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Cubase vs Reaper
Old 26th December 2007
  #61
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Electronique's Avatar
 

I'd consider Sonar 7
thumbsup
Old 27th December 2007
  #62
Gear Maniac
 

try it !

Hey this is a little bit OT but this thread got me thinking I should download the trial version and give reaper a shot.

Just ran a few tracks goofing around with some idea's I'm working on for a new song I'm writing, and thought I'd share the results.

I think it gives me just about everything I need, plus freedom to goof around with edits and whatnot without being shackled to my digi hardware.

I'm not sure I'll pull the trigger and switch (need to do some rigorous A/B for that) but so far I have to say I like:

1. lightness - loads fast on my laptop and seems to not consume a lot of resources.

2. EASE of use. Very intuitive if you ask me. I was able to get my ideas down onto the hard drive quickly with only minimal reference to the user guide or wiki.

3. I thought the user interface was just fine. I see what people are saying about it but geez man for $50 I think you can't really be picky about such things.

4. Rewire support seems great. I only use reason for drums but it handled that just fine. No latency issues that I could detect.

In terms of what I'd miss about PTLE if I made the switch, well.. I don't know. I haven't tried things like loop record yet with reaper. It might be just as good for all I know but PTLE has this neat feature where, after you loop record you have all these takes lying right on top of each other and you can slice through them all like slicing through a layer cake and they are all still aligned. So... if you like the first 20 seconds of the first take and the last 10 seconds of the final take and the middle 10 seconds of take #4, stringing that together into one seamless piece is, well.. a piece of cake (sorry, that as an awful simile but I couldn't resist!). Truth is if you have good musicians, all strong at what they do you should never need such tomfoolery but with my voice I sometimes need that crutch for vocals (never need it for anything else though ) .

Also I was unsure of whether I can automate fx in reaper. Sometimes I find it very convenient to change reverb settings, and also dramatically alter the mix level on things like delays, etc... via automation of those knobs. PTLE does this seamlessly. I need to spend some more time with reaper to figure out of these things are doable in there. I would guess that reaper does mix/edit groups and I would hope to confirm that as I play with it more.

If it has all those thing then I would have no real heartbreak saying goodbye to PTLE. The freedom from the hardware is a big deal in my mind. One thing I'm sure I'd miss is the BF76 compressor plug-in, which can impart a nice character even to my voice (maybe there is a vst equivelent out there somewhere I have not looked). Oh... and massey... damn I think I would miss massey for sure.

I highly recommend a download to check this thing out for yourself. I'm impressed, and really thinking hard about a change.

Charlie
Old 27th December 2007
  #63
SRR
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Yup loop record, and takes in lanes make it very easy for what you want.

You can automate any perimeter on any FX, on any channel or group, at anytime.
Old 27th December 2007
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1ManBand View Post
hey lawrence thanks for the tutorial! damn if you wouldmake a youtube tutorial video i would pay you. ive seen other videos but i just cant seem to find that quad channel. u just click new group right and select it? i have cubase 4 studio.. so it should work with the waves de esser and the waves c1 correct?

Never used Cubase Studio so I don't know if it has a quad channel or not. When you create a new group you should be presented with options of what kind, mono, stereo, quad or whatever.

If those Waves plugs are multichannel and have key inputs... yes... it will work. If not, no.

---------------------------------------------------------

A personal objective observation about Reaper. Seeing as how you can try it for free, it's not disabled in any way, it's a damn fine audio recorder / mixer, and you don't even really have to install it on you main daw system to use it there ...

... there is really no reason not to just demo it, even if you're happy with your current daw. It won't "screw up" anything in the registry or similar.

It's very, very nice. There's a lot of stuff in there.

Justin and Christophe have given a *real* and wonderful gift to the masses... a real pro daw... for $50 ... for non-commercial use. It's very cool and very powerful. I for one applaud them.
Old 27th December 2007
  #65
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imloggedin.
with respect mate , did u even bother to read the reaper features overview ?
1. FEATURES OVERVIEW.
REAPER | Features Overview
notice tab to transient feature ?
2. TECHNICAL SPEC.(feature detail.)
REAPER | Technical Specifications
notice the editing features ?
3. MANUAL.
Reaper Documentation - CockosWiki

before saying a daw doesnt do something it might be nice to
actually verify mate.
Old 27th December 2007
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manning1 View Post
before saying a daw doesnt do something it might be nice to
actually verify mate.

