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What are your favorite headphones in the mastering room.
Old 23rd July 2019
  #751
DAH
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Originally Posted by AreYouHuman View Post
Can anyone that know both well can describe the difference between hd650/600 and the ATH R70x? Both are pretty flat according to sonarworks (the Hds are even a bit flatter), but I'm think a of good impulse response is even as imporant. Something which doesn't get messured often. Can you hear depth on them?

I'm also very interested in the accurate bass response because I'm also into dance electronic stuff.
for accurate lows you will have to dial in as much as 18 dB of boost.

Last edited by DAH; 23rd July 2019 at 04:56 PM..
Old 23rd July 2019
  #752
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AreYouHuman View Post
Can anyone that know both well can describe the difference between hd650/600 and the ATH R70x? Both are pretty flat according to sonarworks (the Hds are even a bit flatter), but I'm think a of good impulse response is even as imporant. Something which doesn't get messured often. Can you hear depth on them?

I'm also very interested in the accurate bass response because I'm also into dance electronic stuff.
Indeed flat response is a start but doesn't reveal how accurate a monitoring or headphones are in terms of speed and time response. And it's indeed maybe the most important thing to feel a good stage, depth and instrument separation.

That's the limit of the HDs.

Audeze headphones are for me the best in terms of speed, then depth and transient response (still need to hear those Requisite SR1a though).
+ they have 100% flat and accurate bass (and I'm not sure the Requisite could beat them on that matter)
Old 23rd July 2019
  #753
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Originally Posted by FabienTDR View Post
Most ME's use amps, speakers and acoustic treatment easily 10 times as expensive.

Businesses declare such expenses. You effectively pay with your businesses' taxes (or the working class pays your classy headphone, depending on the perspective ). Consumers buying pro stuff is "crazy". But businesses buying pro gear is totally healthy.

This high end stuff also uses to last. Bought my last pair 15 years ago, headphone amp overhauled 5 years ago or so.
"Consumers buying pro stuff is "crazy""

So should I sell/donate my 7506, DT880s, etc. and get some Beats?
Old 23rd July 2019
  #754
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Originally Posted by Spartacus View Post
Indeed flat response is a start but doesn't reveal how accurate a monitoring or headphones are in terms of speed and time response. And it's indeed maybe the most important thing to feel a good stage, depth and instrument separation.

That's the limit of the HDs.

Audeze headphones are for me the best in terms of speed, then depth and transient response (still need to hear those Requisite SR1a though).
+ they have 100% flat and accurate bass (and I'm not sure the Requisite could beat them on that matter)
Audeze are pretty fast... but still sluggish next to the Shure KSE1200, which are amongst the best of the best I have heard. Problem with IEMs is they are fit dependent... The KSE are a revelation of speed. They are excellent electrostats, and fit in a pocket
Old 24th July 2019
  #755
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Originally Posted by nyandres View Post
Audeze are pretty fast... but still sluggish next to the Shure KSE1200, which are amongst the best of the best I have heard. Problem with IEMs is they are fit dependent... The KSE are a revelation of speed. They are excellent electrostats, and fit in a pocket
Light and speed is one thing, but drivers quality is also about rigidity and distortion...not sure about the Shure vs Audeze on that matter, especially in both extra ends...

Last edited by Spartacus; 24th July 2019 at 09:32 PM..
Old 24th July 2019
  #756
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Originally Posted by Spartacus View Post
Light and speed is one thing, but drivers quality is also about rigidity and distortion...not sure about the Shure vs on that matter, especially in both extra ends...
Honestly, the shures are also impecabble in tatt regard. The inear nature actually aids in the bass reproduction. They have already been placed next to the stax omega sr009, and sennheiser orpheus in terms of how good they are ,at headfi. They are that good. Personally i still think the stax sr009 is the best in the world and all time but still, its like much more expensive. Being put in that same league, is impressive abd as other have reviewed actually makes em a bargain.

They are faster and lower distortion, than the audeze. No doubt about that. Putting the audeze after the shures there is some graininess that becomes audible.

Audeze wise the lcdi4 actually sound better than their bigger headphones, but noticeably inferior to the shures in every area
Old 24th July 2019
  #757
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Originally Posted by nyandres View Post

Audeze wise the lcdi4 actually sound better than their bigger headphones, but noticeably inferior to the shures in every area
It might be very subjective then, someone here said the exact opposite, that the i4 was slightly inferior to the 4 or 4z.

