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New Flea 47 Next owner Condenser Microphones
Old 11th September 2014
  #91
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GeneHall's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad John View Post
I am sorry there is so much nit picking over The Flea Next since I was away on vacation with my family. The original topic was ideal preamps for the U47 style microphone.

I can honestly say, with the short time I have used my new Flea Next before vacation (about 6 days to try it out in the studio) , I have experienced such total pleasure from singing and feeling out this wonderful mic. It is the first time in 30 years I have ever heard the real organic balance of the tone of my voice (both speaking and singing.)

I admit though, it took a couple of days to learn how to work the mic and feel the proximity range. Then I tested the different preamps that I have. So far Manley 60db and Electrodyne 501 were better for the Flea Next than API, VP26, 2-610. So far, Electrodyne is the winner for rich thick vintage sound.

I plan on getting an Avedis ma5 immediately!

My experience says NEVE all the way!
1073
8801
1084
1272
Portico2 !!


Everything else is compared to these because that are the definable greatness that has documented an extraordinary amount of great products and creations.
I praise all the boutique builders that chase their own spin on these formidable sonic masterpieces, but at the end of the day, Neve is still the extraordinary standout preamp. Everything pales in side by side comparison to the Neve creations.
I find the Neve sound exciting and rewarding to work with. Particularly with our Flea masterpieces.
Old 11th September 2014
  #92
Gear Nut
 

MA5
Old 15th September 2014
  #93
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Mad John's Avatar
 

Yes. I think the MA5 is my next preamp!
Old 16th September 2014
  #94
Gear Head
So far I've tried mine out with my API 312, Pacifica and Great River ME1NV. For me the GR wins out every time (loading button in, output gain around noon). Surprised me a bit, I was expecting to love it with the Pacifica, always do with a TM1, but for the Flea the highs just seem to sound sweeter with the GR. As suggested, I can imagine a 1073 or the likes would be even better... In fact it's fuelled some Neve lust in me! :/
Old 16th September 2014
  #95
Gear Addict
 
at4033's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Markmanch View Post
...I was expecting to love it with the Pacifica.../
Interesting. I have a Flea Vintage 47 on demo here, and also find my Pacifica is not the best match. FWIW, it is perfect with my Soundelux E49.
Old 17th September 2014
  #96
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DeadPoet's Avatar
Just another happy Flea owner. Went from a Peluso 22 251 and P12 to a matched set of Flea 49 and a Flea 47. When comparing to my Pelusos the words 'metallic', 'thin' and 'shrill' were the first to pop in my and others' heads.

FWIW I've got a SCA rack loaded with 4x N72 and 4x A12 plus two UA610MkII and I prefer the Neve sound every time I do a comparison.


Herwig
Old 17th September 2014
  #97
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I have a U47 inspired mic and "seein as how" I actually had the opportunity to use a very good one, back in the early 70s, it is my studied opinion none of the bevy of 47 clones will approach the sonic signature of the original with out a VF14 tube!!! with that said there are some very good U67 and vintage Tele clones (I have a Peluso P67 & P12 that I much prefer) that are very close to the sonic beauty of the originals. The primary reason is the relative abundance of very high quality NOS tubes that were used in the originals that can be purchased for a few hundred dollars. Peluso, Perlman, etc. etc. incorporate very high grade components that is some ways exceed the originals they are modeling however with any valve mic The tube is the quantitative element. To that end I use an AT4060 and Rode K2 with high grade ($175. each) NOS tubes for vocals in our Bluegrass concerts and the warm clarity & texture of the vocals are stunning. The tube will produce 75% of what you will like or dislike about any of these mics that have decent electronic components.
Old 17th September 2014
  #98
Gear Guru
 
Sounds Great's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by hughshouse View Post
back in the early 70s, it is my studied opinion none of
I'm sorry, but your memory of the experience you had with a microphone in the early 70's cannot be applied in any way to compare with something you hear now.

