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Thoughts on Behringer?
Old 1st October 2018
  #721
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by seamonkey View Post
Thanks, I'll check that out.



The Presonus 16.0.2 was also on my short list. Btw, the newer models provide USB, in fact they list it under the new name as Presonus 16.0.2USB. Sweetwater has them new for $999.

But after reading the comments here and watching 100's of videos on the Behringer and Presonus digital mixers, I'm kind of turned off by all the menu diving. I like to have hands on and I'm trying to get away from menu diving since I've been mixing in Cubase and would like to get back to hands on mixing.
I have numerous outboard effects which I'll be routing to extra channels and use the aux to control the effects.

I started looking at analog mixers again after reading the advise in this thread, and I'm pretty much settled on getting the Soundcraft Signature 22MTK mixer with USB.
I'll record in Cubase and then send the tracks for mixing to the Soundcraft.
It pretty much hits all the points I'm looking for, for my simple home studio.
I have a Moog Voyager, Korg FS Odyssey, Korg Kronos, Ensoniq VFX-SD, Roland D50, Takamine Acoustic, Gibson Les Paul Tribute(Gold Top), Vox AC10 tube amp and Oktavia mic.
So the 22 has plenty of inputs and enough channels to run the PCM80 and other effects..

I spent a lot of time reading the Soundcraft Signature 22MTK thread in the Low End Theory forum, and am aware of some of it's shortcomings, but overall I think it's a good fit for me.

I can't thank you all enough for your valuable input, your advise and suggestions have really helped me narrow down my choice of mixer for my studio.
Thanks again.
btw, thanks for the great audio clip from last Christmas, it really put me in a Christmas mood, and that's hard since it's been in the 90's every day here in Florida.
In our modern World of recording in the box on a computer, what do you want a mixer to do?

In a modern recording environment, nominally a mixer represents a whole bunch of individual preamps and unless your into large scale studio work 32 preamps is a bit of overkill.

In a studio environment just enough top notch preamps is far better than say twice as many average preamps.

So how many channels do you need?
You can mix in the box on the computer or do you really need to mix on a console?
While I did state that the X32 preamps aren't necessarily studio quality they still may be better than an average analogue desk.

There is the Midas MR18 to consider. It gives you the better Midas preamps and in a recoding situation the so called "menu diving" isn't that bad.
Live it can be more frustrating but when your recording you get it right and then leave it alone.
Old 1st October 2018
  #722
Deleted baa19f3
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnthonyG View Post
In our modern World of recording in the box on a computer, what do you want a mixer to do?

In a modern recording environment, nominally a mixer represents a whole bunch of individual preamps and unless your into large scale studio work 32 preamps is a bit of overkill.

In a studio environment just enough top notch preamps is far better than say twice as many average preamps.

So how many channels do you need?
You can mix in the box on the computer or do you really need to mix on a console?
While I did state that the X32 preamps aren't necessarily studio quality they still may be better than an average analogue desk.

There is the Midas MR18 to consider. It gives you the better Midas preamps and in a recoding situation the so called "menu diving" isn't that bad.
Live it can be more frustrating but when your recording you get it right and then leave it alone.
Hi Anthony, I've been mixing in the box since 2004 when I bought my first Cubase software, believe at the time it was called Steinberg VST32.
Presently, I'm using a Focusrite 18i8 audio interface and normally use 4 inputs(2 stereo) but then I unplug one to use my Oktavia mic.

I have 3 stereo keyboards, so that's 6 inputs, another input each for the Odyssey and one for the Moog Voyager, so that's a total of 8, another for my mic that's 9, and then I have the Warm Audio Limiter that's another input, that's 10, I will need stereo inputs on channels for each effects unit, a total of 3=16 inputs so far and then stereo inputs for a drum machine, my Tascam 246 4 track cassette deck and my Revox 2 track reel to reel.
I presently also have a Tascam 308B 8 channel analog mixer and a Fostex A8L/R reel to reel deck which I will probably be selling.

The nice thing with the Soundcraft 22MTK USB is you can use it as a mixer to record into the DAW, the the USB allows you to send every recorded track back in sync to the relative channels on the mixer. You may then use the EQ, etc, levels to do your final mix and sum it back to a program that will record it to a stereo summed track. Then using the software you can export your WAV, MP3, etc.

You have great sounding Soundcraft preamps and the eq is supposed to be very good as well.
I'm just a home hobbyist, and I think this mixer fits my needs very well.
Old 23rd October 2018
  #723
Gear Head
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1jordyzzz View Post
I usually avoid behriger except for their proven products like their DI box. Their speakers have reps for bad sounding and reliability but due to their acquisition of midas, turbosound, klark teknik, etc, the salesperson of a musicstore i buy things from said that behringer now incorporate tech from those companies into their product. For example, turbo driver on their subs, midas designed pres on m32, etc. So maybe they have improved their quality for their price point (which is low), and that's good. But when u have more money, i think it's better to avoid them not because of their quality, but because of your rental's marketability due to using behringer (because people / event organizer still generally thought that b stuff were cheap and low quality). Anyway, being said before, if it suits you, if u like the way it sound, etc, buy them. It's your own money at the end of the day.
This is a very good point. IMHO, Behringer made a step in a very position direction when they chose to partner with these companies. Prior to that decision, I wouldn't have considered purchasing any of their gear. However, after having gained several years of intimate experience with the Behringer X32 and X Air Series mixers, and having completely put them through all their potential paces, I have a new outlook on the Behringer Music Tribe.

After downloading the correct driver for my DAW, which (so far) has eliminated the need to further invest in a SoundGrid server; the whole concept of knobs and sends on (motorized) faders has become much more appealing.

