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Affordable LDC Microphone With Multiple Voicings Condenser Microphones
Old 12th May 2018
  #5491
Here for the gear
 

Bought the Warbler Mk VI, going through Audient iD14 into Ableton Live 9, in my laptop setup and it is so much noisier than my Rode NT1-A.

Is it possibly too much of a mic for my setup?
Old 12th May 2018
  #5492
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greaterhornbill View Post
Bought the Warbler Mk VI, going through Audient iD14 into Ableton Live 9, in my laptop setup and it is so much noisier than my Rode NT1-A.

Is it possibly too much of a mic for my setup?
Would not expect any noise.
Old 12th May 2018
  #5493
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Conquertheblock View Post
So after some time mulling it over I decided to get a sowter 1303f and have it put in a Mk1d

-I love it so far...more balanced across the frequency spectrum..the low mids and lows are punchy...very 3D. Position 1 kind of sounds like in between an 87ai and a vintage 87...position 2 more like a vintage 87...haven't played with position 3 yet. I've only had a chance to use it a few times at a friend's so far but couldn't be happier. More muscular than my friends wa87 as well as superior low mids and lows...also more balanced. I'll be able to use it more here the next few weeks and I'll try and get some acoustic and electric guitar samples to post with comparisons. This is a well worth it upgrade and if you are electronically inclined I say do it (you will have to cut the bottom portion of the circuit board off to fit the transformer in.
I don't want to heap tons of praise on it yet till I've used it more, but it really impressed me. Catapults the mic up into the GZ area.

-Compared to my other Mk1d with standard transformer, more balanced with better lows and low Mids...the low mids and lows are punchier...the highs are better due to better balance/separation with less smear. The differences were amplified when we started eqing. As a note, my original Mk1d is one of the firsts and it looks like there is a slight difference in the headbasket. The standard transformer is no slouch however, and compared well...at $349 the Mk1d is still the best bang for the buck in the microphone world in my opinion.

I have very large hands that make working on electronics nearly impossible for me. I asked 3u if they would install it for me and they said yes if I shipped the transformer to them. I did via ups to make sure it got there. Awesome customer service yet again from 3u. Total cost even with shipping ($120 for me to ship the transformer to them via ups) was On par or a little less than a wa87
@Conquertheblock have you had a chance to use the Warbler with Sowter more over the last couple of months? Would you say it's a subtle difference or significant? Do you feel it's a better mic than the WA87 after the upgrade?

I'm trying to decide if I should upgrade my Warbler MKVI with a Sowter or just spend a little more dough to get a GZ67.

The Warbler VI is doing a decent job in my studio. But I never have one of those "OMG" goosebump moments with it. It's more like a, "yeah I can make that work." Super solid and versatile mic but I'm looking for more magic.
Old 12th May 2018
  #5494
Gear Nut
 
Strick9's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Greaterhornbill View Post
Bought the Warbler Mk VI, going through Audient iD14 into Ableton Live 9, in my laptop setup and it is so much noisier than my Rode NT1-A.

Is it possibly too much of a mic for my setup?
The Rode is super quiet, like the CM-1s. But the Warblers aren't noisy. I have 3 and an iD22 and don't have any noise issues. I've got a Sterling ST-51 and that thing is noisy. Something like 22db of self noise.

Are you trying to record from long distances and/or super quiet sources?
Old 13th May 2018
  #5495
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Strick9 View Post
The Rode is super quiet, like the CM-1s. But the Warblers aren't noisy. I have 3 and an iD22 and don't have any noise issues. I've got a Sterling ST-51 and that thing is noisy. Something like 22db of self noise.

Are you trying to record from long distances and/or super quiet sources?

