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Behringer BCF2000 user questions
Old 15th November 2008
  #1
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Behringer BCF2000 user questions

Hi there.

Im thinking abut doing a DIY project involving a BCF2000.

I need to know a few things tho.

1. Is there a limit to how many units (just bcfs) can be cascaded?
2. Are you guys daisy chaining them via midi, or using them on separate usb ports?
3. is it possible to use a bcf2000 along side and with a dedicated transport control, ie frontier tranzport for example?

Im basically looking to put together a custom daw controller. 2x rackmount 16 fader with solo, mute and bank functions. Thats it.

I had a look at midibox.com, but rather than starting from scratch, im considering butchering a couple of BCFs together.

Many thanks,

Oz
Old 16th November 2008
  #2
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FeatheredSerpent's Avatar
 

One of the units connects to the pc via usb, and then cascading is done through the 'real' midi ports.
That's if you want to use just one usb port for two devices.
The Tranzport - I don't know. I don't think you'll have any idea of whether it would play nicely with the BCF's until you try it.
I don't know what protocol they use for it.
By the way, I've got a white BCF2000 for sale here, mint condition and only about 3 months old if you're missing one for your experiment
Old 16th November 2008
  #3
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Thanks for your reply, I may be interested.

Is there a limit to how many you can cascade?

Where abouts are you? Im in the UK.

PM me the details.

Cheers,

Oz
Old 16th November 2008
  #4
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bitman's Avatar
I use 3 via separate usb connections straight to the pc as a hub would not work. I would use 4, but I ran out of desk space. I understand you cannot cascade more than 2 via MIDI cables.

I use mine in Mackie Emulation under Sonar.
Old 16th November 2008
  #5
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Chris Williams's Avatar
 

Someone had a thread either here or on the reaper forum where they were making a custom wood enclosure for a couple of bcfs.

Have a dig around, looked really nice man.

I was thinking of this earlier in the year as well and contacted behringer, they said you can attatch atleast 4 using the midi cables, maybe more.
Old 16th November 2008
  #6
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Ozzy's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Williams View Post
Someone had a thread either here or on the reaper forum where they were making a custom wood enclosure for a couple of bcfs.

Have a dig around, looked really nice man.

I was thinking of this earlier in the year as well and contacted behringer, they said you can attatch atleast 4 using the midi cables, maybe more.
That's awesome.
If I go ahead with this, I will build cpletely new cases for them, with new buttons and fader caps etc.

I want to have 2 bcfs per rackmount module, so that's good news that you can daisy chain 4.

Hope your settling in ok chris, much more gearslut per Sqr mile that side of the pond lol!

Cheers,
Oz
Old 16th November 2008
  #7
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You can attach as many via midi cables as is possible until you reacha midi bottleneck, that is the only limitation, BUT, with more than 2 cascaded you lose the parameter feedback.
So if you wanted a load of units all with parameter feedback, you would do it in groups of two per 1 usb port.
That's what I gleaned from the manual anyways but you may want to double check with Behringer.

ps PM sent!
Old 16th November 2008
  #8
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Yeah loving it here man. got settled in our own aprtment and just put together a nice lil quad core so I can tinker with my guitar a bit till I bring my other stuff over next year
Old 17th November 2008
  #9
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7161's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by FeatheredSerpent View Post
One of the units connects to the pc via usb, and then cascading is done through the 'real' midi ports.
that's not right cos each unit needs a different id

i can use 2, but cant try more as i only have 2, lol

cascading works 100% in logic, and not as well in cubase cos cubase doesnt recognise the bank change commands.

basicaly each unit is installed in the sequencer as a new mackie control unit or a logic control unit or a hui

i made some vids.. i never finshed them all sry, but ...