Hey Manning old pal!

If people did that it wouldn't be the Internet anymore would it? Merry Christmas Manning.
Old 27th December 2007
  #67
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by SRR View Post
Yup loop record, and takes in lanes make it very easy for what you want.

You can automate any perimeter on any FX, on any channel or group, at anytime.
Cool thanks for the tip. Again I really will need to do a pretty rigorous A/B to decide about it, but if I can do that stuff plus what I saw today in a quick trial, I'm kind of leaning that way. Would give me a lot more flexibility on my hardware, and as near as I can tell I seem to be getting the same basic functionality out of a smaller system resources footprint. That might enable me to stay on a laptop and not have to go to a full desktop system - this could radically alter my future plans for the better. I'm pretty pumped on the potential here. Writing and recording music is a hobby for me so I shouldn't be spending my precious little time off work this week goofing around checking out software packages... but I do hope this comes to something and it's looking pretty promising I have to admit.

Thanks again for the tips.

Charlie
Old 27th December 2007
  #68
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ewegogetemtiger's Avatar
Once you spend a considerable amount of time with it you'll be blown away. There is a lot of power under the hood. Read the manual for all the tricks. And you can customize all your keystrokes. Once you get it tweaked just the way you like it you'll be smokin' I can easily work 4 or 5 times faster on reap than I ever could with cubendo

and pick out one of the new, v2 skins
Old 27th December 2007
  #69
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Lawrence.
merry x n a very huge happy new year to you too mate.

it'll be interesting to come back next xmas n see how far reap has developed.
frankly i'm haveing a hard time figureing what new features i would like.
and thats the truth.
only thing for me right now is per item fx.
but its no biggie...a trik i use is to label a blank reap trak per clip fx.
then ..if i need fx on just a portion of a audio track i simply cut that time section to the
per clip fx trak n apply the fx. .ie..add a trak under original trak.
another way i do things simply for me is..i like to experiment with offsets on vocal traks.
theres neat things one can do useing the item properties dialogue also.
for example on synth traks...duplicate em...offset one a smidgeon.then use a teeny weeny pitch shift on the duplicate n mix to taste. i was experimenting with that today.

i see on GS people spend lotsa buks on plug in suites....but the reap ones
work just fine for me. which i think a lot of people new to reap havent experimented with enough mebe.
Old 27th December 2007
  #70
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Psyko/Acoustics's Avatar
 

Hey manning1;

You sound like an Aussie, "mate". You sure you're a Canuck?


Happy Holidays
Old 27th December 2007
  #71
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imloggedin's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by manning1 View Post
imloggedin.
with respect mate , did u even bother to read the reaper features overview ?
1. FEATURES OVERVIEW.
REAPER | Features Overview
notice tab to transient feature ?
2. TECHNICAL SPEC.(feature detail.)
REAPER | Technical Specifications
notice the editing features ?
3. MANUAL.
Reaper Documentation - CockosWiki

before saying a daw doesnt do something it might be nice to
actually verify mate.
plz tell me howto do the things i mentioned..

tab to transients: ?????

group tracks for EDITING: only groups "items" that i can find. this doesnt help me with editing groups of tracks like drums. not to mentions PTs ability to do something to all tracks by holding ALT on just about anything, or assigning groups to letters on the keyboard. the flexibility of grouping is way beyond this.

track comping: "takes" are not the same as track comping and looks to be a pain to edit.

that said, im sure theres some options you can change for comping or something but its not that intuitive to me.

Quote:
you came to troll, you did, move on
OH LOOK IM TROLLING ::TROLL TROLL:
dont be a little fagget.

the editing does not compare.
Old 27th December 2007
  #72
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ewegogetemtiger's Avatar
^

REAPER User Guide - CockosWiki

BTW, you misspelled 'faggot' fuuck

one more clown for the ignore list
Old 27th December 2007
  #73
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SighBorg's Avatar
 

I personally wouldnt want to do a session on Reaper right now.

Just finished tracking a 4 band project on Cubase and it worked really well. I was already used to Nuendo so it wasnt exactly a big jump from PT HD but I was surprised how quickly things got done.

Reaper works but I really dont like the interface. Opening a new plugin is a chore and dealing with the audio waveforms is not fun. Also, the gain laws or whatever you call it didnt seem right and the interface is cluttered.

