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Hofa CD-Burn.DDP.Master DAW Software
Old 29th April 2018
  #61
pmj
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesp View Post
If you don't have any other DDP reading software it may be worth checking out Andreas Ruge's DDP Tools if you want a second opinion on a problem master.
Thanks, these look like a great set of tools. Unfortunately you don't seem to be able to run a cueshet out of the HOFA software in order to run a double check using the command line tools but I'm sure they'll come in handy for checking using other software.
Old 29th April 2018
  #62
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The way I use those tools is to generate a DDP and then read it using them to check everything is OK with the DDP. If you were on a PC I'd suggest downloading Wyatt Rice's DDP to Cue Writer front end for them but I don't think that there is a Mac equivalent.
Old 29th April 2018
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmj View Post
Thanks, these look like a great set of tools. Unfortunately you don't seem to be able to run a cueshet out of the HOFA software in order to run a double check using the command line tools but I'm sure they'll come in handy for checking using other software.

Thanks a lot for mentioning DDP tools this is new to me

Can you not import the txt file in the DDP fileset as the cue?
Old 30th April 2018
  #64
pmj
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe_caithness View Post
Can you not import the txt file in the DDP fileset as the cue?
Not sure which file you mean? The DDP image file comprises of:

CDTEXT.BIN
DDPID
DDPMS
IMAGE.DAT
MD5_CHECKSUM.MD5
PQ-Sheet.pdf
PQDESCR

Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesp View Post
The way I use those tools is to generate a DDP and then read it using them to check everything is OK with the DDP.
I'll be honest, my command line chops evidently aren't sufficient to really grasp how you use those tools to create a DDP from scratch. The tools have pretty good documentation but after playing around with it over the weekend it seems I need a "cue2ddp" for dummies
Old 30th April 2018
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmj View Post
Not sure which file you mean? The DDP image file comprises of:

CDTEXT.BIN
DDPID
DDPMS
IMAGE.DAT
MD5_CHECKSUM.MD5
PQ-Sheet.pdf
PQDESCR



I'll be honest, my command line chops evidently aren't sufficient to really grasp how you use those tools to create a DDP from scratch. The tools have pretty good documentation but after playing around with it over the weekend it seems I need a "cue2ddp" for dummies
This is a good point, the original HOFA DDP BURN created a text file which I presume conformed to the CUE standard, perhaps it doesn't.

if HOFA are listening perhaps creating both the PDF and a TXT cue would be helpful?
Old 30th April 2018
  #66
pmj
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesp View Post
I'd suggest downloading Wyatt Rice's DDP to Cue Writer front end for them but I don't think that there is a Mac equivalent.
Some good news on this for me, there is a Mac version of Wyatt's cue2ddp front end:

Cockos Incorporated Forums - View Single Post - New DDP Export

And it works!

If I take a DDP generated with the HOFA software that has a hidden track in the pregap and burn it using DDP to Cue Writer I can rewind into the pregap with no problem.

Therefore I'm guessing it's the burning firmware within the HOFA software rather than anything hardware related here that's the problem.

Last edited by pmj; 30th April 2018 at 08:16 AM.. Reason: typo
Old 28th May 2018
  #67
Does anybody know how good the sample rate conversion algo is or which algo is used?
I really would like to see it listed here: SRC Comparisons
Old 29th May 2018
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnalogMix.com View Post
Does anybody know how good the sample rate conversion algo is or which algo is used?
I really would like to see it listed here: SRC Comparisons
SRC Comparisons - FAQ

See "How can I contribute to the tests" section.
Old 29th May 2018
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnalogMix.com View Post
Does anybody know how good the sample rate conversion algo is or which algo is used?
I really would like to see it listed here: SRC Comparisons
I'd be great if they incorporated what WaveLab has in the "Custom Montage Copy" feature where you can create your project at your preferred sample rate, for me it's 96k, and do what you need to do.

Then you can use your own 3rd party SRC, for me it's Weiss Saracon, and then tell the app to recreate the project with all the metadata, markers etc. using a new file which is already SRC'd to 44.1k.

Then users wouldn't have to rely on the SRC of this app or wonder if it's any good.
Old 30th May 2018
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin P. View Post
I'd be great if they incorporated what WaveLab has in the "Custom Montage Copy" feature where you can create your project at your preferred sample rate, for me it's 96k, and do what you need to do.

Then you can use your own 3rd party SRC, for me it's Weiss Saracon, and then tell the app to recreate the project with all the metadata, markers etc. using a new file which is already SRC'd to 44.1k.

Then users wouldn't have to rely on the SRC of this app or wonder if it's any good.
Your explanation of custom copy montage is what made me commit to using Wavelab fulltime. Its a really brilliant way to handle the modern mastering workflow.
Old 30th May 2018
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxtone View Post
Your explanation of custom copy montage is what made me commit to using Wavelab fulltime. Its a really brilliant way to handle the modern mastering workflow.
I'm glad you like it, I may have had some influence on PG adding it

Since the Resampler was never available anywhere besides the global master section (which I really dislike using and therefor don't use), the Custom Montage Copy option lets you do your own SRC and recreate the montage based on the selected new file.

