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SSL AWS 924 Session Setup
Old 24th January 2014
  #1
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ajv205's Avatar
 

SSL AWS 924 Session Setup

AWS 924 users only: How are you guys maximizing the limited amount of channels for most creative flexibility during mixdown? Note: I only have 32 I/O for Protools.
Old 24th January 2014
  #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajv205 View Post
AWS 924 users only: How are you guys maximizing the limited amount of channels for most creative flexibility during mixdown? Note: I only have 32 I/O for Protools.
Personally I'm mixing on an AWS900 for many years now.
I absolutely love the workflow and never, ever wanna go back to a LFAC.

I also have 32 out of PT. 24 ins, which is absolutely necessry for my FX-sends-system. Plus 8 AES I/O to and from a TC6000.

Obviously, there's a lot of submixing in PT going on. So all Kicks to a master Kick. All snares to a master SN etc. I really love NOT having everything on a seperate fader. Makes mixing by 'muscle memory' a lot easier and is a more fluid and flowing mixing experience for me. And with the press of a button (Focus Mode), you have all the seperate channels available on faders, too..)

I'm using 1-24 for the line-ins, and 25-32 for the 4 stereo returns. For a rock mix, usually the channels are something like:

1.: Kick
2 - SN
3-4 Toms
5-6 Cymbals
7-8 Room/Trash etc.
9-10 Perc.
11+12 Bass
13-14 Git1
15-16 Git2
17-18 Keys
19-20 Horns
21 Voc Lead
22 Voc Lead parallel (sometimes)
23-24 Backings

25-26 FX Returns (I submix all FX in PT, I don't use any FX with analogue outs.
)
31-32 Rough / Reference Mixes.

Channels 9-20 vary depending on the track, the rest normally stays.

All the channels 1-26 are routed to the Mix bus
31-32 is routed to the Rec bus

Mix out is patched to my master chain (Massive Passive, sometimes Tubetech C2A->TC6000 MD4), and comes back to the EXT A input.

That way, I can flip between mix unprocessed mix (MIX), processed mix (EXT A) and reference / rough mix (REC).

All my FX sends are done via the direct outs, so I can have the analogue FX sends on automated faders.
I have a post outlining this workflow somewhere here.

When finished with mixing, I'm bouncing the mix, and also all the 24 direct outs.
Old 25th January 2014
  #3
1 - Kick
2 - Snare
3 - Toms -L
4 - Toms -R
5 - HiHat
6 - Bass
7 - Piano\Keys -L
8 - Piano\Keys -R
9 - Acc\Elec Guitar -L
10 - Acc\Elec Guitar -R
11 - Elec GTR -L
12 - Elec GTR -R
13 - GTR\Keys\Synths\Vocal Ensamble -L
14 - GTR\Keys\Synths\Vocal Ensamble -R
15 - GTR\Keys\Synths\Vocal Ensamble -L
16 - GTR\Keys\Synths\Vocal Ensamble -R
17 - Strings -L
18 - Strings -R
19 - Pad \Synths\Acc GTR -L
20 - Pad \Synths\Acc GTR -R
21 - Backing Vocals -L
22 - Backing Vocals -R
23 - Lead Vocal Parallel \ Vocal Double
24 - Lead Vocal
25-26 (ST 1) - Overheads\Loops\Percussion
27-28 (ST 2) - Ambience\Loops\Percussion
29-30 (ST 3) - Room\Loops\Percussion
31-32 (ST 4) - Effects\Loops\Percussion


I have an X-rack loaded with 4x stereo dynamic modules and 4x stereo EQ's which are normally connected do the AWS four stereo returns and receiving from channels 25-32 on our PT rig, I also use an SSL Sigma connected to the AWS mixbus inject for FX and group returns.

All my outboard compressors and EQ's are half normalled to channels 1-24 so I know exactly where I'm going to..

REC bus is my drums group most of the time with inserts on it.
Old 25th January 2014
  #4
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The first time I also used the stereo returns for actual instruments, but it really got on my nerves that they don't cut when soloing other channels.
Old 26th January 2014
  #5
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I don't use the AWS I use a different console. For me this summing type mixing using outboard doesn't work for me. I don't like routing all my DAW kick tracks or DAW snare track to one analog track each. On individual tracks I tend to do more extreme eqing then on a subgrouped track. On my console I use 2 tracks for kicks 3 for snares, one for each tom, 2 for overheads, 2 for rooms, etc. Tracks like backing vox, percussion, less critical instruments get mixed ITB and set to two tracks.

To me this lets me use the muscle of the analog eq's more effectively then, for example, adding a little snap, a little low end and pulling a smidge of low mid out of a sub grouped channel.
Old 26th January 2014
  #6
Quote:
Originally Posted by kosmokrator View Post
The first time I also used the stereo returns for actual instruments, but it really got on my nerves that they don't cut when soloing other channels.
You can solve that by choosing a solo method which isn't running through the mixbus like AFL for example and the ST returns will cut whenever you solo other channel from the board. what I love best about the AWS is it's virtually endless flexibility !
Old 26th January 2014
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TanTan View Post
You can solve that by choosing a solo method which isn't running through the mixbus like AFL for example and the ST returns will cut whenever you solo other channel from the board. what I love best about the AWS is it's virtually endless flexibility !
Good idea!

