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Mixing on iPad, yes or no? Other Controllers
Old 1 week ago
  #1
Gear Head
 

Thread Starter
Mixing on iPad, yes or no?

Hello all,

Anyone mix shows entirely from the iPad? Do you find it easy and quick to do it or do you prefer real faders? For gigs where there are multiple bands and multiple players changing constantly is it easy to do everything from iPad?

Thanks
Old 1 week ago
  #2
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Wyllys's Avatar
 

Yes. Yes (and yes...). Yes.
Old 1 week ago
  #3
Lives for gear
There are three things to consider: 1) the performance of the Ipad in terms of its own responsiveness to your touch; 2) the performance of the App controlling the mixer(some apps are apparently better than others); and 3) wifi signal and interference issues depending on the strength of your router network and how much interference you get from cell phones.

Having everything working at your fingertips and being able to store and recall your setups instantly is light years ahead of twisting knobs and pushing faders.
Old 1 week ago
  #4
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No, no, yes, no.
Old 1 week ago
  #5
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Aisle 6's Avatar
Depend on the iPad integration and how responsive the iPad GUI is. Depends on the number of channels being handled at any one time. Depends on the range and reliability of the wireless access point. Depends on...

Can it be done? Yes. Simply a matter of you needs, wants and results.

I personally avoid it or simply add it as an additional GUI and only really use it for a small channel count corporate style event.
Old 1 week ago
  #6
Gear Nut
 

Experience using my m32r

Anyone mix shows entirely from the iPad?
No

Do you find it easy and quick to do it or do you prefer real faders?
It's easy yes but i still need real faders and hands on approach to the mixer system using the control surface provided by the mixer. What if your ipad crashes, out of battery, out of sync with wifi, or sluggish response? so in this case, no.

For gigs where there are multiple bands and multiple players changing constantly is it easy to do everything from iPad?
Yes if i'm only mixing the mixbus for monitors. But IMHO it is still a 2 man job. so, yes and no...
Old 1 week ago
  #7
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Three questions deserve three answers; For my one or two man guitar pulls my I-Pad controlled QUsb works very well. The ergonomics are much easier to negotiate than with the QU16 however the I-Pad will go into power saving mode too quickly requiring way to many time consuming fresh start-ups unless you can by pass it. I much prefer my Digigrid/Waves LV1 computer controlled two 24inch touch screens for large complicated shows such as the situation you suggested. Knobs and faders have become obsolete in my work flow for live SR and in the studio!
Hugh
Old 1 week ago
  #8
Lives for gear
 

Hugh, can you walk up to any console/setup and be at ease with a 12-piece swing band, an 8-piece reggae band or a 5 piece blues/rock band right off the bat?

Not being able to multitask while mixing on most digital consoles is already a PITA for me, I'm absolutely frustrated at how slow it is to navigate a complex mix on a small screen, I would go batty in a multi band /festival situation.
Old 1 week ago
  #9
Gear Head
 
anadelman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1jordyzzz View Post
Experience using my m32r

Anyone mix shows entirely from the iPad?
No
I did it for years. I would mix with between 1 and 3 iPads, depending on the venue and the mixer.

Now I mix on a convertible laptop or a Microsoft Surface Pro, depending on whether I can put it on a small table or I have to hold it all night.

For big shows? No way. A console is the only way to go. Can't depend on wifi with large audiences and long distances.

As someone else mentioned, it also depends on the interface. Can I mix on an X32 with an iPad? Yes. Tap tempos are a little challenging. Can I mix on a GLD or dLive? Not hardly. The Allen & Heath iPad program is severely lacking.

Can I mix either one on a Surface Pro or Convertible PC? Absolutely!
Old 1 week ago
  #10
Gear Head
 

I mix mainly with a Mackie dl1608 and have just supplemented my (2x) iPad 3s with an iPad 5 (or 7, depending on your perspective) "2017".

I have a regular gig with a 5/6 pce Folk/Rock outfit with acoustic and electric components and full acoustic kit, 200-1000-ish ppl. I also do regular folk nights for 500-ish ppl and young indie-rock bands. I've done a fair few festivals where none of the 5-10 acts have anything in common with anyone else on the bill.

