The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
Alan Smart Compressors
Old 31st January 2007
  #31
Gear Guru
 
lucey's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by phild View Post
Anyone like or hear good things about the Alan Smart C1 (or maybe a C2) for mastering purposes?

the LTD2 honeymoon is over.
The C1 is unbalanced and a bit cleaner Phil. I much prefer it to the C2, which is a great mix tool.

Cleaner yet is the TFPRO p38 in Mode 1 (the SSL grab with a super flat gain path) ... it's available often, as people here buy them with too much GR in mind, and are disappointed.


I'd look to try the p38 for a quick fix, or the Shadow Hills.
Old 31st January 2007
  #32
Lives for gear
 
Cellotron's Avatar
 

Verified Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by ulysses View Post
Phild,
If I understand correctly, you want something like the C1 but with a cleaner signal path, a sidechain option that lets the compressor ignore the kick drum a bit to prevent pumping, and a slower attack time. Maybe something like the Shadow Hills thing, but you want a 1RU box and you don't want to spend so much on the cosmetics that you don't care for anyhow. Please take a look at this
It isn't cheap, but it's priced very well and it fits with what you're asking for..
Justin -
Looks interesting and the price is certainly very low relative to other options ($1800 street!). Definitely the high pass filter switch on front is a great feature to have.



Can you answer some questions?

From the pic above looks like threshold and output are on continuosly variable pots - is it possible to get these with stepped switches?
Also - can you talk about the topology - i.e. is it all discrete, transoformer or actively balanced, etc.?
Is the bypass switch a true hard wired bypass?

Best regards,
Steve Berson
Old 31st January 2007
  #33
Lives for gear
 

i have c1 and like it alot on 2bus. i use it as a voc comp sometimes too. it took me a while to learn how to use it, but i like it a lot now. gotta barely hit it. i mainly do hip hop and r+b.

i contacted alan smart about sidechain and sweepable cutoff. he needed to look at the diagrams and think about it.

i would like to try out a 1968 me though. may be more versatile.
Old 31st January 2007
  #34
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by quincyg View Post
i have c1 and like it alot on 2bus. i use it as a voc comp sometimes too. it took me a while to learn how to use it, but i like it a lot now. gotta barely hit it. i mainly do hip hop and r+b.

i contacted alan smart about sidechain and sweepable cutoff. he needed to look at the diagrams and think about it.

i would like to try out a 1968 me though. may be more versatile.
I have a 1968... Very useful on the 2buss... not great for mastering. I always find myself looking for more punch.
Old 31st January 2007
  #35
Lives for gear
 
phild's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ulysses View Post
Phild,
If I understand correctly, you want something like the C1 but with a cleaner signal path, a sidechain option that lets the compressor ignore the kick drum a bit to prevent pumping, and a slower attack time.
Sorry for the egregious pimping.
Thanks for this.
I don't have a problem at all with you trying to sell me gear.
Sometimes it's the only way I get to find out about new stuff.

This comp looks really good

I think maybe the only thing missing here (for me) is the dual mono thing.

I have to be a dual mono man these days
Old 31st January 2007
  #36
Lives for gear
 
phild's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by lucey View Post
The C1 is unbalanced and a bit cleaner Phil. I much prefer it to the C2, which is a great mix tool.

Cleaner yet is the TFPRO p38 in Mode 1 (the SSL grab with a super flat gain path) ... it's available often, as people here buy them with too much GR in mind, and are disappointed.


I'd look to try the p38 for a quick fix, or the Shadow Hills.
Thanks, Brian,
Still the best descriptions going...

You traded your TFPro p38 when the Elysia arrived didn't you?

****..,let's face it I'm gonna have to buy an Elysia.
I'm sure eating ketchup sandwiches 3 times a day for 2 years can't be all that bad?
Old 31st January 2007
  #37
Lives for gear
 
phild's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by quincyg View Post
i have c1 and like it alot on 2bus.
i contacted alan smart about sidechain and sweepable cutoff. he needed to look at the diagrams and think about it
The lack of Side chain isn't life or death for me but balanced with a good PSU is.
I'll shoot them an email.

Thanks.
Old 31st January 2007
  #38
Gear Guru
 
lucey's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by phild View Post
Thanks, Brian,
Still the best descriptions going...

You traded your TFPro p38 when the Elysia arrived didn't you?

