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Otis Redding, Frank Sinatra. Different styles. What compressors? Any idea or facts?
Old 17th December 2014
  #31
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doorknocker's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by tekis View Post
Frank Sinatra is clearly a great singer. I feel he's very in control and concious of his dynamics. Check out this concert; I find the vocal performances really unbelievably great:

Absolutely.

And it's a great example of how to use the microphone, check from 1:05 on how he sing closer into the mic for softer passages and then for proximity effect on his lower range.

Sinatra of course was a master of phrasing, THE best maybe at it. A while ago it occured to me that a lot of really great singers were/are also drummers : Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye, Karen Carpenter, the list goes on. Even Iggy Pop and Steven Tyler started out as drummers.
Old 17th December 2014
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doorknocker View Post
Sinatra of course was a master of phrasing, THE best maybe at it.
Yes, he was good but Nat King Cole takes this prize in my opinion and then there is Ella Fitzgerald too.
Old 17th December 2014
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by warlordpriest View Post
Listening to some vintage recordings of Otis Redding, probably one of the most difficult singers to track because of the huge dynamic range, and noticing how smooth the compression was. Even the low almost whispered stuff was clearly captured…as well as the peaks. Realizing that they went to tape and this is only part of the chain, I'm just curious. Anyone have any idea what they used on him? Stax records was the studio but info on the gear is hard to find.
Also Sinatra. Very smooth and thick. Universal Audio seems to assert that a UA610 was the pre, but the compressor? Would that have been mostly a 176?
On many of those recordings, "compression" was obtained by the engineer riding the fader in real time ... a couple of rundowns and the engineer would have a pretty good idea of where the loud stuff was.

Sometimes they missed it, listen to some of the Clarence Carter stuff from the late 60's - lots of distortion on the loud stuff.
Old 18th December 2014
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samc View Post
Yes, he was good but Nat King Cole takes this prize in my opinion and then there is Ella Fitzgerald too.
different horses for courses...

One feather in the cap for Frankie over the other two was that Miles emulated his phrasing and breath control, circa 55'-57', when Miles was also copping Ahmad Jamal's Pershing Lounge period.

For my money though, for that time Johnny Hartman killed them all - like buttah'...though sassy Sarah Vaughn and the smokey Nina Simone were also sublime...
Old 18th December 2014
  #35
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GeneHall's Avatar
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Originally Posted by phanlon View Post
You can very easily do itwith a sm7.
+1 I have one of the original SM7 ' and it is one of the most reliable microphonesone can have, IMHO. It's
The modern version, sm7b is not even close but dollar for dollar is still a more pragmatic purchase than alot of those low 1k range Ldc '... In my experience, great LDC start at or above 2500 to 3k.
I'm down to an sm7 original and a FLEA 49B, I have all that I want and get so much more than I ever imagined from just those two mics, regarding vocals. I'm very happy with both.
Old 18th December 2014
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 12tone View Post
different horses for courses...
No, phrasing is phrasing your taste is just different from mine. I don't understand how it's okay to speak about Miles (a trumpet) player but discard Nat who sang ballads like Frank.

Nina Simone was more like Otis…lots of passion and heat, hardly as controlled and measured like Nat Cole or Frank Sinatra.
Old 18th December 2014
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samc View Post
No, phrasing is phrasing your taste is just different from mine.
And your taste dictates the kind of phrasing you like or apply to your own work as a musician.

Let's just be happy that artists like Sinatra, Miles, Nat King Cole, Ella Fitzgerald and many others left such a great legacy. It's not a sport.
Old 18th December 2014
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samc View Post
No, phrasing is phrasing your taste is just different from mine. I don't understand how it's okay to speak about Miles (a trumpet) player but discard Nat who sang ballads like Frank.

Nina Simone was more like Otis…lots of passion and heat, hardly as controlled and measured like Nat Cole or Frank Sinatra.
Would never discard Nat, didn't think that I did...and btw, a great singer but I liked his piano playing just as much (when he really played, before he got really famous - much like George Benson and his guitar playing).

I mentioned Miles because I don't know if many people knew how he was influenced by Sinatra - thought it might be a nice thing to share.

As far as Nina Simone - she could be as controlled and measured as anyone, including Nat or Frank...
Old 18th December 2014
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 12tone View Post
As far as Nina Simone - she could be as controlled and measured as anyone, including Nat or Frank...
I loved her piano playing too…she was literally blackmailed into singing while playing in a small club in Philadelphia to fund her music education.

Controlled…yes, but it's a little hard to imagine (after the fact) her delivering "I put a Spell On You", "Strange Fruit", "Ne me quitte pas", "Don't Let Me Be Misunderstood" or many of her other heart rending, emotional renditions in the same sugary style a la Sinatra and Cole.
Old 18th December 2014
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samc View Post
I loved her piano playing too…she was literally blackmailed into singing while playing in a small club in Philadelphia to fund her music education.

Controlled…yes, but it's a little hard to imagine (after the fact) her delivering "I put a Spell On You", "Strange Fruit", "Ne me quitte pas", "Don't Let Me Be Misunderstood" or many of her other heart rending, emotional renditions in the same sugary style a la Sinatra and Cole.
I'm thinking of this:



agree, she was a wonderful pianist...but no Nat Cole - he was a virtuoso...
Old 18th December 2014
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doorknocker View Post
It's not a sport.
Nobody said it was, all of us are expressing our opinions here…
Old 19th December 2014
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by warlordpriest View Post
Listening to some vintage recordings of Otis Redding,..... Anyone have any idea what they used on him?.....
Looks like maybe a U47 in the background at 1 minute 41 seconds - as might be expected from that era.
OTIS REDDING: (Sittin' On) The Dock of the Bay - YouTube
Old 19th December 2014
  #43
Well…couldn't watch the video. For some reason its "from WMG who has blocked it from my country on copyright grounds." (Whatever that means.)

Anyway, came to the same conclusion and figured something on the lines of a U47 would fit the bill.

Wanted to share that I picked up a Stellar CM-6 and its a beautiful sounding mic, right out the box, and everything you need is included in a pretty snazzy and compact case.

Still burning it in but feel like I won the lottery!
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