I had always been hesitant about purchasing a digital mixing board, due to the fact that I've been ale to run plug-ins in real time by simply using he processing capabilities of my Mac Pro. This has been possible even before the release of the Presonus StudioLive digital mixer,

Other than my DAW, all I've ever needed were either a few amplifiers and/or (powered) speakers to get the job done. The Mac Pro has served me well for sound reinforcement, as well as regular performances with the plug-ins I've always used. So, I just never saw the need.

My turning point came when I finally managed to access the X32's sound card as I'd always intended. Doing so allowed me to partner the resources of my laptop with those of the Behringer X32; incorporating such elements as feedback elimination, real-time pitch correction, and real-time dynamic EQ.

Being currently more accustomed to making use of real-time plug-ins on my laptop, I actually still prefer to continue tweaking them from my laptop. However, once these effects are set, they can be passed to the X32 pre-fader via card input and even tweaked further in real-time. The most beneficial aspect of utilizing the X32's soundcard is by far the virtual sound check> It is very useful for verifying proper mic technique.

I should also confirm the build for the Behringer X32 is very solid. It records 32 channels over USB and is very stable. I have also upgraded the firmware on a few different Behringer X32 boards to facilitate wireless remote control for several clients without a hitch.

In short, the Behringer X32, S32, S16, along with the entire X AIR Series of Digital Mixers and entire P-16 Series Monitor System series all get high marks from my personal experience.

Last edited by DrStrangeBeat; 23rd October 2018 at 08:52 PM.. Reason: Grammatical error correction.
Old 24th October 2018
  #724
Lives for gear
 
teamsterjim's Avatar
I started off with a BCF-2000 12 years and onlyretired it recently
Stillworks like a champ
Played around with mydruners X16Rack
Good dynamicsand sound quality, the FX like Reverb were mediocre but usable.
DM12 sounds good, the D also sounds good,my buddy bought one.

If you bash on Behringer it’s probably from older year with cheap PSUs.
Seems you get what you pay for,and sometimes you get great gear for a little more.

I’m only upset Uli keeps doing the clone stuff.
He’s a good keyboard player, obviously know MIDI and Synthesis.
Build the Behringer Beast.
2/4 part multi timbraln16 voice with true monophonic portamento options.
A mix of wavetables, samples and real discrete audio Oscillators and Filters.

I know the guy has the resources to bring us the Beast.
Give the kids a few more clones but please build the Monster end to all synths.
Your the man who has the capability.
ASRock made consumer level products, hit their ROI Targets then starting whooping Asus with those triple NVMe X series boards.
Now they are the goto guys while everyone else adds blinkinglights for the kids, they add a 3rd NVMe slot, etc.

This is where the Behringer group is headed, just bring it sooner than later.

Sorry, I tend to get a trigflee cited thinking about the possibilities.
Old 24th October 2018
  #725
Lives for gear
 
mojo filters's Avatar
 

Why have Behringer not developed a few more budget yet serviceable keyboard instruments?

I have to admit I'm tempted by some hefty discounts I've seen recently, on the already inexpensive Deepmind synth. As I recall the SOS review was pretty good, and for the money it seems to offer a more diverse range of sounds and other functionality than similarly priced options.

I'm not concerned if they haven't completely captured the perfect emulation of a VCS3 or some valuable vintage filter. I've been very happy with my existing Yamaha CS1X, which has been my principle ivory tinkler for about 20 years - but it could be time to add something of similarly good value, to upgrade and expand the range of sounds at my fingertips; previous attempts to integrate MIDI keyboards with software synths etc have been hampered by the limitations of my crappy personal laptops, plus when it comes to this hobby I'm an old fashioned user who prefers dedicated hardware solutions.

Given he's apparently a keen and talented player himself, I've wondered why Uli never went after what I assume is a fairly large market for inexpensive versions of popular professional keyboard instruments?

From the little Novation Bass Station to the large and incredibly popular range from Nord, I'd have thought there would be a market for some similar cheaper yet cheerful Behringer versions.

Unless I just don't understand the market, and it's like Peavey making solid and affordable guitars - but everyone who wants a Fender or Gibson still buys the real thing. As a Telecaster fan myself, I've a strong affinity for the heritage of genuine instruments from that pioneering brand - but outside of hardcore professional users, I don't associate the same thinking with keyboard instruments...though maybe I'm just wrong!
Old 3rd September 2019
  #726
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Holden Sandman View Post
A few of years ago I would never have thought I would have Behringer made synthesisers in my studio.

Now I have a Model D and Deepmind 12 which are both superb.

Personally I am brand agnostic. I don't care who the manufacturer is, I care about the sound and result I'll get from the product.

Behringer are pushing hard into the synth market right now, they are filling gaps that the incumbents have left open for years. If other manufacturers feel heat from Behringer then that's a good thing, because for years the big names have ignored the demands of the marketplace.
That's the thing with Behringer, they always push out **** you actually want from other manufacturers. I would have loved that the Behringer Motor 49 was actually called a Nektar Panorama P4.

If the Motor would cost the same as the Panorama with the guarantee that it'll not break, it would be the ****ing standard keyboard controller. The features are there, they are just done the Behringer way, which is always kind of cheap.

I don't like Behringer, I would actually like for them to stay in the same price ranges as their competitor models and just improve upon them instead of making stupid quasi-better clones of them at half the price. It's frustrating but you end up buying a lot of their gear just because of this.

The X-Touch also comes to mind, and the MR18. It's just too hard not to buy products especially designed for you to want them.
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