Recording vocals from just a few metres away. Through a 5m Mogami gold xlr lead. Have the gain set to just below half, as above that the noise is unbearable. So my recordings are quiet and sem a little distorted with a visible jagged line in the wave forms when the vocal is silent.
Old 13th May 2018
  #5496
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greaterhornbill View Post
Recording vocals from just a few metres away. Through a 5m Mogami gold xlr lead. Have the gain set to just below half, as above that the noise is unbearable. So my recordings are quiet and sem a little distorted with a visible jagged line in the wave forms when the vocal is silent.

have you tried tightening the mic body? I’m sure I read (in this thread?) that someone experienced noise and it was because the body wasn’t screwed tight enough causing grounding issues.

Also, a few metres away?
Old 13th May 2018
  #5497
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greaterhornbill View Post
Recording vocals from just a few metres away. Through a 5m Mogami gold xlr lead. Have the gain set to just below half, as above that the noise is unbearable. So my recordings are quiet and sem a little distorted with a visible jagged line in the wave forms when the vocal is silent.
So when recoding from a few meters away with the Rode, do you have to have the gain as high? I'm thinking may be the pre amp could be introducing the noise or are you in a quiet room, as turning up the gain high enough to record vocals from a few meters away means turning up any room or street noises etc.

However, I can't remember the specs of either but I'd guess the Rode could be as quiet as some of their others, around 7dB (A) and the warbler may be still quiet at around 14dB (A), which at "normal" recording distances for vocals, this would not be an issue at all, but at a few meters, then 7dB gets more significant.

I use mics that are not as quiet as the Warblers, but never have noise problems in 'normal situations".
Old 13th May 2018
  #5498
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Funk View Post
So when recoding from a few meters away with the Rode, do you have to have the gain as high? I'm thinking may be the pre amp could be introducing the noise or are you in a quiet room, as turning up the gain high enough to record vocals from a few meters away means turning up any room or street noises etc.

However, I can't remember the specs of either but I'd guess the Rode could be as quiet as some of their others, around 7dB (A) and the warbler may be still quiet at around 14dB (A), which at "normal" recording distances for vocals, this would not be an issue at all, but at a few meters, then 7dB gets more significant.

I use mics that are not as quiet as the Warblers, but never have noise problems in 'normal situations".
Sorry for the confusion, recording at the regulation 6 inches from the mic, with the mic about 5 metres from the laptop in a quiet room. Gain is exactly the same as the Rode.
Old 13th May 2018
  #5499
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jake_SJL View Post
have you tried tightening the mic body? I’m sure I read (in this thread?) that someone experienced noise and it was because the body wasn’t screwed tight enough causing grounding issues.

Also, a few metres away?

Nice tip on the Mic Body, tried tightening it but made no difference.

Confusion over the distance, only 6 inches from mic which is about 5m from laptop. Haha.
Old 13th May 2018
  #5500
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Dr. Jule's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Greaterhornbill View Post
Bought the Warbler Mk VI, going through Audient iD14 into Ableton Live 9, in my laptop setup and it is so much noisier than my Rode NT1-A.
Give it some time. My GZ251fet was super noisy after arrivel (a moisture/temperature thing from shipping?) and was getting quiet after a couple of days.

My Warbler and CM-1's where quiet from the beginning though.

If it stays noise contact GZ.
Old 14th May 2018
  #5501
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greaterhornbill View Post
Nice tip on the Mic Body, tried tightening it but made no difference.

Confusion over the distance, only 6 inches from mic which is about 5m from laptop. Haha.
Too bad, it was worth a try.

It really shouldn’t be that noisy though, mine isn’t at all.

Definitely confusion over the distance lol
Old 15th May 2018
  #5502
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greaterhornbill View Post
Sorry for the confusion, recording at the regulation 6 inches from the mic, with the mic about 5 metres from the laptop in a quiet room. Gain is exactly the same as the Rode.
haha. OK, well I have recorded with mics with 22dB of self noise and it's not been an issue, so a Warbler should be plenty quiet enough.

