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Avid HD i/o , Antelope OCX , AND BURL B2 together Synchronisers/Clock Generators
Old 26th November 2014
  #1
Gear Nut
 
InMyGalaxie's Avatar
 

Avid HD i/o , Antelope OCX , AND BURL B2 together

Hey everyone,

Been looking through the forum and elsewhere for the past few days, but have not been able to find a clear answer to my question. I currently operate using an Avid HD 16x16 i/o and clock to an Antelope OCX. I prefer the the sound and spread of the Avid clocked to the OCX. I do a ton of tracking, mixing, and mastering for indie bands and want to be able to record (guitars, bass, vocals, percussion) through the Burl B2 as well as mix and master through it. The only time I would be using the Avid clocked to the OCX would be during drum tracking.

My questions are: 1) What is the best way to setup the Burl B2 if I want to use my OCX with the Avid but use the Internal Clock on the B2? Would this not make sense because the two convertors would be clocked to different sources? I'm a bit confused here.

2) Also, when tracking or mixing through the Burl B2, how would I monitor? Still through the AVID OUTS 1-2 since I'd be going into the Avid's AES in from the B2?

(p.s. I was told by Burl to not clock the B2 to the OCX because it would just result in more jitter)

Thx
Old 27th November 2014
  #2
Gear Nut
 
InMyGalaxie's Avatar
 

Anyone? I'd love to hear from you Burl fanatics. You know who you are!
Old 27th November 2014
  #3
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Slug1's Avatar
Try both ways. Clock both the Avid and Burl with the Antelop and see how it sounds. Then try it with the Burl's internal clock, but clocking the Avid with the Antelop. Burls have great clocks and will generally sound great with their internal clocks. But they are also good at accepting external clocks. There's a great article in SOS, its old, but it shows how some converters work better with their own clocks but don't do great with external clocks. And there are converters that sound great with their own clocks but also sound great with external clocks.

But you should be able to monitor through a pair of the Avid analog outs. For tracking, yes, just go through your Burl to the Avid by AES and print to ProTools. You should be able to do direct monitoring while recording and listening to the mix through the main buss going out of a pair of outs on the Avid. It should work beautifully! So try the clocking set up both ways and see what sounds best.

I'm responding because I have a little bit experience with this gear. I have a pair of Avid HD 16x16 IO and a Burl B2. Avids feed an SSL Sigma, and the Sigma feeds the Burl. Then the Burl goes back to the DAW through one of the Avids AES input pair to record the summed mix. The Avids are clocked with the Burl. However, I have a Dangerous D-Box, which has two AES inputs. So I use one of the AES on the D-box to capture the direct monitor from the Burl (has two AES outputs), and the second D-box AES input accepts feed from one of the Avids, to listen to the summed mix after it is captured. So I can actually listen to direct monitoring as I'm mixing, I can listen to the summed mix after its captured in DAW, AND compare that to the pre-summed digital DAW mix.
Old 27th November 2014
  #4
Gear Guru
 
RoundBadge's Avatar
I clock an Avid,Burl Mothership and B2 all from the Antelope trinity/10m.
works flawlessly.sounds great.
use short cables.try it and see.
yeah monitor off an Avid pair.you'll be fine.
Old 27th November 2014
  #5
Gear Nut
 
InMyGalaxie's Avatar
 

Hey thanks for the comments guys. Much appreciated. I've been geeking out over all the positive things I keep hearing people say about the Burl sound. I mix ITB then print through an API 5500 and 2500. Started out on a 002, then Lynx Aurora 8, now the Avid - the better conversion makes such a difference in the ability to glue together great mixes that feel both open and detailed. I've been watching all those Burl promos with Brauer and Larry Crane and Vance Powell etc... - When you watch the way these guys react to the Burl convertors, it's real hard to not open that wallet! haha
Old 27th November 2014
  #6
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Slug1's Avatar
They really do sound amazing. Even Chris Gehringer over at Sterling has pulled in the B2 after years of using his Prism Dreams. It just adds weight and heft. I love mine and will always sum back through it.
Old 27th November 2014
  #7
Gear Guru
 
