The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Reviews  Search Gear Database  Search Gear for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
Heritage Audio '73 JR vs others... 500 Series Preamps
Old 17th August 2013
  #1
Lives for gear
 
euphoria89's Avatar
 

Heritage Audio '73 JR vs others...

Hi,

Looking at getting a decent single channel preamp. At the moment, i have the following;

-GAP Pre73
-ISA One
-Warm WA12
-Daking Mic Pre One

I've narrowed it down to a few options:

- Great River MP1NV
- 500 Series + 500 Module (MA5, new Heritage, MP500nv) etc

This is at the top of my budget (£1100).

I do lots of folk/acoustic/country and lots of old school blues/rock, so needs to cover a lot of ground. Don't do any classical or much traditional pop or electronic styles.

I'm after something with lots of depth and warmth for sparse mixes and something with plenty of character as i'm running into an Apollo which is very neutral and uncoloured. Most of my mic's (Kiwi, Mojave301FET, TLM102) are fairly transparent too, so colour is a good thing. I like the transient compression i hear from the Neve designs and the richness and forwardness on things like vocals, which are a massive part of my sound. Big upfront vocals.

Great River - Lots of praise. Different transformers than most clones i believe, but very versatile and built to last. Lot of options for shaping tone. Maybe more modern sounding though? Uses up 2 x 500 series slots.

New Heritage '73 - New to the market but is supposed to be identical to the more expensive '73 clone, just without the EQ. Bit darker and richer? Very useful HPF. Maybe the closest 1073 clone?

MA5 - Lots of praise. Not a direct clone but lots of similarities. Air band sounds interesting. Heard reports of power supply issues with certain 500 series modules?

Also, would the cheaper Lindell 500 module (6 slot) work fine with these units? Truth be told, i'm only after one preamp for the moment anyway. I can't see myself being able to afford all 3 anytime soon. The API6B is another £100, but if the Lindell would work fine, i could save a bit.

Any input would be appreciated.

Thanks
Nathan.
Old 17th August 2013
  #2
Gear Maniac
 
Heritage Audio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by euphoria89 View Post
Hi,



Also, would the cheaper Lindell 500 module (6 slot) work fine with these units? Truth be told, i'm only after one preamp for the moment anyway. I can't see myself being able to afford all 3 anytime soon. The API6B is another £100, but if the Lindell would work fine, i could save a bit.

Any input would be appreciated.

Thanks
Nathan.
We've tested the Lindell 506 power with 6 '73JR in it with great results. You can't go wrong.
Old 17th August 2013
  #3
Quote:
Originally Posted by euphoria89 View Post
Great River - Lots of praise. Different transformers than most clones i believe, but very versatile and built to last. Lot of options for shaping tone. Maybe more modern sounding though? Uses up 2 x 500 series slots.
Actually, the MP500NV still has a nice harmonic quality to the tone, it's certainly more like its "vintage" counterpart's, than any modern chip'y transformer-less flava...

The MP500V is following suit and based on Neve 1081/1073 discrete/transformer preamplifier circuits, but its taken further and improved. This preamp is quiet, high headroom and detailed, without mud clouding things up. The Loading Switch gives you the option to go either way, but the tone is quite enamoring, to my ear.

I would say the Great River is neutral enough to use anywhere, and in my experience one of the most versatile preamplifiers on the market. Not because of its "input and output" saturation characteristics, but because you can patch any mic or instrument into it and get a very pliable and good sound with it.

peace
a.j.b
Old 18th August 2013
  #4
Gear Addict
 
Lolo22's Avatar
 

Hi Nathan, I'm also about to buy a Heritage 1073jr, going to sell my BAE DMP.

Also checkout the CApi stuff. Esp the VP28. Highly recommend it
Old 18th August 2013
  #5
Lives for gear
 
euphoria89's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heritage Audio View Post
We've tested the Lindell 506 power with 6 '73JR in it with great results. You can't go wrong.
Thanks for that. That's great.

