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hated uln 8, should I even bother with a symphony? Audio Interfaces
Old 1st June 2014
  #31
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by swafford View Post
Well, it's certainly more complicated then posting on the internet.

Being a muso and not a engineer, it took me awhile to wrap my head around the work flow, but when I did, I was and continue to be blown away by the depth of the MIO routing and feature set.
I hear you but I never could get it. and I actually did try. I printed out the 400 page manual and it looked like a christian preachers highlighted bible by the time I finally gave up on it.
Old 1st June 2014
  #32
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ben_allison View Post
The MIO Console is not remotely difficult to use.
it's not them, it's me. I think, for what it is capable of doing, it is probably very easy to use but just not for me. which bums me out. it's an awesome piece of gear. and this has nothing to do with your or my post but, I wonder why you can't have just one jensen preamp on the uln 8? wouldn't that be awesome?
Old 1st June 2014
  #33
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mixtree Audio View Post
The MIO Console is a 'route anything, anywhere' kind of console. A virtual and scalable uber-console, if you will. The 80-bit summing is very nice and superior to any DAW summing I've heard, and along with the monitor controller, MH Character, on-board DSP, latency compensated i/o send and returns, pre and post insert direct outs, silent and instantly switchable routing scenes at a touch of a button...you name it: anything you could possibly want to do in any kind of workflow. Maestro (or UAD Console) is primitive at best in comparison. All that said, workflow is most important and to someone who does not regularly have to conceptualize and use varying complex signal flows, it can be a bit challenging to wrap your head around. Maybe the Maestro is better suited for some people, but one really cannot fault the MIO Console and the ULN-8. It is immensly deep and powerful and can be stupid simple to operate if you put the time into understanding its logic.
yeah, again, I Loved the ULN 8; I was literally--lterally--depressed when I sold it at a fraction of what I paid for it. but it was like having a 1940's cobra mustang that I couldn't get out of first gear. it was irresponsible to keep it. it wasn't metric halo's fault. it's not prosumer gear. I did take quiet a bit of time trying to learn it but I definately wouldn catagorize it's user friendlyness as easy. I'm assuming that you had a lot of experience with recording gear? it was the second recording thing I ever purchased after having some two input tascam thing. still, I'm not blaming metric halo.
Old 1st June 2014
  #34
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonSpacht View Post
Maestro is designed to be the antithesis of the "über-console" described above. It is as lightweight and simple as possible, so you can do what you need to do and then get back to recording. Many Symphony users only open Maestro infrequently, if at all.

Some people find the simplicity "primitive," others love it - kind of depends on how you feel about software mixers and control apps in general.
well it's a mute point. the thing I was looking at was sold. I keep hearing that to forgo opening maestro, and to use logic 9 with the symphony instead of another software daw as a go between, you have to have thunderbridge?
Old 1st June 2014
  #35
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by duo jet View Post
There are also templates in Mio that can get you up and running with everything you need for most applications in seconds, even if you have no idea how to set it up for yourself.
yeah, I used one of them. still tough to do some of the things I wanted to do. my fault, though, not theirs.
Old 1st June 2014
  #36
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avening View Post
Don't bother with the Apollo, or RME (Totalmix) if you're looking for "simple". Although after a slight learning curve, they're fine to use, it's still yet another screen/workflow/signal flow to remember. I had a UFX and an Apollo and although they were great in a lot of ways, I just grew tired of having that extra layer of complexity. Especially if you're used to Pro Tools HD where everything is incorporated in the DAW.

Go for a Symphony, but BUY THUNDERBRIDGE! This way you never have to open another software mixer to monitor. Use it exclusively in Pro Tools (or whatever DAW) and be done with it. This is what I did, and have absolutely no regrets.
see, this is news to me. that's why I was leaning towards apogee in the first place; because I already think that the duet/maestro is pretty glitch free. and your telling me that with thunderbridge, I could use logic only?
Old 1st June 2014
  #37
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chet.d View Post
Although I can relate with the lack of interest in much of MIO's routing options & depth..
The good folks at MH got me in business w/ 2 templates (tracking & mixing) in 20 minutes or so. Other than the channel inserts, I never really mess around too much otherwise.