Like suggested, it may be moisture or something. I'd contact GZ in a few days if it's still there. may be make a recording of the noise and send it to him with the settings of the pre amp etc.
Old 23rd June 2018
  #5503
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Rocket88's Avatar
Must. Keep. Thread. Going.
Old 16th July 2018
  #5504
Here for the gear
Rode NT2 (modified) vs. Warbler MKI, MKID or the GZ67fet

I posted this in another thread and haven't gotten any responses. Let's try this one...Thanks in advance.

Has anyone compared the Rode NT2 with an RK-47 capsule in it to either of the Warbler MKI, MKID or the GZ67fet microphones?

With all of the newer mics that have come out in the last 15 years or so...do you think it is worth it to mod an original Rode NT2?

Has anyone had any experiences with John Bonnell's mod or Michael Joly's mod on the NT2?

Thanks in advance.
Old 16th July 2018
  #5505
Quote:
Originally Posted by miscend View Post
Do you have an audio demo for GZ800 tune yet?
https://www.gearslutz.com/board/showpost.php?p=13419940&postcount=362
Old 16th July 2018
  #5506
Gear Nut
 
Strick9's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dptaylor74 View Post
I posted this in another thread and haven't gotten any responses. Let's try this one...Thanks in advance.

Has anyone compared the Rode NT2 with an RK-47 capsule in it to either of the Warbler MKI, MKID or the GZ67fet microphones?

With all of the newer mics that have come out in the last 15 years or so...do you think it is worth it to mod an original Rode NT2?

Has anyone had any experiences with John Bonnell's mod or Michael Joly's mod on the NT2?

Thanks in advance.
The NT2 is actually a decent mic with quality parts. Whether or not you want to mod it, depends on what you’re looking for. Those mic modder places like M-P and Joly are trying to sell their services or capsules, and call every Chinese mic bright, peaky, and harsh to sell stuff.

The circuit has good electronic components and the capsule is nice. It’s a 797 audio piece with their nice K67, designed by Jim Williams. GZ worked for 797, and that’s probably why those capsules are so nice compared to the 32mm K67 in MXLs and other Chinese mics. It’s essentially the same as the Behringer B2 Pro, or at least the older ones with the heads that come off like U87s.

You can change out the capacitors in the head amp to polystyrene, but everything else is fine.

Like I mentioned, the capsule is nice. It is a little brighter than the MKID, but not harsh like other K67s. If you want a darker mic, then think about the capsule.

I have several B2s and an MKID. They’re both nice mics. The 3u is darker past 5 or 6khz and more vintage sounding.

If you want a darker mic with more midrange, try something different like an MKII or buy the capsule for the Rode from 3u. Don’t bother with RK whatever capsules, 3u capsules sound better. I’ve got an M49 clone, and the 3u K47 makes an RK-47 sound like a cheap K67.
Old 16th July 2018
  #5507
Here for the gear
The NT2 is actually a decent mic with quality parts. Whether or not you want to mod it, depends on what you’re looking for. Those mic modder places like M-P and Joly are trying to sell their services or capsules, and call every Chinese mic bright, peaky, and harsh to sell stuff.

Thank you so much for the great feedback! That was the sense I gathered after reading over the forum posts the last several months. I went through this 3U forum twice to make sure that I hadn’t missed anything. I am very appreciative for those of you that have been willing to listen and give advice to those of us that haven’t been in the game that long or just haven’t worked with audio/recording for some time. As an aside, I was on this forum a long time ago under a different name and I remember reading posts from several of you guys from back in the day. It’s cool to see the ones of you I remember (And no I wasn’t kicked out, I lost my password and have no idea what email address I used on the account back then circa 2000 – it was either this forum or the homerecording.com one).

The circuit has good electronic components and the capsule is nice. It’s a 797 audio piece with their nice K67, designed by Jim Williams. GZ worked for 797, and that’s probably why those capsules are so nice compared to the 32mm K67 in MXLs and other Chinese mics. It’s essentially the same as the Behringer B2 Pro, or at least the older ones with the heads that come off like U87s.

