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Bass DI's Sans amp RBIi?Radial?or Countryman? Direct Injection & Re-amp Boxes
Old 18th August 2008
  #1
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PyroDano's Avatar
 

Bass DI's Sans amp RBIi?Radial?or Countryman?

I'm looking to start saving for a DI rather than just going into the input of the FW mixer.

I'm pretty much a newb to recording and was wondering what you slutz would recommend for a versatile(tone wise and active or passive) DI.I personally love what i call the TOOL Bass tone found on most tool cd's<but i know this is'nt what everyone would want all the time on everything,but if at all possible i would love to tune/tone that sound in.

My 2 pre's are FMR RNP and ART MPA Gold(telefunken tubes).If this makes a difference.

I will most likely be recording rock/hard rock/metal

I guess suggestions dont have to be limited to the message title.But i can't afford a reddi.

Also why would one choose an active Radial to a passive as the active seems to introduce unwanted noise?Just curious.TIA
Old 18th August 2008
  #2
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GordZilla's Avatar
 

The Radial DIs are pretty darn good... the passive JDI has a Jensen tranny and sounds awesome (great detail, nice low end, excellent clarity)... the active J48 is equally awesome, (with maybe a touch more fidelity in the bottom and top ends). Both are built like brick s**t houses... very tough and well made.

If you don't mind paying a bit more... the class-A active Radial JDV Mk3 is arguably one of the nicest sounding DIs you can get... absolutely stunning detail and fidelity.. and it's "drag control" feature allows you to taylor the load on your pickups for uber-accurate response. I use mine for tracking Bass and guitars... often re-amping afterwards with the also excellent Radial X-Amp re-amp box.

Regards
Old 19th August 2008
  #3
Gear Maniac
 
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Thanks for the response.I did see the Radial JDV Mk3 while searching it's defiantly an option.

I noticed while searching everyone praises the reddi because it's really clean.Well what if the bass's themselves are just kinda sub par,can you still dial a DI in to try and change the tone up a bit?

I also see the JDV is active.I'm still not sure what the advantages/disadvantages of active vs passive,or when one is used over the other.
Old 19th August 2008
  #4
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close/far's Avatar
 

Ditto on Radial gear, though I tend to hear a kind of top-end roll-off with my JDI (the Jensen Xformer passive DI). These sound GREAT with a bright and/or active bass, but sometimes dull out certain instruments too much.

For the Tool tone, you'd definitely prefer the brighter tone of the Radial active, something like the J48. But I'll also agree with moracspace that you should own the Tech21.

As always, the instrument and player in front of it are really going to determine how the bass comes across and what you should use down the line.
Old 19th August 2008
  #5
Gear Maniac
 
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Hmm,i guess I'll have to forget the tool tone for now as i can't afford any kind of live rig for other people to play or record through at this time.

So i guess it's between one of the Radials or the Tech21.
Thanks for the suggestions.

Man i swear a few months ago before i found gear slutz i was a drummer lol. Spent $3500 over the last 6 weeks(not including the FW interface,my S#$tty lil monitors or the PC i built)And i feel i haven't even scrathced the surface.

I want more ,more,more,so addicting. I'm hoping one day to put it all to use,lol.
Old 19th August 2008
  #6
Lives for gear
What don't you like about the DI on the RNP? Reason I ask, I have several good stand alone DIs and I've used the DIs on the RNP with good results. That being said, I'll understand if you'd want a stand alone tho..!...heh...Good luck
Old 19th August 2008
  #7
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Snatchman , To be honest i haven't even hooked up the RNP yet.I just got it out of the box and looked at it so far.Same goes for the ART,With the exception that i just received NOS matched telefunken ribbed plate today and just put them in.(burning them in)

Im trying to get an engineer(friend of a friend) over hear to help me hook all my new stuff out so i dont mess anything up.

I guess I'm looking for other options,or maybe i don't need anything more for bass??? Hmm.... I know i never really liked the tones achieved with plugging a bass in dirsct into either my friends Mackie or Korg d1600.I haven't tried my $100 Dean into my FW board,but i can just imagine,lol.
Old 19th August 2008
  #8
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by PyroDano View Post
I'm looking to start saving for a DI rather than just going into the input of the FW mixer.

I'm pretty much a newb to recording and was wondering what you slutz would recommend for a versatile(tone wise and active or passive) DI.I personally love what i call the TOOL Bass tone found on most tool cd's<but i know this is'nt what everyone would want all the time on everything,but if at all possible i would love to tune/tone that sound in.

My 2 pre's are FMR RNP and ART MPA Gold(telefunken tubes).If this makes a difference.

