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Is the Neumann K47 capsule a direct replacement for a U47? Condenser Microphones
Old 28th January 2015
  #1
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Is the Neumann K47 capsule a direct replacement for a U47?

has anyone replaced the M7 on their U47 with a new Neumann k47 capsule? was it difficult to do and how did you like the results compared to the M7. Thanks

Last edited by Palermo; 29th January 2015 at 12:07 PM..
Old 28th January 2015
  #2
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Matt Nolan's Avatar
 

This thread may help with this question - Neumann M49
Old 28th January 2015
  #3
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U67's come with k67 capsules, not M7's.

U47's had M7's in early production, K47 later.
M7's always have more mids 200-500Hz than a k47.
Current day M7's can be either pvc or mylar, they sound different. Mylar emphasises 2kHz, pvc 1kHz, plus other frequency differeces.
Most if not all original pvc M7's have dried out by now, but they can be re-done (in either material).

Now you know just about everything there is to know about capsules.
Old 28th January 2015
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbock View Post
U67's come with k67 capsules, not M7's.

U47's had M7's in early production, K47 later.
M7's always have more mids 200-500Hz than a k47.
Current day M7's can be either pvc or mylar, they sound different. Mylar emphasises 2kHz, pvc 1kHz, plus other frequency differeces.
Most if not all original pvc M7's have dried out by now, but they can be re-done (in either material).

Now you know just about everything there is to know about capsules.
...
Old 28th January 2015
  #5
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hasbeen's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Palermo View Post
has anyone replaced the M7 on their U67 with a new Neumann k47 capsule? was it difficult to do and how did you like the results compared to the M7. Thanks
You have "U47" in the title and "U67" in the post. Which is it?
Old 29th January 2015
  #6
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...it seems of late, M7 nostalgia aside, there's a renewed interest in employing the K47 capsule in new (clone) and original 47 builds...
Old 29th January 2015
  #7
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Sorry correction made it should be u47. Obviously the u67 never came with an m7/k47 capsule
Old 29th January 2015
  #8
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hasbeen's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Palermo View Post
has anyone replaced the M7 on their U47 with a new Neumann k47 capsule? was it difficult to do and how did you like the results compared to the M7. Thanks
Of course, one option would be to contact Neumann and see if they will sell a replacement headbasket/capsule containing a K47. I thought I had read somewhere about a member doing this but am not sure.

I contacted TELEFUNKEN-Elektroakustik about this in 2012 and they offered a replacement for around $1750. Not sure what K47 capsule they are using though.

I have an M7 in mine and have often considered how nice it would be to have a choice.
Old 29th January 2015
  #9
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John Willett's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dbock View Post
Current day M7's can be either pvc or mylar,
An M7 capsule has a PVC diaphragm - if it's a Mylar diaphragm, it's not an M7 !

The M7 is a capsule designed by Georg Neumann and an original can only be made by Neumann or Gefell (Gefell is still owned by the Neumann company started by Georg Neumann in 1928), any other M7 would be a copy.
Old 29th January 2015
  #10
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The thread that Matt mentioned in the second post is a must read. It's also applies to the U47. Make sure you order the K47/49 with part# 053291. (at Sennheiser)

Last edited by nielsb; 31st January 2015 at 10:56 AM..
Old 29th January 2015
  #11
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Geffel sells mics with M7's (same dimensions and hole patterns as the old days) having mylar membranes. They claim heritage from Georg, if you want to argue with them have at it. Not quite the stretch of AKG selling nylon CK12's which are entirely different than all varieties of brass CK12. Still an M7.
An old M7 which has had it's dried out membrane replaced with a new pvc membrane is not a copy, it is a rediaphraqgmed M7.
A new manufacture of M7, with either pvc or mylar, would be a copy.
Old 30th January 2015
  #12
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i understand that Neumann no longer makes M7s and moreover the original PVC formula is no longer available. I also beleive Neumann doesn't provide any reskinning services of orignal M7 capsules. But they do still produce the k47 which I would imagine would provide a reasonable sonic alternative. I would like to hear form any u47 owners who utilize a k47 in their u47.

Last edited by Palermo; 30th January 2015 at 05:08 AM..
Old 30th January 2015
  #13
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Neumann still makes the K47, and it is excellent. I have K47s in two of my U47s and two of my M49s.

Last edited by jjblair; 31st January 2015 at 02:34 AM..
Old 30th January 2015
  #14
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U47's had k47's as well as M7's in them.