Not that their “modifications” aren’t worth it, but my gut feeling was that for the price I could buy a brand new Warbler and just keep one or both of the NT2’s I have. I am not sure it is a sentimental attachment to that microphone, but I had thought about doing whatever it needed to make it the best it could be. Bottom line is I like the way it sounds, but I am sure that there are better choices sonically with the advancements we have made in technology since 1995, lol.

You can change out the capacitors in the head amp to polystyrene, but everything else is fine.

I have looked for a good while to try and find more information about this…really just to see what it would cost to have it modded by someone or if I was able to get the parts and try to do it myself.

Like I mentioned, the capsule is nice. It is a little brighter than the MKID, but not harsh like other K67s. If you want a darker mic, then think about the capsule.

I have several B2s and an MKID. They’re both nice mics. The 3u is darker past 5 or 6khz and more vintage sounding.

I believe that I would like it to sound “more vintage and darker.”

If you want a darker mic with more midrange, try something different like an MKII or buy the capsule for the Rode from 3u. Don’t bother with RK whatever capsules, 3u capsules sound better. I’ve got an M49 clone, and the 3u K47 makes an RK-47 sound like a cheap K67.

Are you able to order just the capsule from Mr. Guosheng?

I have really been curious about the Warbler I, the MKID and the GZ67fet. A good buddy of mine who runs a studio in town recommended that GZ251fet for me to try. He said that would sound “killer” on my voice. He hasn’t tried any of the 3U offerings, he was just going by the descriptions that GZ has made public and the many years of experience he has had with all different types of microphones.
Old 16th July 2018
  #5508
Gear Nut
 
Strick9's Avatar
 

@dptaylor74 You can order capsules from 3U directly. Just send him an email. There's several of each style. Bright/Modern Warbler VI K67, Vintage Warbler I K67, and a flat K67 I've read about in another forum that's not in any of his current mics. There's two different K47 capsules, and also 3 different CK-12 type capsules (C-12, M 251, and dark). You can get single sided or dual sided.

Use 1000pf 100v polystyrene coupling caps, between the capsule and the circuit and the pattern switch. It's pretty easy to do yourself. If you don't feel comfortable, I bet you could find someone locally to do the mod. Maybe a guitar amp or electronics repair place. They can probably solder up a capsule, if you decide to go that route.

All of the 3U mics are great. I really don't think you could go wrong with any of them. If I had to recommend you one, it would be the MKIVD or GZ251. The MKI is darker than the Rode, but it's not a whole lot different in overall vibe. The MKIV is very flat in cardioid, but you can add some upper midrange and vintage vibe in Fig 8. You can also roll off the top end with the V2 or V3 settings and make it darker.

It would be really cool if you could get a MKIVD, a 3U K47 capsule for one of the Rodes, and keep the original capsule in the other Rode. You could have 3 different sounding mics for less than one GZ.
Old 17th July 2018
  #5509
Here for the gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strick9 View Post
@dptaylor74 You can order capsules from 3U directly. Just send him an email. There's several of each style. Bright/Modern Warbler VI K67, Vintage Warbler I K67, and a flat K67 I've read about in another forum that's not in any of his current mics. There's two different K47 capsules, and also 3 different CK-12 type capsules (C-12, M 251, and dark). You can get single sided or dual sided.

Use 1000pf 100v polystyrene coupling caps, between the capsule and the circuit and the pattern switch. It's pretty easy to do yourself. If you don't feel comfortable, I bet you could find someone locally to do the mod. Maybe a guitar amp or electronics repair place. They can probably solder up a capsule, if you decide to go that route.

