called "Diagnostics". There you can activate several functions.
Activate the option "Enable crash report". Quit and relaunch WaveLab.
If a crash happens, one crash dump is generated and a dialog proposes to save it.
Thanks Justin, for bringing this to my attention.

::
Mads
Old 8th September 2020
  #202
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Thomas W. Bethe's Avatar
 

Verified Member
1 Review written
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin P. View Post
Normally crashes are from 3rd party plugins. If you post the crash report on the public forum, PG can usually analyze it and help pinpoint the issue.

https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewforum.php?f=297

Until the plugin developer can fix the issue, using the VST2 version instead of VST3 or vise versa can be temporary fix. Too many plugin developers don't take the time to test in WaveLab.

A conversely WL has been extra finicky about certain plugins that run fine in other DAWs. I have owned and worked with WL since version 1.6.2 and certain plugins have had problems that only exist in the WL world. Suggest some of the blame can be shared with the WL developers who don't check plugins we all use with WL. I think that most plugin developers would share their plugins with WL developers for free if WL signed a nondisclosure agreement. It seems like a two way street. FWIW
Old 8th September 2020
  #203
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mljung's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe View Post
A conversely WL has been extra finicky about certain plugins that run fine in other DAWs. I have owned and worked with WL since version 1.6.2 and certain plugins have had problems that only exist in the WL world. Suggest some of the blame can be shared with the WL developers who don't check plugins we all use with WL. I think that most plugin developers would share their plugins with WL developers for free if WL signed a nondisclosure agreement. It seems like a two way street. FWIW
That would be very nice.

Also the Wavelab developers could seek inspiration just going back to their own version 9, what were changed since the compatibility has gone worse in 10. I think it's unusual and must consider it a downgrade.

::
Mads
Old 8th September 2020
  #204
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mljung's Avatar
BTW I'm looking for the fold / unfold track feature from WL 9. Is it gone in WL10? I'm aware that it's possible to make a track smaller by dragging, but the fold feature made it extra small, so useful.

::
Mads

Last edited by mljung; 8th September 2020 at 04:11 PM..
Old 8th September 2020
  #205
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Thomas W. Bethe's Avatar
 

Verified Member
1 Review written
Quote:
Originally Posted by mljung View Post
That would be very nice.

Also the Wavelab developers could seek inspiration just going back to their own version 9, what were changed since the compatibility has gone worse in 10. I think it's unusual and must consider it a downgrade.

::
Mads
For most of my mastering/restoration work I still use WL 9.5.5. IMHO it is just more stable and I can run plugins that do not work well in WL 10.0.4. Maybe by the time WL 10 gets to version 10.5.5 it will be a good solid DAW. For right now I am staying with WL 9. I see some talk that multi-track is MAYBE something that WL 11 will come with. Considering the track record for promising and not delivering multi-track I would NOT hold my breath. fWIW
Old 11th September 2020
  #206
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mljung's Avatar
More WL 10 trouble

Hmm it's not only crashes, it also malfunctions with 3rd party plugins.

If I put TDR Nova GE, on a track I only get a signal in the left channel..!? (see attached image)

And if I put it on WL 10's MASTERSECTION it does another strange thing - it changes the stereo-image making it more out of phase.

I wonder what's going on. I can't recall I have ever had any problems with TDR plugins in any DAW.

I really wish it worked better...

::
Mads
Attached Thumbnails
Wavelab 10, the major update nobody is talking about.-wavelab-10-tdr-nova-error-1.jpg  
Old 11th September 2020
  #207
Deleted 49af092
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mljung View Post
Hmm it's not only crashes, it also malfunctions with 3rd party plugins.

If I put TDR Nova GE, on a track I only get a signal in the left channel..!? (see attached image)

And if I put it on WL 10's MASTERSECTION it does another strange thing - it changes the stereo-image making it more out of phase.

I wonder what's going on. I can't recall I have ever had any problems with TDR plugins in any DAW.

I really wish it worked better...

::
Mads
Wow. All I can say is that you have A LOT of plugins inserted. Even if they are all bypassed, it's an invitation for something to go wrong.

I just inserted TDR Nova GE on a montage track and I am not getting the issue of only playing in the left channel. (See attachment).

I would consider starting from a cleaner starting point and weeding out any bad plugins or other things that may cause an issue.

I would also consider using the Montage Output FX slots since those are automatically saved in the .mon file. Global Master Section FX need to be manually saved and loaded separately from any Montages or files in the Audio Editor.

I like the Playback Processing in the Global Master Section for things like Clarity M plugin to talk to my Clarity M, and others use this section for Room/Headphone correction but plugins in the Playback Processing slot by nature are not actually rendered.

Other then Playback Processing, I avoid the Global Master Section completely and actually keep it hidden since all it does is host Clarity M for me.
Attached Thumbnails
Wavelab 10, the major update nobody is talking about.-screen-shot-2020-09-11-8.02.46-am.jpg  
Old 11th September 2020
  #208
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mljung's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin P. View Post
Wow. All I can say is that you have A LOT of plugins inserted. Even if they are all bypassed, it's an invitation for something to go wrong.

I just inserted TDR Nova GE on a montage track and I am not getting the issue of only playing in the left channel. (See attachment).

I would consider starting from a cleaner starting point and weeding out any bad plugins or other things that may cause an issue.

I would also consider using the Montage Output FX slots since those are automatically saved in the .mon file. Global Master Section FX need to be manually saved and loaded separately from any Montages or files in the Audio Editor.

I like the Playback Processing in the Global Master Section for things like Clarity M plugin to talk to my Clarity M, and others use this section for Room/Headphone correction but plugins in the Playback Processing slot by nature are not actually rendered.

Other then Playback Processing, I avoid the Global Master Section completely and actually keep it hidden since all it does is host Clarity M for me.
Alot of plugins right but they are completely turned off so why should I worry unless somethings wrong in the program? It's actually an imported project from WL9 in which it works just fine (I use the mastersection to check things on-off).

I have used Wavelab since version 3, so I'm quite familiar with it and aware that I can use it in different ways - but I can't see I'm doing something that should cause problems here.

I will check some more, but so far my experience is that there are some things not done right in version 10, as Thomas also seem to believe - version 9 just works however.

Edit: I updated Nova GE to the most recent version, this did the trick for WL10 - a nice experience, I don't want to be negative

::
Mads

Last edited by mljung; 11th September 2020 at 03:25 PM..
Old 11th September 2020
  #209
Deleted 49af092
Guest
OK. I will stop trying to help then.
Old 11th September 2020
  #210
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mljung's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted 49af092 View Post
OK. I will stop trying to help then.
I appreciate your help - I just wanted to clarify that I know Wavelab pretty well.
I've updated my post before - Nova is working as expected now.

::
Mads
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