RoundBadge's Avatar
love the burl setup.
printing through the B2 is great.your API buss chain is really good too.
experiment with hitting it [the input] at different levels and makeup the level with the gain pot.[its post transformer].
enjoy!
Old 27th November 2014
  #8
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nickelironsteel's Avatar
 

Is it possible on the bomber to turn the trannies off entirely and is it still the best conversion out there after that? Cause id rather chose my transformers on my 2bus with my blackbox.
Old 27th November 2014
  #9
Gear Guru
 
RoundBadge's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by nickelironsteel View Post
Is it possible on the bomber to turn the trannies off entirely and is it still the best conversion out there after that? Cause id rather chose my transformers on my 2bus with my blackbox.
no.
I guess it'd be kinda cool if you could but for me not a deal breaker.
I've recently messed with other current top conversion,Antelope,Prism,etc.
keep coming back to the burl.musical.subtle increase in size/ tightening in the lows cant be beat.
if you don't hit em hard they're really transparent.I usually have a lot of tx's beforehand as well..api console,neve 32087,Pultecs,SH mastering etc.
no prob.
Old 27th November 2014
  #10
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InMyGalaxie's Avatar
 

Great, thanks for the help! So--- Burl Black Friday sales?????
Old 27th November 2014
  #11
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RoundBadge's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by InMyGalaxie View Post
Great, thanks for the help! So--- Burl Black Friday sales?????
nah.
be patient.B2's pop up used here all the time.
I got one basically new for $1900.0
Old 27th November 2014
  #12
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Slug1's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by nickelironsteel View Post
Is it possible on the bomber to turn the trannies off entirely and is it still the best conversion out there after that? Cause id rather chose my transformers on my 2bus with my blackbox.
You can't turn them off but you can hit them at a lower level and then make up the gain with the trim. Or hit the tranny hard for more mojo and back off of the digital feed. For me it's the business as the back end of my mixes.
Old 29th November 2014
  #13
Gear Guru
 
RoundBadge's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by InMyGalaxie View Post
Great, thanks for the help! So--- Burl Black Friday sales?????
boom-
$1850.0
Burl b2 bomber adc
Old 29th November 2014
  #14
Here for the gear
 

cool
Old 29th November 2014
  #15
Gear Nut
 
InMyGalaxie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by RoundBadge View Post
boom-
$1850.0
Burl b2 bomber adc
...I already purchased one new with dante from sweetwater for $1250. Couldn't wait haha. Thanks for sharing though.
Old 29th November 2014
  #16
Gear Nut
 
InMyGalaxie's Avatar
 

Now the question is to find out whether my Avid io clocks better to my OCX or new B2 (when the B2 arrives) when tracking drums and not converting through the B2's AD.

When you are using the B2's AD on say a vocal, that aes cable coming from the B2 into the aes in on the Avid, would the Avid still need to be clocked to the B2 or OCX even though you aren't using it as the A/D? That's one thing I'm not clear on.
Old 29th November 2014
  #17
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RoundBadge's Avatar
Everything needs to be clocked to the same source.
Old 29th November 2014
  #18
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InMyGalaxie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by RoundBadge View Post
Everything needs to be clocked to the same source.
Ah ok cool. thanks for clarifying.
Old 29th November 2014
  #19
Gear Nut
 
InMyGalaxie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slug1 View Post
...Then try it with the Burl's internal clock, but clocking the Avid with the Antelope...
One of the scenarios Slug suggested trying involves clocking the Burl internally and the Avid to the Antelope OCX instead of clocking both to 1 unit. So, don't do this?

thx again
Old 29th November 2014
  #20
Gear Guru
 
RoundBadge's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by InMyGalaxie View Post
One of the scenarios Slug suggested trying involves clocking the Burl internally and the Avid to the Antelope OCX instead of clocking both to 1 unit. So, don't do this?