This test is rather lacking in the level matching department.. heh
Old 18th September 2014
  #99
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GeneHall's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by hughshouse View Post
I have a U47 inspired mic and "seein as how" I actually had the opportunity to use a very good one, back in the early 70s, it is my studied opinion none of the bevy of 47 clones will approach the sonic signature of the original with out a VF14 tube!!! with that said there are some very good U67 and vintage Tele clones (I have a Peluso P67 & P12 that I much prefer) that are very close to the sonic beauty of the originals. The primary reason is the relative abundance of very high quality NOS tubes that were used in the originals that can be purchased for a few hundred dollars. Peluso, Perlman, etc. etc. incorporate very high grade components that is some ways exceed the originals they are modeling however with any valve mic The tube is the quantitative element. To that end I use an AT4060 and Rode K2 with high grade ($175. each) NOS tubes for vocals in our Bluegrass concerts and the warm clarity & texture of the vocals are stunning. The tube will produce 75% of what you will like or dislike about any of these mics that have decent electronic components.
While a valve can dramatically affect, it is but one component in a sophisticated assembly balanced by great engineering and build standards.
Comparing a re tubed Peluso to a Flea is like comparing Warhol to Rembrandt.
The sum of great mic engineering is not hung on one component, and any summation that says it does, misleads those who seek understanding and clarity, not armchair observations recanting a nearly 50 yr old recollection of a sound in contrast to modern creations...mate really!
Flea are a work of High Art.
No question, a defining leader in modern microphones. Peluso builds stuff that will work.

Last edited by GeneHall; 18th September 2014 at 03:11 AM.. Reason: uh..forgot
Old 18th September 2014
  #100
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I have not replaced any of the tubes that were originally installed in the four Peluso's I own. Only the 2247SE is a possible candidate for a tube upgrade and at this point I am not willing to spring for a VF14. The NOS tubes I purchased were installed in an AT4060 and a Rode K2. Paul White had a very positive review of the flea47 three years ago in Sound on Sound and was impressed by the transparent nature of the mic. He also made the following remarks: "Wunder, Wagner, Korby, Soundeluxe, Telefunken & Peluso all attract favorable comments. The difficulty is in saying which comes closest to the original as no two old U47s sound exactly alike" A great mic is a great mic whether of not it sounds like something built a half a century ago." Bottom line is declaring a "best U47 sound" is a highly biased subjective opinion. Unlike most of the folks that contribute to these threads I have a vivid memory from 40 years ago of a U47 in a much closer factory spec condition than is possible today and I do not believe that sound is possible with out deploying a VF14 tube. I do not own a flea47 and It is unlikely I will purchase one because the warm transparency in the P67 and P12 are satisfying my studio needs. That is my highly biased subjective opinion.
Old 18th September 2014
  #101
I have the Flea 47 Next, and am using it with a John Hardy Twin Servo. For comparison, I also have an SM7b that I also use. The Flea into the Hardy sounds big, deep, detailed with a veeeeeery pleasing ember-ish glow on top. The SM7b also sounds very nice through the Hardy, but I could just listen to the 'sound' of the Flea vocal and be pleased sans lyrics [if that makes any sense].
Old 21st September 2014
  #102
Gear Addict
How do the Wunder and Flea compare? I've read consistently glowing reports about each.


Tom
Old 25th September 2014
  #103
I have a Flea 47 & I must admit that my AML ez 1073 suits perfectly well. this is such a wonderful mic... tried here with SSL Alpha Channel, Desert Island Audio Neve VR Rack, Liquid Channel: always sounds great. When you reach this kind of mic quality the only problem to solve is just hoping the singer will be to the top...
Old 26th September 2014
  #104
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kidvybes's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by hughshouse View Post
I it is my studied opinion none of the bevy of 47 clones will approach the sonic signature of the original with out a VF14 tube!!!
The tube will produce 75% of what you will like or dislike about any of these mics that have decent electronic components.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hughshouse View Post
Unlike most of the folks that contribute to these threads I have a vivid memory from 40 years ago of a U47 in a much closer factory spec condition than is possible today and I do not believe that sound is possible with out deploying a VF14 tube.
...well, Oliver Archut (RIP) might have disagreed with you on that as well as David Bock and Dave Pearlman, to name a few...Oliver who apprenticed as an engineer for Telefunken before starting his own TAB Funkenwerks/AMI, was a strong believer that the Telefunken EF800 tube is very capable of comparable performance to the VF14 when employed in the 47 circuit...

...if you aren't already familiar with this other forum, you may find some of the projects quite interesting...Dany Bouchard's (aka "Poctop") contributions, with collaborative assistance from Oliver Archut are quite impressive:
Microphones

...Dany's website features a U47 clone based on Oliver's own recreation of the original circuit modified to employ the Tele 800, 802 or EF80:
Vintagemicrophonepcbkit.com

...and then there's this:
MK-U47 - Official build thread

...all of these "clone" offerings are quite a bit higher-grade (as well as much closer to the originals) than any of the Peluso offerings, and until you've auditioned some of the options being re-engineered by collaborative effort, as has been made available by the GroupDIY community, it's a bit presumptive to make such blanket statements...

