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The best Kick drum mic Dynamic Microphones
Old 4th January 2005
  #1
Gear interested
 

Thread Starter
The best Kick drum mic

Back in the 90s I worked in a studio and the drums were miked with a 57 on the snare aU47 fet on the kick and a pair of neuman 84s for over heads. Senheisser 421s for all toms. I now have a mobile setup and for years have only been recording choral and orchestral music but periodically I get asked to record a small rock or blues band. I can never get the kick drum to sound like the nueman and of course I cant afford to buy one now as they are silly money. I dont want to take out a load of EQ so want a really good workable sound that I can tweak back in the studio. Has anyone ever found a kick mic that comes any where near?

Thanks John
Old 4th January 2005
  #2
Gear maniac
 
StefanM's Avatar
 

Hi John,

you might not like my answer but -
you get the best neumann sound from a neumann...
In fact I like to use AKG D12 or D112 or Shure SM91 for inside and U87 / U89 for outside
(these are a little less expensive...)
Sometimes I use BPM CR-73II on the outside (don't know if you can grab one of these in the US - a lot less expensive then Neumann , with less high end but o.k. for bd)

Cheers,
Stefan
Old 4th January 2005
  #3
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StefanM's Avatar
 

sorry just realized you are in U.K. So it might be easier...
Old 4th January 2005
  #4
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Thread Starter
Dear Stephan thanks for the reply. I dont know what it is but I just dont like miking kick drums inside the drum with mics like the D12 etc and always prefered the sound of the drum with a bit of room miking about 6 inches infront of the front skin.
I am pretty intrigued by the sm91 boundry mic as it is the kind of mic that I might be able to use in my normal mobile recording work. As for 87s or 89s I dont have but dont laugh if I tell you i have a couple of the chinese ADK lookalikes. I haven't tried one on a kick but I will give it a go. I had never heard of BPM but have had a quick look on google and found a site so thanks for that.
Almost all of my work is orchestral or choral and I rely heavily on my old Calrec Soundfield but I just dont fancy putting it infront of a kick drum!


John

www.reelsound.co.uk
Old 4th January 2005
  #5
Soundelux iFET7 sounds great on kick. In particular in it's "I" mode. An engineer friend (who's on Gearslutz actually) came over the other day when I was getting drum sounds, and I was using the iFET7...he accused me of using a sampled kick it sounded so good.
Old 4th January 2005
  #6
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Hey Nathan,
Are you using a pad with the ifet7?
What pre?
Thank you.
Old 5th January 2005
  #7
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max cooper's Avatar
 

Quote:
Dear Stephan thanks for the reply. I dont know what it is but I just dont like miking kick drums inside the drum with mics like the D12 etc and always prefered the sound of the drum with a bit of room miking about 6 inches infront of the front skin.
Right on!
Old 5th January 2005
  #8
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De chromium cob's Avatar
 

I have a U47 fet I use on the kick all the time for that same reason- nothing else gets that exact sound....but if I had to get close I'd suggest trying a Beyer M-88 (N/C not TG model) or even a Shure Beta 52. Also give the Audio Technica 4047 a go as it can get in the ballpark of the U47 fet- with just a little less 'oh my god' low end......
Old 5th January 2005
  #9
Quote:
Originally posted by apangry
Hey Nathan,
Are you using a pad with the ifet7?
What pre?
Thank you.
No pad, it has the sensitivity of a vintage solid state mic, a la Neumann. Preamp for kick, I usually use an OSA MP1-L3, a Vintech X73i, or a Great River MP-2NV. Basically a pre with a lot of color and a rounder low end.
Old 5th January 2005
  #10
Motown legend
 
Bob Olhsson's Avatar
 

Certainly the BEST sounding kick drum mike is whatever happens to be sitting in front of Charlie Watts right this minute!