I will most likely be recording rock/hard rock/metal

I guess suggestions dont have to be limited to the message title.But i can't afford a reddi.

Also why would one choose an active Radial to a passive as the active seems to introduce unwanted noise?Just curious.TIA
I have the Radial JDI and I have to admit I can't tell the difference between it and the 1/4 ins on my Emu 1616m when recording bass direct (same thing with guitar.) I kind of wish I had bought a sansamp instead.
Old 19th August 2008
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PyroDano View Post
I know i never really liked the tones achieved with plugging a bass in dirsct into either my friends Mackie or Korg d1600.
because they are line level inputs with a much lower impedance than is used for instrument level. the RNP has actual instrument level inputs. im not saying do or dont buy a DI just try what you have first. (a Radial or similar DI is next on my list on things to buy as well so your not alone in your buying frenzy.)

oh and hooking things up right or wrong is when you learn, as long as your not playing with mains power there is no danger so just get stuck into it and dont be afraid to make a mistake.
Old 19th August 2008
  #10
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conquest's Avatar
 

+1 for the TECH 21 RBI. Great tool for Live and Studio. I use it live through a dbx 166xl into a crown amp. In the Studio I use it as a DI, and or have used it to split the signal. The effected output going directly to tape, while the unaffected going into a bass head and cabinet, and micing the cabinet. I have a mic cable wired out of phase that I use for one of the signal which has worked fine.

The RADIAL DI's are great but just not as flexable.
Old 19th August 2008
  #11
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allencollins's Avatar
 

I just don't understand the love for sansamp di's
They are crap. It boggles my mind.

Buy an api preamp or even a cheaper Grace / RNP or something.
There are 100's of better options than sansamps.

Those things kill your tone. They're fine for noisy club gigs
not for serious recording. Those things are below 'low end'.
Old 19th August 2008
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allencollins View Post
I just don't understand the love for sansamp di's
different strokes.
they have a particular sound that is good for particular styles, no one will ever say they are good for everything. when not using it as a sans amp its still a good DI. obviously not worth it if you are only looking for a DI but a good feature regardless.

Of course like any piece of gear it does need the setting right, if we all judge a piece of gear to be bad as soon as we heard something bad out of it we would never like anything.
Old 19th August 2008
  #13
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GordZilla's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by aussie_techie View Post
different strokes.
they have a particular sound that is good for particular styles, no one will ever say they are good for everything. when not using it as a sans amp its still a good DI. obviously not worth it if you are only looking for a DI but a good feature regardless.

Of course like any piece of gear it does need the setting right, if we all judge a piece of gear to be bad as soon as we heard something bad out of it we would never like anything.
Gotta agree with that... different strokes for sure

This is why a Countryman Type 85 works for some, and an MXR Bass DI+ works for others.... or a Solo 610... or a Grace... etc. etc.

Personally... I like the sound of my bass, going into my JDV, going into my Grace... but that's me.. and I would never say that it would be the best way... just my way
Old 19th August 2008
  #14
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by PyroDano View Post
Snatchman , To be honest i haven't even hooked up the RNP yet.I just got it out of the box and looked at it so far.Same goes for the ART,With the exception that i just received NOS matched telefunken ribbed plate today and just put them in.(burning them in)

Im trying to get an engineer(friend of a friend) over hear to help me hook all my new stuff out so i dont mess anything up.

I guess I'm looking for other options,or maybe i don't need anything more for bass??? Hmm.... I know i never really liked the tones achieved with plugging a bass in dirsct into either my friends Mackie or Korg d1600.I haven't tried my $100 Dean into my FW board,but i can just imagine,lol.
Yes, the DI input on the RNP will sound "better" than the inputs on the Mackie as the previous poster has implied. Try it before buying another, at least you will be giving yourself another option. Good luck...
Old 20th August 2008
  #15
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by allencollins View Post
I just don't understand the love for sansamp di's
They are crap. It boggles my mind.

Buy an api preamp or even a cheaper Grace / RNP or something.
There are 100's of better options than sansamps.

Those things kill your tone. They're fine for noisy club gigs
not for serious recording. Those things are below 'low end'.
I beg to differ, if you are going for a rock/SVT type of tone the RBI is great, if you want something cleaner/tamer, yes a good pre with DI is better.

I've got Great River, Calrec, True Systems, and a Hardy M-1 pre and 90% of the time I go with the RBI because it sounds like what I want the bass to sound like.

Not a good overall tool for a studio unless you are recording rock bass that needs to sound like that but gee at $300 you will not get remotely close to that sound with any other box.