If you could get the original PVC, I'm not so sure you'd want it, since the PVC would harden and lose bass response over time.

Thiersch, who was an engineer at Microtech Gefell, makes a good M7 "version", in pvc (blue line) as well as polyester/mylar (redline): Thiersch elektroakustik

I haven't heard an old Thiersch blue line, so I can't comment on if the pvc still ages the same way, but the mylar redline sounds very good, nice smooth top end.

Tab-Funkenwerk also offered(offers?) a "K47 Classic" replacement, made with original spec materials, skinned in Germany, for $200:
4

There is some truth that only Neumann and Gefell technically made M7's or k47's, but I wouldn't get so pedantic that I'd overlook the above options. Of course, Neumann capsules are still good, and they make the k47/49 replacement still.
Old 30th January 2015
  #15
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Klaus's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by toledo3 View Post
U47's had k47's as well as M7's in them.
There is some truth that only Neumann and Gefell technically made M7's or k47's, but I wouldn't get so pedantic that I'd overlook the above options. Of course, Neumann capsules are still good, and they make the k47/49 replacement still.
'Pedantic' connotes an unhealthy obsession with detail.
I don't find it unreasonably obsessive to point out that NO aftermarket M7 capsule or diaphragm is able to reach the sonic quality of the original Neumann product, East or West.

In my experience and opinion, all currently manufactured PVC M7 lack in three-dimensional, musical, emotionally attractive rendering, and, listening to them side by side with an original manufactured before 2005, this would be readily apparent to all.
Old 30th January 2015
  #16
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Pedantic was a poor word choice.

I do think the Thiersch redline sounds very good though. I personally think the PVC (blue line) is a poor buy even if it did nail the tone of the originals.
Old 30th January 2015
  #17
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hasbeen's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjblair View Post
Neumann still makes the U47, and it is excellent.
I'm sorry, but I don't understand. Are you talking about the capsule? Head basket?

Thanks.
Old 31st January 2015
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hasbeen View Post
I'm sorry, but I don't understand. Are you talking about the capsule? Head basket?

Thanks.
Sorry, I meant K47, not U47.
Old 31st January 2015
  #19
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hasbeen's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjblair View Post
Sorry, I meant K47, not U47.
That's great news! So the Neumann K47 capsule is still bloody good?

Makes my desire for a U47 head basket with K47 even stronger.
Old 31st January 2015
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hasbeen View Post
That's great news! So the Neumann K47 capsule is still bloody good?

Yes, it is no news, it is a fact!!!
I already gave you the part number:
Quote:
Make sure you order the K47/49 with part# 053291. (at Sennheiser)
http://spares.sennheiser.co.uk/neuma...9-capsule.html

Last edited by nielsb; 31st January 2015 at 10:57 AM..
Old 1st February 2015
  #21
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K47/49 Capsule

Quote:
Originally Posted by jjblair View Post
Neumann still makes the K47, and it is excellent. I have K47s in two of my U47s and two of my M49s.
A little off topic, but since you brought it up. I was considering ordering a Flea 49 with the F47/49 capsule rather than an F7 their M7 remake. Since having an F7 in a Flea 47, and the CT 12 capsule in the Flea 12. It would give a different option. Any info on the Flea 49 difference with the F7 compared to the F47/49 and your M49's ? I though you own and use both. Any feed back would be appreciated. Sorry for going off topic a little.
Old 1st February 2015
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bzone View Post
A little off topic, but since you brought it up. I was considering ordering a Flea 49 with the F47/49 capsule rather than an F7 their M7 remake. Since having an F7 in a Flea 47, and the CT 12 capsule in the Flea 12. It would give a different option. Any info on the Flea 49 difference with the F7 compared to the F47/49 and your M49's ? I though you own and use both. Any feed back would be appreciated. Sorry for going off topic a little.
I don't own any FLEA products. Sorry.
Old 1st February 2015
  #23
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John Willett's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bzone View Post
A little off topic, but since you brought it up. I was considering ordering a Flea 49 with the F47/49 capsule rather than an F7 their M7 remake. Since having an F7 in a Flea 47, and the CT 12 capsule in the Flea 12. It would give a different option. Any info on the Flea 49 difference with the F7 compared to the F47/49 and your M49's ? I though you own and use both. Any feed back would be appreciated. Sorry for going off topic a little.
Send a PM to Plush on the Remote forum - he has several FLEA mics.
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