Most of the commonly suggested kick mikes are the ones that work pretty well without windscreens. If you put on a windscreen so all the moving air can't pop the mike, a lot of mikes sound really great.
Old 5th January 2005
  #11
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doorknocker's Avatar
Quote:
Originally posted by NathanEldred
An engineer friend (who's on Gearslutz actually) came over the other day when I was getting drum sounds, and I was using the iFET7...he accused me of using a sampled kick it sounded so good.
I miked my Marshall Super Lead 100W with a Beyer M160, vintage 421 and a 57 all in a close pattern, adjusted the phase with an IPB set on the 57, added an U47 for the room thru a 1176 on all in. Pres used were a TG-2 and a pair of NEVE 1084s.
A friend came over and accused me on using a POD, it sounded THAT good.....



Andi

www.doorknocker.ch
Old 5th January 2005
  #12
I switch between an old D12e, a Beyer M88 and an Audix D6 depending on the drum and drummer. Usually with the D12e and the M88 I get the best tone with the mic just outside the hole.
With the D6, it's too big outside the hole . It really wants to be in the kick drum.
Old 5th January 2005
  #13
Gear interested
 

Thread Starter
thanks to all for your ideas and suggestions. I guess because of the bulk of my work that I'm not really inclined to spend a lot on a kick mic that I will only use occasionally but suggestions like the beyer m88 are interesting. Is it really that good? The audio techica 4047 sounds pomising for the price

john

www.reelsound.co.uk
Old 7th January 2005
  #14
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Old 7th January 2005
  #15
Dot
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Dot's Avatar
Old 7th January 2005
  #16
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Telecastr's Avatar
 

Dot,
i checked out the red5audio website. can you tell me more about the rvd1? how does it sounds compared to a Beta 52 or D112? I'm more a fan of a Beta 52 so i'm more interested in a comparison between those 2. have you tried it on floor tom, bass cab, or anything else? Thanks,
Derek
Old 7th January 2005
  #17
Dot
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Dot's Avatar
Telecastr, haven't tried the RVD1 on floor tom. Have used the RVD1 on upright bass and bass cabs and it does a great job. The RVD1 would be closer to the 52 than the D112. The RVD1 is more defined than the often rounder D112. RVD1 doesn't pick up quite as much highs as 52. RVD1 has smoother mics than 52.

BTW, if you want a killer floor tom mic, the Studio Projects B3 is a monster.

Here's some notes I wrote on kick drum mics:

Audio Technica ATM-25– I really like the AT mics. They give a really nice definition with not a lot of fuss. If you're just starting to learn to mic drums and are building a mic collection, I would recommend this mic [ or the Red5 Audio RVD-1 if you're in the UK ]. Good for classic rock and pop.

AKG D-112 – I like this mic for hard rock. Very solid, round tone can easily be had with this mic. I also like this mic for jazz – where the point is to often get this fluffy, ****ty kick sound. This mic is forgiving on less-than-perfect kick drums.

Beta52 – this is a good mic if you're going for an in-your-face sound. It picks up "clicks" well for heavy metal [ metal washer duct taped to kick head at point of impact and struck with a wooden beater ]. Also good for R&B and Hip Hop. It's not the most musical kick mic, but it does pack a punch. There's a sort of a "honk" to it, and I wouldn't recommend for general kick miking purposes unless you want more "smack" than "boom". Good on tight kicks.

EV RE20 – This is a classic and probably my fav kick mic when it works and least favorite when it doesn't. This mic will make a really good well-tuned kick sound great, but wouldn't help the less-than-perfect kick sound as much. It's pretty flat and very unforgiving. This is the one mic that you'll find you get more use out of than just kick drum. It can make a great vox mic on the right voice.

