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High end nearfield test Studio Monitors
Old 8th August 2014
  #2311
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Willett View Post
If you say so - but, when I listened, I found I very difficult to tell the difference between the 906 and the 901 - it was only the extra bass extension on the 901 that revealed it.

I was very surprised how very close they were when I heard them in the same room with the same source.
If you say so. Having heard the 906 I can think of quite a few things about their sound that bigger speakers would not have, so calling it sounding the 'same' is still a weird one for me, but hey. Very similar family sound, sure. They all 'sound the same'? Very much doubt it.
Old 8th August 2014
  #2312
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Willett View Post
If you say so - but, when I listened, I found I very difficult to tell the difference between the 906 and the 901 - it was only the extra bass extension on the 901 that revealed it.

I was very surprised how very close they were when I heard them in the same room with the same source.
John

I'm very surprised by your statement.
I have had the RL906 and RL 940.
The sound between is coherent and it's obviously the same brand. But switching from 906 to 940 revealed a huge difference. The 906 sounded so small in comparaison (not to say more...)
Old 8th August 2014
  #2313
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Quote:
Originally Posted by priko View Post
John

I'm very surprised by your statement.
I have had the RL906 and RL 940.
The sound between is coherent and it's obviously the same brand. But switching from 906 to 940 revealed a huge difference. The 906 sounded so small in comparaison (not to say more...)
I'm only saying what I heard - it may have been the source material that was playing when I heard them together (and not my own recordings which I would have been more familiar with).
Old 8th August 2014
  #2314
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this is how geithains advertises.
and its not true in my experience, too.
how this should work at all?
Old 8th August 2014
  #2315
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Thread Starter
Do Geithain Speakers Sound The Same ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karloff70 View Post
Sorry, but this 'all Geithains sound the same' thing is getting me a bit. I have only heard 906's myself, so can't comment, but find it impossible to say 'sound the same' about any speakers from any manufacturer. Shouldn't it be 'sound very similar' in reality??
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Willett View Post
If you say so - but, when I listened, I found I very difficult to tell the difference between the 906 and the 901 - it was only the extra bass extension on the 901 that revealed it.

I was very surprised how very close they were when I heard them in the same room with the same source.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karloff70 View Post
If you say so. Having heard the 906 I can think of quite a few things about their sound that bigger speakers would not have, so calling it sounding the 'same' is still a weird one for me, but hey. Very similar family sound, sure. They all 'sound the same'? Very much doubt it.

I have been working with the RL801 and RL944 a few month now and can definitely confirm they sound different. However.. I can relate to Johns statement about them sounding the same or similar if I try to match the response by finding the placement sweetspot and also play at low levels.

Trying to look away from the speakers bass response is however almost impossible because this aspect affects the entire speakers response and interaction in the room. When the RL944 is 1.3m away and the RL801 is 3m away they do present separate different and very useful qualities. Still.. mix decisions on one speaker usually translate to the other.

Geithain do have a sound philosophy they try to fulfil by making as similar voicing´s as possible on their speakers, but different cabinets and different sized drivers will make your room interact different regarding phase , freq and impulse response and thereby making the speakers sound different. As stated..everything affects everything.

I think we can clarify that you do buy into the "Geithain sound" when you by Geithain but I would not expect the different models to sound the same in any given room.

This is my humble opinion anyway !
Attached Thumbnails
High end nearfield test-lydspesialisten-control-room-2.jpg   High end nearfield test-room-behind-1.jpg   High end nearfield test-geithain-all-w-widescreen-2.jpg  
Old 8th August 2014
  #2316
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JP__ View Post
this is how geithains advertises.
and its not true in my experience, too.
how this should work at all?
It's true, they say their whole rang is "comparable" and they are.