I still remember the days before WaveLab 9, manually recreating montages at new sample rates with all the fades and markers etc. It was painful and time consuming, and also prone to human error.

Now it's done very precisely done, automatically in a matter of seconds and allows you do do all your processing at higher sample rates, and still get down to 44.1k and 48k very easily, and use the 3rd party SRC of your choice. while keeping all your markers, fades, and everything else totally in tact.

I think you can do this in Sequoia too in a similar way but I have never used it.
Old 30th May 2018
  #72
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You can try Triumph if you are on Mac.
Old 31st May 2018
  #73
Gear Maniac
In compiling a CD with HOFA CD-Burn.DDP.Master is there any way to add pre-gaps to tracks that will have a CD Player cue up to the track (-2, -1, 0, play..) when selecting that respective track, but otherwise play through and ignore the pre-gap when listening to the CD in sequence without stopping?

The reason I'm asking is that I'm compiling a CD with virtually non-existent pauses between the tracks and some CD players are having difficulties in cueing up to the start of the tracks, when choosing a specific track (i.e. track #5 ). The result is that the first couple hundred milliseconds are being skipped, which is not really desirable

thing is, I don't really want to move the start indices to frames residing in the fade-outs of the previous tracks, but just have some silence beforehand. Is this possible in any way?
Old 2nd June 2018
  #74
JDN
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mart View Post
In compiling a CD with HOFA CD-Burn.DDP.Master is there any way to add pre-gaps to tracks that will have a CD Player cue up to the track (-2, -1, 0, play..) when selecting that respective track, but otherwise play through and ignore the pre-gap when listening to the CD in sequence without stopping?

The reason I'm asking is that I'm compiling a CD with virtually non-existent pauses between the tracks and some CD players are having difficulties in cueing up to the start of the tracks, when choosing a specific track (i.e. track #5 ). The result is that the first couple hundred milliseconds are being skipped, which is not really desirable

thing is, I don't really want to move the start indices to frames residing in the fade-outs of the previous tracks, but just have some silence beforehand. Is this possible in any way?
That's a really great question, please let us know if you find an answer. have you tried Hofa support?
Old 2nd June 2018
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mart View Post
In compiling a CD with HOFA CD-Burn.DDP.Master is there any way to add pre-gaps to tracks that will have a CD Player cue up to the track (-2, -1, 0, play..) when selecting that respective track, but otherwise play through and ignore the pre-gap when listening to the CD in sequence without stopping?

The reason I'm asking is that I'm compiling a CD with virtually non-existent pauses between the tracks and some CD players are having difficulties in cueing up to the start of the tracks, when choosing a specific track (i.e. track #5 ). The result is that the first couple hundred milliseconds are being skipped, which is not really desirable

thing is, I don't really want to move the start indices to frames residing in the fade-outs of the previous tracks, but just have some silence beforehand. Is this possible in any way?
I don't see how any CD master program could make a CD that does that.

Possibly a player could be made that could be programmed to play that way, with two seconds pre-roll silenced by the player into index 1, but it would be a function of that player only, not the CD.
Old 2nd June 2018
  #76
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I'm not really sure, why it seems to be difficult or intriguing question, it's quite basic task for any CD software to handle pregaps (aka Index 0).
HOFA CD-Burn & DDP functionality is rather very similar to other mastering apps, where you can assembly CDs. I haven't upgraded to its newer v2 version called Master, but the logic it's the same.

First basic explanation of some indices used on CD

index 0 marks the position, where starts track pre-gap, this goes on up to following index 1 and so pre-gap length is defined by distance between the index 0 and adjacent index 1.

index 1 marks the position, which is used, when you're using track skip at CD player

index 2-99 marks the position within the particular track, it's commonly called sub-index and some CD players supports seeking over sub-indexes (it's sometimes used for classical music for example)

Index 0 is only mandatory at the start of CD by Redbook standard and has to be 2s (150 cd frames) before start of the first track (eg. the first index 1).
All the other tracks can be defined just by their index 1, while pauses (commonly with silence) are simply appended to previous track, but you can of course use index 0s, if you would like to stick with pre-gaps.
I like to avoid that nowadays, but it's merely my preference, because lot of people rips or plays those CDs at software, which doesn't work with pre-gaps and thus pauses are essentially missing, when you sequentially play the ripped files. IMO it's better to have longer tracks with appended silence (no-one will really examine ends of tracks), but universally playable.

In HOFA CD, it's rather simple to me. Audio clips are possible to freely position and trim almost as you like, similarly you can set indexes, where you need it.. There are default distances and index positions, which are applied to imported or dragged files, but you can either change those, or override them with pressed ctrl key, when moving clips at timeline.