****..,let's face it I'm gonna have to buy an Elysia.
I'm sure eating ketchup sandwiches 3 times a day for 2 years can't be all that bad?
I didn't want to suggest it but yea it's cleaner than any of them, nulling in the -50 RMS range vs bypass even with the source through the electronics, and it does the clean grabs every way to Sunday. Not exactly SSL, but what is? (and no you don't want a G.) PSU? Class A insanity. I haven't yet sold the p38 because my wife's doing a lot of tracking lately and when I mix I generally use as an insert on OHs with K n Sn on a parallel.

A pair of those AL.SO comps might be cool, but that gets into alpha money.

New double blind studies show that Ketchup can give you Cancer, or is at least a liberal plot to demasculate men. So we eat oatmeal and grapefruit for breakfast ... meat, salad and cookie dough for desert.
Old 31st January 2007
  #39
Quote:
Originally Posted by phild View Post
Maybe I get bored easily?
This may be it actually.

Also why not build your own SSL type comp? You can add a HPF on it if you like with a switch on the front. It will also be cheaper than all of the clones out there.
Old 1st February 2007
  #40
Lives for gear
 
ulysses's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by trilliumsound View Post
Any specs available such as attack and release speed, ratios etc.?? Could not see anything on the website.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cellotron View Post
From the pic above looks like threshold and output are on continuosly variable pots - is it possible to get these with stepped switches?
Also - can you talk about the topology - i.e. is it all discrete, transoformer or actively balanced, etc.?
Is the bypass switch a true hard wired bypass?
First, the photo posted by Cellotron is an old photo of an old unit. The knobs changed color, the meter now lights up, and most importantly we added another ratio choice: 1.5:1.
So the ratio choices are 1:5, 2, 4, and 10 :1. Attack times are .05, .1, .2, .5, 1, 2, 5, 10, 20, and 50 mS. Release times are .1, .15, .2. .3, .4, .6, .8, 1.2, 1.6, and 2 seconds. There's a switchable 150Hz hi-pass filter in the sidechain, and the "Dual" button is a program-dependent release mode similar to "auto release" on other boxes except it doesn't take away your ability to control the short release characteristic with the Release Time switch.
The Threshold and Gain knobs are continuously variable. We've had a few requests for stepped controls here, and I've been looking into the feasiblitiy of that. My biggest concern is users who prefer the continously-variable. We can't please everybody. One solution I'm considering is to offer an option where the range of these two pots is much narrower - imagine if the gain knob's full rotation brought you from 0 to +6dB, rather than the current range of -14 to +20dB. This would allow "eyeballing" it to be more precise than your ears.
The topology is VCA-based with electronically balanced inputs and outputs. It's IC-based, but it's a very clean, simple circuit that uses high quality parts and sounds good. There's only one (polyproplylene) coupling capacitor in the signal path.
We left out some of the circuit complexity that would make it more idiot-proof in favor of a cleaner circuit. (For example, if we added some more amps we could have made it so the circuit doesn't care how you wire up an unbalanced cable. But this is a professional device for professional use, and we don't think our users want to sacrifice sound quality just so hobbyists don't have to float Pin 3 when they connect it to unbalanced consumer junk.)
Anyway, the unit is absurdly overbuilt, with a stainless steel chassis, torroidal power transformer, massive power filtering, good regulation, etc. and so on. It uses relays for true hard-wire bypass so when you hit the bypass button (or the power switch, for that matter) it's like unplugging the XLR cables from the unit and plugging them into one another.

Quote:
Originally Posted by phild View Post
This comp looks really good
I think maybe the only thing missing here (for me) is the dual mono thing.
I have to be a dual mono man these days
Huh. We never even considered offering a dual mono mode because the thing has only one set of controls. It does "single mono" just fine, but the idea of using two mono compressors across a stereo mix just seems so wrong to me that it didn't enter my mind during the design. Different strokes and all, but the only time dual mono would sound at all different from linked stereo is when it's messing up your center image. I'm not saying it can't work, I just don't see an advantage over linked operation. I'm sure the wobbling back-and-forth of the kick, snare, and bass is not the effect you're after, so I'm curious as to what result people are getting from dual mono compression that they like. You're not the first person to say they do it, but I've usually just written it off as a relatively harmless red herring. I do want to give professionals the tools they need, so I'm open to ideas. I just don't get this one. As it stands, the way to get dual mono operation with the Super Stereo is to buy two.
Old 1st February 2007
  #41
Lives for gear
 
robot gigante's Avatar
You might want to think about dual mono... as practically all C2 users will tell you, there is a big difference when you run those unlinked vs. linked. It sounds way better unlinked- when you link it the stereo image closes in and is less wide, and it sounds less punchy.