...nostalgia aside, the tube, while it plays an important part in the equation, it no way accounts for 75% of the signature sound...the capsule and transformer are equal, if not greater contributors, IMHO...and the PSU is surprisingly important in the final outcome...
Old 26th September 2014
  #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hughshouse View Post
I have not replaced any of the tubes that were originally installed in the four Peluso's I own. Only the 2247SE is a possible candidate for a tube upgrade and at this point I am not willing to spring for a VF14. The NOS tubes I purchased were installed in an AT4060 and a Rode K2. Paul White had a very positive review of the flea47 three years ago in Sound on Sound and was impressed by the transparent nature of the mic. He also made the following remarks: "Wunder, Wagner, Korby, Soundeluxe, Telefunken & Peluso all attract favorable comments. The difficulty is in saying which comes closest to the original as no two old U47s sound exactly alike" A great mic is a great mic whether of not it sounds like something built a half a century ago." Bottom line is declaring a "best U47 sound" is a highly biased subjective opinion. Unlike most of the folks that contribute to these threads I have a vivid memory from 40 years ago of a U47 in a much closer factory spec condition than is possible today and I do not believe that sound is possible with out deploying a VF14 tube. I do not own a flea47 and It is unlikely I will purchase one because the warm transparency in the P67 and P12 are satisfying my studio needs. That is my highly biased subjective opinion.

With all do respect, To say you can detect the subtle shadings between a vintage u47 you heard 40 years ago versus one of the current recreations and to further speculate that said differences are solely based on the difference of the vacuum tube employed sounds a little absurd. I don't mean to be critical here but come'on.
Old 27th September 2014
  #106
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andrewk808's Avatar
 

I just got one and am also interested in trying a different pre. I think the Pacifica can be a little thumpy. Even with my Schoeps. Or maybe it's my room. Or both, but I was thinking about maybe NPNG...maybe Pueblo? ...room acoustics...
Not exactly your typical use for this mic but this chain is 47 Next- Pacifica - Aurora. No added compression, EQ or anything. Not really wanting to go that route to fix anything.
Corey Fujimoto "Canon in D" - YouTube
Old 27th September 2014
  #107
Gear Guru
 
Sounds Great's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewk808 View Post
I just got one and am also interested in trying a different pre. I think the Pacifica can be a little thumpy. Even with my Schoeps. Or maybe it's my room. Or both, but I was thinking about maybe NPNG...maybe Pueblo? ...room acoustics...
Not exactly your typical use for this mic but this chain is 47 Next- Pacifica - Aurora. No added compression, EQ or anything. Not really wanting to go that route to fix anything.
Corey Fujimoto "Canon in D" - YouTube
That sounds fantastic.
Old 27th September 2014
  #108
Gear Head
 

I think you'd' be very happy with a Pueblo Audio preamp. I purchased four channels last year and have since sold my GML and John Hardy/Jensen Twin servo mic preamps.
Old 27th September 2014
  #109
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Mad John's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewk808 View Post
I just got one and am also interested in trying a different pre. I think the Pacifica can be a little thumpy. Even with my Schoeps. Or maybe it's my room. Or both, but I was thinking about maybe NPNG...maybe Pueblo? ...room acoustics...
Not exactly your typical use for this mic but this chain is 47 Next- Pacifica - Aurora. No added compression, EQ or anything. Not really wanting to go that route to fix anything.
Corey Fujimoto "Canon in D" - YouTube
Andrew, I really enjoyed your ukulele playing and the recording sounds really great too. Fantastic job. You are a talented man!
Old 28th September 2014
  #110
Gear Addict
Quote:
Originally Posted by at4033 View Post
You noticed that, too?
So, how do the Wunder CM 7 and Flea compare?


Tom
Old 28th September 2014
  #111
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andrewk808's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad John View Post
Andrew, I really enjoyed your ukulele playing and the recording sounds really great too. Fantastic job. You are a talented man!
Oh, I'm just recording, that's Corey. I play but not that good. There are a number of guys that work at our store that are really great musicians though and I've been trying to step up my recording ability to showcase them and the instruments we sell.