Last week I did a very short comparison between RL901k and mo2:
The first mo2 placement, picture 1, does not work at all, of course. The placement shown in picture 2 was ok, and then they sound very similar. The bass on that mo2 is great, too, but can't compete with the 901. The 901 is darker, voices are better, more natural, more space around them.
I listened to only few tracks, one was MJ Billie Jean, and i was surprised how similar they sound. The mo2 is more mid forward which i like more when mixing. Overall the 901 is better, of course, but the fact that with certain music they can sound nearly the same is quite amazing.
Attached Thumbnails
High end nearfield test-bildschirmfoto-2014-08-08-um-15.08.09.jpg   High end nearfield test-bildschirmfoto-2014-08-08-um-15.08.43.jpg  
Old 8th August 2014
  #2317
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by kabelton View Post
It's true, they say their whole rang is "comparable" and they are.

Last week I did a very short comparison between RL901k and mo2:
The first mo2 placement, picture 1, does not work at all, of course. The placement on picture 2 was ok, and then they sound very similar. The bass on that mo2 is great, too, but can't compete with the 901. The 901 is darker, voices are better, more natural, more space around them.
I listened to only few tracks, one was MJ Billie Jean, and it was surprised how similar they sound. The mo2 is more mid forward which i like more when mixing. Overall the 901 is better, of course, but the fact that with certain music they can sound nearly the same is quite amazing.
That IS quite amazing ! Thank you for sharing !
Old 9th August 2014
  #2319
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiovisjon View Post
I just finished reviewing the Meyer HD1.

First of all... these are great speakers and I would not hesitate recommending them to my fellow studio-owners.

I have worked on a new single all the way from idea to recording , mixing and mastering. The product turned out to translate very good and my clients was very happy with the result.

To my ears you can record a storm with these babies and feel very confident separating the elements and putting the mix together. The first day I brought up the session-mix shared on gearsluts, and fooled around for an hour or so to see were they guided me. The result is with the other mixes in the link I will post next. They feel a bit brighter ( or less bottom ) compared to the Geithain 944 so the first testmix ended up a little forward and mid heavy I think. This was easily learned though and the next mix turned out better.

I also spent some time comparing them to the Geithains.
The first thing I noticed was that they sounded very calm and interacted with the room almost as good as the RL944. The direct sound was very clear presented and the details was accurate. They felt more revealing to inner details and micro dynamics compared to the Geithains and many others in the test, but still in a non-fatigue way to my ears. Very nice feature indeed!

The mid phantom center is a bit weaker compared to the Rl944 resulting in a wider image with more power to the side signal. The sweetspot sounds very wide and I could move quite a bit without having the feeling of massive tonal changes. They sound slightly more 3d compared to the RL944. The treble feels very dense and high resolutive. The transients is not hard or harsh but do sparkle and feels accurate but maybe a tad to "nice" compared to some of the more "brutal" speakers in the test.

They sound a bit clearer and I have to work harder on the Geithains to obtain clarity compared to these. The mix I did on the HD1 was a little darker and thicker then desirable when listening back on the Geithains and I felt the mix needed an hour or so more work. I think this is easily something anyone can adapt to though when getting to know them better.

In my measuring and headroom test they performed pretty good . No pumping or artefacts even at crazy levels. I could not reach the limiter and still be in the room so its more than enough SPL . The phase did shift a bit like most of the speakers in the test but got much better after a period of run-in time. The bottom end was what made them feel a bit bright compared to the Geithains which measured much lower and stronger in the bottom octave. However..They had no problem dealing with a 7db compensation down to about 35hz which was pretty impressive. After Trinnov calibration I could be just as happy working with either of them..

Highly recommended !!

Attached is a freq plot measured before and after compensation on both speakers in the same position ..
Hello
What soft do you use for phase measurement?
Thank you
Old 10th August 2014
  #2320
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by powerestudio View Post
Hello
What soft do you use for phase measurement?
Thank you
Trinnov optimizer Pro !
Old 11th August 2014
  #2321
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Thread Starter
Amphion One15

Hi guys!

Based on the feedbacks on the Amphion One15 the company has decided to improve it with a passive radiator. It will remove the “bass bump”, increase midrange resolution and the transient reproduction without changing the good qualities they say. If they manage to keep the imaging close to the amazing qualities of the Two18 , I am suspecting this speaker to be be a complete bargain.

They are also working on a new amp that will be a perfect match for the range.
The new model will be available in a week or two.