And it doesn't 'wobble' or mess with the center to my ears unless there is something much louder on one side and you're compressing hard.

Therefore I am also a dual mono man myself, especially when it comes to the C2.
Old 1st February 2007
  #42
Lives for gear
 
phild's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by thethrillfactor View Post
This may be it actually.

Also why not build your own SSL type comp? You can add a HPF on it if you like with a switch on the front. It will also be cheaper than all of the clones out there.
I thought about doing this and just figured that there was no way I could build one better than smart/ssl. Y'know?

Even if I buy the smart I'll have to customize a few things anyway..
Old 1st February 2007
  #43
Lives for gear
 
phild's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by lucey View Post
New double blind studies show that Ketchup can give you Cancer, or is at least a liberal plot to demasculate men.
Ha! Some things are worth risk.

I assure you that buying an Elysia will be far worse for my health!!
One day....
Old 1st February 2007
  #44
Lives for gear
 
True North's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by phild View Post
Thanks for this.
I don't have a problem at all with you trying to sell me gear.
Sometimes it's the only way I get to find out about new stuff.

This comp looks really good

I think maybe the only thing missing here (for me) is the dual mono thing.

I have to be a dual mono man these days

You could always get two stereo units - and send the L/R signals to a seperate unit each.......kind of overkill but this is Gearslutz

Better if you get three units you could always use them on 5.1 mixes heh
Old 1st February 2007
  #45
Lives for gear
 
phild's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ulysses View Post
Huh.
Yeah, I'm a dual mono guy. No disrespect to what you've designed at all.

Robot Gigante posted a great explanation of why some users prefer dual mono. After using the VariMu with various success for years - what I learned form using it is that unlinked was best. Sounding. To me.
Sometime in 2002 I had a MS encoder/decoder made so I could work M/S in analog.
I could run my dual mono comps in this configuration if I had to - but my "stereo" comps (focusrite 330 and spl kultube) were a no go.

Eq's? Same thing.

Just the way i work now.
Old 1st February 2007
  #46
Lives for gear
 
phild's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by True North View Post
You could always get two stereo units - and send the L/R signals to a seperate unit each.......kind of overkill but this is Gearslutz
I have gone into overkill territory before. I am not afraid.

Quote:
Originally Posted by True North View Post
Better if you get three units you could always use them on 5.1 mixes heh
5.1? Crazy talk.
Old 3rd February 2007
  #47
Lives for gear
 
ulysses's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by phild View Post
Yeah, I'm a dual mono guy. No disrespect to what you've designed at all.
S'okay. Can you imagine how boring this stuff would be if we all had the same tastes?

The question that's got me curious is whether there's something inherently different about linked vs. dual mono compressors, or whether it's a matter of certain specific compressors having a link circuit that affects the way they sound. My money's on the latter, but it's something to ponder.
Old 3rd February 2007
  #48
Gear Guru
 
AllAboutTone's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Boyd View Post
I had a Alan Smart C2 for a few years and that honeymoon is definitely over for me. I've got plenty of options for that type of compression in software and especially with the release of the SSL bundle, a lot of mixes already have that stamp. The other thing that really started to bug me was the lift in the top end with the C2. It's not even really 'euphonic' it's just brighter. I think it's cool as a mix compressor but found better options for the mastering room.

For now, im somewhat in your favor, i use the Sintefex stuff and the Smart stuff is ok but don't really knock my socks off, the Fairchild, Vari Mu, Tube Tech & SSL sound much much better.
Old 3rd February 2007
  #49
Lives for gear
 
robot gigante's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by zaza View Post
For now, im somewhat in your favor, i use the Sintefex stuff and the Smart stuff is ok but don't really knock my socks off, the Fairchild, Vari Mu, Tube Tech & SSL sound much much better.
Are you talking about the other emulations (Fairchild, ect) in the Sintefex beating the Smart emulation, or are you talking about an actual comparison of each hardware compressor?
Old 3rd February 2007
  #50
Quote:
Originally Posted by phild View Post
I thought about doing this and just figured that there was no way I could build one better than smart/ssl. Y'know?
.
First of how do you know unless you try. You pick the parts you want to use so you can tailor it to suit your sonic signature(selectable HPF side chains,transformers, hifi output amp etc). Also you can build it in the GSSL mode which works really well on the sides if you do any M/S processing or you can build it in the Oxford mode which is more SSL traditional and gives a more weighted center image.