Spend some time with it and it doesnt sound too bad though. I like how the meters show RMS and Peak. I was also impressed with how flawlessly it will accept UAD-1 plugins.

Not saying Reaper is bad - just saying I wouldnt pay for it at the moment.

*However* I have a feeling Reaper is going way cooler fast...
Old 27th December 2007
  #74
Lives for gear
 

Psyko/Acoustics .
actually mate, i'm a bona fide cockney londoner born in london uk.
(that moved away decades ago n got an "educashun".....lol. )
wifey is canadian. but i nearly once did go to aussie.
still miss london n all the "gear shops".
london was fantastic in the 60's. lotsa fun.
(yummmy...the mini skirt era....lol.)
(if u want a giggle..go listen to jumbo pillows...
a v ruff mukabout cockney song on my motagator site.)
hammers supporter.

happy new year to you n everyone ..whatever stuff you use to make a song.
Old 27th December 2007
  #75
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imloggedin's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ewegogetemtiger View Post
^

REAPER User Guide - CockosWiki

BTW, you misspelled 'faggot' fuuck

one more clown for the ignore list
hmmm wonder why so many people are on your ignore list fuuck
Old 27th December 2007
  #76
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Hey manning1,

Oops, sorry man. I didn't recognize your accent.

Makes sense now... By my passports I'm British and CDN; we have something in common there (even tho I grew up in Toronto).

I got a REAPER license and I think it's a cool app, I've been trying to get rid of my Cubase dependence but Steinberg pulled me back in when they released 4.1.

Will using Powertracks make up for Reaper's (current) sequencing shortcomings? I like the sequencing/groove features in Cubase.

Is an audiowarp/elastic audio-style feature not desirable to you? That's still one of the main reasons I use Cubase.

Please correct me if Justin has already changed the program to encompass these functionalities... It happens when your back is turned, sometimes...

One major Reaper asset is CPU friendliness.

A lot of people are quick to judge REAPER -I was one of them- but dude... for the price the value is immense.

Last edited by Psyko/Acoustics; 27th December 2007 at 10:07 PM.. Reason: blah blah
Old 27th December 2007
  #77
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ewegogetemtiger's Avatar
^ three layers of Elastique (including Pro) in Reap with V2
After some initial bugs it works flawlessly now.
Old 27th December 2007
  #78
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Psyko/Acoustics.
1. re...my accent.
no probs mate. i just use the cockney accent for giggles
on some songs.
my granparents were both cockneys.
n i spent my youngish years all in cockney land n mods n rockers n spivs...lol.
what amuses me bout some songs today trying to do the
"brit thing" (often falsely imho..)...is we were "punk" way back in 69..lol..
in the uk.
yes....i DID also see THE WHO live with keith moon as the drummer.
may he rip. a fab night..i'll always remember..totally wild.
actually i think ive become canadianised...even say eh ?
lol.
2. re elastic/midi.
are u not aware a few releases back ELASTIQUE
was implemented in reaper.
i dont know when you last tried reap..but there have been many changes.
includeing midi. so i would try the latest release which i understand
will also slave to time code.
3. powertracks(or as users call it ptw.).
god .where do i start.
for years the midi feature list has been huge.

includeing notation editing. midi guitar fretboard.
various editors etc.
it would take me pages to describe the features.
a new feature in ptw that folks seem to love is the ability to
id chords in midi/audio/mp3 etc files.
(read the details at pgmusic.com )
reaper i consider my king for audio and ptw for midi.
(tho ptw has some neat audio features too...like a real time analyser built in
and various other real time fx like its echo chorus i use in reap.
cos low resource useage fx. i also really like the ptw noise gate for taming noisy guitar amps.))

now there is a new trend with pg products.
real instruments. for example check out the real drums in ptw and band in a box.
the latter is like haveing a back up band on tap.
i notice several reap users are useing biab in conjunction with reap.
ie..useing biab to quickly generate bed traks....then import into reap n add
up front traks.
check out the biab demo links in the biab user forum at pg n see what you think.
loads of demos in many styles.

just try the demos of ptw and biab at pgmusic.com and see
what floats your boat.
youll also notice a thread i started in the powertracks user forum
at pg bout achieving rock solid midi timing.
no flangeing etc. the replies are rather interesting.
i started this open (hopefully pleasant) discussion there cos
ive read so many threads on the net about various probs folks have with accurate midi timing.
particularly the BS (imho.) that the pc isnt capable.
and youll notice the replies in that thread agree with me.

long live "torronna"...n "the leafs"...lol.
peace.
Old 28th December 2007
  #79
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illacov's Avatar
 

Talking Lawrence COME ON!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawrence View Post
I guess I'm smoking crack. I've only been using Cubase forever. Whatever.

