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Fairchild 670...Reborn!! Dynamics Processors (HW)
Old 10th October 2013
  #61
Gear Maniac
 
Johanz's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gyraf View Post
And



..a bit confusing: IIRC, the Ear660 uses PCC189 vari-mu tubes in a strange cascode type setup, very very far from the Fairchild's push-pull 6386 setup. Yet this is both? Or neither?

That aside - what a beautiful device! And a very good idea to update it to contemporary functionality instead of clinging to purist classicness.

Jakob E.
Hi Jacob

It uses 6386's. Don't know about the Ear, but POM just skips the tubes for the power transformer and for the side chain amp. They're not in the audio path anyway, you could argue. Maybe the Ear does the same? Anyway, heard some samples and ordered it right away! I has the same rich sound as a 1:1 'remake' I tested, though even more details in the mid and the very handy low cut. Original Fairchilds are made for different music conception as the more bass heavy sound we're used to today (Hifi homesystems became more bass heavy too). I could hear the 1:1 clone struggling with this, testing extreme samples, were the POM could deal with it by using it's sidechain filter.

It's a great idea to update to modern functionality indeed (same as with the UTA Unfairchild, which is still not available since they switched to JJ 6386's and are redesigning things).

Anyway, this is were my long quest for the best sounding Vari Mu limiter ended. Personally, I believe it's mainly the transformers/inductors which 'color' the sound, make the phase right, and thereby pressing the sound forward in a pleasant way.
Old 14th October 2013
  #62
EAR660 topology

Quote:
Originally Posted by gyraf View Post
And

Hi,

I was only mentioning the EAR600 because it uses the same principle where the valves are only used for the audio:
1)
The Audio path is authentic : An input Transformer, a Push-Pull with a cascode arrangement, as you mention, and an output transformer, nothing else.
2)
And in another hand, the control side and power supply is all solid state using TL082, TL084 for the side chain along side with a few discrete transistors (BC149,159) and standard TIP41 and 42 to generate the control voltage which is much less using these tubes...

I hope this clarifies everything.
POM


..a bit confusing: IIRC, the Ear660 uses PCC189 vari-mu tubes in a strange cascode type setup, very very far from the Fairchild's push-pull 6386 setup. Yet this is both? Or neither?

That aside - what a beautiful device! And a very good idea to update it to contemporary functionality instead of clinging to purist classicness.

Jakob E.

Last edited by POM AUDIO DESIGN; 14th October 2013 at 09:01 AM.. Reason: spelling mistake
Old 14th October 2013
  #63
Gear Addict
 
a.beck's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by POM AUDIO DESIGN View Post
I hope I can get some more of him now before he dies! ahahah!
Well that took kind of a dark turn...
Old 14th October 2013
  #64
Audio Transformers in the FAIRCHILD 670 and mine

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggy Neve Slut View Post
Note sure if this is Internet here say but I've been told and read a few times that the biggest issue in the Xformers was the actual materials used in the windings. This has historically prevented a like for like copy as there were some metals and processes used in the cores production that are now prohibited to be undertaken as part of a more 'greener' manufacturing regime world wide.

Not sure how true but I can see like Neve repo's that this is a crucial ingredient in the mix and scheme of things when trying to nail 'that sound'!

Any truth here or just WWW BS?

Wiggy
Hi,

All I can say is that I am not building the transformers myself and that professional who have been doing it for the past 40-50 years have hundreds of bobbins and laminations in stock, nothing is thrown away, especially if you a dealing with someone that is dedicated and passionate about audio transformers with a constant demand for audio stuff...
Please contact Kore Studio in LONDON if you want to send some files and hear my FAIRCHILD.

If you call UTC tomorrow, they will manufacture the transformer for you, it cost about £1000 setup charge and about £400 per transformer, all the 50s military spec transformer that may have been utilised for the army equipment has got to be repeatable with exactly the same spec, no questions asked, so there is stock, believe me! It is the same as the "new old stock" valves, it's insane how much of the stuff is left!

For the pollution part, we can talk about Pyralene if you like, here is what I found on the net:
Technically speaking, Pyralene has excellent properties: it tolerates great temperatures - up to 1,700 degrees, does not mix with any other substance, It is stable and non-degradable. It was used to charge of transformers, because the physical and chemical contacts could not be ignited and cause any damage. Also in the reactive energy compensation systems it was used to recharge the capacitor batteries.
In the seventies of the last century was discovered a terrible malignant characteristic of pyralene: Pyralene is a carcinogen and causes genetic mutations.