I won't use it much though, unless absolutely necessary, since I can't automate, EQ, or use my sends-method on those returns.
Also, as I said I record all 24 direct outs after finishing a mix and just have 24 inputs.

I agree about the incredible flexibility of the desk!
One can see that there are many different workflows possible with the thing. Michael Wagener f.e. uses a completely different one.

It's a mind-boggingly cool desk!
Old 26th January 2014
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paul999 View Post
I don't use the AWS I use a different console. For me this summing type mixing using outboard doesn't work for me. I don't like routing all my DAW kick tracks or DAW snare track to one analog track each. On individual tracks I tend to do more extreme eqing then on a subgrouped track. On my console I use 2 tracks for kicks 3 for snares, one for each tom, 2 for overheads, 2 for rooms, etc. Tracks like backing vox, percussion, less critical instruments get mixed ITB and set to two tracks.

To me this lets me use the muscle of the analog eq's more effectively then, for example, adding a little snap, a little low end and pulling a smidge of low mid out of a sub grouped channel.
Funny, for me it's exactly the other way 'round. I really like the channels hitting the desk being already heavily EQd ITB (if necessary), so that the biggest 'problems' are gone.
The desk EQ then is used for creative and musical stuff.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #9
Here for the gear
Aws 924

Hi,


Just wondering I have the aws 924 since a few weeks I am about to buy SSL Aplha Link Madi AX converters and would like to hook it all up just by dsubs.However aws dsubs read extA1 A2 etc . I m confused as of where to connect what? The Alpha Link has groups of 8 channels per dsub but on the console side it is so unclear what the dsub connections actually are?
Thanks









UOTE=kosmokrator;9789798]Personally I'm mixing on an AWS900 for many years now.
I absolutely love the workflow and never, ever wanna go back to a LFAC.

I also have 32 out of PT. 24 ins, which is absolutely necessry for my FX-sends-system. Plus 8 AES I/O to and from a TC6000.

Obviously, there's a lot of submixing in PT going on. So all Kicks to a master Kick. All snares to a master SN etc. I really love NOT having everything on a seperate fader. Makes mixing by 'muscle memory' a lot easier and is a more fluid and flowing mixing experience for me. And with the press of a button (Focus Mode), you have all the seperate channels available on faders, too..)

I'm using 1-24 for the line-ins, and 25-32 for the 4 stereo returns. For a rock mix, usually the channels are something like:

1.: Kick
2 - SN
3-4 Toms
5-6 Cymbals
7-8 Room/Trash etc.
9-10 Perc.
11+12 Bass
13-14 Git1
15-16 Git2
17-18 Keys
19-20 Horns
21 Voc Lead
22 Voc Lead parallel (sometimes)
23-24 Backings

25-26 FX Returns (I submix all FX in PT, I don't use any FX with analogue outs.
)
31-32 Rough / Reference Mixes.

Channels 9-20 vary depending on the track, the rest normally stays.

All the channels 1-26 are routed to the Mix bus
31-32 is routed to the Rec bus

Mix out is patched to my master chain (Massive Passive, sometimes Tubetech C2A->TC6000 MD4), and comes back to the EXT A input.

That way, I can flip between mix unprocessed mix (MIX), processed mix (EXT A) and reference / rough mix (REC).

All my FX sends are done via the direct outs, so I can have the analogue FX sends on automated faders.
I have a post outlining this workflow somewhere here.

When finished with mixing, I'm bouncing the mix, and also all the 24 direct outs.[/QUOTE]
Old 4 weeks ago
  #10
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Kronos147's Avatar
My buddy has been recording us at his place about once a week. He has the original 900's (upgraded to a virtual 924+, something like that). To enhance the console, there is an X-Rack hooked up with a plethora of other inputs.

Our jams are more basic. Maybe 16 ins while we experiment multi mics on the same source on occasion to better understand the room\studio options.

When he started pulling up faders I was thinking "needs a drum bus compressor". So we patched in a group and I looked on the console to where it comes back. I have looked at the manual too. It seems that there are no dedicated group return faders to get back to the mix bus.

It turns out he runs an X Desk as well, dedicated to the group returns. So we hit the assigns on the desk to 1-2 and hooked up a compressor, and the output went to the X-Desk, which comes back into the console as an external, I believe, on a pot. Is that what other use for group returns?