It's also good to know the options are there should they be needed.
The product & the people are just 1st rate.
I agree. they were really nice and helpful even though I was so pissed off when I emailed/called them I'm sure it was hard. you know, it needs to be said that "easy to use" is subjective. for most people, a jet isn't easy to operate and it really can't be. shouldn't be. but if you are a pilot then the "ease of use" in regards to jets is relative.

I'm sure to most of you, the moi console was "easy." It makes something that can never really be simple, RELATIVELY simple. I'm not a jet pilot so for me it was just to much. I want something that sounds professional but it easy to use. it's looking like that's going to be a symphony.

what the symphony Nay-sayers are calling a "lack of options" will still probably be to extensive for me. I just concerned with preamps, latency, and conversion.
Old 1st June 2014
  #38
Gear Nut
 

it's a moot point because the symphony I was looking at is sold so oh well. but a lot of the questions that I had, the things that made me hesitate, are gone so when next we meet (a good deal on am syphony), I'll pull the trigger.
Old 2nd June 2014
  #39
Lives for gear
 
Avening's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by justbass4 View Post
see, this is news to me. that's why I was leaning towards apogee in the first place; because I already think that the duet/maestro is pretty glitch free. and your telling me that with thunderbridge, I could use logic only?
No, not at all. You can use whatever DAW you want. I use it in Pro Tools.
Old 2nd June 2014
  #40
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avening View Post
No, not at all. You can use whatever DAW you want. I use it in Pro Tools.
no I get that but what I didn't know was that thunderbridge enables you to bypass maestro in most cases.
Old 2nd June 2014
  #41
I am using a Symphony I/O with a Symphony 64 PCIe card in my Mac Pro and I NEVER need to use the onboard Apogee mixer, as the latency it so low..its perfect.
I work with PT10.3.5 on a 8-core Dual Core 2.26 machine. I keep it parked at 64 samples, unless there is an unreasonable amount of software processing being used for mixing, which is rare in my studio.
Old 2nd June 2014
  #42
Lives for gear
 
Avening's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by justbass4 View Post
no I get that but what I didn't know was that thunderbridge enables you to bypass maestro in most cases.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Mixwell View Post
I am using a Symphony I/O with a Symphony 64 PCIe card in my Mac Pro and I NEVER need to use the onboard Apogee mixer, as the latency it so low..its perfect.
I work with PT10.3.5 on a 8-core Dual Core 2.26 machine. I keep it parked at 64 samples, unless there is an unreasonable amount of software processing being used for mixing, which is rare in my studio.
^ that's why you can bypass Maestro
Old 2nd June 2014
  #43
Here for the gear
 

@doc that's good to hear as that's how I like to work at my place. I'm likely in the market for a symphony with a 2x6 module installed.

This might be a side point to the discussion but do new units come with the noise mods pre installed or at least come in the box with the unit if it's an issue? My Mac Pro is noisey enough already in my room. This is prob my only concern with this unit as it seems the early stability issues for a minority of users were addressed.

It's good to hear that the maestro design is aiming to be minimal though. Set and forget is good for keeping your focus on music. I'd be upgrading from the original motu ultralite with my monitoring conversion coming from a central station. If anyone is interested in that info.
Old 2nd June 2014
  #44
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by YellowBlueGreen View Post
@doc that's good to hear as that's how I like to work at my place. I'm likely in the market for a symphony with a 2x6 module installed.

This might be a side point to the discussion but do new units come with the noise mods pre installed or at least come in the box with the unit if it's an issue? My Mac Pro is noisey enough already in my room. This is prob my only concern with this unit as it seems the early stability issues for a minority of users were addressed.

It's good to hear that the maestro design is aiming to be minimal though. Set and forget is good for keeping your focus on music. I'd be upgrading from the original motu ultralite with my monitoring conversion coming from a central station. If anyone is interested in that info.
You're in luck if you want a 2x6 - they just became available for $1995!
Apogee Announces 20% Summer Sale Discount for Symphony I/O 2x6 Configuration - Apogee Electronics

We started blocking the left-side vents straight from the factory, so new production runs don't need the magnetic strip to block the vents. A 2x6 configuration generates very little heat anyway - it shouldn't be an issue.
Old 2nd June 2014
  #45
Lives for gear
 
NoVi's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonSpacht View Post
We started blocking the left-side vents straight from the factory, so new production runs don't need the magnetic strip to block the vents. A 2x6 configuration generates very little heat anyway - it shouldn't be an issue.
And what about existing owners. is there some way to lessen the noise issue?
Old 2nd June 2014
  #46
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by NoVi View Post
And what about existing owners. is there some way to lessen the noise issue?
Yes, you just need to block those left-side vents. We send out a magnetic strip to fit across the vents. It's free; you can request it from our Tech Support department.
Old 3rd June 2014
  #47
Quote:
Originally Posted by YellowBlueGreen View Post
@doc that's good to hear as that's how I like to work at my place. I'm likely in the market for a symphony with a 2x6 module installed.