Or you can build both in one box and switch it back and forth according to taste(which the Smart can't do). This to me is the ideal.
Old 3rd February 2007
  #51
Gear Guru
 
AllAboutTone's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by robot gigante View Post
Are you talking about the other emulations (Fairchild, ect) in the Sintefex beating the Smart emulation, or are you talking about an actual comparison of each hardware compressor?

Yes ive never heard the Smart , but ive heard the emulation, and it did not do anything for me, emulation vs the real hardware in Sintefex way too close to tell apart. very happy with Sintefex units, they are the ONLY true emulation ive ever heard, Ive heard the LC is not on par as far as a vocal chain tho but never tried it.
Old 4th February 2007
  #52
Lives for gear
 
robot gigante's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by zaza View Post
Yes ive never heard the Smart , but ive heard the emulation, and it did not do anything for me, emulation vs the real hardware in Sintefex way too close to tell apart. very happy with Sintefex units, they are the ONLY true emulation ive ever heard, Ive heard the LC is not on par as far as a vocal chain tho but never tried it.
This is not a bash on the Sintefex, but what you get out of the Smart depends very much on how you use it- there is so much variety there especially once you start using the sidechain inputs that I would be very much suprised if the people who made the Smart presets captured all of what it can do. I'm sure that what you get out of a box like the Sintefex is only as good as what the people who made the preset have done.

Besides, I own a couple of the other compressors which emulations you say you like better, and again, it really depends on a lot of factors which one will work better for what music... There's no way for example that you could get a Vari-Mu to grab and punch like a C2, never in a million years.
Old 5th February 2007
  #53
Gear Guru
 
AllAboutTone's Avatar
 

I agree with you 100 percent, it depends on what music, or band for that matter that you are mixing, the Farchild gives the most punch, but i love the Tube tech, Vari Mu, Neve and the SSL a lot as well, what i like about the Sintefex is i do not have to spend a ton of cash on compressors when i can have all of it in one, like i said (if) the sound is off 5 or 10 percent from the org's the Sintefex is far far worth having for what i do.

ps: i do not have the C2 crush only the org.
Old 5th February 2007
  #54
Moderator
 
jayfrigo's Avatar
 

Verified Member
The Smart didn't excite me. It wasn't bad, but I didn't get the urge to write a check. Have you tried an API 2500 yet?
Old 5th February 2007
  #55
Lives for gear
 
inlinenl's Avatar
 

Verified Member
okay, it isn't a flashy piece off gear .. but it's a decent compressor, my clients like it a lot, it pays a lot off bills overhere ... it's okay next to my vari-mu and tubetech smc-2b ... it really has his applications ...

I wasn't excited .... like I was when I got the manley/tubetech ... but that was purely based on the looks ....

most off the time the C2 is in combo with the manley .... all nice tools, but it's always the egineer who makes it sound OK/FANTASTIC or screws it up !!

but some guys like ducati's and some like triumphs :-) ( p.s. don't even start about suzukis )

regards wim

www.inlinemastering.com
Old 5th February 2007
  #56
Lives for gear
 
Darius van H's Avatar
 

Verified Member
I think of dual mono compression as a sort of euphonic "effect".......that slight image wobble makes it seem wider.........a kind of mastering engineers autopan / tremolo / stereo chorus.........very useful.
Old 5th February 2007
  #57
Gear Guru
 
AllAboutTone's Avatar
 

when i get a lot of bass wobble i go nuts !! F##K with my mind.
Old 5th February 2007
  #58
Gear Guru
 
AllAboutTone's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jayfrigo View Post
The Smart didn't excite me. It wasn't bad, but I didn't get the urge to write a check. Have you tried an API 2500 yet?
I would have to be honest, i have not . But i do love my 3124s, that tells me that the 2500 has to be a great unit.
Old 5th February 2007
  #59
Moderator
 
jayfrigo's Avatar
 

Verified Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by inlinenl View Post
but some guys like ducati's and some like triumphs :-) ( p.s. don't even start about suzukis )
I don't know who you could talking about... and how did you know my first bike ever was a Suzuki?heh

I can think of bikes from all three of those manufacturers that I'd be happy to ride, even if the Trumpy is my main squeeze. Gearslutism spills over into other areas you know. Get one of everything!
Old 5th February 2007
  #60
Gear Guru
 
lucey's Avatar
BMW k1000Rs !
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump
Forum Jump