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Tokyo Dawn DeEdger Dynamics Plugins
Old 25th May 2017
  #1
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Tokyo Dawn DeEdger

Hey there,

Has anyone had a play with the Tokyo Dawn DeEdger?
I just used it on a project where the vocalist had used 2 different mics on particular tracks, one expensive (no problems) and one not so expensive (sibilance).
It really did a great job to smooth out the cheaper mics problems and help it stand up to the fancier mic, client happy.
I did a shootout of it against the iZotope spectral De-esser and it provides a useful difference and application.
Seems like a handy tool for those jobs where you need to have a few options to try out.
Old 25th May 2017
  #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Channel time View Post
Hey there,

Has anyone had a play with the Tokyo Dawn DeEdger?
I just used it on a project where the vocalist had used 2 different mics on particular tracks, one expensive (no problems) and one not so expensive (sibilance).
It really did a great job to smooth out the cheaper mics problems and help it stand up to the fancier mic, client happy.
I did a shootout of it against the iZotope spectral De-esser and it provides a useful difference and application.
Seems like a handy tool for those jobs where you need to have a few options to try out.
yeah, caught my attention too. just watched the presentation video but for a more in depth evaluation I have to check out the demo.
probably won't get much attention around here as it doesn't have a fancy GUI ... I'm being mean, I know.
Old 25th May 2017
  #3
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Yeah, been beta testing it a couple of months now, it's really a fabulous tool.
Old 25th May 2017
  #4
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It's exceptionally useful! A little can go a long way. It's one of those things you don't always immediately notice what it does, until you turn it off.

Have a too "chunky + muddy" kick on the track but can't EQ it away because the vocal gets too thin? Can't get a compressor to sort it out? DeEdger is the right tool here.

Have a nasty hihat that you can't seem to tame (especially if it's closed hihat)? DeEdger is like magic.. takes away the edge without killing the sizzle.

Got nasty "ticky" consonants on a vocal? No problem for DeEdger.

Yes, I sound like an infomercial.

Anyhow, point is. It's deceptively useful.

WARNING: It's easy to overdo due to it's transparency. It takes a while to truly "hear" and appreciate what it does.
Old 25th May 2017
  #5
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I can confirm that!

I was on the beta too and it's a subtle tool that only gets to work when "hardness" is present. When the material calls for it, it definitely does a great job of taking off those hard edges!

It took me a while to understand when and where to use it actually, but I have found it far more useful than I first thought. As bmanic said, it's an extremely transparent tool and can be very subtle.

Cheers

Conundra

Last edited by Conundra; 25th May 2017 at 02:23 PM.. Reason: Typos
Old 25th May 2017
  #6
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Have used it only today on an album. I'm happy they did not exclusively focus on top frequencies, it works very well on thick low end and boxy mid.
Old 25th May 2017
  #7
great tool from my buddy jan - i use it since the first alpha version every day and it helps a lot against harsh vocals, edgy cymbals, annoying snares, cold acoustic guitars, resonant pianos, aching e-guitars, boxy lowmids ASO.
as faster and high-definition your monitoring, as better you here the improvement you can get with the de-edger
Old 25th May 2017
  #8
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I'm using the demo now on a track with over-enthusiastic single tambourine hits - it's calmed things while keeping the feel in a way that a standard de-esser or EQ couldn't. A nice tool, which I look forward to learning fully.
Old 25th May 2017
  #9
I was in the beta testing team and fell in love with the plugin immediately. It's a problem solver, straight forward and always great sounding. I really like these type of plugins and Jan did a great job with this one.

With both DeEdger and bx_refinement (which is a different problem solver, not comparable to DeEdger) it's easier to make a troubled mix sound acceptable.
Old 25th May 2017
  #10
I have Refinement that really is helpful. I can't wait to try this. Nice it has an unrestricted demo that allows you to get familiar with it. Very cool all the different tools coming out to address the harsh problem. Sounds like this does a lot more....
Old 25th May 2017
  #11
A big strength of Jan's algorithm is how well it preserves the things "that matter" in the original. Most alternatives that I'm aware of typically introduce substantial collateral damage. Quite a feature imho.
Old 25th May 2017
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miguelmarques View Post
With both DeEdger and bx_refinement (which is a different problem solver, not comparable to DeEdger) it's easier to make a troubled mix sound acceptable.
Looks nice
You would be nice too if you could you explain the differences between deedger and refinement please ?
Thanks ;-)
Old 26th May 2017
  #13
Excited to try this out on a mix that needs it. Fortunately, none on todays docket fit the bill.