Red5 Audio RVD-1 - a new up and comer. Really nicely defined tone - and picks up the low-end well. Smoother mids than Beta52. Great pop and rock kick mic.
Old 7th January 2005
  #18
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Telecastr's Avatar
 

Thanks Dot,
i've heard the B3 is pretty good on floor tom. are there any american dealers for red5audio or do i have to get it directly from them?
Old 7th January 2005
  #19
Dot
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Dot's Avatar
Telecastr, Red5 isn't in the US yet. In the works. Check your PM.
Old 9th January 2005
  #20
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Alexi's Avatar
 

hey there,

i got to mention the sennheiser 602.
i think its a great mike because it soundwise fills the gap between an akg112 and the shure beta52. A little harder to place though
Old 9th January 2005
  #21
Gear nut
 
newatthis's Avatar
I've been real happy with a Sennheisser 441 lately.
Old 9th January 2005
  #22
Gear Guru
 
Sounds Great's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Alexi
hey there,

i got to mention the sennheiser 602.
i think its a great mike because it soundwise fills the gap between an akg112 and the shure beta52. A little harder to place though
Also using the E602.


It replaced my AT ATM25 there.
Old 9th January 2005
  #23
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tonymite's Avatar
 

try the new audio technica dynamic/condenser bass drum mic . fits your bill.
Old 10th January 2005
  #24
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Scinx's Avatar
 

e602/md421 u5
Old 10th January 2005
  #25
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Telecastr's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by tonymite
try the new audio technica dynamic/condenser bass drum mic . fits your bill.
i think the AT AE2500 sounds like total crap. i have yet to like the sound of one time for anyting from kick drums to bass cab to djembe bottom. it's very muddy. there's not enough definition to it.
Old 10th January 2005
  #26
mpr
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mpr's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Telecastr
i think the AT AE2500 sounds like total crap.
I agree. I was offered one 'cheap' from sweetwater when they first came out and I used it twice (the second time on a completely different drum to verify my initial findings).

Great concept, lousy mic. Look for one on ebay soon if you are interested.
Old 10th January 2005
  #27
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Telecastr's Avatar
 

i'm glad i'm not the only one who thinks they aren't any good, not that it really change what i think of them. anytime i would read a review about it, i would give it another shot just to see if was crazy and was missing something. when we got this mic, which was pretty much as soon as it came out, i put it on everything i could. the concept is good, it's just too bad the sound isn't. i still try to put it on kick from time to time to give it another chance. it just doesn't matter. i never like the sound of it. if you want a lumpy kick, here's your mic. don't expect a nice round punchy kick though.
Old 3rd October 2010
  #28
Gear interested
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Telecastr View Post
i think the AT AE2500 sounds like total crap. i have yet to like the sound of one time for anyting from kick drums to bass cab to djembe bottom. it's very muddy. there's not enough definition to it.
Yeah, I was very excited to get this mic and then I tired it on kick and cajons. I thought it was broken. I've never had a mic clip so easily and the overall tone was pretty unusable. I ended up using an sm57 and TLM103 to get the result I was after. I haven't touched the thing in a couple of years now.
Old 3rd October 2010
  #29
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AcoosticZoo's Avatar
Neumann 149 as a Kick drum mic.

A little birdie once revealed that a Neumann 149 makes a great kick drum mic jokingly.

Try that - I think you'll be delightfully surprised. oh and use a pop shield for protection against rush of air when the beater hits the kick tom.

Regards
Josef Horhay
Mixing Engineer
www.acoosticzoo.com
Old 3rd October 2010
  #30
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beingmf's Avatar
 

I usually get a lot of mileage from one or a combination out of
- KSM32
- Pearl cheapo LDC
- 421
The KSM is mostly used outside for a nice fluffy attack and shell sound, the Pearl inside (surprisingly great natural and deep tone!) and with the 421, it totally depends if I use a complementary mic, and which one.
Positioning is crucial, but also the choice of preamps (especially the emphasis on the "wanted" frequencies and slew rate: "faster" is not necessarily "better")

FYI: I dislike the sound of the Beta 52 and most of the time the 602 as well, so maybe you get my general direction in taste...
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