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Old 17th July 2020 | Show parent
  #7951
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by sergioelectro View Post
Amphion one 15 are great but seriously lack some low end! Sound Picture is not fully reproduced !
Has anyone here tried these with the FLEXBASE. I understand its quite new, but I have heard nothing about the flex base on any thread.
Old 18th July 2020 | Show parent
  #7952
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HansMues's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by glymur View Post
Very interesting. Alright, now I'm going to have to figure out some way to avoid pop when I turn off the console and related gear.
all gear ¨suffer ¨ from turning it on and off. Change in temperature of components make them expand and contract and this wears them off. ALL

Excepting tube gear, maybe it´s a matter of which has a bigger cost? leave it on and replace broken components or pay higher electricity bills. (and more carbon footprint)

In general, when i´m working consecutive days, solid state gear stays on 24/7. I only turn it off when i know i´m out the studio for at least a full day

I do have felt weird when i just switch on console, bass manager and amp and start working right away, but the only way to be sure for me would be to make and a/b between a cold and a warm amp, cause it could be my brain/ears the ones that are hearing cold

Last edited by HansMues; 18th July 2020 at 02:26 PM.. Reason: forgot the carbon footprint
Old 25th July 2020
  #7953
Here for the gear
 
davidryanolson's Avatar
 

Just got my Two15s in after a long (and painful!) backorder!!

Right out of the box they sound incredible. Faster and more detailed than the one18s for sure. Can't wait until they get broken in.
Old 25th July 2020 | Show parent
  #7954
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Shaggy2039's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidryanolson View Post
Just got my Two15s in after a long (and painful!) backorder!!

Right out of the box they sound incredible. Faster and more detailed than the one18s for sure. Can't wait until they get broken in.
Enjoy! Glad you're digging them. I personally liked the Two 15's much more than my demo time with the One 18's.

Edit: The One 18's ARE great monitors as evidenced by the many people on this thread doing stellar mixes with them.

Last edited by Shaggy2039; 26th July 2020 at 12:57 PM.. Reason: clarifying post
Old 2nd August 2020
  #7955
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Shaggy2039's Avatar
I wasn't even considering the Flexbase 25 but I made the mistake of casually asking Alto Music if they ever heard it with the Two 15's. They said "It sounds VERY very nice. The Two 15's become even more efficient and fast".

So now I'm looking into the possibility of getting the Flexbase 25 for my space...

I'm seeing it has two 10 inch drivers on each side and theres the ability to change the spread from mono to stereo but I'm trying to figure out how it does true stereo when it's coming from one single cabinet that's placed in the middle of the speakers.

Anyone here with a better understanding of this kind of thing care to explain?
Old 16th August 2020
  #7956
Hey everyone,

I wanted to take a moment to dog pile on with my Amphion journey. Due to Covid-19 lockdowns I’ve been mixing from home all summer (my commercial spot has been unavailable for months) and decided it’d be a great time to shop new monitors.

 I auditioned a short list of speakers and ended up bringing home a pair of demo One18’s which I’ve had for nearly 3 months. I’ve delivered around two dozen mixes for various clients so far and I think it’s finally time to pull the trigger on a pair of my own. These have made mixing from home totally doable and they help offset the fact that I’m not sitting in a purpose built room that’s been tuned to the nth degree.


Being ever diligent with my gear purchases, I decided to try the Two18’s for sh!ts and grins… just to be sure I wasn’t leaving anything on the table I might later regret. So I boxed up the demo One18’s and swapped them out for the Two’s, thinking I’d only need the weekend to surely decide that the bigger brothers would be *somewhat* better (but not twice as good as the price tag suggests) and that I’d place my order for a pair of One18’s come Monday.


I placed the Two18’s on the same stands in the same place as the singles. Upon hitting space bar on a mix I’d just wrapped for a client, the final 5% that I had been struggling with and simply abandoned on the One18’s suddenly were crystal clear on the Two18’s. My wallet let out an audible gasp. A whole 5 f*kn seconds is all it took for me to KNOW I needed these in my life. Being fully convinced just prior that the Two18’s wouldn’t justify the added expense, I was utterly and completely wrong. Five seconds has now greatly improved my life and I’m ordering a pair immediately. Are they worth double the money? Only if they’re the main source of your money.