Look, the point is that the Reaper and Cubase SX use the same method for getting the key audio into the key input, using a secondary channel, and requiring multichannel routing, as the key source. It's funny how people called Cubase's sidechaining "quasi-workaround-fake-ass- sidechaining" and suddenly the same method in Reaper is "true sidechaining". And it is the same method... multichannel routing.

I set them up virtually the same way and neither is really easier than the other TO ME. Insult me by calling me a crackhead for voicing my opinion. Thank you. An opinon that I can back up with facts btw... instead of name calling.

Here it is step by step in both.... from a crackhead who's been using daws for many, may years.

STEP 1:

Reaper: Change the target channel to 4 ch's so you can use the second pair for the key input. A Quad channel. You need a quad (or two channel for mono) channel to sidechain, just like Cubase.

Cubase: Cubase groups support multiple streams/channels (for surround up to 7.1) just like Reaper internal channels so I create a quad group, give it two stereo child channels and send the original track to the group.

Now both daws have a single channel with the original audio playing on it and a secondary unused stereo stream inside of it that we will use for the key audio. Identical.

ReaComp is on the original target track in Reaper.

ReaComp is on the group track in Cubase.


The next step is getting the key audio into the secondary channel.

STEP 2:


Reaper: Send the output of the track being used as the key to the second stereo channel of the target channel 3/4 . Or pull in a receive from that channel. Same thing.

Cubase: Send the output of the track being used as the key to the second stereo channel of the target group. Ls Rs Same thing.

Now both daws have a single channel with the original audio playing through it and also the key audio coming through the second stereo stream on that same channel. Exactly the same thing.

The next step is to assign the key audio to the ReaComp key input.

Final Step

Reaper: Assign the key input of the ReaComp to the Aux pair using ReaComps detector input list. 3-4
Cubase: Assign the key input of the ReaComp to the Aux pair using ReaComps detector input list. Ls-Rs

It's the same thing. EXACTLY the same thing routing wise, using a secondary channel to feed the key input. I cand set that up in Cubase in about 7-10 seconds and in Reaper in about 5. Big difference huh?

Now Reaper can do more stuff because of it's routing flexibility but basic sidechaining is done in an almost identical way. But yes ... it can do more. But the same multi-channel routing that people complained about being "semi-quasi-half-ass-fake" ducking / sidechaining in Cubase for years is suddenly "true sidechaining" in Reaper when the routing to get there is near IDENTICAL and it works exactly the same way in practice.

Schwa's fine VST plugins (with key inputs) will work in Cubase also. Any plug with multi-channel inputs (seperate inputs for key sources) will work in SX or Cubase 4 or Reaper using the above method.

Most people only want to key the input for a track like they did with a real analog comp. That's what most people were crying like little babies for in Cuibase and they had it already. If it's "quasi-fake" then they both are "quasi-fake".

Is Reaper's just a tiny tiny bit easier to setup?. Yes a very tiny bit as you don't need the group. The METHOD to get the souce to the key input is near identical, using a secondary audio channel to bring the source audio into the key input. M_E_T_H_O_D

Cubase 4 takes the key input source directly from the original souce channel without additional audio paths. There is no additional routing to do... just assign the key to any track in the project. A different method.

To me, that method for ducking or getting a key source to a plugin key input is better than both SX and Reaper.

Both daws are GREAT daws. Even to crackheads like me.

The PLUG IN makes the second set of channels when you load it in Reaper.

Tiny bit easier??

I load MajorTom and it has 4 channels
I open the send on the key track and send the signal BOOM it works

How is this a tiny bit easier??

Maybe I was harsh with the word crackhead, you're just a mistaken crackhead

Explain to me how i need to make 4 channels in Reaper on the key track??

One send does it all.

Check the routing again please


Cubase 4 can be all that and a bag of chips but a 40 dollar program is on its heels for the most important aspects of recording THE AUDIO. Midi is getting there, hats off to you on that, but we're just addressing sidechaining here and I dont want to discourage newbies from trying it out based on incorrect observations.