Though the price is much lower than the speakers in this test I would very much like to do a short review on the One15 if the chance is offered and the interest is positive ..
Attached Thumbnails
High end nearfield test-one_15_pn_b_01.jpg  
Old 11th August 2014
  #2322
Gear Maniac
 

Consider me interested.
Old 11th August 2014
  #2323
Geariophile
 
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Sexy little beasts.....come to daddy.
Old 11th August 2014
  #2324
Gear Maniac
Interested
Old 11th August 2014
  #2325
Gear Maniac
Will these changes help with giving more headroom??
Old 11th August 2014
  #2326
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Thread Starter
Amphion One15 Headroom

Quote:
Originally Posted by eclipse View Post
Will these changes help with giving more headroom??
Good question !

I am not quite sure but to my knowledge the load on the driver is lessened in a radiator design because the added dampening of the woofer. The radiator is just a woofer without a magnet or connection, but will still be moved by the driver and produce low frequencies as a result of the air pressure. This probably opens up the opportunity to dampen and filter the connected driver more.. to increase the headroom among other advantages. Maybe someone else knows more about this but this would be my assumption ..

They do however plan a full range system that according to Amphion will interact very well with the existing range if one needs to " upgrade ". I am assuming headroom won't be a problem with these!

Instagram
Attached Thumbnails
High end nearfield test-amphion-full-range.jpg  
Old 12th August 2014
  #2327
hez
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiovisjon View Post
Hi guys!

Based on the feedbacks on the Amphion One15 the company has decided to improve it with a passive radiator. It will remove the “bass bump”, increase midrange resolution and the transient reproduction without changing the good qualities they say. If they manage to keep the imaging close to the amazing qualities of the Two18 , I am suspecting this speaker to be be a complete bargain.

They are also working on a new amp that will be a perfect match for the range.
The new model will be available in a week or two.

Though the price is much lower than the speakers in this test I would very much like to do a short review on the One15 if the chance is offered and the interest is positive ..
Sounds fantastic - seriously excited. Did you hear any ETA on the amp by the way?
Old 17th August 2014
  #2328
Gear Maniac
Amphion one18

Hi all!

I've been in a rush the last weeks with my mixing work and also with my own
band rehearsing for the upcoming gigs...It was not possible to return to this thread until now...

Anyway, sopme questions left unanswered about my Amphion test, so here we go:

- My room is quite small, it's 12 sqm, about 3m x 4m the height is about 3 meters. It's quite small but with Amphions I can live with that, my old Adam S3Xs were too big for this room (i suppose), had very bad problems with mids getting loud and muddy...I don't have these issues with One18s, I'm sure it's because of their single woofer design.

My distance from the cabinets is a little over one meter... I can check the measurements more precisely if somebody is interested.

After having the Amphions for a few weeks now I can still only praise their quality, my mixes translate much better than they used to, even though I'm now in a much smaller room. The room I used to be in was designed and built by Akukon which is the leading acoustics designing and building company here in Finland...I was in that room for almost 2 years so I got used to it and can say that it in general sounded much better than the one I'm now in...The treatment was done much better...STILL my mixes are better now thanks to Amphions.

I believe every speaker drives your mixes into a different direction. . Compared to my mixes with S3Xs (done in a room they really worked well), the Amphion-mixes are more precise, have more detail and are less muddy, no matter where i play them.

I used to check my mixes in other systems both during mixing and afterwards...No need for that anymore...The only thing I'm checking now is the very lowest lowend (under 50 or so), I'm considering selling my Avantones since I seem to have no use for them anymore. I used to check levels with them all the time when using Adams.

About the amp I'm using:
The guys in Amphion have not told me the price yet, but as this is class D it should be reasonable. If I understood correctly Amphion has been keeping a close eye on the D class amp technology for years now. I guess they finally feel it is ready, especially as this one has been developed using their gear.

About the difference of One18 and Two15:
>"one18s are 8 ohm impedance while two15 s (and two18) are 4 ohm >impedance: is possible that difference is due to that? -R"

I do not think so as the amp seemed to drive both equally well. I think that in my pretty square room a single woofer design simply worked better. This is also the reason I didn't test Two18s. Before the test, I talked with Anssi Hyvönen (the god of Amphions) on the phone for a long time (very nice guy who really seems to know things he's talking about). I told him about my smallish room and he suggested me to try the new One18s. He told me the two18s might be too big for my room. After testing the Two15s and also after my problems with S3Xs, I'm sure this is really the case.