Needless to say, I'm glad I found this thread to begin with as I had never heard of Amphion before.
Old 16th August 2020
  #7957
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anaudiopro's Avatar
 

Crazy to see this thread still going! Are blown tweeters still an issue or has Amphion fixed this?
Old 26th August 2020
  #7958
Gear Head
 

Amphion response

Can anybody here help reading the rew file and tell me where i need to improve? I find confusing the decay part or spectrogram! Measured with ecm8000 at listening position 130 cm from mic to each speaker, speaker to speaker 160 cm at center point, speakers are 10 cm gap from the front wall and tweeter is 135 cm from ground , room dimension after treatment : L420cm W320cm H240cm ! Amphion one18 Amp100! Thnx
Attached Files
File Type: mdat amphions LR.mdat (5.76 MB, 27 views)
Old 26th August 2020
  #7959
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Moreisless's Avatar
 

My Amphion One18 experience

Hi all! I have read this entire thread through the years and refer to it often. Thank you all for sharing your knowledge and experiences. The info here is priceless.

I would now like to contribute my own experience as I have now used the One18 for over a year. I run a recording studio that focuses mostly on heavy rock, punk, and metal. I have had many monitors over the years including Behringer Truth, Yammy Hs8, KRK Rokit 5, Neumann kh120, NS10, and Focal CMS 65. I have also tested out the Barefoot Footprint 01 in my room.
My room is a fully treated Listening/mixing room. I have spent countless hours using REW to place diffusion and absorption and move speaker placement inch by inch. The room is 11’ x 18’ x 8’ and my fft response measures +/- 4db from 30hz all the way up. To be fair, room treatment has progressively gotten better throughout the years so my room is a lot tighter now than when I had the my first monitors. On to the Monitors!

First I had the Behringer Truth, which btw weren’t actually horrible monitors. They were slightly fatiguing and a bit 2 dimensional if memory serves me right but for the price quite decent.
Next the Hs8 were a step up in terms of power and transient response but they had this razor sharp, grating presence region and caused me ear fatigue as I mostly mix music with high gain guitars. I think I could only last 5 minutes in front of the before fatigue kicked in. Much worse than NS10 in that respect for me personally. Also, the fact that they were rear ported caused huge problems in my room. Huge peaks and nulls below 200hz. I probably mixed on them for a year before my buddy gave me a pair of KRK Rokit 5.
These were Fun to work on and I actually produced some good mixes with the help of the car stereo, headphones, etc. I hooked up a cheap home theater sub and got the room pretty flat. I thought I might be missing some details in the music and I found a deal on the KH120.
Upon first listen I was so impressed I gave away the Rokits. The KH120 sounded amazing! They offered a smooth response with tremendous front to back detail. The way I could hear reverb trails for the first time. Closing my eyes, I could see the entire soundscape unfold beautifully like a painting rich with color and so much depth. To this day I think those are just great speakers for daily listening. The problem is they don’t translate well at all! I fought with them over and over but when I would playback my mixes on other systems I would be downright confused as to what the hell I was hearing in relation to what I thought I had mixed.

This is why it cannot be overstated: How good a speaker sounds to you has very little bearing on its value as a mix tool. I should mention that by this time my room was fully treated and in the ballpark of acoustically flat.
I moved to the CMS65 which did not sound as pleasing, nor did they retain the front to back depth of the Neumann’s, but they had a weightier sound, more bass punch, and my mixes were translating better or at least it wasn’t a complete guessing game. The CMS65 were the first speaker to show me compression. At first I thought there was a certain tightness to the drivers that was rather boring and 2 dimensional, at least it seemed so coming from the Neumanns. I soon realized that there was value to this attribute, as the cones were really showing me a glimpse of what compression does to a mix. As I grew with the CMS65 my mixes improved somewhat and I learned how to dial in compression more accurately. I even bought the matching Focal sub and used for a while but ended up selling it as I didn’t find it was offering much to what I already had. The CMS65 extend low enough on their own.
Enter the NS10. I mainly bought them because I had to know for myself what the hype or hate was about. Even if you despise them it still stands that they are tried and true in the recording industry. So I picked some cheap NS10 on ebay and also purchased an Adcom GFA-545.
The NS10 opened up a new world to me in the time domain. The lightning fast response allowed me (and still does allow me) to balance a mix at low volume. They show me what is important in the mid range and allow my mixes to translate better on smaller systems. The problem with them is I always need another speaker as a “main” because I can’t mix too long on the NS10 without getting ear fatigue. Also the lack of low end is a thing but I realize I’m not saying anything new here.

