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I want to upgrade from Yamaha HS8, any advice for my taste?
Old 17th June 2019
  #1
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I want to upgrade from Yamaha HS8, any advice for my taste?

Hi, I'm not a musician or engineer, but I listen to music on Monitors, because I want true Sound with a flat response. I am using Yamaha HS8 with the HS8S sub and my interface is an Audient iD44. I am impressed with the Interface, but the monitors are boring me. I find the stereo imaging to be quite poor. The front-to-back stage is very narrow for my taste and the reverb of instruments sounds weak unlike my headphones HPH-MT8.

Today I've been listening to the Neumann KH 310 in the music store. I really liked the details because it's a high-res speaker. The Yamaha hasn't got the details. And the bass of the Neumann was much more realistic. It didn't sound artificial and the whole sound character was more pleasing and real.

There's a little problem with the Neumanns. I found it not so easy to seperate the instruments, because the sound is softer. Is this true?

But I couldn't listen to a couple of other monitors because they weren't connected today. I found out about the brand ATC. They seem to buid superior speakers. What about the entry-priced models? How do they compare to Yams or Neumanns? The Neus are 3-way and I love the bass. I can imagine that I would miss the bass on same-priced ATC speakers and I've not enough cash for an additional sub in this price range.

I don't listen to electronic stuff at all. I like folk, symphonic, metal etc. My absolute preference is a good stage and an organic sound, because of my music Genres. I want to hear the wood of a violin.

What else can you recommend or what can you say about Neumann and ATC?
Old 17th June 2019
  #2
Deleted e999d8e
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The guy who operates Brookwood Studio down the road from me uses 8-inch Mackies, both in his studio surround system, and in his home theater system. I have no idea whether those speakers would suit you or not, and I've got no other suggestions.
Old 17th June 2019
  #3
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Jeff Hayat's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Horizon731 View Post
...the monitors are boring me. I find the stereo imaging to be quite poor. The front-to-back stage is very narrow for my taste and the reverb of instruments sounds weak unlike my headphones HPH-MT8.
Hi

I used the HS8s for quite some time, and they were not boring, the stereo imaging was very good, the front-to-back stage was not narrow at all, and reverb sounded fine. If you are finding these things to be the case, the issue is more than likely your room, and I would advise you to look into treating it first before purchasing other monitors.

I want to hear the wood of a violin.

Yep - room there as well.

Cheers.
Old 17th June 2019
  #4
Lives for gear
Comparing your speakers in your room with speakers you listen to in a different room at a different time is not a meaningful comparison. If you could demo the speakers you consider buying in your room, set up next to your speakers, you could be more certain of your comparative evaluation.
I agree with Mr. Hyatt in thinking that your imaging and definition deficiencies are more likely to be room issues than monitor issues. But you didn’t post with that concern.
The key phrase in your post is “the monitors are boring me.” So buy new monitors. Spend at least double the amount you paid for the Yamaha setup and you might get a slightly better system which will sound different than the Yamahas.
Meanwhile, read in the acoustics forum here and start to think about creating a listening environment that will give you optimum clarity and imaging over the full frequency spectrum. That will improve your perception of any monitor.
Good hunting!
Old 17th June 2019
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted e999d8e View Post
The guy who operates Brookwood Studio down the road from me uses 8-inch Mackies, both in his studio surround system, and in his home theater system. I have no idea whether those speakers would suit you or not, and I've got no other suggestions.
I know some of my favourite musicians are using them as well, but I can't listen to them in my near. They must be very good units.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff Hayat View Post
If you are finding these things to be the case, the issue is more than likely your room, and I would advise you to look into treating it first before purchasing other monitors.

I want to hear the wood of a violin.

Yep - room there as well.
Ok, that's true. My room is untreated, but I think the sound will not drastically improve by doing that. The room has got a very little resonance and I can hear the vast differences to other monitors as well. I also don't like the cheap look of the Yamahas and the cheap plastic parts.

I am not mainly speaking about some little improvements thanks to room treating, but I want better resolution and a more musical sound. Treating can be done later.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Horizon731 View Post
My room is untreated, but I think the sound will not drastically improve by doing that.

I am not mainly speaking about some little improvements thanks to room treating, but I want better resolution and a more musical sound. Treating can be done later.
You have a profound misunderstanding of this subject.
I hope that someday you will make your room deserve the speakers you have or those you intend to buy. Then you will hear what you want to hear.
I’m going to try to refrain from posting further in this thread. Almost everyone starts where you are on this subject, and there isn’t any point in trying to force you further down a road you will probably travel in your own time.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7
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Then I think I will try your recommendations out.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #8
I used to have HS7s quite some years ago and now have KH 310s. Instrument separation is much, much better on the Neumanns imho, it’s actually quite exceptional. But since you mentioned that your room is untreated you may not benefit much from investing in expensive speakers. I mean if I had to choose between even HS5s in a treated room or ATCs in an untreated one, I’d go for the Yamahas any day... Don’t underestimate the importance of acoustic treatment, read a bit about it (there’s lots of super useful info here on GS as well). Treating only the first reflection points can make a drastic difference already, especially with the stereo imaging.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #9
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Cool, I have never believed how important it is, because I still can't understand how it changes the audio so much, but I am now reading about it and I will change my room and see what happens.

peter.m.junior, what can you say about Neumann KH 310 being too soft for hard music genres? A lot of people find that and I found that in my listening test. They sound super round in my opinion. I like the harsher sound of Yamahas.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #10
The sound of the Neumanns is very neutral which some people find uninspiring indeed. I've heard from others that they didn't enjoy producing music on them because they are too flat for their tastes and they lack excitement. But for me they are just perfect as my main goal is to have very transparent, flat and neutral monitoring. I wouldn't call them soft though, as I think their transient response and "punchiness" is excellent. The Yamahas have a more mid forward sound so I understand why you feel the 310s are not the perfect choice for you. But then maybe it's not a true flat response you are after but a speaker system which is enjoyable for general music listening.

I'd suggest you try some room treatment first. You'll be surprised how well the imaging will improve on the Yamahas. Then you might not be interested in buying new speakers at all.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #11
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Great infomation. I will do the treatment very soon. But anyway I have just listened to the Focal 65 today and they were much more textured and clear than my ones and I was able to hear stuff that is not present on my system actually. I'm getting more and more interested for the Neumanns. But tbh, to me they don't sound lacking in excitement. I really notice the flat response, but I love it. I have just heard from other people that they couldn't mix metal on them because of the boredom, but I found the lead and rhythm guitars to be super easy to spot and this makes it more exciting to me. The Dynaudios I've listened at today made it really hard to spot and I didn't like them at all. I forgot which model.

But when the Yamahas will reveal their potential soon, I will be happy.
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