This might be a side point to the discussion but do new units come with the noise mods pre installed or at least come in the box with the unit if it's an issue? My Mac Pro is noisey enough already in my room. This is prob my only concern with this unit as it seems the early stability issues for a minority of users were addressed.

It's good to hear that the maestro design is aiming to be minimal though. Set and forget is good for keeping your focus on music. I'd be upgrading from the original motu ultralite with my monitoring conversion coming from a central station. If anyone is interested in that info.
The sonic differences you will hear with the Apogee will blow your mind!!! Way easier to work with!
I am mixing a record with mine right now, and the DAC is destroying everything else I have around here.
Like Don said, the 2x6 generates almost no heat. Same with my 8x8x8 unit. The Fan never turns on. I have tube gear with power transformers that whine louder than the Symphony, and mine is in the rack with tons of tube gear! This interface has been steam rolling for me since 2012!!!

I can't wait to add more I/O to it!
Old 3rd June 2014
  #48
Here for the gear
 

Well thats good to hear! Anyone have a guess as to how long the sale will last? I'd prefer to wait till next quarter comes around if you catch my drift.

To the OP I'd suggest getting external preamps just cause you can move them from one setup to the next. If you develop a sound with one preamp itd be nice to take it with you in the future. I don't know the unl8, but the symphony seems to be the industry standard at least in my industry. That's why I'm interested in it anyway.
Old 4th June 2014
  #49
Gear Maniac
Quote:
I can't wait to add more I/O to it!
...and then put it into a silent rack because the fan noise WILL be there along with the 2nd card.

At least that happened when I added the 16x16 card to my single card 8x8 system.

But no complaints here, the interface is rock solid and idiot proof in use - just what I need :-)
Old 4th June 2014
  #50
Quote:
Originally Posted by mart View Post
...and then put it into a silent rack because the fan noise WILL be there along with the 2nd card.

At least that happened when I added the 16x16 card to my single card 8x8 system.
I plan to add another 8x8x8 module.

I have a really quiet studio with the computer underneath my knees and a rack of big hot gear surrounding the Apogee.

Fan Noise from all this stuff is not a problem for me. It doesn't color my ability to get a good mix, and it doesn't bleed into my mics.
Old 5th June 2014
  #51
Lives for gear
 
Rumi's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ben_allison View Post
The MIO Console is not remotely difficult to use.
It's not as intuitive as I would wish, but you can certainly learn to operate it.

The MIO summing sounds much better than any DAW summing I have heard so far. I would keep a Metric Halo unit for that alone (but I don't mind the other aspects of it ).
Old 10th June 2014
  #52
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonSpacht View Post
Maestro is designed to be the antithesis of the "über-console" described above. It is as lightweight and simple as possible, so you can do what you need to do and then get back to recording. Many Symphony users only open Maestro infrequently, if at all.

Some people find the simplicity "primitive," others love it - kind of depends on how you feel about software mixers and control apps in general.
Agreed.
I'm a big fan of modularity and simplicity. I come from a computer programming background, so I like each separate thing to do a single function, do it simply, and do it well. That's why I went with the Symphony. It does 1 thing - convert digital and analog information at a very high quality, and just passes it down the chain. I feel that modularity is an extremely important concept in any system; when something breaks, you can replace it with minimal collateral loss. When something is due for an upgrade you have the same advantage. When each piece in a system only does one function it also makes trouble shooting very efficient.

I try to make my audio system as much like Object-Oriented-Programming as possible:
  • modularity
  • adaptability
  • data isolation (or, in audio, the use of transformers for current isolation, so if one thing breaks it doesn't break the whole system)
  • functional isolation (for example, an interface that does nothing but interfacing, and does it very efficiently and effectively)

These things result in increased understanding, ease of maintenance, and ease of evolution.

I applaud Apogee in designing such an elegant product.
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