Also here a review I found : "When you essentially completely do away with external noise (HVAC, traffic, people moving around, fan noise, etc.) you realize even more how open-sounding the Audeze LCD-i4 is. Even outside the anechoic room, the open-back Audeze has an obvious (and not surprising) advantage over the Shure KSE1500, in terms of openness, width, and depth of soundstage. With the isolation--with little to no external auditory distraction--it's like my brain allows the soundstage of the LCD-i4 to fully realize itself. I wish I could shut the world out like this on-demand (without having to visit the lab)."

And this : "I can believe that the Shure edges it out in terms of resolution and transparency, but the i4 has a stage and airiness that the KSE1500 can't compete with."
Old 24th July 2019
  #758
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAH View Post
for accurate lows you will have to dial in as much as 18 dB of boost.
The r70x has according to sonarworks measurement -6 dB at 30hz, how do you come to the conclusion with 18dB of boost? Is it by trying a manual curve until it sounds right for you?
Old 24th July 2019
  #759
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KSE vs i4 was already discussed earlier in this thread. Thermos used both and chose the Audeze, I also auditioned the 1500 vs i4 and chose i4. Both of us found Shure to bee too artificial sounding and not suited to mixing. Can be fun to listen to though.
Old 24th July 2019
  #760
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For me the AKG K-812 is in the perfect price range, but there are very few opinions about them here at GS. It has some pretty good and some pretty bad reviews. Does anyone here have made a comparison to the r70x or Audeeze range? Any other opinion on them is also welcome.
Old 24th July 2019
  #761
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spartacus View Post
It might be very subjective then, someone here said the exact opposite, that the i4 was slightly inferior to the 4 or 4z.

Also here a review I found : "When you essentially completely do away with external noise (HVAC, traffic, people moving around, fan noise, etc.) you realize even more how open-sounding the Audeze LCD-i4 is. Even outside the anechoic room, the open-back Audeze has an obvious (and not surprising) advantage over the Shure KSE1500, in terms of openness, width, and depth of soundstage. With the isolation--with little to no external auditory distraction--it's like my brain allows the soundstage of the LCD-i4 to fully realize itself. I wish I could shut the world out like this on-demand (without having to visit the lab)."

And this : "I can believe that the Shure edges it out in terms of resolution and transparency, but the i4 has a stage and airiness that the KSE1500 can't compete with."
It is subjective up to a point indeed, that was my experience though... I owned both till 2 or so months ago... I owned the LCDs first. The shure made them sound noticeably grainy... The HD800 which I still have is also grainy next to the LCDs.

The shure's to me sound way closer to my Lipinski's than my HD800 and LCDi4 in terms of overall quality except for the size of the imaging, which speakers still own at. The LCDi4 remind me more of hi end hi fi sound systems, a bit enhanced in the low mids, but overall really really good, but definitely grainy (only noticeable after listening to the Shures for me). Im also surprised by the imaging comments, I thought one of the biggest difference was the shure's being able to separate instruments a lot better which makes sense due to them being a lot faster, thus having much cleaner and impactful transients (electrostatic drivers)

Anyways
...here is also a Review by headfi founder Jude, of the KSE (one of the biggest headphone audiophile sites, if not the largest). https://youtu.be/kPNGmU2Ysr8?t=274 Stax SR009, Sennheiser Orpheus.. some of those are also in that review. Review puts it in the same league as those.
Old 24th July 2019
  #762
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spartacus View Post
It might be very subjective then, someone here said the exact opposite, that the i4 was slightly inferior to the 4 or 4z.

Also here a review I found : "When you essentially completely do away with external noise (HVAC, traffic, people moving around, fan noise, etc.) you realize even more how open-sounding the Audeze LCD-i4 is. Even outside the anechoic room, the open-back Audeze has an obvious (and not surprising) advantage over the Shure KSE1500, in terms of openness, width, and depth of soundstage. With the isolation--with little to no external auditory distraction--it's like my brain allows the soundstage of the LCD-i4 to fully realize itself. I wish I could shut the world out like this on-demand (without having to visit the lab)."

And this : "I can believe that the Shure edges it out in terms of resolution and transparency, but the i4 has a stage and airiness that the KSE1500 can't compete with."
It is subjective up to a point indeed, that was my experience though... I owned both till 2 or so months ago... I owned the LCDs first. The shure made them sound noticeably grainy... The HD800 which I still have is also grainy next to the LCDs. HD800s change very noticeably with different amps..