Because of my GAS and the fact that my close friend uses Barefoot mm27 which sound outstanding if not a bit too intense with the details, I decided to try the more affordable Footprint 01. My goal was to find an all in one solution, and while I was never too hopeful in Barefoot’s “meme” technology, I thought the speaker itself would at least deliver. Boy was I wrong! The sound of the Footprint 01 was big and punchy for the most part as expected from all Barefoots. But I immediately knew something was wrong. They sounded hollowed out as if there was information missing from about 150hz to 350hz. It was blatantly obvious. I tried moving them around but had no luck finding a position in which the problem improved. Upon testing with REW I found exactly what I had expected, a 6db hole from 150hz to 350hz. As it turns out, the crossover for that speaker was pushed up to 250hz to cut production costs. Imagine that! I assume the crossover was the culprit. Or maybe the side firing woofers didn’t agree with my room. Either way they didn’t work for me in my room. In a side by side comparison the CMS65 had a more solid image and more consistent midrange. I sent the Footprints back and ordered the Amphions.

I had been reading about how honest the Amphions were on this forum and though it was quite a price jump, I decided to go for it. I figured I could run them on my GFA-245 until I could figure something else out. I spoke with Julian at Amphion and he suggested the One18 as the best transition from the Focals since I was used to the 6.5” driver so I ordered them. As soon as I set them up I knew something was different with these speakers. Whereas the Barefoots struggled to show any improvement over the Focals, my Amphion One18 outperformed the Focals in every way. The difference was obvious, night and day (which it should be at that price point). There it was. No question whether or not they were really giving me more to work with. The details are gently shown with more resolution than I have heard in my previous monitors, but not forced forward like the Barefoot mm27. Listening to them for me is a blissful experience as I consider them quite pleasant throughout the spectrum with a sweetness to the top end. The speed of the drivers is outstanding in that well produced drums pop out and prick your ear just right even in dense, heavy mixes.

I figured I may just be giving in to the hype so I spent time away while I let them burn in. Each time I would return I would smile upon listening. This is the way music is supposed to sound. I figured maybe my ears had become biased so I placed them side by side with the CMS65 and to my surprise the CMS65 actually sounded almost broken. There was so much weirdness around 500hz it was like a big fuzzy area, just a blur. I had never noticed that before. Admittedly my mixes had suffered there before but I just figured it was me. But the One18 are so clear there. It makes me wonder if it has to do with their super tight phase accuracy across the board. So that was that. I sold the Focals.

The One18 have been a joy to work with. It’s been said before and it’s true, the center image is razor sharp and focused like I could reach out and touch it in front of my face. The sweet spot is big enough to move around a bit while I’m working. Again I guess that has to do with phase accuracy. There’s also this holographic nature to them that’s hard to describe. The image kind of floats slightly in front of the cones for me. I have them up against the wall, save 1” and about 56” apart and 52” to my listening position, pointing about a foot behind my head. I have had no problems with ear fatigue.
About 6 months ago I built myself an Amp500. It’s relatively simple to diy as the plans are online. In comparison to the GFA-545(unmodded), the Amp500 clone definitely had more weight in the low end. It also seemed more clinical if even a bit colder. The GFA-545 had more juicy vibe going on but in the end I needed the low end and the peace of mind one gets from staying in the Amphion brand. They have a vision of what their product should sound like and they’ve proved that they know what they’re doing.

Throughout the year I’ve mixed a dozen or so songs and a bunch of dialogue and my work continues to improve. I use a lot less compression nowadays because the Amphions “tell” me not to. They guide me to find other ways to enhance perceived punch without making instruments sound smaller. I still check in the truck and on the NS10. The only region I end up revising most often is the sub bass. This region can clearly be seen on a rew, where the frequency response drops at least 3db between 80hz and 30hz (right where my kick drum sits). So I’m considering getting the Flexbase25 or a pair of rhythmic subs to finalize my setup. On one hand Amphion offers that all in one package peace of mind at twice the price and on the other hand Rhythmic has made a lot of happy customers and they offer plenty of tweakability with controls on the back. I haven’t had the best luck with subs but I’m confident either of these would be great options.