Thanks for the comments. I should have pulled the trigger on Pueblo a while back. I think I'm gonna do it already. Mahalo!
Old 28th September 2014
  #112
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By the way, just wanted mention that I wasn't trying to talk bad about the Pacifica. There are so many factors with finding the perfect balance in sound and sometimes one is compensating for another. I just don't feel qualified to have serious opinions on this forum with the limited experience I have, especially compared to many others here. I'll just keep buying gear and learning.
Old 30th September 2014
  #113
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127Riot's Avatar
 

Flea

I have a vintage series Flea 47 with the F-7 capsule and the EF-12 tube, I use it as far room mic all the time with an old vintage 312 and the results are fabulous. The room and hard wood floors have a big part in this sound. I should mention that the mic is a room down the hall from the room the drum kit is being played in. It's an odd shaped decent size room with one entire wall being a book shelf. I slide the sound of this track under the close mic and overhead track and it gives the drum kit a body that I no longer want to mix without.

On vocals I agree that the 312 does sound great with the flea 47, but I also have a BAE 1073 and an Ma5 that sound gret as well with the F-47 on vocals. It really just depends on the singer, the song, and the feel you want.
Attached Thumbnails
New Flea 47 Next owner-image_6047.jpg  
Old 30th September 2014
  #114
Gear Head
I was thinking of getting a Flea Next 47 for my acoustic guitar recordings.
It is between the Flea and a pair of Josephson E22S's.
any suggestions?
Old 1st October 2014
  #115
Gear Head
Hmm, well I haven't tried the Josephson's but I pick up my km54 for the acoustic guitar most of the times. Only occasionally I use my Flea 47. It really depends on a song and the arrangements. Flea 47 has got really nice top end that can cut nicely through a busy pop arrangement. For an acoustic genres definitely km54. Also Flea 47 will pick up more room sound (in case you need to take that into consideration).
On the other hand you probably won't use Josephon's on vocals whereas Flea 47 excels in that regard. Double bass, mono drum room mic or even an overhead mic, dobros, Flea 47 would shine there as well, most of the time.
Then Josephson E22S stereo vs Flea 47 mono....
If you only looking for the mic solely for acoustic guitar I'll go for Josephsons. If you looking for general ( or vocal ) purposes mic that is not bad on an acoustic guitar I'll go for Flea. And obviously considering you're happy with a mono sound.
All the best with your final decision :-)
Old 3rd October 2014
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kr1012 View Post
So, how do the Wunder CM 7 and Flea compare?


Tom
Cm7 vs Flea?
Old 16th October 2014
  #117
Here for the gear
 

I have the vintage line Flea 47 and LOVE the sound I get. I got a BAE 1073 DMP for the mic and I have to say that it gives it such a nice tone. I cut all the vocals off of my new album with that mic and pre-amp. I used two different compressors (not at the same time but on different songs)- LA2A and the Neve 33609 (both have their own distinct qualities). Hope this helps some!
Old 18th October 2014
  #118
Gear Nut
 

@ Sandmansong...... I have a vintage Flea 47 and have used it with great results on solo acoustic guitar recordings along with some Josephson C42 sdcs. As good as the Flea sounds though on acoustic guitar I have found myself reaching more and more for my Josephson C716 for guitar, an amazing mic. It brings a real clarity, a sheen to the high end, and yet has a wonderful smoothness to the whole spectrum. It is now my go to for any high resolution or modern acoustic guitar tracks. Don't even get me started on what this mic can do for female vocalists.......
Old 18th October 2014
  #119
Gear Head
I heard great things about the 716 josephson mic.
I have narrowed it down to the josephson e22s, 617 set
And maybe the 716 for my acoustic instruments.
I am using a buzz ma2.2 TX mic pre.
Old 12th May 2015
  #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elambo View Post
The part I'm curious about is whether or not a Flea Next sounds identical to a Flea 47 in cardioid as Flea claims. I have little need for a 47 w/ omni so the Next might be the ticket, but not if it's a compromise in any way.
I've been wondering whether the cardioid-only "47 NEXT" is a single membrane version of the capsule, or whether it's the standard dual membrane capsule but just simplified electrically to run in cardioid-only mode.

Either way - but particularly the first way - I think there's the potential for the "47 NEXT" to actually have the edge over its more expensive multi-pattern big brother. Usually, when you simplify a circuit or the mechanics of an electroacoustic element by removal of redundant parts, parasitic effects are eliminated and the sound improves subtly. It moves in the direction of slightly more purity, "HiFi-ness", and speed of response. So, I'd not be worried at all about the "47 Next" being inferior...On the contrary...It's probably superior.

Well...

...except for the fact that if it sounds "better" than the multi-pattern 47, then it wont sound quite exactly the same as a 47 anymore, which means what? It's worse?
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