The shure's to me sound way closer to my Lipinski's than my HD800 and LCDi4 in terms of overall quality except for the size of the imaging, which speakers still own at. The LCDi4 remind me more of hi end hi fi sound systems, a bit enhanced in the low mids, but overall really really good, but definitely grainy (only noticeable after listening to the Shures for me)

Anyways here is also a review by headfi founder Jude, (one of the biggest headphone audiophile sites, if not the largest). https://youtu.be/kPNGmU2Ysr8?t=274 Stax SR009, Sennheiser Orpheus orpheus.. some of those are also in that review. Puts it in the same league as those and as
Old 25th July 2019
  #763
DAH
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AreYouHuman View Post
The r70x has according to sonarworks measurement -6 dB at 30hz, how do you come to the conclusion with 18dB of boost? Is it by trying a manual curve until it sounds right for you?
I did measure my two pairs of HD580 with my Behringer ecm8000 into a custom ina219 preamp. Note that the capsules for hd580/600/650 are the same, can check by the replacement part number.
The resulting curve with boost in the lows and a 6 dB dip at 4.5 kHz was proven to be right with my own rain and thunder and other recordings as well as with commercial records.
I do not know what the magazine measurements are made according to, but I am a strong believer in the flat FR at the ear opening for the over the ear headphones without pinna /ear channel /hrtf compensation to have a good speakers/real world translation.
Did not say anything about AT r70x.
Old 25th July 2019
  #764
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Oh sorry DAH, I thought you mean the r70x. Good information otherwise.
Old 30th July 2019
  #765
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Sennheiser HD600

and these cheap white iPhone earpods. That's how the kids ultimately listen to our stuff..
Old 30th July 2019
  #766
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In terms of total mentions I'd say the HD-600 wins!
Old 31st July 2019
  #767
Since this thread is all about headphones, I purchased the Bellari HA543 headphone amplifier last week and this amp is remarkably transparent and clear. It also includes an enhanced future that can be selected via a push button that does an incredible job at creating a huge open and airy soundstage. This amp is super quiet and does not get hot at all. I got it hooked up in parallel with the output line to the main speakers amp and it sounds great.
Old 31st July 2019
  #768
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Phoenix_2018 View Post
In terms of total mentions I'd say the HD-600 wins!
Also the oldest and mostly widely known. Still a great headphone.
Old 31st July 2019
  #769
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Originally Posted by thermos View Post
Also the oldest and mostly widely known. Still a great headphone.
I use my Sennheiser 600s most days, whether for mastering QA, speech editing or bass guitar practice. Dump the foams, swap out the cable from a 650 and you're golden IMO.

I had Beyer 990 Pros for a long time before getting the 600s a few years ago - I did a lot of good work with the Beyers, but when I gave them a quick listen against the Senns recently they were pleasant enough, but softer sounding and lacking the resolution i look for nowadays.

Still interested to hear what the HEDDphone has to offer when it comes out, but I have my workhorse.
Old 31st July 2019
  #770
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AreYouHuman View Post
For me the AKG K-812 is in the perfect price range, but there are very few opinions about them here at GS. It has some pretty good and some pretty bad reviews. Does anyone here have made a comparison to the r70x or Audeeze range? Any other opinion on them is also welcome.
I own/use a ATH R70x and I ordered a LCD-X that should be here is a coupe of days. I'll do a quick review once I've worked with both.
Old 3rd August 2019
  #771
Quote:
Originally Posted by lowland View Post
I use my Sennheiser 600s most days, whether for mastering QA, speech editing or bass guitar practice. Dump the foams, swap out the cable from a 650 and you're golden IMO.

I had Beyer 990 Pros for a long time before getting the 600s a few years ago - I did a lot of good work with the Beyers, but when I gave them a quick listen against the Senns recently they were pleasant enough, but softer sounding and lacking the resolution i look for nowadays.

Still interested to hear what the HEDDphone has to offer when it comes out, but I have my workhorse.

You might like the Beyer 1990's as they are a nice step up from the 990
Old 4th August 2019
  #772
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I'm not in the mastering room but I am producing and mixing records full time.

My reference monitors are a pair of ATC 45A, truly a dream in terms of translation and engineering. I was finally able to buy a pair after having owned PMC, Dynaudio, Focal, etc.

I've been looking for a pair of headphones to check mixes etc. on the road now I'm going to be travelling more and in case I need to do bits of production away from my studio.