Anyway sorry for the long post. I just wanted to do this thread justice for all that I have learned and confirm that Amphion has one more satisfied customer and fan for life! Fyi I kept the NS10 but mostly because according to clients they make my studio “official”.
Old 26th August 2020 | Show parent
  #7960
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Moreisless's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Erion View Post
Can anybody here help reading the rew file and tell me where i need to improve? I find confusing the decay part or spectrogram! Measured with ecm8000 at listening position 130 cm from mic to each speaker, speaker to speaker 160 cm at center point, speakers are 10 cm gap from the front wall and tweeter is 135 cm from ground , room dimension after treatment : L420cm W320cm H240cm ! Amphion one18 Amp100! Thnx
First of all your spl is quite low. This may be because you haven't "checked levels" in rew's preferences. Go through the check levels process and use an spl meter or a phone app to make sure your speakers are around 75db at your listening position. Once done, click on the SPL button at the top of the new interface. Type in the appropriate number. I'm not sure this is the right thread to be asking this question though.
Old 27th August 2020 | Show parent
  #7961
Gear Head
 

You’re right I didn’t calibrate the spl but the check levels confirmation was green indicating that i have good levels! Plus the levels were right bcz any more than that would blow the amphion woofers! Btw yes wrong thread! Thnk you
Old 31st August 2020
  #7962
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anaudiopro's Avatar
 

Does anyone know anything about the brand new Adcom GFA-565SE?
Old 31st August 2020
  #7963
Are there MM45 users against Amphion?
Old 1st September 2020
  #7964
Gear Maniac
 

Not to bash Amphion.......they make great sounding loudspeaker systems.......but the TWO systems are seriously flawed for mixing tools......the center to center distance of the two midwoofers violate the 1/4 wavelength rule at the crossover point creating a forward lobe that makes depth of field decisions nearly impossible. Yes......they can handle more power and the D’Appolito alignment reduces floor and ceiling bounce...........both of which should be inconsequential in a well treated room, which at this price point shouldn’t be an issue as spending $5k-$7k on monitors for use in an untreated space wouldn’t make much sense.......
Old 1st September 2020 | Show parent
  #7965
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anaudiopro's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayhem13 View Post
Not to bash Amphion.......they make great sounding loudspeaker systems.......but the TWO systems are seriously flawed for mixing tools......the center to center distance of the two midwoofers violate the 1/4 wavelength rule at the crossover point creating a forward lobe that makes depth of field decisions nearly impossible. Yes......they can handle more power and the D’Appolito alignment reduces floor and ceiling bounce...........both of which should be inconsequential in a well treated room, which at this price point shouldn’t be an issue as spending $5k-$7k on monitors for use in an untreated space wouldn’t make much sense.......
This came out of left field... LOL
Old 1st September 2020 | Show parent
  #7966
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by anaudiopro View Post
This came out of left field... LOL
Not really.......a D’Appolito alignment is a great speaker for listening....but not an ideal tool for analyzing. Wanna impress your clients with a loud, clean listen of their mixed down masterpiece?......yep......these will do just that. The MT versions on the other hand are an excellent representation of what constitutes a great analytical monitor.

Here are some measurements of the woofer used in the One and Two 18

https://hificompass.com/en/speakers/...l18rnx/p-h1224

A very nice, linear driver for bass response.....but look at the massive energy storage around 1khz, possibly the most critical range of hearing?.....it’s one of the choices Amphion made as to the low crossover point of 1.6khz is to be sure that energy was already down 6db at 1khz for a flat response.......but that energy still propages as non linear HD. As a designer, this woofer is FAR better suited in a 3way design.

Interestingly, the smaller 5.25 woofer used in the One and Two15 has the same upper mid/treble character of the it’s larger cousin, only sacrificing low end response with its smaller cone and overall size......but because it is smaller, the center to center distance to the tweeter is less allowing for a higher crossover point before comb filtering sets in.....a good thing for a woofer who’s breakup mode is so pronounced.