How do you find your preamps to stack? I've heard reports that the '73 sound can be a little overbearing when used on everything? I'm after something thats going to give me a considerable tone boost for vocals and acoustic instruments. Fat, full and rich is what i'm after. Something with an older vibe and feel that adds to the personality of the track. Obviously, the majority of that comes from the source and microphone/room, but i have noticed how much influence the preamp can make if you want it to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Mixwell View Post
I would say the Great River is neutral enough to use anywhere, and in my experience one of the most versatile preamplifiers on the market. Not because of its "input and output" saturation characteristics, but because you can patch any mic or instrument into it and get a very pliable and good sound with it.

peace
a.j.b
Yeah, i've read that you don't get the mud buildup with the GR as much. I guess maybe this is where some folks consider it a little more modern? DI runs through the full circuit path just like the JR '73 too, so great fat sound for bass etc. Reamping for virtual instruments would be a cool addition if required in the future too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lolo22 View Post
Hi Nathan, I'm also about to buy a Heritage 1073jr, going to sell my BAE DMP.

Also checkout the CApi stuff. Esp the VP28. Highly recommend it
Would love to know your thoughts, especially against the BAE, which i was looking at getting about a year back. I know lots of people do love the BAE so it would be interesting to know first hand if you think the differences are good/bad. CAPI stuff - heard of it but never properly looked into it. API DIY builds yes?

Thanks for replies. Going to wait a couple of weeks yet before i make a decision, and i'm going to try and see if i can loan the two for direct comparison.
Old 18th August 2013
  #6
There's an ez choice too

The ez1073 by AML. The designer, Colin, used to work for Neve. His stuff is incredible (which is why it graces the racks of some very high end studios indeed)
Old 18th August 2013
  #7
Gear Addict
 
Lolo22's Avatar
 

Did like the BAE though. But I have heard some great things about the heritage. Crazy price as well. Keen to try it out.

Capi is API DIY yes. But you can also buy it fully assembled. Sound is fantastic. serious stuff. My pair are strapped on my 2 Buss for now. great to run a mix through these as well. search for the Capi thread.
Old 18th August 2013
  #8
Here for the gear
 

I shot out a several pres (Avalon, Helios, Phoenix, GR) a few weeks ago for folk singer/songwriter stuff, with super present vocals being of prime importance.

It was a landslide victory for the Great River 500 series pre. Insanity.

The pres start to really show their stripes after you compress and eq them at mix time. The GR seemed to keep getting better and better.

I also emailed GR about a 500 series power supply question and had a response back in 8 hours from Dan. Pretty awesome customer service.
Old 18th August 2013
  #9
Lives for gear
 
SoZo's Avatar
I have a Heritage coming next week and have multiple channels of GR and VP28's , Ill let you know how they are.
Old 18th August 2013
  #10
Lives for gear
 
cheu78's Avatar
Get an MA5 and call it a day..
Ray Lamontagne used it on vocals..(check the grammy winner posts by Ryan Freeland) heh quite a good reference.

no problem here with: purple sweet ten, old api 6space (modded pin1), BAE rack, avedis 2space rack, a designs 2space rack.. never tried the lindell though.. I'm pretty sure it will be fine..

<<<(fwiw I wrote a review in the GS reviews section, below my avatar there's the link).

I strongly suggest to ask a dealer to send you some contenders and test them out with your ears, you will be able to discern which one fits your needs while giving you an educated opinion...

I hope this helps,



Cheu
Old 18th August 2013
  #11
Lives for gear
 
euphoria89's Avatar
 

Thanks for all the feedback.

Sozo, would love to also get your thoughts against the GR.

Calb, good input regarding the folk style. Nice to hear you've had great experiences against the others.

Chue78 - It was actually that record that got my first interested in the MA5. I read it and thought 'wow, must be good enough for a serious pro to use over anything else'. I've heard its really really good, just like the GR.

Trev - Will look into that too.

Old 18th August 2013
  #12
Lives for gear
 
Beastie's Avatar
 

BURL B1 500 series pre! Trust me it will blow you away
Old 30th August 2013
  #13
Lives for gear
 
etrella's Avatar
bump!! more opinions on the 73JR
Old 30th August 2013
  #14
Best 500-series preamp I've tried. Up there with my Forssell SMP-2 in terms of solid performance. Great features/specs, build quality and sound!
Old 30th August 2013
  #15
Gear Addict
 
Lolo22's Avatar
 

Great Pre
Old 30th August 2013
  #16
Lives for gear
 
SoZo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by euphoria89 View Post
Thanks for all the feedback.