After hearing many pairs of headphones next to my ATCs I'd been disappointed every time. I was also kind of astounded at the sheer range of differences. From massive amounts of extra low end, awful shrill highs etc. I have been trying understand how anyone could make anything reliably on a pair of headphones. I've owned a pair of HD650s for ten years and am quite aware that they don't sound really all that correct out of the box either.

Enter the Audeze LCD-XC [I need a closed version]. I had a chance to try my friend's pair in my room and this was a real moment. The low end was resolved exactly correctly, and switching between the headphones and the ATCS finally made sense. Dare I say it it felt almost the same, apart from the slightly more polite upper midrange in the headphones. This actually didn't bother me as for me I really need the headphones to resolve the low end and low mids accurately more than anything else. Also aware there is the Reveal plugin, Sonarworks etc, Can Opener to try.

Will be purchasing next week...but so far in my experience of trying headphones these [and the LCD-X] are the only headphones that have made sense to me. I haven't tried the high range Senns or Stax etc. but so relieved to have found something that's gonna work.
Old 4th August 2019
  #773
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Originally Posted by Glenn Bucci View Post
You might like the Beyer 1990's as they are a nice step up from the 990
Thanks for the tip, Glenn.
Old 4th August 2019
  #774
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I use Beyerdynamic DT-990 pro 250 ohm. I almost never use them for tonal adjustments in mastering they are strictly for restoration, clicks, pops, glitch detection and removal. They have the clarity and deep lows required for this.

The headphone amplifier used to drive them is an important factor with headphones, a good HP amp can make a set of headphones sound very different. The Crane Song Quantum DAC has a good HP amplifier, I would say truthful and given the total absence of jitter, fast, clean and clear. I use this for removal of clicks/pops etc. (The Crane Song Quantum HP output is a BIG step up from my old Benchmark DAC-1 HDR HP output.) However for listen backs post mastering on another PC, I find a Hi-Fi exaggeration is perfect for spotting clicks, vocal pops, excessive lipsmack, synth envelope clicks etc. So I use a dedicated dedicated HP amplifier that is not just a "one chip does it all" HP amp, which uses 2 x LM4562's in the amp drive stage. This HP amp produces a really wonderful sound, deep/wide stereo, full range FR, crystal clear without sounding unnatural, a very pleasurable hi fi listening experience.

This is a preferable presentation of the music for quality control.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #775
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Originally Posted by Saxnscratch View Post
I own/use a ATH R70x and I ordered a LCD-X that should be here is a coupe of days. I'll do a quick review once I've worked with both.
Any news?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #776
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AreYouHuman View Post
Any news?
I'm in the middle of something right now, I'll give my impression soon (when I got more time)
Old 4 weeks ago
  #777
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saxnscratch View Post
I'm in the middle of something right now, I'll give my impression soon (when I got more time)
Sure, no pressure. Was just curious.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #778
Love this thread!
I just wanted to add the new Audeze LCD-i3 to the discussion; will be in the closer to an i4 or to the lower series?
I can't find much info about this...
The i4 is VERY tempting, but if the i3 is close enough and can be drive easily directly from a laptop that could be interesting for a really mobile setup...
https://www.audeze.com/products/lcd-i3
Old 3 weeks ago
  #779
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Originally Posted by E Artsy Moods View Post
Love this thread!
I just wanted to add the new Audeze LCD-i3 to the discussion; will be in the closer to an i4 or to the lower series?
I can't find much info about this...
The i4 is VERY tempting, but if the i3 is close enough and can be drive easily directly from a laptop that could be interesting for a really mobile setup...
https://www.audeze.com/products/lcd-i3
They told me the I3 is the same as the I4 with a slightly thicker diaphragm. I think I'm allowed to share that...
So it should sound real similar, maybe not quite as resolved. Seems like a damn good headphone for the money.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #780
Quote:
Originally Posted by thermos View Post
They told me the I3 is the same as the I4 with a slightly thicker diaphragm. I think I'm allowed to share that...
So it should sound real similar, maybe not quite as resolved. Seems like a damn good headphone for the money.
Very interesting! Kinda what I wanted to hear
Do you know if the thickness is the same as in the LCD-X?
If I can go with those in place of the X and get the same kind of result it would be super cool.

Also, not sure if your already answered this, but do the i4 let the ambiant sounds leak in & out too much for using it in train/airplane/airports? Or do you have to be isolated?
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