For an interesting overall view, the components used to manufacture one One18 are about $200 street price and around $125 wholesale in quantity. At $1500 retail, that’s quite a profit margin. Now I’m sure a bit of that is US import tariffs, so here in the US?.......I’d find better value in a domestic product.
Old 1st September 2020 | Show parent
  #7967
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayhem13 View Post
Not really.......a D’Appolito alignment is a great speaker for listening....but not an ideal tool for analyzing. Wanna impress your clients with a loud, clean listen of their mixed down masterpiece?......yep......these will do just that. The MT versions on the other hand are an excellent representation of what constitutes a great analytical monitor.

Here are some measurements of the woofer used in the One and Two 18

https://hificompass.com/en/speakers/...l18rnx/p-h1224

A very nice, linear driver for bass response.....but look at the massive energy storage around 1khz, possibly the most critical range of hearing?.....it’s one of the choices Amphion made as to the low crossover point of 1.6khz is to be sure that energy was already down 6db at 1khz for a flat response.......but that energy still propages as non linear HD. As a designer, this woofer is FAR better suited in a 3way design.

Interestingly, the smaller 5.25 woofer used in the One and Two15 has the same upper mid/treble character of the it’s larger cousin, only sacrificing low end response with its smaller cone and overall size......but because it is smaller, the center to center distance to the tweeter is less allowing for a higher crossover point before comb filtering sets in.....a good thing for a woofer who’s breakup mode is so pronounced.

For an interesting overall view, the components used to manufacture one One18 are about $200 street price and around $125 wholesale in quantity. At $1500 retail, that’s quite a profit margin. Now I’m sure a bit of that is US import tariffs, so here in the US?.......I’d find better value in a domestic product.
So, you are telling us that according to current aerodynamic engineering practice, the bumblebee can't fly......
Old 1st September 2020 | Show parent
  #7968
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Shaggy2039's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayhem13 View Post
Not to bash Amphion.......they make great sounding loudspeaker systems.......but the TWO systems are seriously flawed for mixing tools.......
Utter nonsense.
Old 1st September 2020 | Show parent
  #7969
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Shaggy2039's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalGrease View Post
So, you are telling us that according to current aerodynamic engineering practice, the bumblebee can't fly......
There's a sect of people in this forum who live and die by frequency response charts, specs and graphs. And ofcourse, they'll point out any flaws they see with them but they fail to point out that no speaker is perfect and if you learn your monitors well enough, you can mix on ANY speaker.

Is the NS-10 a "perfect speaker" by any of these frequency charts and graphs? Nope. Yet it's the most popular mix tool on the market and literally countless records have been mixed on them over the decades.

Are Auratones a perfect speaker by any of their charts and graphs? Same answer.

Did Rob Kinelski just mix Billie Eilish's album - arguably the biggest album of 2019 - on Amphion Two 18's? Yes he did.

Does Dave Pensado mix on the Two 18's? Yes he does.

I actually hate the fact that this has to be said over and over but here we are....

Last edited by Shaggy2039; 1st September 2020 at 05:10 PM..
Old 1st September 2020 | Show parent
  #7970
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy2039 View Post
There's a sect of people in this forum who live and die by frequency response charts, specs and graphs. And ofcourse, they'll point out any flaws they see with them but they fail to point out that no speaker is perfect and if you learn your monitors well enough, you can mix on ANY speaker.

Is the NS-10 a "perfect speaker" by any of these frequency charts and graphs? Nope. Yet it's the most popular mix tool on the market and literally countless records have been mixed on them over the decades.

Are Auratones a perfect speaker by any of their charts and graphs? Same answer.

Did Rob Kinelski just mix Billie Eilish's album - arguably the biggest album of 2019 - on Amphion Two 18's? Yes he did.

Does Dave Pensado mix on the Two 18's? Yes he does.

I actually hate the fact that this has to be said over and over but here we are....
Well not that it will change Mayhem13's mind but Shaggy, you can count Finneas as a Two18 user, apparently he auditioned other monitors ( I'd very much like to know which ones !). He also mentioned that when he sends the mixes to Kinelski "they are 98% there"( having work on headphones and Yamaha HS80). The guy knows what he's doing on many levels, interesting he settled for Two18 ( +Base). The last Eilish single "My Future" was done on Two18 at all stages.

Actually Kinelski added Base25 too.

Ok on another note, look who adopted a lil sister !?


Last edited by DownSideUp; 1st September 2020 at 08:17 PM..
Old 1st September 2020 | Show parent
  #7971
One15 and One18

Dang! It took 1mn to love one15. Sort of the low mids I always was missing in the 18 ( and adding to MY mixes only to discover it was too much).