Was the omission of a delta listen mode intentional? Seems like something i'd personally like to have.
Old 26th May 2017
  #14
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Old 26th May 2017
  #15
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Old 26th May 2017
  #16
Quote:
Originally Posted by phaz View Post
Looks nice
You would be nice too if you could you explain the differences between deedger and refinement please ?
Thanks ;-)
bx_refinement is aimed at removing high frequency harshness. It can affect the spectral balance in a good way, making harsh mixes sound more natural. It deals exclusively with harsh mids/treble, I don't know exactly how it works internally but think of it as a set of special dynamic EQs with some tricks up it's sleeves just to tame those harsh high frequencies.

DeEdger is dealing with fast signals and/or part of transients. Sounds that have inconstant or too much clicked/edgy/hard signals. That's what DeEdger deals perfectly. It softens them without any artifacts and with ease of use.
Old 26th May 2017
  #17
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First of all: Jan, congrats to your first plug in release (which really comes a long way). Look and feel is great, I really like it! The all stepped parameters are cool thing, too. Wish that more plug ins would follow this route.

On the other side I dont get the usefullness of it for deharshing which in my understanding comes often from freq build-ups, uneven overtone spreads etc. Not especially from the initial transient alone, but more often a decay thing. Particularly because a clean transient is so important for localisation, expression of depth etc. So, after a only very short test period today my conclusion is a bit mixed for now: the outcome is indeed a real soft one, but also with the result of a kind of woolliness with the expression of dull (lost punch and lost overall tightness. Could it be a kind of pumping of attack/release too?) and reduced feel of the depth of field even with only one or two steps at Depth, at least on the full mixes I tried it (Stoner Rock with a overall kind of harshness combined with wooly lows [a quite challenging combination], Funk with very tight transients, Big Band with a bit harsh vocals and brasses). So for me at the moment not the right weapon for everyday work, but more a very special weapon, at least in mastering. May it needs an especially punchy analogue chain to compensate (I will test it within the chain next week).
Could be really cool for mixing I bet.

Last edited by JP__; 26th May 2017 at 10:53 AM..
Old 26th May 2017
  #18
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I've found it most effective on various EDM music and beats/hiphop where the mix is "edgy" sounding without any clear frequency related issues.

It's also effective in changing a kick that has too much "knock" to something softer (focusing with a narrow Q at around 150 to 250Hz).

Also, it seems I can get away with more drastic sweetening EQ when I use DeEdger after it.

But yeah, it's definitely a specialty tool and not a plugin that works on every project. It can even be harmful on some sources. Always trust your ears.
Old 26th May 2017
  #19
I just tried the demo and thought it seemed cool enough to warrant a purchase. Unfortunately, in Reaper (latest version, OSX 10.11.16) the 'compensate' control always returns to 'on' whenever I close the GUI. Is anyone else having this problem? I thought it might be a demo thing but it's happening in the purchased version as well.
Old 26th May 2017
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hippocratic Mastering View Post
Unfortunately, in Reaper (latest version, OSX 10.11.16) the 'compensate' control always returns to 'on' whenever I close the GUI. Is anyone else having this problem? I thought it might be a demo thing but it's happening in the purchased version as well.
Same here (win7, 64x, reaper 5.4).
Would be interesting if Jan and Teebaum (which both work with reaper) can reproduce this too.
Old 26th May 2017
  #21
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Oops. Confirmed. How did that go past us? I do use it mainly with compensate turned on but still, I should have spotted that bug.