Behringer BCF 2000 - BEHRINGER BCF 2000, Total Recall USB/MIDI Controller with 8 Motor-Faders, cascadeable Total Recall M
Old 17th November 2008
  #10
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Yeah, but you set the id value from the front panel.
When two are linked, the master (via usb) is set to the expanded usb mode (4), and the slave is set in stand-alone mode 3.
Master midi outA sends parameter feedback from the computer to slave midi in, and slave controller data is sent to master midi in, then it's merged and sent to the pc via usb.

I don't know if the units intelligently step up and down with each other (ripple) with regards to fader banks though, haven't tried it.
Old 28th November 2008
  #11
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7161's Avatar
 

well mine are working together and thats how i did it.
Old 28th November 2008
  #12
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Coil's Avatar
 

i`ve got a bcr2000 working togehter with an alphatrack in logic - no problem here
Old 28th November 2008
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Williams View Post
Someone had a thread either here or on the reaper forum where they were making a custom wood enclosure for a couple of bcfs.

Have a dig around, looked really nice man.
.
So I want faders.....but which ones?



i'd just do thin sides though out of sanded down 1"x2-3" wood though and use the original side screw holes to secure them. faster, smaller, and still similar look.

(fyi, joat's pic is unstained)
Attached Thumbnails
Behringer BCF2000 user questions-gearslutzdemo.jpg-via-joat.jpg  
Old 28th November 2008
  #14
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Yeah, unstained and still unfinished. I should make templates for these out of this proto. After that I can produce them as needed. I have already negotiated a deal with a company that is willing to produce the woodwork for them.

But this is just a side project of mine, and my actual work has kept me from focusing on this. I'm also scouting on different knobs and sliders, since Behringers own are kind of cheap looking. Fader knobs in particular. Someone said they look and feel like jellybeans, and I tend to agree.

The plan is to make these upgrades as packages with everything included exept BCF / BCR's. For that I need to sort the design to be easily installable without modifications to the units themselves.

As for staining and wood, there will be plenty of options. Probably for the knobs as well. The final products will be made with professional tools and by professional woodsmiths. Unlike the woodwork in this proto which is made by me with hobbyist tools.
Old 28th November 2008
  #15
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You might want to do a version that has a dry marker "write strip" under the faders for quick marking of channel faders. Using a tape strip would mess up the nice woodwork.
Old 28th November 2008
  #16
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A scribble strip is actually a very good idea. I have to see how this could be incorporated as an option. Personally I like the armrest to be without dents so I can rest my arms on it. But it could be quite easy to incorporate the scribble strip as well.

What is the plastic called that's usually used in making them?
Old 28th November 2008
  #17
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Ozzy's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coil View Post
i`ve got a bcr2000 working togehter with an alphatrack in logic - no problem here
thats encouraging, thanks!

Ill bring the tranzport back from the studio after I finish the session Im working on atm, and give it a go.


Those wooden cheeks look cool, good luck with the project!

My unit is gonna be a bit different. Im basically trying to make two BCFs look like a Neve 8804 (with v-pots).

I want to end up with 2 of these, and am currently dreaming of a sterling modular console with a Neve 8804 right in the middle and 2 of these units either side, giving the illusion of a big arse console with a fluid look.

I would have gone for the Euphonix mc system, but no PC support= no deal!

Ive been so busy at the studio that I havent spent any real time on this, but have dismantled my first BCF, and currently seeing how I can chop the PCB so the two banks of 8 faders can sit right next to each other, as apposed to edit keys between them. The major stumbling point atm is the fact that the PCBs are printed both sides, and the tracks are abolutely miniscule, so its gonna be really hard to "mod" by hand.

Will keep this thread updated with my progress.

cheers guys,

Oz
Old 29th November 2008
  #18
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Remember to post lots of pictures when you start to mod those behringers. I for one am very intrested to see how you tackle the challenges that arise from the mod of that magnitude.

Good luck, and keep us posted!
Old 29th November 2008
  #19
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Will do mate.