Channel 1 is your bass line (Major Tom) gets inserted

Channel 2 is your kick. You shoot a send to channels 3/4 on Channel 1 (that has Major Tom) from this channel and you're keying the bassline.

Boom sidechaining.
No crazy 4 channel setups cuz the plugin allocates that for you when you load it.

Peace
Illumination
Old 28th December 2007
  #80
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
No crazy 4 channel setups cuz the plugin allocates that for you when you load it.
Jesus Christ. You really are a moron aren't you?

The Reaper manual tells you to create a 4 channel track to sidechain. If you weren't so busy trying to engage in a stupid kiddie daw war maybe you'd have time to actually read that part of it.

To send anything to "3/4" you first have to HAVE a 3/4 on the Reaper audio channel. The plugin does not create 3/4 on the Reaper audio channel.

Your "plugin loading allocation" above is pure bull****.

Quote:
Explain to me how i need to make 4 channels in Reaper on the key track??
Not the key source track, the key target track with the comp that's being keyed. How do you think you send to 3/4? By making the track a four channel track. Otherwise, how would you send to 3/4 on that channel if it has no 3/4?

I'll let the person who wrote the software tell you. These are his words, not mine. Maybe you'll listen to him?

Quote:
first make the track that it is in a 4 channel track (by setting it in the track I/O dialog).. then you can set the JS effect to sidechain input, then send another track to that track, and in the send you can specify to send to channels 3/4...
Before you can "...boom, send to the key input..." you have to have a second audio path to carry the key source audio. Your 3/4 on the channel is that second path. You can't just send audio directly to the plugin's 3/4 inputs from anywhere. You have to go through the original track on a secondary audio path (it's 3/4) to hit the key input, the plug's "3/4.

Just like the method used in Cubase SX I spoke of earlier that inspired you to call me a crackhead. A plugin inserted on a quad track or group using the second pair to carry the key audio signal to the plugin on that channel.

Go away.

They're both great daws. I love them both.
Old 28th December 2007
  #81
Gear Addict
 
Psyko/Acoustics's Avatar
 

manning1

Haha the Leafs need some help! I'm a bandwagon fan... I'll check back in the playoffs.

I still love this city with all its issues.

RE: Reaper Holy Crap. Looks like I better download the new vers. I haven't messed with it since mid Nov (been busy).

Guess I better check out ptw too.

Damn dude, hard to keep up with all this... thanks for the update.

Never mind the bollocks... Of course, I know this anti-Reaper stuff doesn't bug you too much. I've been reading your posts on this soft for a LONG while now.

Cheers mate!
Old 28th December 2007
  #82
Lives for gear
 

Psyko/Acoustics .
1. re reaper.
i really dont see how people can be down on such a great effort.
i also think its healthy for the musician when there is new competition like this.
even if you dont become a reaper user now..i'm sure you will at some point.
cos i tell you...my reading of the developers of this product is..
they arent gonna stop.
just my opinion ...but i feel they are highly motivated n driven.
i urge you to really check out all the reap plug ins.
and many third party plug ins done by such gifted folks as stillwell and others.
2. re powertracks(ptw).
make sure you really look deeply.
and notice lots of subtle stuff ..check out the bars view for easily moving gobs of midi data around.
and the built in midi drum machine with various included music styles or you can
build your own. thus u can quikly get a drum trak going...no need to enter from a midi kbd.
in addition..something that a lot of folks dont realise.
check out MIDIMON.EXE. this is a highly usefull utility for say analysing various midi streams or say you have a troublesome midi file imported. this will let u analyse it.
by the way .there is a ptw trik....if u have the horsepower you can do 96 traks.
there is also an interesting ptw feature for live recording.
(back ups.)
also be sure to check out the included TC HELICON.
usefull for creating virtual back up singers is the way i would describe it.


try this on lead vocs sometime.
record a lead vocal in reap. duplicate it....then on the duplicate plug in (via reaps fx button.)
the ptw echo chorus plug in.(there are lots of settings..set the extreme left one for about 145 millisecs.).set relatively wet. so now in reap you have two traks.
the original dry voc n the effected echo chorus voc trak.
bring the latter just under the dry one n mix to taste. mebe add some eq also.
(pm me for further settings details if you wish.)
also notice in ptw...make sure you check out the high ppqn for midi resolution. (OPTIONS>>RESOLUTION.) .
another long time ptw user told me he can do 64ths in midi
for example which seems to give some users of some daws problems. lots of other things to discover..so delve mate or pm me
for more hints.

go leafs ...lol. happy new year.
Old 28th December 2007
  #83
Gear Maniac
 

Manning,

I'm really digging reaper and appreciate your remarks ad tips on this thread so far.