I think he sends the X-Rack summed output into a couple of channels in the console, again, for available parallel compression.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #11
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny nak View Post
Just wondering I have the aws 924 since a few weeks I am about to buy SSL Aplha Link Madi AX converters and would like to hook it all up just by dsubs.However aws dsubs read extA1 A2 etc . I m confused as of where to connect what? The Alpha Link has groups of 8 channels per dsub but on the console side it is so unclear what the dsub connections actually are?
The inputs are on the channels, those are XLR/TRS.
The dsubs are definitely described in the manual.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Kronos147
When he started pulling up faders I was thinking "needs a drum bus compressor". So we patched in a group and I looked on the console to where it comes back. I have looked at the manual too. It seems that there are no dedicated group return faders to get back to the mix bus.
You can use the 4 stereo echo returns or the bus insert summer if you want to return more inputs.
Analog consoles don’t have ‘group return faders.’
Old 4 weeks ago
  #12
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Kronos147's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by brew View Post
Analog consoles don’t have ‘group return faders.’
I beg to differ! I challenge you to glove face slapping at dawn, sir!



Mine does. My console is analog. It has 4 stereo groups. With balanced inserts. Each channel can be bussed to the mix bus, or the 4 stereo groups, or all, etc... every combo.

The 4 stereo group faders feed them to the mix bus (if assigned so). (It also has two mix busses but I never installed\wired up #2 .)

http://www.kronosrecording.com/Wheatstone/

So is the Mackie 8 bus. I seem to recall group faders on that guy too.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #13
Lives for gear
Mea culpa—but, Wheatstone is a broadcast console.

Studio consoles do not traditionally have group faders/inserts. Go check any SSL, Neve, or API, Neotek. One cannot claim this is a common feature or complain when it is missing from a studio console.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #14
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Kronos147's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by brew View Post
Mea culpa—but, Wheatstone is a broadcast console.

Studio consoles do not traditionally have group faders/inserts. Go check any SSL, Neve, or API, Neotek. One cannot claim this is a common feature or complain when it is missing from a studio console.
We may have to agree to disagree.

Check out the API 1608, as an example. That "08" is about the group busses. There are 8 faders dedicated to their return.

How about the Neve Genesis?
Not a studio console?

You disregarded my reference to the Mackie 8 bus as well. There are many other consoles that have this. It IS a common feature.


However, Brew, how do you bring the groups back for use in a mix with your AWS?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kronos147 View Post
However, Brew, how do you bring the groups back for use in a mix with your AWS?
I already noted this: with the echo returns or main bus insert sum. Or channels obviously.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #16
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Kronos147's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by brew View Post
I already noted this: with the echo returns or main bus insert sum. Or channels obviously.
I apologize for my lack of clarity, brew. I was looking for specifics.


In what case do you use the Echo Returns? In what case would you actually give up channels?


If you give up channels, do you use the inserts?


If you use the Main Bus insert sum, doesn't that mean you lose the ability to have an insert on the master?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #17
Gear Head
 

I'm using an AWS 900 (functionally almost the same thing).

1-2 Kicks
2-4 Snares
5-6 Toms
7-8 Overheads, Room
9-10 Bass Stuff
11-12 ~depends on song~
13-14 ~depends on song~
15-16 ~depends on song~
17-18 ~depends on song~
19-20 Lead Vocals
21-22 Backing Vocals
23-24 FX Returns (both hardware, and pro-tools aux send fx)

I'm also using the Rec Bus as a Drums & Bass Bus, and the Mix Bus as the Everything Else Bus. They are getting summed together with a SPL Mixdream XP and returned back on the insert return on the Mix Bus.
1-10 are sent to the Rec Bus (Drums & Bass): Feeding a pair of Distressors
11-24 are sent to the Mix Bus (Everything Else): Feeding a Neve 33609

My Mixbus Insert Return is also running through a pair a Proreplica Pultec EQP-1A clones.

I've also converted my Cue A & B into 2 more FX sends, so I get 6 FX sends instead of just 4. FX Return 1-4 are sent to Foldback B on the console and are fed into another SPL Mixdream XP to be summed together with Cue A & B returns that are fed into channels 23 & 24.
Cue A: Eventide H3000 (always on MicroPitchShift)
Cue B: Lexicon 224
FX1: AMS RMX-16 (usually on NonLin 2)
FX2: Lexicon 480L (usually on Large Hall)
FX3: Bricasti M7 (usually on Music Room)
FX4: Pair of Lexicon PCM42's (after running through Lexicon 480L Machine B mix 100% dry, so I can add more verb if needed).

I'm much happier with this setup than being totally ITB, however I would really like to have more channels. I'm looking closely into getting a 4056 G+ with a stereo bucket for FX returns, a THD Labs Tangerine computer, and an Atomic power supply.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #18
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Kronos147's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevemachine View Post
I'm also using the Rec Bus as a Drums & Bass Bus, and the Mix Bus as the Everything Else Bus. They are getting summed together with a SPL Mixdream XP and returned back on the insert return on the Mix Bus.
Nice post. I was hesitant to advise my buddy to get the X-Desk to to what you do with the SPL Mixdream. It seems the logical approach though to get more out of the console.
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