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Has anyone replaced the tube in a Behringer 2200
Old 28th April 2015
  #1
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Tommycash's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Has anyone replaced the tube in a Behringer 2200

I recently inherited a few outboard pieces, including 4 Behringer Ultragain 2200 preamps. I have some pretty good mic pre choices already so I just plan on using them to amp my keyboards/samplers ect. and to experiment with different tubes. I purchased a few tubes (mullards/JJ/Tungsol) and opened one of the pres only to discover that I can not access the tube. There are 3 LED diodes in the way. I didn't want to bend them out the way before I got some conformation that it would not break upon bending it back. Also if there is another way to access the tube I would love to know. Thank you in advance
Old 29th April 2015
  #2
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MarkF48's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
I found a couple of interesting blurbs regarding changing out the tube in that unit....

"CAUTION: CHANGING THE TUBES IN THIS UNIT REQUIRES SKILLFUL USE OF A DREMEL."

"A tube emulated mic pre that the user cannot even change out, as that cheap Chinese tube is soldered into place. " Does this look to be true?

"Oh, and a tube in the middle of the front panel. (Which is apparently a terrible place to get to when you want to put in a better tube.) "

"This thing is a major league Pain In The @$$ to take apart."

IMHO, A change of tubes in that unit likely may not make a noticeable change in the sound. If you have good tubes save them for something worth putting in. Clip the LED's out if it makes it easier. The LED's don't do anything useful anyhow.

Old 29th April 2015
  #3
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
I have changed the tube in a Behringer 2200. It is not soldered so it can be removed but it's not easy...

It was a couple of years ago so I don't remember it clearly but I'm pretty sure you can't replace the tube simply by cutting the LEDs. There's not enough room to get the tube out of the socket without disassembling the whole unit. If you google "behringer 2200 tube replacment" you will find a website with the complete instructions on how to do it. It's really complicated, especially the part where you have to slide out the entire front circuit board. The difficult part was sliding in back in. I finally managed it by using the small piece of circuit board below the tube as leverage, bending the main board to make it slide past openings in the front panel. I know I'm not describing this very well but it will make sense once you open it and try.

The result... Definitely not worth putting any expensive tube in there. I tried a couple of different 12AX7s with very little, if any, difference. I did however like it slightly better when replacing the 12AX7 with a 5751. It seems like this unit might benefit from the slightly lower gain of the 5751 and those can be found pretty cheap even NOS.

It wasn't a huge difference though and probably not worth the effort, especially if your unit is still under warranty. To be honest I never found much use for it, before or after the tube change. I guess the pre can be used if better options are unavailable but the eq... truly horrible!

I've seen a lot of people claim that the tube does not glow in this unit. That is simply not true, the tube is glowing just fine but it's not easy to see with the stupid LEDs behind it. I'm sure the tube doesn't operate at full voltage but it does glow and it is definitely in the circuit somehow. I'm not exactly sure how it works but from how it sounds I suspect the tube is not providing much of the gain. I have a feeling that the design of this unit is really a solid state preamp with a little tube distortion blended in somehow. This is pure speculation on my behalf but it could explain why I preferred it with a lower gain tube.
Old 29th April 2015
  #4
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Cozmik Prod.'s Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
It is not a proper tube circuit, it is low voltage.

Don't do it, save your tubes for a real pre amp.

Behringer tubes are just marketing tubes, not only Behringer, there's lot's of these fake tube circuits out there, if it has a wallwart and a tube it is fake, this also goes for series 500 tubestuff, this is not proper tube gear as there is no high voltage power supply.
It could be done right in a series 500 system with additional step up transformers, but 8 channels of heatercurrent will probably collaps the power supply of any lunchbox.

Don't be fooled.
Old 29th April 2015
  #5
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Tommycash's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Thanks guys for the responses. I may still give it a go as I have a good mic pre set up. ( Gap and Warm Audio ) As I stated these didn't cost me a dime so I can afford the risk. I may as well try the 5751 while I'm at it.
Old 1st May 2015 | Show parent
  #6
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Rob Coates's Avatar
 
19 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cozmik Prod. View Post
It is not a proper tube circuit, it is low voltage.

Don't do it, save your tubes for a real pre amp.

Behringer tubes are just marketing tubes, not only Behringer, there's lot's of these fake tube circuits out there, if it has a wallwart and a tube it is fake, this also goes for series 500 tubestuff, this is not proper tube gear as there is no high voltage power supply.
It could be done right in a series 500 system with additional step up transformers, but 8 channels of heatercurrent will probably collaps the power supply of any lunchbox.