Im treating this as a bit of an experiment while im building up enough outboard to make the move. 13 pres, 6 eqs and a few £ comps to go

Anyways, just to wet your apitites, heres what it looks like at the moment (thank dfegadapple for the ****ty pic quality)
Thanks to FetheredSerpant for being a cool guy to deal withthumbsup

Oz
Attached Thumbnails
Behringer BCF2000 user questions-img_0120.jpg  
Old 11th January 2009
  #20
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Any progress on this project yet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by audiovisceral View Post
So I want faders.....but which ones?



i'd just do thin sides though out of sanded down 1"x2-3" wood though and use the original side screw holes to secure them. faster, smaller, and still similar look.

(fyi, joat's pic is unstained)
Old 11th January 2009
  #21
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Havent really had a chance to fiddle recently, due to xmas and lots of work.

The main problem I have atm is figuring out how I am going to split the circuit board as its printed on both sides. (I was going to cut the tracks, then wire in a simple loom, but itll be impossible to do, as it drilling the holes to solder on the loom, id ruin the track on the other side).

I also need to buy another bcf to figure out how its all going to hook up together.

This is really just a sideline project while im building up my pres etc to make the full move.

I guess im also hoping some company out there will beat me to it, and build whats essentially the housing of a neve 8804 but with 16 motorized fader and cut/ solo buttons. However it seems no manufacturers finger is on the pulse of consumers and contollers at the moment.

Heres hoping?!

Oz
Old 27th January 2009
  #22
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Scott Cairns's Avatar
 

I noticed you can buy metal faders on Ebay: metalized f ALPS, Business Industrial items on eBay.com

I wonder if they're too heavy for the BCF2000, considering the motorised faders that come with it are plastic?
Old 27th January 2009
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozzy View Post
Thanks to FetheredSerpant for being a cool guy to deal withthumbsup

Oz
Likewise!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Cairns View Post
I noticed you can buy metal faders on Ebay: metalized f ALPS, Business Industrial items on eBay.com

I wonder if they're too heavy for the BCF2000, considering the motorised faders that come with it are plastic?
Ooh, nice link, they'll look nice on my spirit 328 heh
Old 28th January 2009
  #24
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Scott Cairns's Avatar
 

Save some for me.
Old 29th January 2009
  #25
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Michael Maeurer's Avatar
Let me also answer your questions:

1. Is there a limit to how many units (just bcfs) can be cascaded?
Not really, just give it different IDs. But as far as I know the HUI protocol does maximum 32 faders.

2. Are you guys daisy chaining them via midi, or using them on separate usb ports?
Can do with USB, but set different IDs.

3. is it possible to use a bcf2000 along side and with a dedicated transport control, ie frontier tranzport for example?
If the sequencer supports it, yes.

Old 29th January 2009
  #26
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Use it with Tranzport in Sonar.
Old 29th January 2009
  #27
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Ozzy's Avatar
 

Thanks for the responses guys.

As I said, this project is on hold for a while, coz Im really busy atm.

I am still thinkin on workarounds for the pcb at the moment, coz the dual sided issue has stumpted me.

Oz
Old 8th February 2009
  #28
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I had a frame built for my controller, I also have some brushed metal Alps faders on order. Thread is here: So I pimped my Daw controller..
Old 8th February 2009
  #29
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I notice that the new version of the BFC200 has an internal power supply (no wall wart). Did they up the quality control on the new units also, i.e. no more noisy motorized faders?
Old 24th April 2009
  #30
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Progress

Hi chaps,

Finally had some time to develop this a bit more.

I decided against cutting the PCB, it was just too awkward, so its gonna be 1 bcf per rack module.

This kinda works with my new "revised" plan of ditching the intended 8816, and going with an SSL Xdesk instead.

*Please approach the rest with a bit of creative vision, this is still early stages*

Heres what the new 7U front plate looks like...



Obviously it needs painting and engraving or silkscreening etc yet. This is more a prototype.

Heres what I hope itll look like once in its new home. Itll be painted the same gunmetal grey as the XDesk...


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