Pyralene is virtually indestructible and naturally chemically and physically irresolvable. It destroys only artificially, on ignition in special furnaces at temperatures above 1,700 degrees, but then as an incidental product to the final destruction of it, Phosgene and Diphosgene is released, some of the worst poison gases in the world. So, it is a liquid that by getting, for example, in the ground, leaves irreparable consequences. Likewise, of course, would be if the pyralene got into the water and air. A disaster would be imminent. The nature can not do anything to Pyralene. People have created it, only the people can destroy it.

Now, what people need to realise is that the FAIRCHILD audio transformers hasn't got anything to do with big power transformers that runs at high temperature in power station, or in big equipment and we are not dealing with the high voltage from an old TV set either!

None of the UTC and Triad transformers used in the FAIRCHILD is oiled filled with PYRALENE and doesn't need to be, the pollution is out of question here, I am sorry to say.

I hope this helps clarifying some of the questions and fears that you had.

POM
Old 15th October 2013
  #65
Gear Maniac
 
Kore's Avatar
 

Kore fairchild

Hey guys,

We've been getting a lot of enquiries about the sound of this unit. If you would like to have a file run through it please contact us direct through our site at Kore Studios - Home and we can organise that for you.

Thanks!
G.
Old 24th January 2014
  #66
Are these units still available to order? Has any one else on GS used one?
Old 29th January 2014
  #67
I guess that's a double no then.
Old 30th January 2014
  #68
Deleted User
Guest
He makes them to order.

FAIRCHILD RECORDING EQUIPMENT CORPORATION LTD.
Old 30th January 2014
  #69
Yes I realise that. The emails for his site were bouncing back last week and I was hoping that posting here may get a response but no.
Old 30th January 2014
  #70
Gear Maniac
 
Kore's Avatar
 

Hey Paul

Afaik Pom is still available for orders. Shoot me a pm if you are having issues contacting him.

G
Kore
Old 30th January 2014
  #71
Gear Head
 

I can count only 8 tubes? Mmm... its not exactly like the original one...
Old 30th January 2014
  #72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kore View Post
Hey Paul

Afaik Pom is still available for orders. Shoot me a pm if you are having issues contacting him.

G
Kore
Thanks G, I'm in direct contact now so I should be good….
Old 30th January 2014
  #73
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluesafiro View Post
I can count only 8 tubes? Mmm... its not exactly like the original one...
This is explained earlier in the thread.
Old 30th January 2014
  #74
Order for the 670 MK2 and the Boiler MK2 placed! Can't wait...
Old 30th January 2014
  #75
Lives for gear
 
Ol' Betsey's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul_G View Post
Order for the 670 MK2 and the Boiler MK2 placed! Can't wait...
Very nice!



R.
Old 30th January 2014
  #76
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul_G View Post
Yes I realise that. The emails for his site were bouncing back last week and I was hoping that posting here may get a response but no.
Hi,

I am sorry, I wish I had more time to write and check if people have questions on Gearslutz…
For some reason my server went down last week. All my email has been running fine this week:

[email protected]

If you have any questions about my "POMCHILD", please send me an email.

Best Regards,
POM
Old 30th January 2014
  #77
Pom audio design

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul_G View Post
Order for the 670 MK2 and the Boiler MK2 placed! Can't wait...
Thanks for your orders Paul, your records sound fantastic.

POM
Old 30th January 2014
  #78
Quote:
Originally Posted by POM AUDIO DESIGN View Post
Thanks for your orders Paul, your records sound fantastic.

POM
Thanks POM, I have a feeling they're gonna sound even better soon....
Old 30th January 2014
  #79
The POM AUDIO DESIGN FAIRCHILD mkI and mkII

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluesafiro View Post
I can count only 8 tubes? Mmm... its not exactly like the original one...
Hi,

I am going to repeat myself again, because it is important that people realise what this is about:
Yes, only two transformers and four tubes through each channel, a short signal path with minimum distortion and coloration, (that's in the 1950s context! How wonderful the "no coloration" concept was then!!!???), all the rest is Control Amps and PSUs...
Of course, I also use transformers for all the inputs and outputs of my control amps to preserve the interactions and loadings between stages...

As Suggested by the designer, Rein Narma : "nowadays, there is no need to use Tubes Control Amps or Tube Regulated Supplies with Neons, we can do that with discrete components, and get even better spec if we want to!", of course!