Sozo, would love to also get your thoughts against the GR.

Calb, good input regarding the folk style. Nice to hear you've had great experiences against the others.

Chue78 - It was actually that record that got my first interested in the MA5. I read it and thought 'wow, must be good enough for a serious pro to use over anything else'. I've heard its really really good, just like the GR.

Trev - Will look into that too.

I did some testing... It is more vintage sounding in the S and T's then the Great River and the lows are fuller, but not muddy or masked at all! The Great River will process slightly cleaner in the end. The Heritage breaks up better then the Great River if you need that sound. The Heritage is very great I would use the Great River on a male vocal the Heritage on a female if that makes sense.

It does not have that run away high end or cant break through low mid of the other 1073 types I've heard. I tested with dynamic and condersors on Apogee 16x converters and Focal 6be monitors.
Old 31st August 2013
  #17
Lives for gear
 
euphoria89's Avatar
 

Thanks for that.

Still eyeing up either jr73 or GR. I'm able to get a GR at trade + vat, which makes it cheaper than the 73. I like the idea of it being a little more vintage to be fair as a lot of my mics are really bright in the top and anything to help tame those is going to be useful.

Hopefully will have made a decision by next week!
Old 31st August 2013
  #18
Gear Head
 
yaknski's Avatar
IMO, you can't go wrong w/ GR. It's a great sounding and somewhat versatile pre. dynamic, condenser and ribbon Mics I've run through it all sound amazing. Well made and great customer service (I lost a small part to rack 2 NV's together and GR sent me the part for free!). The deal you mentioned for the GR should be persuasive as well.

Not to muddy up your choices. You should check out Atlas Pro Audio's Juggernaut Twin or 500 pres; input/ output tranny options( iron and nickel), variable impedance, fat switch, great DI and saturation/gain staging options. Very well thought out and quiet. I actually sold my GR pres after I bought the Juggernaut Twin as it can do the GR sound quite well plus many others (API'ish, Quad 8'ish, Neve 1073 and 1272'ish, clean. It's a pallette! I have a Juggernaut Twin and a 500 in my rack. Def my go to pres.
Old 31st August 2013
  #20
Lives for gear
 
SoZo's Avatar
The GR is not at all sibilant on the top either if that helps... Its almost the same just less color than the Heritage. The Heritage has more vintage mids to the articulation.
Old 31st August 2013
  #21
Lives for gear
 
euphoria89's Avatar
 

Right I'm with you. I guess it really depends on the price of the GR and if I can save a fair bit getting it at trade prices against a retail GR.

Thanks again. Been incredibly useful.
Old 31st August 2013
  #22
Lives for gear
 
_Mark's Avatar
So, which one is better going to give the Neve sort of sound better? I've got API, but I'm looking to Neve, now.
Old 13th September 2013
  #23
Lives for gear
 
euphoria89's Avatar
 

The heritage will be closer to the original neve tone I believe.

Just ordered myself the jr73. Got it at a cheaper price than I thought I would and I think the extra low mid buildup is actually just the thing I'm aiming towards for some sparse mixes which I'm wanting to sound as full and warm as possible with just a few parts in the mix.

Will let you know how it performs on a vocal (blues) on Sunday. Needless to say, I'm pretty excited about it!
Old 13th September 2013
  #24
Lives for gear
 
cheu78's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by euphoria89 View Post
The heritage will be closer to the original neve tone I believe.
How do you know? Have you compared it beside an original one?

I'm sure you'll be happy with it, but please be careful with these "popular believing"..

I don't want to flame or anything.. just to say that is a bit silly claiming to believe that a piece of gear is closer to the original without having heard that particular piece nor the original.. you see my point?

In the end you have to be happy with it and it's subjective anyway as everything else afterall.. just be careful to not fall in the mistake of believing simply because other people said it... test them in your place and decide with your ears..