So when you want longer pauses between imported track files, you simply move those more apart from each other. Similarly you can move track indexes (1) more towards the silence area between tracks to handle the time before CD player catches up, when skipping.
If pregaps are used (at HOFA CD default settings, it places 2s pregap between tracks), then you'll see the CD track end marker (grey vertical line with left aimed triangle), this is the pre-gap start and it continue up to next CD track start marker (white vertical line with right aimed triangle and number).
If you omit pregaps (no CD track end markers), HOFA will automatically fills the area from audio clip end up to start of next clip with silence and append it to previous track. Contrary if you have whole CD without pregaps and would like to add some, then simply place the playhead to position, where you would like start of pregap and hit Set track end button.

Finally after you start the blank CD project and before you import audio clips, I'd recommend to set default distances and pauses to fit your project.. for example marker distances are there exactly to avoid chopping of track starts.

Good luck!

Michal

PS: couple of screenshots could help with the explanation
Attached Thumbnails
Hofa CD-Burn.DDP.Master-hofa-defaults.png   Hofa CD-Burn.DDP.Master-hofa-just-track-marker.jpg   Hofa CD-Burn.DDP.Master-hofa-track-marker-pregap.jpg  
Old 5th June 2018
  #77
Gear Maniac
Thank you Michal!
In the meantime, I had gotten a reply from HOFA support. They told me that it will always be a bit of a compromise in my situation, but recommended me to set the song start a little ahead of time, even if that means that the fade out of the previous track might be heard at times.
Old 6th June 2018
  #78
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermetech Mastering View Post
SRC Comparisons - FAQ

See "How can I contribute to the tests" section.
I downloaded the software and created the conversions according the specifications on the website. Let's see when the results will be published on the website.
Old 11th June 2018
  #79
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I switched to this app from Triumph a few weeks ago and am absolutely loving it. I think Triumph looked better, but it was always 100 steps to do a basic task.

HOFA DDP and the Vinyl PQ export feature have been so great for me. The DDP player maker is also great for clients to preview the layout.

I'm only exporting DDPs from here bc I'm too scared that any dither will take place on 24 bit exports. So I echo everyone else's ideas about 3rd party dither/SRC controls, or a Montage-based system where all exports can take place on a single click from a set of options (as I understand it). I'd love a big checkbox or something that says whether ANY processing is taking place on files you're exporting. I thought DSP Quattro had a decent way of making sure dither was "off", though that was about the only thing I liked...

I also echo someone's earlier comment about bringing up the current save folder instead of the previously used - that really screws me up sometimes when I'm exporting a directory named "DDP" into a different artist's folder and have to go find it.

I finish all my projects in Pro Tools, so really just need a DDP/PQ machine with as few bells and whistles as possible. I'm loving it for this purpose.
Old 13th June 2018
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mart View Post
In compiling a CD with HOFA CD-Burn.DDP.Master is there any way to add pre-gaps to tracks that will have a CD Player cue up to the track (-2, -1, 0, play..) when selecting that respective track, but otherwise play through and ignore the pre-gap when listening to the CD in sequence without stopping?

The reason I'm asking is that I'm compiling a CD with virtually non-existent pauses between the tracks and some CD players are having difficulties in cueing up to the start of the tracks, when choosing a specific track (i.e. track #5 ). The result is that the first couple hundred milliseconds are being skipped, which is not really desirable

thing is, I don't really want to move the start indices to frames residing in the fade-outs of the previous tracks, but just have some silence beforehand. Is this possible in any way?
not that I know of...

I guess that is only relevant for continuously mixed stuff as you could always leave a very (nearly unrecognisable) small pause in front of the audio of any track to prevent that some CD players will miss the first miliseconds of a track.

in case of mixed CDs I usually put the Start-IDs a little bit into the fade out of the track before..to me a small trade off and still better than the option that the first miliseconds of a track are missed! so far non of my customers ever complained
Old 14th June 2018
  #81
Gear Maniac
Quote:
in case of mixed CDs I usually put the Start-IDs a little bit into the fade out of the track before..to me a small trade off and still better than the option that the first miliseconds of a track are missed! so far non of my customers ever complained
yes, this is what I ended up doing, thanks!
Old 10th August 2018
  #82
the sample rate test is now up on: SRC Comparisons
Old 18th August 2018
  #83
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Would be great to have a non CD PQ option for digital only releases where HOFA has been used to compile the meta data
Old 20th August 2018
  #84
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Dear Hofa, it's basically impossible to see a space before a meta data field or double spacing until it's too late.

Could you put a snap option in or an indicator of a space left before text imported into a field?
Old 1st October 2018
  #85
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whoops double post
Old 30th October 2018
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mart View Post
In compiling a CD with HOFA CD-Burn.DDP.Master is there any way to add pre-gaps to tracks that will have a CD Player cue up to the track (-2, -1, 0, play..) when selecting that respective track, but otherwise play through and ignore the pre-gap when listening to the CD in sequence without stopping?

The reason I'm asking is that I'm compiling a CD with virtually non-existent pauses between the tracks and some CD players are having difficulties in cueing up to the start of the tracks, when choosing a specific track (i.e. track #5 ). The result is that the first couple hundred milliseconds are being skipped, which is not really desirable

thing is, I don't really want to move the start indices to frames residing in the fade-outs of the previous tracks, but just have some silence beforehand. Is this possible in any way?
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