To a great extent your work flow is dictated by the tech, as it always has been. Once you work out some handy tricks and schemes it's pretty straightforward for jobs of this size.
Old 1 week ago
  #11
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dickiefunk's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by leo_slash View Post
Hello all,

Anyone mix shows entirely from the iPad?
Yes

Quote:
Originally Posted by leo_slash View Post

Do you find it easy and quick to do it or do you prefer real faders?
Yes I find QU-Pad very intuitive and easy to use. I am using an iPad mini and feel very comfortable working with QU-Pad though I prefer real faders.

Quote:
Originally Posted by leo_slash View Post
For gigs where there are multiple bands and multiple players changing constantly is it easy to do everything from iPad?
I’ve not done multiple bands but have done some community events for various bands and choirs and have been very happy to use the iPad but I’m only using up to 14 channels. I’m not sure how I’d feel if I had a lot more channels though.
Old 1 week ago
  #12
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abell1234's Avatar
 

The mix position where I work is pretty bad. During shows that aren't sold out I like to walk the room with an ipad and tweek the mix but thats about it.
Old 1 week ago
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leo_slash View Post
Hello all,

Anyone mix shows entirely from the iPad?
Yes.
Quote:
Do you find it easy and quick to do it...
Yes

Quote:
... or do you prefer real faders?
I think nearly everyone would prefer real faders IF it is feasible, and convenient to have a full console at a FOH position.

Many (most) small to medium venues do not have a dedicated FOH mix position. For these venues, mixing on a tablet is way better than mixing on real faders ..... when the real faders are located along side the stage .... behind the speakers.
Quote:
For gigs where there are multiple bands and multiple players changing constantly is it easy to do everything from iPad?

Thanks
I prefer a laptop for setting up a show. Having the keyboard and mouse makes it super fast compared to the tablet IME. Having said this, when I have run sound for a multiple band event, I got the show files setup before the show .... and only had to tweak a bit at the sound check. Knowing the band members names, and instruments ahead of the gig is essential to avoiding last minute setup problems IMO.

As others have said, for a big show, no one would "want" to use a tablet over a full console. In these venues, you are guaranteed to have a dedicated mix position. It is still really nice to use the tablet to ring out the stage monitors though.
Old 1 week ago
  #14
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by leo_slash View Post
Hello all,

Anyone mix shows entirely from the iPad?
Yes, many times. Lots of times, people forget entirely that sound engineers exist, and plan in a way that doesn't even give you enough room to setup your mixer. So, you do what you can, and shove it under the stage and pray to whatever you believe in that your iPad doesn't have any flaws, and then go mingle in the crowd.
Quote:
Do you find it easy and quick to do it
Depends on your setup. I'm either using a Midas pro 1, or an X32 99% of the time. Both have great iPad apps, so that's a really big part of it. The workflow within the app will be your make or break point for the show. If there's an issue and you need to enable a mute group quickly, can it be done? You need quick access and a GUI that's easy to remember, or even better, customizable.

Another thing to note, is how the app responds to being closed. Some shows, I use my iPad to run sound and lights simultaneously. So having apps that respond well to this is a big part of it. Make sure that you can turn the screen off, and back on without forcing a huge delay while the board is synced back to your iPad.
Quote:
or do you prefer real faders?
Absolutely. Nothing beats having the console at your fingertips. Yet.

There are many instances where the iPad shines over being at the desk (setting monitor mixes on stage with the talent, being able to walk around the venue to verify your mix is heard well throughout and eq on the fly, etc etc)

Another really good use we've found for this is on the X32 platform. You can have the talent download an app that allows control of the board, and then lock it onto a certain buss so that they can control their own monitor mix without being able to change any other parameters on the board. This makes for really happy players.
Quote:
For gigs where there are multiple bands and multiple players changing constantly is it easy to do everything from iPad?
Once again, the setup will determine this. On the x32, you'll find that scenes/snippets will be your saving grace in a scenario like this. You can switch any board settings you want on the fly, using pre saved settings and recalling them as needed.
Old 1 week ago
  #15
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by anadelman View Post
I did it for years. I would mix with between 1 and 3 iPads, depending on the venue and the mixer.