thx again
Sounds strange.doesnt make sense.
I've never done that.
I've always clocked all converters in the system from the same clock.
Old 30th November 2014
  #21
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Slug1's Avatar
Yep, my mistake. Either clock everything with the Antelop clock, or clock the Avid with the Burl.
Old 30th November 2014
  #22
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InMyGalaxie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slug1 View Post
Yep, my mistake. Either clock everything with the Antelop clock, or clock the Avid with the Burl.
All good man. Wanted to make sure I understood my setup options correctly.
Old 1st December 2014
  #23
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Slug1's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by InMyGalaxie View Post
All good man. Wanted to make sure I understood my setup options correctly.
Since you like the sound of the Avid to the Antelop, I would just go ahead and clock everything to the Antelop. The Burl should receive the Antelop clock gracefully.
Old 3rd December 2014
  #24
Gear Nut
 
InMyGalaxie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slug1 View Post
Since you like the sound of the Avid to the Antelop, I would just go ahead and clock everything to the Antelop. The Burl should receive the Antelop clock gracefully.
Cool yeah, it's being delivered tomorrow so I'll be comparing clocking between everything to the Burl vs everything to OCX.

Will Kahn from Burl told me the OCX isn't necessary anymore because the B2 will give you less jitter on its internal clock. Not sure if that's the same with adding external clocks to any unit though... I do know the OCX made the Avid 16x16io sound a little better.

Anyway, going to shootout both units clocked to the OCX then clocked to the B2 and we'll see what happens. I'm predicting a minuscule, if any, difference...

Most likely not selling the OCX either way just in case I happen to trip, fall, and accidentally purchase a 10M a couple years down the line.
Old 3rd December 2014
  #25
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Slug1's Avatar
Have fun dude! I'm clocking my Avids to a Burl B2. I have two Avid HD IO's loop synced, with the master receiving clock from the Burl. Will be nice to know if the Antelop clock leads to better sonics than the Burl. I hope not, or I'll be trying to demo a 10M!!!! NOOOO!!!!!
Old 3rd December 2014
  #26
Gear Guru
 
RoundBadge's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slug1 View Post
Will be nice to know if the Antelop clock leads to better sonics than the Burl. I hope not, or I'll be trying to demo a 10M!!!! NOOOO!!!!!
trinity/10m here. -yes.
Old 4th December 2014
  #27
Gear Nut
 
InMyGalaxie's Avatar
 

Ok, got the Burl B2 ADC in. Had an hour to compare just the clocking between the Avid to the B2 and to the Antelope. As I posted a couple days back, I honestly did not expect to find much significant difference or improvement between the OCX and B2 clocks. Happy to say that the Avid clocked to the B2 really surpassed my expectations. I haven't read many comments on the clock in this unit, but it really made the Avid's internal clock sound flat with much less weight in the low end. And I've never had any issues with the sound of the Avid...however, switching back and forth from Burl's internal clock to the Avid's internal clock made the Avid sound the worst it's ever sounded to me.

Waiting on a Dsub/Xlr and AES cables to come in before I can swap the OCX for the Burl in my rack. Can't wait to actually test the A/D in this thing. The clocking test was a great start.
Old 5th December 2014
  #28
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Slug1's Avatar
If your blown away by the clock, you're REALLY in for something when you hear the ADC!
Old 13th March 2017
  #29
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powerestudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by InMyGalaxie View Post
Ok, got the Burl B2 ADC in. Had an hour to compare just the clocking between the Avid to the B2 and to the Antelope. As I posted a couple days back, I honestly did not expect to find much significant difference or improvement between the OCX and B2 clocks. Happy to say that the Avid clocked to the B2 really surpassed my expectations. I haven't read many comments on the clock in this unit, but it really made the Avid's internal clock sound flat with much less weight in the low end. And I've never had any issues with the sound of the Avid...however, switching back and forth from Burl's internal clock to the Avid's internal clock made the Avid sound the worst it's ever sounded to me.

Waiting on a Dsub/Xlr and AES cables to come in before I can swap the OCX for the Burl in my rack. Can't wait to actually test the A/D in this thing. The clocking test was a great start.
Interesting. Finally what clock did you prefer, OCX or B2 ?
Old 13th March 2017
  #30
Gear Nut
 
InMyGalaxie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by powerestudio View Post
Interesting. Finally what clock did you prefer, OCX or B2 ?
B2 and took the OCX out of my rack, but now I use a 10MX
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