I tried to implement this one here:

Quote:
Originally Posted by manning1 View Post

try this on lead vocs sometime.
record a lead vocal in reap. duplicate it....then on the duplicate plug in (via reaps fx button.)
the ptw echo chorus plug in.(there are lots of settings..set the extreme left one for about 145 millisecs.).set relatively wet. so now in reap you have two traks.
the original dry voc n the effected echo chorus voc trak.
bring the latter just under the dry one n mix to taste. mebe add some eq also.

but I was unable to find that plugin. All I've got so far is the ones that come with the demo version of reaper. Should I be able to find that plug among those?

I found a different one that I really like (JS: Delay/chorus) but I would like to give this one that you're talking about a shot if I could find it. Do I need to add in this thing called powertracks seperately or is that part of reaper?

Thanks.

Charlie
Old 28th December 2007
  #84
Lives for gear
 

Charlie_M.
re cant find plug in.
let me explain.
i use two daw software to do songs...reaper n powertraks (ptw).
(total cost is about 100 buks for both.
i dont know of any other combo of software which gives so many features for so little money..
unless one spends oodles of buks. i'm a registerd user of both.
no dongles with either ...which i really like.)

like reaper powertraks (ptw) comes with its own audio plug in suite.
(even has a special facility for cleaning up old vinyl records if that ever interests you.)
i use reap n ptw for different things.
cos there are neat features in both.
one being an echo chorus plug in in ptw that i really like.
cos reaper cleverly accepts third party plug ins....
both dx and vst...
i simply use the ptw echo chorus plug within reap.
(for this you would need to install ptw..its painless.)
cos the ptw echo chorus is fast to set up n use and consumes little resources.
i'm just very used to it on lead vocs.
(to get the ptw echo chorus plug in...
its available from pgmusic.com as part of ptw.)

alternatively if you cant afford the 50 buks for ptw and its fx suite.
..try this.duplicate the original
reaper voc track..then in the duplicate trak via item properties add.
5 millisecs to the start time.
(experiment tween 5 n 10 millisecs.) then via the fx button...
plug in reaps own reaverbate fx.....reasonably wet.
in summary you have two traks.
the original dry vocal trak and the same again but effected n offset a few millisecs.
alternatively you could try various impulses in reaverb.

ptw was reviewed in this months canadian musician magazine.
or just go to the pg site n try the demo mate n look at the on line videos.
and descriptions. cos theres only so much detail i can go into...
cos.like reap..the feature list is large.
(if u DO try ptw..make sure you try the various midi filtering features...
for doing lots of things to midi traks. also check out the REAL DRUMS feature .)

a lot of it is experimentation eh ?

heres how i do vocals in reap.
hope it helps you.
1. i set up a parent trak called LEAD VOCS.
with say 5 children traks linked to the parent.
(if u notice child traks are indented in reap.)
2. i then label each child trak for example....
verse x or verse take y or chorus x or chorus take y.
3. the above way i can then do subtle edits on takes n verses n choruses. (notice each reap clip or split clip has a vol handle on it a well as fade in /out.
plus ive done fancy stuff like automate pan so vocs can move around in the stereo image.
4. within the parent as another child trak i also have a seperate overdubs trak in case i screw up.

an example...
TRAK 7...PARENT TRAK lead vocs
.........child traks.......
..........TRAK 8 lead voc verse 1
..........TRAK 9 chorus left
..........TRAK10 chorus right
..........TRAK 11lead voc verse 2

useing the sliders in the TCP then i can blend the different takes
as well as the volume handles on each clip.

once i have the vocs all done charlie...then i simply move the clips in
reap so my lead vocs look like this in the child traks.
.......>..TRAK 12 lead vocs verses.
......>...TRAK 13 lead vocs duplicate (with ptw echo chorus added via fx button.)
.......>..TRAK 14 choruses
.....>....TRAK 15 choruses (with fx.)