Now I mix on a convertible laptop or a Microsoft Surface Pro, depending on whether I can put it on a small table or I have to hold it all night.

For big shows? No way. A console is the only way to go. Can't depend on wifi with large audiences and long distances.

As someone else mentioned, it also depends on the interface. Can I mix on an X32 with an iPad? Yes. Tap tempos are a little challenging. Can I mix on a GLD or dLive? Not hardly. The Allen & Heath iPad program is severely lacking.

Can I mix either one on a Surface Pro or Convertible PC? Absolutely!
If i were to mix drums or bands, or anything that requires 16 ch or more, i won't rely solely on my ipad, except in the case where the sound check has been completed, i might wander around the venue during the event with my ipad.

I only wish the m32 ipad app retains the RTA on the eq section. Then, maybe i'll have more confidence using ipad solely.

The strong reason on why i won't rely on ipad is the wifi connection. When the venue is empty and it's sound check time, i never had connectivity problems. But when the venue is full, and you're pretty far away from the console, it starts to lag a lot to the point that it is not reliable anymore..
Old 1 week ago
  #16
Gear Head
I prefer using actual faders. An iPad simply does not give me all the channels I want during a live show when mixing a 5 piece band.

I find the iPad is great for doing monitors on stage either by standing with the artists and adjusting during sound check then moving back to the dedicated desk or in situations when there is no monitor engineer giving the iPad to the drummer or MD and allowing them to adjust the monitors of everyone in the band throughout the night or if you have someone available but only one desk allowing the monitor engineer to mix monitors from stage using the iPad thats connected to the FOH desk.
Old 1 week ago
  #17
Lives for gear
 

Sam, I genuinely appreciate your opinion based on many years of experience and corresponding familiarity with knobs and faders associated with consoles and I totally agree with you pursuant to the integrated small screens on most all digital desks offered today. My Digigrid?Waves LVI system features two 24 inch, USB 3 controlled, touch screens that are lightning fast with unlimited routing and intuitive processing and an amazing amount of precision control. The two large screens afford an ability to monitor multiple functions simultaneously including DAW multi-track recording: it becomes habit forming very quickly. Pre-setting shows pursuant to the needs of personnel involved would have saved a ton of time back when I was traveling with the "New South" doing FOH at festivals all over the country in the mid 70s. Perhaps you have not had an opportunity to work with a well appointed Digigrid/Waves system like the one I work with daily.
Hugh
Old 1 week ago
  #18
Gear Maniac
Even with a lightning-fast iPad etc etc, the one flaw with any touchscreen is that there's no tactile feedback. With a console, you can have fingers on each guitar and another on the lead vocal (for example), and ride the faders according to who's doing what while actually watching the band.

Tablets leave you staring at a screen too much IMO, though I do use one for pretty much every gig I do.


It'd be really nice if there was some kind of USB device that could plug into the tablet and give you, say, 9 faders. Perhaps Windows/Mac based and do it via MIDI..?

Chris
Old 1 week ago
  #19
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by hughshouse View Post
Sam, I genuinely appreciate your opinion based on many years of experience and corresponding familiarity with knobs and faders associated with consoles and I totally agree with you pursuant to the integrated small screens on most all digital desks offered today. My Digigrid?Waves LVI system features two 24 inch, USB 3 controlled, touch screens that are lightning fast with unlimited routing and intuitive processing and an amazing amount of precision control. The two large screens afford an ability to monitor multiple functions simultaneously including DAW multi-track recording: it becomes habit forming very quickly. Pre-setting shows pursuant to the needs of personnel involved would have saved a ton of time back when I was traveling with the "New South" doing FOH at festivals all over the country in the mid 70s. Perhaps you have not had an opportunity to work with a well appointed Digigrid/Waves system like the one I work with daily.
Hugh
Hugh, I haven't worked with the digigrid system, but I'm sure it's a lot easier to work with than an iPad on a random console and my question was really about iPad use in general. The LVI system was designed around touch-screen operation as opposed to being a third party add-on that need to depend on other protocols...and you have two 24" touch-screens to work with to boot.