Nice high mids too, coherent.

One18 probably extend a bit or aim to be sweeter up high, and measure nice to reach 30hz in my room ( more like 40hz for One15), but actually the 15 doesn't sound lacking in the bass area in my room. similar really. probably just less headroom ( and no tweeter protection for sure).

I have to thanks Anssi who helped me with my bad measures of the 18. I did a stupid mistake and in the end they measured fine.

It was unrelated but I mentioned I was after trying the 15s. He told me "move the 18, try this and that and don't buy new speakers" !!
He was dedicated to help get the best of that speaker and not push any sale. Really great guy.

BUT, I'm a curious bastard so I had to have the 15s, and BOOM finally a pal of mine offers a insanely good deal. Mine ! I could even keep both, but I think I won't ! I love them, they make sense in my room and the way I hear. I'll probably pull out the HR824 for "fun and loud and not scared to blow them up".

Ok first impression ! let's see how I mix now.

Last edited by DownSideUp; 1st September 2020 at 08:19 PM..
Old 2nd September 2020 | Show parent
  #7972
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy2039 View Post
Utter nonsense.
Not nonsense, physics. With two sources playing the same content with a distance between them greater than that of the 1/4 wavelength of the fundamental, a forward lobe is created.......not me shaggy, fundamental physics and wave propagation.

The D’Appolito alignment ‘steers’ this lobe off axis as much as possible.....but that still creates a phase anomaly and a ragged power response. Combine these, and the depth of field is leveled to the point where three dimensional soundscapes only exist in the nearfield....but fall apart in the mid and far.

Yes.....listening habits and devices have changed......but not physics.
Old 2nd September 2020
  #7973
Gear Maniac
 

Yes....yes...yes.....all of you triggered by my statements.....I hear you......and yes, you can mix on anything........but what does that statement serve to prove?

As for Eli’s whatever her name is,.........so the biggest selling album is quantified by the highest fidelity, imaging and 3D soundstage?.........being consumed by who and listened on what? Somehow this reduces the reality of science and acoustic principle?

Like I said, Amphion makes a great speaker........but the ONE series is the FAR better choice with a more even power response and an insignificant forward lobe. Bigger isn’t always better fellas......remember the ideal speaker is a fullrange point source.....I can’t debate that reality with any of you, nor should you choose to try
Old 2nd September 2020 | Show parent
  #7974
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayhem13 View Post
Yes....yes...yes.....all of you triggered by my statements.....I hear you......and yes, you can mix on anything........but what does that statement serve to prove?

As for Eli’s whatever her name is,.........so the biggest selling album is quantified by the highest fidelity, imaging and 3D soundstage?.........being consumed by who and listened on what? Somehow this reduces the reality of science and acoustic principle?

Like I said, Amphion makes a great speaker........but the ONE series is the FAR better choice with a more even power response and an insignificant forward lobe. Bigger isn’t always better fellas......remember the ideal speaker is a fullrange point source.....I can’t debate that reality with any of you, nor should you choose to try
It appears to me that you were triggered originally, perhaps by our enthusiasm? What impulse drove you to try to convince us that we are so wrong, and with such energy?

I think you are looking into a mirror with this whole "all of you triggered" thing.

It's ok. We are all imperfect, none of us are omniscient. I choose to just keep stumbling along the best I can with what I got. (limited cognitive capabilities)

No worries.
Old 2nd September 2020
  #7975
Lives for gear
I have been enjoying the One15's. I won't enjoy them any less if someone criticizes them. If Mayhem13 was repeatedly just bashing the sound of them with subjective opinions, then that's one thing. However, he/she is stating objective points about the design. I'm not detecting anything personal. If somebody wants to critique the technical points he/she is making, then please go ahead and correct it. That would be equally useful.

Subjective and objective feedback are both useful (to me).
Old 2nd September 2020 | Show parent
  #7976
Billie Eillish ( get the name right) 'songs are stellar productions and those speakers are loved, and used by the best engineers.

I've always wondered about why "one extra woofer" made another model that's so much more expensive and perceived by many like a real step up, after all it's just one speaker and even the design can be ( like above) criticized.

Design that was also used on the Lipinski L-707A, two 7" woofers surrounding a tweeter, passive monitors serve by Class-D amps, sounds familiar
Bob Katz used that design for years with great success.