I could not imagine a blander thing than running bass through a Grace DI, great pres for capturing pristine tone, but for rock bass just not the right tool, unless you are also running into an amp, micing that up, etc. which people don't do that much anymore, expect on higher end projects....this IS the LOW END forum after all heh

Analogeezer
Old 20th August 2008
  #16
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by PyroDano View Post
I'm looking to start saving for a DI rather than just going into the input of the FW mixer.

I'm pretty much a newb to recording and was wondering what you slutz would recommend for a versatile(tone wise and active or passive) DI.I personally love what i call the TOOL Bass tone found on most tool cd's<but i know this is'nt what everyone would want all the time on everything,but if at all possible i would love to tune/tone that sound in.

My 2 pre's are FMR RNP and ART MPA Gold(telefunken tubes).If this makes a difference.

I will most likely be recording rock/hard rock/metal

I guess suggestions dont have to be limited to the message title.But i can't afford a reddi.

Also why would one choose an active Radial to a passive as the active seems to introduce unwanted noise?Just curious.TIA
FWIW I am a bass player and most people really praise my live and recorded tone, but hey I'm no recording or bass god...

Anyway I love the Radial stuff, I own a passive D2, works great, also a host of really nice preamps, but I am also really into the dedicated bass preamp thing. I've got a Sansamp RBI in my recording rig, also I use an Ampeg SVP Pro sometimes (it's in a live rig but I can patch it in pretty quickly), and then an Ashly BP-41 in my "B Room"

If you are going for a Tool kinda tone, then proceed directly to the RBI, that will get you that sound.

Unless you are also recording an amp, using a clean DI will not get you that sound, if you need to get that sound directly an RBI or Ampeg bass pre is your best bet. Don't discount the Ashly BP-41 (hard to find, as it has been out of production for about 20 years, but you can find them for around $150, I paid $85 for mine) either.

Still at $300ish for the RBI, $500ish for the Ampeg pres, that's the route to go, especially if you are a bass player as opposed to just needing a DI for bass.

One thing to keep in mind with bass though, 90% of the tone is still in your hands, there is no magic box or pre that will get you "the sound" but I get much better results with a dedicated pre than using a DI or high quality mic pre, UNLESS I am also recording an amped track.

Analogeezer
Old 8th April 2009
  #17
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I'd like to get a DI that has a good true-bypass that won't alter the tone I send to amp at all.

I'd also like to use the dry track to reamp them sometimes.
And it needs to sound as good as possible on bass (that I could blend with a real amp).

I just need something that sounds "real" nd good, I'd rather have one that doesn't require a power supply and it needs to be robust like the radial are with their "protected buttons".

thanks
Old 8th April 2009
  #18
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Obitheincredible's Avatar
 

Any body try the DI's from Naiants?
http://www.naiant.com/dispecifications.html
Old 9th April 2009
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matskull View Post
I'd like to get a DI that has a good true-bypass that won't alter the tone I send to amp at all.

I'd also like to use the dry track to reamp them sometimes.
And it needs to sound as good as possible on bass (that I could blend with a real amp).

I just need something that sounds "real" nd good, I'd rather have one that doesn't require a power supply and it needs to be robust like the radial are with their "protected buttons".

thanks
almost all DIs have a 'through' wired in parallel with the input so its not adding anything in between your guitar and amp but using any device will change the loading which can in turn affect the sound. if you want to minimise any change make sure you use a DI with a high enough input impedance.
Old 9th April 2009
  #20
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Thanks aussie.

I just listened to a shootout where they compared the countryman to the J48 and the redeye.
The countryman sounded the "best" to me, the test was with a passive and an active guitar, both sounded good and seemed to preserve the instrument's tone pretty well.
I'm sure it would sound really good with a bass too.

That and a reamp and I'd be in business
Old 9th April 2009
  #21
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How do the JDI compares to the JDV and how do those two compare to the countryman?

I'm looking for a good tone that can be used for reamping too.
I'm not a huge fan of power supply getting in the way though...
Old 9th April 2009
  #22
Gear Maniac
 

I'm a bass player by trade and have a massive amount of vintage amps,basses etc etc.Lately I've been tracking my bass D/I through an ART MPA Gold with upgraded tubes.Sounds great.
Old 9th April 2009
  #23
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KeithMoonwannabe's Avatar
 

does the bass have to be direct?

cuz it seems like you've got a couple good DI options already in your two outboard pres.

Perhaps you should get a small combo such as an Eden N8 and a decent dynamic like an ATM25 and go the miking route for some variety.

Just trying to suggest something out of the box. I've gotten much better sounds imo using a miked up N8 than I have going DI to my Focusrite Saffire. Not that the Saffire sounds awful it's just a little sterile in comparison.
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