Don't be fooled.
I hate fake, starved plate "toob" devices. However, it is not true that if something has a wall wart it's a starved plate design. An example is something like the EH 12AY7 preamp. Uses a wall wart that outputs 12 volts AC. However, it has an internal voltage multiplier and the tubes are run at 270 volts. Bellari also used to sell a couple of preamps and a half rack compressor that had 150 volts on the tubes and used wall warts.
Old 1st May 2015
  #7
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
dang you guys ae to quick :( I was gonna say if you want more warmth your better off changing the led behind the tube.
Old 1st May 2015 | Show parent
  #8
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Cozmik Prod.'s Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Coates View Post
I hate fake, starved plate "toob" devices. However, it is not true that if something has a wall wart it's a starved plate design. An example is something like the EH 12AY7 preamp. Uses a wall wart that outputs 12 volts AC. However, it has an internal voltage multiplier and the tubes are run at 270 volts. Bellari also used to sell a couple of preamps and a half rack compressor that had 150 volts on the tubes and used wall warts.

Yes you are right, like I sayd, it could be done right with a step-up transformator.

Let's say, if it has a wallwart it is very suspicious and you need to check the circuit before you buy into it.

But if you don't know how to do that better avoid anything with a wallwart.
Old 1st May 2015
  #9
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Tommycash's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Update...I replaced the tubes in 2 of the pre amps. They do sound slightly 'different" I used the Tungsol and the Mullard. The Mullard seems to take the shrill off of sped up samples. It was the more noticeable change in sound between the 2. Like I said, I just wanted to experiment so mission accomplished. Quick question though...why does everyone seem to think the ultragain has a wall wart? Is this a recent change because none of mine have them. I don't know how old mines are but the person I got them from has had them at least 5 years
Old 1st May 2015
  #10
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Hi
The LEDs are basically a gimmick but mainly because in most valves the heater is totally enclosed so you have to look up from the bottom where the pins are or down from the top and even then you only get a small circle of orange/red light as the cathode is only a 'cylinder' about 2mm diameter. People are expecting the red glow of output valves being driven to destruction but preamp valves are simply boring.
I did try using a preamp valve as a 'light dimmer' to control a 40 Watt mains lightbulb. It worked for about 50 seconds until ALL the metalwork inside the valve glowed very bright orange then melted the glass!
A 'proper' valve preamp would use in excess of 200 Volts in any decent design but as stated it is possible to do with 'wallwart' or lunchbox designs but not easy.
Matt S
Old 2nd May 2015
  #11
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🎧 10 years
I haven't replaced the tube, but I bypassed it out, and removed the tube out of circuit.
either unsolder or bend the leds out of the way to remove it. I clipped them out and removed the tube when I modded mine.

and removed c37 and c65 then install jumper wire from minus, to minus on those caps for channel 1.

remove c134 and c132 then install jumper from minus to minus on those caps for channel 2.

then its very ssl-ish
Attached Files
File Type: pdf behringer_mic-2200_sch.pdf (2.17 MB, 550 views)

Last edited by drtechno; 2nd May 2015 at 03:38 PM..
Old 21st June 2017 | Show parent
  #12
Gear Maniac
 
Secret80sMan's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by drtechno View Post
I haven't replaced the tube, but I bypassed it out, and removed the tube out of circuit.
either unsolder or bend the leds out of the way to remove it. I clipped them out and removed the tube when I modded mine.

and removed c37 and c65 then install jumper wire from minus, to minus on those caps for channel 1.

remove c134 and c132 then install jumper from minus to minus on those caps for channel 2.

then its very ssl-ish
Can you elaborate on what the specifics and benefits of the mods that can be done to this unit?
Old 29th January 2019 | Show parent
  #13
Gear Head
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Secret80sMan View Post
Can you elaborate on what the specifics and benefits of the mods that can be done to this unit?
One of the best mods is actually using it properly.
You should set the gains right. Calculate the point, past which the additional gain is not worth the disproportionally increased noise.
Careful mic placement, careful selection of lo-cut frequency, careful removal of bad frequencies from the signal with the help of a tight notch of parametric eq.
I also expand a little afterwards, in hardware, down the signal chain in my rack.
People always wonder what kind of gear I use when they hear what I record.
Need I say I don't think about modding the thing?
Old 29th January 2019
  #14
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
You're responding to a thread that is 2 years old. Check your last post date before reviving a dead thread. many times the people who posted it aren't even around any more so you're responding to dead air.
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