The Studer Vista compact and Salzbrennere/Stagetec Polaris systems are similar products...the integration is total and flawless, all the features are easily accessible from the screen. I don't have a problem working on a touch screen system, I have a problem working on a remote system that does not afford total integration and easy access.

an iPad offers convenience in a bar situation when the band is mixing from the stage or when they can't setup out front, but these are basically convenience situations. the only two places where this makes sense to me is when setting up monitor mixes next to a musician, or for setting up the different zones in a bigger system/venue. I don't see the need to use a remote in a small single system venue because overtime you adjust the system its going to affect the entire room anyway and if you know what you're doing you would have figured out how the things you do affect other parts of the room...
Old 1 week ago
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chris661 View Post
It'd be really nice if there was some kind of USB device that could plug into the tablet and give you, say, 9 faders. Perhaps Windows/Mac based and do it via MIDI..?
In other words, recreate the console again....
Old 1 week ago
  #21
Gear Maniac
 
Pro Sound Guy's Avatar
 

Yes, No, Maybe so

I have a Soundcraft Ui24r and a Ui12.

I ALWAYS have something hardwired to the units.

I use an external router.

I use an IPAD and it works well with both units.
Old 1 week ago
  #22
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by chris661 View Post
Even with a lightning-fast iPad etc etc, the one flaw with any touchscreen is that there's no tactile feedback. With a console, you can have fingers on each guitar and another on the lead vocal (for example), and ride the faders according to who's doing what while actually watching the band.

Tablets leave you staring at a screen too much IMO, though I do use one for pretty much every gig I do.


It'd be really nice if there was some kind of USB device that could plug into the tablet and give you, say, 9 faders. Perhaps Windows/Mac based and do it via MIDI..?

Chris
there are midi controllers like this designed for DAW use that will do this but you have to check to be sure it functions with your specific tablet, app, mixing desk and midi controller. Korg NANO KONTROL 2 Slim line USB MIDI Controller Black | Full Compass
Old 1 week ago
  #23
Gear Head
 
anadelman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by chris661 View Post

It'd be really nice if there was some kind of USB device that could plug into the tablet and give you, say, 9 faders. Perhaps Windows/Mac based and do it via MIDI..?

Chris
Kind of like a Behringer X-Touch connected to a WAP to control an X32? That works very well.
Old 1 week ago
  #24
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Sam, I am in total agreement with you!
Hugh
Old 3 days ago
  #25
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mante's Avatar
 

The iPad helps, but it´s a pain if you have more than 12 channels to mix plus monitors and not enough time, i use it a lot with Yamahas CL and Souncrafts Vi ( the worst gui ) and i like very much but i prefer to do the job in the console, it´s faster to me.
Old 2 days ago
  #26
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by anadelman View Post
Kind of like a Behringer X-Touch connected to a WAP to control an X32? That works very well.
Yeah, but on a USB cable directly into the tablet.
Sorta like an MS Surface Pro, but replace the keyboard with physical faders.

Chris
Old 2 days ago
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chris661 View Post
Yeah, but on a USB cable directly into the tablet.
Sorta like an MS Surface Pro, but replace the keyboard with physical faders.
Sounds like you're creating a console to control the console...I don't see the point especially since it will be in bits and pieces (iPad and fader pack) and wired.

Just sounds like adding the possibility of problems and complication without much benefit to me.
Old 2 days ago
  #28
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jude's Avatar
 

Mixed one one for the closing of a festival 2 weeks ago. It was horrible. and that is being polite about it. Give me a real console, with real faders, and no delay between moving a fader and hearing a change.
Old 2 days ago
  #29
Here for the gear
 

I do most cultural events with Ipad (X Air 16). It's really compact, has all features I need. Of course I use it with good router, but still there can be trouble with Wifi connection, depends on enviroment working in.

All of the bigger events I work with console + help with Ipad - for example: with Ipad you can walk around the room and make some adjustments, you can make line check, monitor check alone on the stage, you can mix monitors with Ipad and stand next to performer (in sound check). In some places FOH positions can be really bad, for example very far from stage, or at the sides, etc. In some congress rooms, console is set in closed room with window at the far end of the congress room - in that type of environment using Ipad is really handy.

For me, it depends, but most of the times I work with both But when using only with Ipad, there is still that bit of fear of losing connection, battery life, etc
Old 2 days ago
  #30
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I’m waiting for Mind control.
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