I mention the EAR before as a comparison, but people didn't seem to get the point, there is no need to be technical :
The EAR660 uses the same principle, only tubes and transformers on the audio path, everything else is ICs and solid state for the control Amp, you can have a look on my website here :
EAR
If you want to be technical : You can see a couple of TLO82 to pick up the output, TLO84s or LM348N, depending on the "mood" for the side chain with standard TIP 41 and 42 across 37V to get a descent "swing" to control their PUSH-PULL double cascode arrangement with the PCC88 and PCC189… Simple, very efficient and the EARs transformers are very nice sounding indeed…

My control amp is a lot more powerful to drive all the 6386 tubes in parallel, and I only use discrete transistors, I could do complete cut-off of the valves if I wanted to(more than a 100V into a few Ohms etc…) so I am happy with the spec.

For most musicians and sound engineers I can see how difficult it is to try to make money out of the music industry, it would be easy for me to charge £10000 more and do everything with valves that are not used in the Audio Path, like in the 50s when there was no alternative technology to do that, but there is no reason to do it today! As suggested by Rein Narma, and as long as I use UTC and Triads Transformers with 6386 Tubes in the Audio Path, then we have it back, and all my customers agree, it's all about the sound.

Thank you.

POM
POM AUDIO DESIGN
http://www.fairchild-recording-equipment.com/
http://www.boilermk2.com/
Old 31st January 2014
  #80
Well!

Dear Pom
My old mate Cenzo from decoy studios has invested in a 670 clone but the one he has is incredibly similar to the original ex Jackson Brown one he used to use, that actually belonged to Jason Nicholls of endless knobbing.
You should get Jason to 3d print you up some Fairchild clone knobs if it's a pain making them yourself.
Endless Knobbing - Knobs and Fader Caps for Amps, Guitars and Keyboards made from precious metals and gemstones
Cenzo's new At101:

My son Robin is a mad keen totally obsessed Tube/Fet compessor/limiter designer of increasing repute.
but on the polymath we cram a couple of Pultec type EQ designs together in the box and a multi impedance pre amp just in case.
Result lots of nice knobs to twiddle with under the 33609 in this rack:

Price? Reassuringly expensive IE. a great deal more than most engineers are prepared to spend on this kind of stuff.:-)
Old 31st January 2014
  #81
FAIRCHILD knobs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bassmec View Post
Dear Pom
My old mate Cenzo from decoy studios has invested in a 670 clone but the one he has is incredibly similar to the original ex Jackson Brown one he used to use, that actually belonged to Jason Nicholls of endless knobbing.
You should get Jason to 3d print you up some Fairchild clone knobs if it's a pain making them yourself.
Endless Knobbing - Knobs and Fader Caps for Amps, Guitars and Keyboards made from precious metals and gemstones
Cenzo's new At101:

My son Robin is a mad keen totally obsessed Tube/Fet compessor/limiter designer of increasing repute.
but on the polymath we cram a couple of Pultec type EQ designs together in the box and a multi impedance pre amp just in case.
Result lots of nice knobs to twiddle with under the 33609 in this rack:

Price? Reassuringly expensive IE. a great deal more than most engineers are prepared to spend on this kind of stuff.:-)
Hi,

Thanks for the tips.
I have been in contact with a few injection moulding company too, but the polishing part is too expensive, also 3D printing is **** for now, so...

I actually like to finish a FAIRCHILD project making the knobs, it's a journey of metal work, wiring, setting up that finishes nicely with the cherry on top : The knobs making… Why not?
I like to do everything myself...
I made new moulds last summer, they are very nice and shinny, like a new bakelite jobs, absolutely identical. I can still afford to spend a few hours making them at the end of each project for now, it's my therapy for now! AHahah!

Cheers!
Old 31st January 2014
  #82
Lives for gear
 
tekis's Avatar
Pomchild

Hello Pierre: I'm a fan of your work, as I own a Ridge Farm Industries Boiler. It's a really cool unit. The POMCHILD looks great as well! I remember seeing my first 670. It was at the Record Plant auction in about 1988 or 89. The crowd gasped as the bidding went to over $6500 each. That was unheard of in those days. Somebody representing Jackson Browne bought them all up. I became obsessed with them from that day on. Years later I bought a 670 and then later a 660. Had to sell 'em both when the bottom fell out of the recording industry. I miss having them. But I never thought I'd see the day when the 670 got properly re-made! Just out of curiosity, are there any plans to make a mono unit like the 660? Merci-beaucoup!
Old 5th February 2014
  #83
The 660