All of the 3U mics are great. I really don't think you could go wrong with any of them. If I had to recommend you one, it would be the MKIVD or GZ251. The MKI is darker than the Rode, but it's not a whole lot different in overall vibe. The MKIV is very flat in cardioid, but you can add some upper midrange and vintage vibe in Fig 8. You can also roll off the top end with the V2 or V3 settings and make it darker.

It would be really cool if you could get a MKIVD, a 3U K47 capsule for one of the Rodes, and keep the original capsule in the other Rode. You could have 3 different sounding mics for less than one GZ.

Thanks so much for the detailed reply. I think that's a great idea to have three different sounding mics. I am really interested in the MKIVD now that you and a good buddy of mine have mentioned it. After hearing it, I guess I can then decide if I want to upgrade to the GZfet version.

I have already email GZ to inquire about the capsules. Regarding the polystyrene coupling caps, do you know how many of these I would need and also, do you have a recommendation on where is the best place to buy them? I have heard that you have to be careful buying certain items on eBay, etc. due to quality control.

At the moment, I also have a Blue Baby Bottle and a Rode NTK with a 70's NOS Siemens 6922 tube. I just recently got this and I have not have a chance to test it out in a good environment, although I have done the burn in. My room is 10x10 with a concrete floor with half carpet and a window - so I am not sure the NTK will work great as of now. But that's another story.
Old 17th July 2018
  #5510
Gear Maniac
 
askomiko's Avatar
 

I used a gz67 and NoHype LRM2 ribbon mic as overheads, they were similar enough to work as a pair without eq! Intresting.
Old 17th July 2018
  #5511
Gear Nut
 
Strick9's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dptaylor74 View Post
Thanks so much for the detailed reply. I think that's a great idea to have three different sounding mics. I am really interested in the MKIVD now that you and a good buddy of mine have mentioned it. After hearing it, I guess I can then decide if I want to upgrade to the GZfet version.

I have already email GZ to inquire about the capsules. Regarding the polystyrene coupling caps, do you know how many of these I would need and also, do you have a recommendation on where is the best place to buy them? I have heard that you have to be careful buying certain items on eBay, etc. due to quality control.

At the moment, I also have a Blue Baby Bottle and a Rode NTK with a 70's NOS Siemens 6922 tube. I just recently got this and I have not have a chance to test it out in a good environment, although I have done the burn in. My room is 10x10 with a concrete floor with half carpet and a window - so I am not sure the NTK will work great as of now. But that's another story.
I'm happy to help!

I'll have to look and see where I got my capacitors tonight. They're not easy to find, i remember that. You need two of them for each mic.

The capsules in the Blue and NTK are RK-12s. That should give you an idea of the response of edge terminated capsules versus center terminated capsules. They're probably not as smooth, flat, or have the depth of the MKIV capsules, but I haven't compared them directly to each other in the same microphone like I have with the RK-47 vs the 3U K47. I've only compared the modded pair of MXL's I had with RK-12s to my MKIV pair, and to a C414 B-ULS pair.
Old 18th July 2018
  #5512
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Dr. Jule's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Strick9 View Post
They're probably not as smooth, flat, or have the depth of the MKIV capsules, but I haven't compared them directly to each other in the same microphone like I have with the RK-47 vs the 3U K47.

It would be awsome to hear a clip of RK-47 vs 3U K47! Any chance?
Old 18th July 2018
  #5513
Have had a Warbler 127 with Cardioid Flat and Omni Flat capsules for a while now, love it, wish I had bought a matched pair...
Old 18th July 2018
  #5514
Here for the gear
super smooth 87 style capsule for a flat circuit

@Strick9

I just received an email from GZ.

He said that he has a super smooth 87 style capsule for a flat circuit in a single and a dual diaphragm style. He said Rode changed the model during production and he needed to know which one I have. I am going to send him some photos when I get back home tonight. I have included the response curve that he sent me as well, entitled "super smooth 87 capsule for flat circuit".

He also stated that the Warbler and GZfet mics might be available in a black mat finish around August.