legend .the > shows roughly to you the fader level on the tcp in reap.
once happy i delete child traks 8 thru 11.
just one of many ways of doing it.
in more complex songs i might have 8 child traks going.
i'm assuming thru this you know in reap the concept of child traks linked to a parent folder.
(hold mouse over the folder picture by trak name.)

in some cases if i'm doing a quikie voc comp i just insert
the ptw chorus echo on the parent .
eg...in this case TRAK 7....and set wet/dry params n delay etc .
this then affects all child traks.

theres is nothing to stop you chaining fx on the parent trak 7
useing both reaps fx as well as ptw's.
there are alsoneat triks to discover useing child traks in reap linked to a parent. eg...have just one part of a vocal or chorus with fx on.
or for example at some point in a song have some special effect
zoom from left to right etc. (use reaper panning aurtomation after effecting.).lots of triks n lots of fun.....lol.

heres another reap trik i use....
we all get excited sometimes getting too close to mic .right ?
so ya got this perfect voc trak except for one dam "P"
consonant. no probs. placecursor just before the "P" ,
right clik n split trak. place cursor at top left of P bit.
notice the cursor changes ? drag with mouse to right to soften the P impact. (we are essentially doin a subtle fade in on the P consonant).

another reap trik.
ya got a vocal trak perfect except at one point for a few secs...
the level drops. whaddya do ? (vocallist stepped back n compressors arent always the solution.).
no probs....hilite the quite few secs..right clik split.
so the quite bit is seperated from rest of trak. then right clik...
normalise....then hold mouse over top of clip n drag down volume handle to balance the now louder quiete bit to rest of trak.
(another alternative is to cut out the quite section to a new blank child trak n simply raise its fader in the tcp.)
i hope this illustrates why i call BS when some people say reap doesnt have a full complement of editing features.
(obviously they havent bothered to learn the features. )
seriously its all there mate if one reads the manual..
n developes ones techniques/triks.

happy new year.
Old 29th December 2007
  #85
Gear Addict
 
Psyko/Acoustics's Avatar
 

Thanks manning1.

I bought Reaper because I really liked the spirit of the prog and the price was nice. I'll be holding on to my license. The future looks bright for Reaper... like quantum computing


Happy "Gwai Lo" New Year!
Old 29th December 2007
  #86
Lives for gear
 

Good stuff Manning.

Reaper's editing is fine... the only thing I can't do in Reaper is redraw waveforms. A quick jump to an external editor solves that problem as you know.

No big deal, but being able to just draw out pops, clicks and 'plosives is just another tool in the box. $$$ Sony Vegas doesn't have a sample editor either so it's not an issue.

Good tips man. Very good tips.
Old 29th December 2007
  #87
Lives for gear
 

lawrence.
happy new yr.

actually mate i'm a blinkin lousy painter/drawer.
even at school decades ago i couldnt even paint a flower.
got thrown out of art class into the quad..
for chattin up the lady art teacher...lol.

i normally screw up on such delicate low level sample
waveform redrawing.
it can be very time consuming.
but yes i'm sure it will come as a feature.

normally in this type of situation if ive got a real problem trak
like that with say pops/cliks or someone gave me such a trak.
what ive found is "divide n conquer".
lets say i have a trak with 10 bad cliks on it "puh's"
or whatever..in reap i would set up a new trak under the problem
trak called "fix ups". cut each one of the 10 out to the fix up trak.
then ive got a likkle trik i use.
(i dont claim to be a great audio engr. i'm, just a nuts songwriter for fun.)

remember its all sample values in those "anomolies".
so what ive sometimes done in the past is detailed hand editing
on the fix ups trak (fade in/out/level/automation/eq triks etc.)
as well use the merest "hint" of flange on the fix ups undetectable to the listener.
thus ..by useing a dsp plug in one is changeing the sample values of the
"anomolies". mebe throw in a teeny bit of compression.
n experiment with some of the reap plugs like reacomp/flange etc.

another "trik" is to use a noise reduction filter ...ive found..
to attack anomolies.
but not in a traditional way. ie...noise print of an area of trak
is the normal method .a blank noisy bit of trak.
but my way is to get creative with the NR.
use the NR to sample the clik or anomolie (just a "smidgeon")..
itself...then try n apply that "print" to the fix up trak containing our ten anomolies.
its all physics eh ? (my degree is in physics..lol.)
in essence we are modifying the anomolies waveform.
sometimes it works.sometimes not..depends on the source waveform.
but there are lots of ways ive found to skin the anomolies cat.