My search for perfect nearfields is over. I strongly suggest everybody looking for nearfields try the Amphions.

-- Mikko
Old 17th August 2014
  #2329
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DR Music's Avatar
What amps are recommended for the one18 or two15/18?
Old 17th August 2014
  #2330
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I find these Amphion speakers really interesting. I wonder if it would be a wise move to sell my PSI A21-m and buy Amphion Two15 (+amp) instead? Not that I'm unhappy with PSI, I love them, it's just that I want something new, something that might inspire me. I also have Quested V2108, that I want to keep. I'm not bored with them yet.
Old 18th August 2014
  #2331
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Thread Starter
Amphion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yagya View Post
I find these Amphion speakers really interesting. I wonder if it would be a wise move to sell my PSI A21-m and buy Amphion Two15 (+amp) instead? Not that I'm unhappy with PSI, I love them, it's just that I want something new, something that might inspire me. I also have Quested V2108, that I want to keep. I'm not bored with them yet.
You should really try them out. They are a very accurate , musical and inspiring tool indeed …. with a very reasonable price tag .
Old 19th August 2014
  #2332
Lux
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiovisjon View Post
Hi guys!

Based on the feedbacks on the Amphion One15 the company has decided to improve it with a passive radiator. It will remove the “bass bump”, increase midrange resolution and the transient reproduction without changing the good qualities they say. If they manage to keep the imaging close to the amazing qualities of the Two18 , I am suspecting this speaker to be be a complete bargain.

They are also working on a new amp that will be a perfect match for the range.
The new model will be available in a week or two.

Though the price is much lower than the speakers in this test I would very much like to do a short review on the One15 if the chance is offered and the interest is positive ..
I'm very interested in such a review
Lux
Old 20th August 2014
  #2333
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Thread Starter
New Amphion Review !

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lux View Post
I'm very interested in such a review
Lux
Thanks guys!

I will most likely receive both the Amphion one15 and one18 with the new Amphion amp within weeks for another review.

I can´t wait ! Stay tuned !
Old 22nd August 2014
  #2334
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I have enjoyed and learned quite a lot following this thread from its inception. The thread is coming around to more affordable inquiries (amphion) and I hope that the Spiral Grooves gets a shot.

I was an early adopter of the barefoot mm12 and just received the studio ones. While I don't have the breadth of experience of th OP, I can say that the Spiral Grooves should be compared to the field of great monitors in this post.
Old 23rd August 2014
  #2335
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by xaos View Post
I have enjoyed and learned quite a lot following this thread from its inception. The thread is coming around to more affordable inquiries (amphion) and I hope that the Spiral Grooves gets a shot.

I was an early adopter of the barefoot mm12 and just received the studio ones. While I don't have the breadth of experience of th OP, I can say that the Spiral Grooves should be compared to the field of great monitors in this post.

While they are obviously leagues apart in price, size and design I would love to hear some more of your experience with both the mm12 and the spiral grooves. I am saving for a killer set of mains although have been very tempted to upgrade my near fields in the meantime. Can you describe why you have added the spiral grooves to your mm12's? Are the mm12's as amazing as they look?
Thanks a lot
Old 24th August 2014
  #2336
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Quote:
Originally Posted by funtez View Post
While they are obviously leagues apart in price, size and design I would love to hear some more of your experience with both the mm12 and the spiral grooves. I am saving for a killer set of mains although have been very tempted to upgrade my near fields in the meantime. Can you describe why you have added the spiral grooves to your mm12's? Are the mm12's as amazing as they look?
Thanks a lot
The mm12s (originals form 2006ish) are/were quite different from the SGs. I suppose my impression of them was that they did the job quite well. Nothing exciting, but all the information you needed to make a mix translate with 100% confidence. I think what made them so great was that they sounded utterly unremarkable to me. And that is why I liked them so much.