Lastly, he is going back to China next week and is going to check on the polystyrene capacitors! What an awesome dude! Ha.

Thanks again for all of your help and suggestions...it surely is making this process more understandable!
Attached Thumbnails
Affordable LDC Microphone With Multiple Voicings-super-smooth-87-capsule-flat-circuit.jpg  
Old 18th July 2018
  #5515
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermetech Mastering View Post
Have had a Warbler 127 with Cardioid Flat and Omni Flat capsules for a while now, love it, wish I had bought a matched pair...
What instruments have you been liking them on the most? Looking at a pair myself and just curious.
Old 18th July 2018
  #5516
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ogilthorpe View Post
What instruments have you been liking them on the most? Looking at a pair myself and just curious.
100% Acoustic Guitar, main thing I play and record, and main reason I got it. Have preferred KM84s in shootouts but it's not $1k better sounding.
Old 19th July 2018
  #5517
Gear Nut
 
Strick9's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. Jule View Post
It would be awsome to hear a clip of RK-47 vs 3U K47! Any chance?
I'll try to make some comparison clips soon.
Old 19th July 2018
  #5518
Here for the gear
I received another response from GZ.

So, the NT2 that I was thinking about getting modified is the "transformerless circuit with a flat frequency response design" according to GZ. He also stated that of the capsules he has, the 47, the standard 87 and the smoother 87 would all work. He also asked if I felt the mic had too much top end? I honestly do not know...I haven't had much to compare it to yet. I have compared both of the NT2's and one has more top end than the other (comment from the engineer that tested both of them a few months back). GZ also stated that they have the saddles and screws for mounting, if needed.

Would the super smooth capsule make it more like the Warbler I or the MKID?

I still like the idea of putting in a 47...to diversify the mic locker.

@Strick9 - what's your take on this?

Happy Thursday everyone.

Last edited by dptaylor74; 19th July 2018 at 06:18 PM.. Reason: I can't spell...
Old 19th July 2018
  #5519
Gear Nut
 
Strick9's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dptaylor74 View Post
I received another response from GZ.

So, the NT2 that I was thinking about getting modified is the "transformerless circuit with a flat frequency response design" according to GZ. He also stated that of the capsules he has, the 47, the standard 87 and the smoother 87 would all work. He also asked if I felt the mic had too much top end? I honestly do not know...I haven't had much to compare it to yet. I have compared both of the NT2's and one has more top end than the other (comment from the engineer that tested both of them a few months back). GZ also stated that they have the saddles and screws for mounting, if needed.

Would the super smooth capsule make it more like the Warbler I or the MKID?

I still like the idea of putting in a 47...to diversify the mic locker.

@Strick9 - what's your take on this?

Happy Thursday everyone.
Both the Rode and 3U circuits are flat. The standard 87/Warbler I/MKID capsule would make it most like the Warbler I. That smooth capsule would kind of split the difference between the Warbler I and the NT2. I'm sure it will still sound awesome, but I don't think it would be a big difference.

I think that one of the 47 capsules is a better idea because it has more upper mids and the top end rolls off faster than the Warbler I capsule.

You need to try out those other two mics you have before you make a decision. Perform your own comparisons between them and the NT2s in both cardioid and Figure 8. That will go a long way in helping you find what works best for you.
Old 19th July 2018
  #5520
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bowzin's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermetech Mastering View Post
100% Acoustic Guitar, main thing I play and record, and main reason I got it. Have preferred KM84s in shootouts but it's not $1k better sounding.
Also love the 127's (cardioid flats here), so far primarily on acoustic guitar, drum OH, and anything requiring a stereo mic setup. They definitely sound great in stereo.

Very forgiving, hard to get a bad sound out of them. I even like 'em slightly better than KM184's FWIW... little bit more character. I don't use SDC's to mic orchestras, I'm just recording rock/folk, etc. For $500/pair (!!!) these have been a home run for us.
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