ive also used NR dsp algos in other ways.
for example , sometimes mebe a guitar trak stands out too much in a mix.
so.for giggles...i ask the NR to take a noise print of an actual piece of real guitar trak ,
then apply the print (picture) to the whole guitar trak.
this way changeing the character of the track.

sometimes little triks like this for me...save me redrawing time etc.
if a trak is that bad...anyway i would "cover" by doing another trak or verse of vocs whatever .
god bless.
Old 29th December 2007
  #88
Gear Maniac
 

Manning,

Thanks a lot for all your tips and advice on Reaper. I tracked with my demo copy quite a bit yesterday and have to say I'm really stoked with it. Your tips about the "tracks in lanes" helped me a lot. I haven't tried the parent/child track concept yet but I'm sure I will. I'm going for the non-commercial license on reaper. If I ever write anything good enough to get it published and get paid for it, I'll spring for the commercial license no problem. I really like what these guys are doing. Being freed from my hardware is such a big deal for me. Also the lightness of the program is pretty different from what I'm used to. I'm pretty new with recording, only been at it for a little under a year. Reaper definitely goes on my list of "things I wish I knew about on day 1".

btw... Me too with the physics Great stuff. It's like weightlifting for the mind.


Happy New Year!
Charlie
Old 6th January 2008
  #89
Gear Addict
 
PitchSlap's Avatar
 

Some things I like about Reaper:

-The oversampling output options are great, and its really easy to organize a DX/VST/VSTi favorites list

-The ability to dock windows and have them tabbed at the bottom. It keeps things quite neat and you can get to any window you want with one click.

-The routing and single track type, while a bit strange at first, is really intuitive once you get working with it.

-Its got a built in FXTeleport type function that allows you to play softsynths etc. 'ReaRoute' has a nice ring to it. Does anybody use system link?

-The internet collaboration feature NinJam is pretty creative. The way they deal with latency is very slick:
Quote:
Since the inherent latency of the Internet prevents true realtime synchronization of the jam2, and playing with latency is weird (and often uncomfortable), NINJAM provides a solution by making latency (and the weirdness) much longer.
Latency in NINJAM is measured in measures, and that's what makes it interesting.
The NINJAM client records and streams synchronized intervals of music between participants. Just as the interval finishes recording, it begins playing on everyone else's client. So when you play through an interval, you're playing along with the previous interval of everybody else, and they're playing along with your previous interval. If this sounds pretty bizarre, it sort of is, until you get used to it, then it becomes pretty natural. In many ways, it can be more forgiving than a normal jam, because mistakes propagate differently.
At the rate its developing, I think it should have most of what I need by version 3 or 4.

Steinberg is the obvious winner GUI-wise, but with the "reaBend [R5mkIII]" skin, I feel better.
I could get used this:
http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/6679/reaperqa9.jpg

Come on baby... Don't fear the Reaper
Baby take my hand... Don't fear the Reaper
We'll be able to fly... Don't fear the Reaper
Baby I'm your man...
Old 6th January 2008
  #90
Quote:
Originally Posted by PitchSlap View Post
Some things I like about Reaper:

-The oversampling output options are great, and its really easy to organize a DX/VST/VSTi favorites list

-The ability to dock windows and have them tabbed at the bottom. It keeps things quite neat and you can get to any window you want with one click.

-The routing and single track type, while a bit strange at first, is really intuitive once you get working with it.

-Its got a built in FXTeleport type function that allows you to play softsynths etc. 'ReaRoute' has a nice ring to it. Does anybody use system link?

-The internet collaboration feature NinJam is pretty creative. The way they deal with latency is very slick:


At the rate its developing, I think it should have most of what I need by version 3 or 4.

Steinberg is the obvious winner GUI-wise, but with the "reaBend [R5mkIII]" skin, I feel better.
I could get used this:
http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/6679/reaperqa9.jpg

Come on baby... Don't fear the Reaper
Baby take my hand... Don't fear the Reaper
We'll be able to fly... Don't fear the Reaper
Baby I'm your man...
this skin looks great!
there are several good looking skins to use with reaper!
I don´t think visuals should keep people from using the app.
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