But we can discuss physics all day, there are so many designs used from concentric Tannoys (Scheps and Maserati) to tiny large bands Auratone ( Brauer, Helmirst, MixedByAli) that there'll always be plenty to talk about, not because "people mix on anything" but more like "some design are surprisingly efficient to mix and produce, science isn't everything".


Anyway if I come across a pair of Two15, I'd not be against making my own judgement and give them a try.

Last edited by DownSideUp; 2nd September 2020 at 09:47 AM..
Old 2nd September 2020 | Show parent
  #7977
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James Lehmann's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayhem13 View Post
Like I said, Amphion makes a great speaker........but the ONE series is the FAR better choice with a more even power response and an insignificant forward lobe. Bigger isn’t always better fellas......remember the ideal speaker is a fullrange point source...
Just to be clear then, are the sweeping conclusions you have reached above based on:

a) Mixing a wide range of music over a period of weeks on several different Amphion One and Two systems – perhaps in different studios – and incorporating feedback on your mixes/translation from multiple sources including one or more mastering engineers, the artists, and lots of other trusted listeners?

b) Poring over the published spec sheets?
Old 2nd September 2020 | Show parent
  #7978
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayhem13 View Post
Not nonsense, physics. With two sources playing the same content with a distance between them greater than that of the 1/4 wavelength of the fundamental, a forward lobe is created.......not me shaggy, fundamental physics and wave propagation.

The D’Appolito alignment ‘steers’ this lobe off axis as much as possible.....but that still creates a phase anomaly and a ragged power response. Combine these, and the depth of field is leveled to the point where three dimensional soundscapes only exist in the nearfield....but fall apart in the mid and far.

Yes.....listening habits and devices have changed......but not physics.

Just pointing out that the Amphion monitors, including the Two series, are specifically and literally marketed, sold, and mostly used as nearfield monitors.

The first words on the Amphion Two18 product page, in big bold text:

Two18
Nearfield studio monitor

https://amphion.fi/create/products-p...tudio-monitor/

So, your point is essentially; Oh, never mind, these ARE nearfield monitors...
Old 2nd September 2020 | Show parent
  #7979
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by James Lehmann View Post
Just to be clear then, are the sweeping conclusions you have reached above based on:

a) Mixing a wide range of music over a period of weeks on several different Amphion One and Two systems – perhaps in different studios – and incorporating feedback on your mixes/translation from multiple sources including one or more mastering engineers, the artists, and lots of other trusted listeners?

b) Poring over the published spec sheets?
No, it’s a comprehensive understanding of loudspeaker design principle and how it relates to the laws of physics. Forget spec sheets......measurements of anechoic or gated frequency response will tell you next to nothing about how a system will behave in your environment.

.....with that, I would only add that the Amphion offerings are passive......and passive circuits are incapable of time domain processing to any effect.....yes...I would firmly stand behind my assesment. Liken it to an incredibly good looking car with the most comfortable interior possible......and no engine.....

I really don’t understand the pushback.....I’m trying to share with you folks my decades of experience with loudspeaker design( not subjective, but purely scientific) and it’s being interpreted as subjective opinion? I have no dog in this fight fellas.....no rival company or interests.....just wanna provide objective information to help someone avoid spending more money on a product that doesn’t have the performance potential for the $$$

If someone is capable of challenging the premise that the perfect loudspeaker system ISN’T a full range, point source device.....i’m all ears and count me in for the lesson.......but until then, I will continue to point out the obvious flaws of a passive D’Appolito alignment as an optimal analyzing tool. The ONE series, by design is a much better option.
Old 2nd September 2020 | Show parent
  #7980
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalGrease View Post
Just pointing out that the Amphion monitors, including the Two series, are specifically and literally marketed, sold, and mostly used as nearfield monitors.

The first words on the Amphion Two18 product page, in big bold text:

Two18
Nearfield studio monitor

https://amphion.fi/create/products-p...tudio-monitor/

So, your point is essentially; Oh, never mind, these ARE nearfield monitors...
See now.....you’re response is being purposefully condescending as it seeks to defend a position you’ve adopted from Amphion’s marketing......

I can’t correspond with a premise based on marketing trumps science. Continue to believe what you will and ENJOY.....(Big, bold text).
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