Sorry guys. Beta blunder.
Old 26th May 2017
  #22
These things happen, eh. Do you think there'll be a hotfix for this?
Old 26th May 2017
  #23
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Yeah, confirmed here too, what are we like?
Old 26th May 2017
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miguelmarques View Post
DeEdger is dealing with fast signals and/or part of transients. Sounds that have inconstant or too much clicked/edgy/hard signals. That's what DeEdger deals perfectly. It softens them without any artifacts and with ease of use.
wow, thanks. thats a very good description!

Quote:
Originally Posted by JP__ View Post
First of all: Jan, congrats to your first plug in release (which really comes a long way). Look and feel is great, I really like it! The all stepped parameters are cool thing, too. Wish that more plug ins would follow this route.

On the other side I dont get the usefullness of it for deharshing which in my understanding comes often from freq build-ups, uneven overtone spreads etc. Not especially from the initial transient alone, but more often a decay thing. Particularly because a clean transient is so important for localisation, expression of depth etc. So, after a only very short test period today my conclusion is a bit mixed for now: the outcome is indeed a real soft one, but also with the result of a kind of woolliness with the expression of dull (lost punch and lost overall tightness. Could it be a kind of pumping of attack/release too?) and reduced feel of the depth of field even with only one or two steps at Depth, at least on the full mixes I tried it (Stoner Rock with a overall kind of harshness combined with wooly lows [a quite challenging combination], Funk with very tight transients, Big Band with a bit harsh vocals and brasses). So for me at the moment not the right weapon for everyday work, but more a very special weapon, at least in mastering. May it needs an especially punchy analogue chain to compensate (I will test it within the chain next week).
Could be really cool for mixing I bet.
thanks! i agree, for some problems you described (especially the part with "decay") DeEdger is not the right tool.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hippocratic Mastering View Post
I just tried the demo and thought it seemed cool enough to warrant a purchase. Unfortunately, in Reaper (latest version, OSX 10.11.16) the 'compensate' control always returns to 'on' whenever I close the GUI. Is anyone else having this problem? I thought it might be a demo thing but it's happening in the purchased version as well.
i am (and it seems most of our beta testing team ) mostly using DeEdger with compensate=on, so it seems we have overseen that. of course we will fix it.
//edit: we already fixed it & v1.0.1 is available for download.

thanks to all for your feedback (whether negative or positive)!

Last edited by karumba; 27th May 2017 at 07:51 PM..
Old 26th May 2017
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the3030club View Post
Was the omission of a delta listen mode intentional? Seems like something i'd personally like to have.
i know some other TDL products have that, but yes, it was a design decision not to implement it for DeEdger.
Old 26th May 2017
  #26
Refinement basically is a steep eq cut with stuff that replaces what you took away (Presence). Also has saturation and a way to time the effect. I find it useful and this does something completely different. I'm curious to try both as often a couple of subtle things works better than one big move.
Old 26th May 2017
  #27
I'm quite enjoying it - it has already helped with one of those classic 'bright hi-hat in a dark mix' situations. One thing I think would be nice, and I know the feature-set is intentionally limited to avoid bloat, is variable/partial linking of L+R/M+S. Was this ever considered?
Old 26th May 2017
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JP__ View Post
So for me at the moment not the right weapon for everyday work, but more a very special weapon, at least in mastering. May it needs an especially punchy analogue chain to compensate (I will test it within the chain next week).
Have you tried it for cutting yet? Sounds like a potentially cool tool for that.
Old 26th May 2017
  #29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Reierson View Post
Have you tried it for cutting yet? Sounds like a potentially cool tool for that.
i'm quiet sure it can help a lot for cutting!
Old 26th May 2017
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Reierson View Post
Have you tried it for cutting yet? Sounds like a potentially cool tool for that.
No, but I will try for sure with overpeaky stuff.
Btw: I remembered a discussion about the Tonebooster Deesser for cutting we had. Im using it atm when doing "flat cuts" and when theres no real mastering involved. Good results without any parameter fiddling due to its automatic algo here. I dont use an analog HF Limiter in my cutting setup.

In critical mastering work I prefer DMGs deeser.
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