I have comparatively limited time on the Spiral Grooves. My initial impression is that they are transparent with a good sweet spot (not huge) that gets things, spatially speaking, in a very good place. Some may call it 3d. I hear quite a bit of information. They are flat sounding and the bass really does extend for such a small driver. Flat enough to create great mixes. I am able to mix at very low volumes and I think the strong point of the SGs is that they allow me to create more exciting mixes as a result. They are keepers.

I hope this helps. I am not a technically minded engineer (if you can call me that!)

Last edited by xaos; 24th August 2014 at 02:04 AM.. Reason: Clarification
Old 24th August 2014
  #2337
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xaos View Post
I have comparatively limited time on the Spiral Grooves. My initial impression is that they are transparent with a good sweet spot (not huge) that gets things, spatially speaking, in a very good place. Some may call it 3d. I hear quite a bit of information. They are flat sounding and the bass really does extend for such a small driver. Flat enough to create great mixes. I am able to mix at very low volumes and I think the strong point of the SGs is that they allow me to create more exciting mixes as a result. They are keepers.
)
That's my experience with the Spiral Grooves as well - I've been lucky enough to have a pair to try (thanks Spencer!) and compare with a set of Geithain RL940s (thanks Zach!). I hear that using a higher end amp like the Parasound A21 instead of the regular Class D Audio amp makes a big difference as well, thought the Class D does sound really good!

The Spiral Grooves are absolutely amazing speakers for the money - they have a wide 3D sound stage, are very revealing, and go surprisingly low. Fantastic mix tools - they're every bit as good as I was hoping they would be.

The Geithains are also amazing - they're more expensive and more of a mid-field (or in my room, main) monitor. They do go lower than the SGs and have a wider sweet spot. They're also a little bit more '3D'. Again, that's not a totally fair comparison as the SGs are more of a near field and cheaper. I would say the SGs are a little 'pickier' than the Geithains though. I really know and trust the Geithains, but every now and again something will slip by me on them, and will be obvious when switching to the SGs.

All in all, the Geithains and SGs work great together when mixing - they compliment each other very well, and I've been getting really positive feedback on mixes done between these 2 sets of monitors. My dream monitoring set up would be having both of these and a set of cheap mix cubes.....

Just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in, since there's a lot of interest in the SGs and it seems not many have had the chance to try them! I highly recommend that anyone who's curious make the effort and get your hands on a pair - I think you'll be impressed. They needed a little time to break in (as did the Geithains), they sound noticeably better (less stiff) now than they did when they arrived....so definitely give them a little time. Hope this helps...if anyone has any questions about either of these sets of monitors feel free to PM me, I'd love to give back to this thread as it's been a huge help to me in my search for a great monitoring set up! Thank you to everyone who's been contributing!!!

Old 24th August 2014
  #2338
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tone Ranger View Post
They needed a little time to break in (as did the Geithains), they sound noticeably better (less stiff) now than they did when they arrived....so definitely give them a little time.
Don't the spiral grooves arrive with a signficant number of hours already logged? I thought they were burned in for like 100 hours before they leave the door.
Old 24th August 2014
  #2339
Here for the gear
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigKD View Post
Don't the spiral grooves arrive with a signficant number of hours already logged? I thought they were burned in for like 100 hours before they leave the door.
Yeah, apparently they do - but I still noticed them 'loosen up' after using them over a few weeks. The Geithains were the same, though I think over a longer period. I'm not sure if Geithain burn theirs in too - but the sound improvement in both the SGs and Geithains over a few weeks was noticeable to me. They didn't really change in a drastic way, but just kind of got a bit warmer and not as stiff in the bottom end. Subtle but definitely more pleasing.
Old 24th August 2014
  #2340
Hi,new member.This amazing thread has lead me here so i thought i would comment.
Looking for a pair of nearfield monitors i contacted Vintage King LA.
I can't remember the name of the gentleman i spoke with,but he told me of Brian Lucey
and that he had some speakers i should hear.Super coolz considering they do not sell Spiral Groove Studio One!
I bought a pair and have used them for the last 5months,what a joy to work with.
It was a blast to hang out with Brian at his ultimate man cave(that piano!).Brian went out of his way to personally
burn them in and hooked me up with an amp in my budget.Bargain.
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