Cheu
Old 13th September 2013
  #25
Gear Addict
 
Lolo22's Avatar
 

^^^^

Probably cause its not a MA5

Enjoy the Heritage Euphoria. Its a great piece
Old 13th September 2013
  #26
Lives for gear
 
dxavier's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by euphoria89 View Post
The heritage will be closer to the original neve tone I believe
I think you made a bit of mistake with that comment. They are many many debates about what does and does not sound close to the Original 1073 and to be frank, many people have not heard an original 1073 module to be in a position to make those comments. In fact, it is hilarious that we are talking about the "1073" sound in the same breath as a Heritage jr73, when it doesn't have EQ. Further to that, depending on age, servicing and replacement parts, the tone of one 1073 module can sound different to another, so who knows which of the products inspired by the 1073 sounds closest? It's a pointless debate.

Heritage Audio, BAE, Aurora Audio, Avedis, Vintech and Great River have all contributed amazing ball park offerings. I went for BAE personally, but I don't think it is better or worse than any of the other offerings.
Old 13th September 2013
  #27
Lives for gear
 
cheu78's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lolo22 View Post
^^^^

Probably cause its not a MA5

Enjoy the Heritage Euphoria. Its a great piece
What a poor comment..I'm not saying that he'll not like the heritage..

and you could check on some of my other posts about the MA5, most of the times my advice is always to check and compare in your place with your ears.. mics, preamps, comps....whatever the brand is..and I never claimed that the MA5 is closer to the original, also because it's NOT meant to be a clone and it's not a clone, it's an original design based on that circuit topology.

Btw my point is only that he doesn't know how an original neve sound compares to another piece that he has not heard yet.. I hope this is helps to explain my point of view..

I don't like heritage, but this it's not the matter of my posts here.
there's no brand differentiation..



Cheu
Old 13th September 2013
  #28
Lives for gear
 
euphoria89's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dxavier View Post
I think you made a bit of mistake with that comment. They are many many debates about what does and does not sound close to the Original 1073 and to be frank, many people have not heard an original 1073 module to be in a position to make those comments. In fact, it is hilarious that we are talking about the "1073" sound in the same breath as a Heritage jr73, when it doesn't have EQ. Further to that, depending on age, servicing and replacement parts, the tone of one 1073 module can sound different to another, so who knows which of the products inspired by the 1073 sounds closest? It's a pointless debate.

Heritage Audio, BAE, Aurora Audio, Avedis, Vintech and Great River have all contributed amazing ball park offerings. I went for BAE personally, but I don't think it is better or worse than any of the other offerings.
Think my comment may have been taken out of context a little. I was replying to the comment relating to the difference between the GR and JR73, and which was closer to the original neve sound and design, which as i said, i'm sure is the Heritage. Not saying how it competes against an original neve, because, no, i've not used a real original 1073. The GR is based on the neve topology, and the Heritage more of a replica, which is how i based my comment.

In terms of Heritage, BAE, Avedis... I don't know the differences, and yeah, you're spot on with the fact that its so close that it really makes very little difference in the end.

Not trying to start a flamed debate here, just wanted to state my views regarding both units that were in discussion.
Old 13th September 2013
  #29
a good pre, is a good pre
Performance trumps all of this

If you already have that, than any pre discussed here will get the job done
Old 13th September 2013
  #30
Lives for gear
 
dxavier's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by euphoria89 View Post
Think my comment may have been taken out of context a little. I was replying to the comment relating to the difference between the GR and JR73, and which was closer to the original neve sound and design, which as i said, i'm sure is the Heritage. Not saying how it competes against an original neve, because, no, i've not used a real original 1073. The GR is based on the neve topology, and the Heritage more of a replica, which is how i based my comment.

In terms of Heritage, BAE, Avedis... I don't know the differences, and yeah, you're spot on with the fact that its so close that it really makes very little difference in the end.

Not trying to start a flamed debate here, just wanted to state my views regarding both units that were in discussion.
Fair Play, My bad!!!

Put it this way, which ever one you choose, I don't think you are going to be disappointed, but in the spirit of "variety" being the spice of life, I would give the Great River a nod. Tonally, it has more scope for experimentation than I found with the BAE. Don't get me wrong, I bought the BAE as I loved the sound and I had a variety of other pres, so it was exactly what I wanted but looking at your pre list (Which I think is well thought out) this will be your most expensive purchase yet and perhaps the GR will give you alot more roads to choose from than the others.

Have to say, noticing your Warm Audio, makes me think of the TB12 Tone Beast as that unit looks like it covers ALOT of ground, from Clean to many many other realms....
Topic:
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump
Forum Jump