Quote:
Originally Posted by tekis View Post
Hello Pierre: I'm a fan of your work, as I own a Ridge Farm Industries Boiler. It's a really cool unit. The POMCHILD looks great as well! I remember seeing my first 670. It was at the Record Plant auction in about 1988 or 89. The crowd gasped as the bidding went to over $6500 each. That was unheard of in those days. Somebody representing Jackson Browne bought them all up. I became obsessed with them from that day on. Years later I bought a 670 and then later a 660. Had to sell 'em both when the bottom fell out of the recording industry. I miss having them. But I never thought I'd see the day when the 670 got properly re-made! Just out of curiosity, are there any plans to make a mono unit like the 660? Merci-beaucoup!
Hi,

Thanks for your message, I am sorry to hear about your Fairchild that had to go, it is a real shame… A lot of my dreams also had to be put to the side because of the "TESCO accountant mentality" that has driven all the record companies approach since the late 90s, as we all know... Combined with the fact that anything "new" is aways better, as the technology says, same for any musical project that in essence can't last more than one album to be any good in that new trend...

The FAIRCHILD 660 sounds different than the 670 because it has a different input transformer, it is all TRIAD in and out, as opposed to UTCs on the inputs and TRIADs on the outs, the control amps are also different, but that's not important...

Making a mono Fairchild is easy enough, but would workout a lot more expensive than making a stereo unit in comparison : We would only save 4 valves and two transformers, all the rest still needs manufacturing, wiring, punching and engraving, combine with the fact that the FAIRCHILD 670 input transformer is everywhere on the second hand market and that the 660 input transformer is nowhere to be seen!.… I could not claim I can make a 660 unless I'd have that key element, so I could not help you there at this moment in time, I am sorry...

I personally prefer the low end from the 670, it is much better down to 10 Hz, and the phase linearity completely nails it, it's incredible!… I know that there is a big fashion going round that says : "The 660 is better than the 670", but that is complete "bullocks" in technical terms anyway, I am sorry to say!...
The real reason is that, being a mono compressor, people use it more across mono signals like Vocals or Guitar where the 10Hz to 30Hz quite frankly is not the most important part, especially in a typical mix situation, and that the phase is more tuned around 880Hz on the FAIRCHILD 660 (better for speech and vocals) and lower for the 670...
Just look at the way an ALTEC "speaks" to you when recording vocals or a mono overhead drums(listen to the Beatles) and you will realise how much phase is important in recordings, that is where the soul of every machine is!

You can email me if you'd like to talk about some options I could do for you, and if you are interested: [email protected]

Take care.

POM
Old 6th February 2014
  #84
Lives for gear
 
nobtwiddler's Avatar
 

Fairchild 600

I just received this beautiful piece from a dear friend, with the hope of finding someone who can to turn it into, a simple but beautiful vintage compressor.
It's a Fairchild 600...De-esser.
All original parts.
Attached Thumbnails
Fairchild 670...Reborn!!-dsc07113.jpg   Fairchild 670...Reborn!!-dsc07114.jpg   Fairchild 670...Reborn!!-dsc07115.jpg  
Old 6th February 2014
  #85
Gear addict
 

Anyone try these units.

anyone try these units out?
or do a side by side comparison to a vintage unit or ADL, Pendulum, Fairman TMC, EAR or plug-in clones.
Old 6th February 2014
  #86
Gear addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by POM AUDIO DESIGN View Post
Hi,

Thanks for your message, I am sorry to hear about your Fairchild that had to go, it is a real shame… A lot of my dreams also had to be put to the side because of the "TESCO accountant mentality" that has driven all the record companies approach since the late 90s, as we all know... Combined with the fact that anything "new" is aways better, as the technology says, same for any musical project that in essence can't last more than one album to be any good in that new trend...

The FAIRCHILD 660 sounds different than the 670 because it has a different input transformer, it is all TRIAD in and out, as opposed to UTCs on the inputs and TRIADs on the outs, the control amps are also different, but that's not important...

Making a mono Fairchild is easy enough, but would workout a lot more expensive than making a stereo unit in comparison : We would only save 4 valves and two transformers, all the rest still needs manufacturing, wiring, punching and engraving, combine with the fact that the FAIRCHILD 670 input transformer is everywhere on the second hand market and that the 660 input transformer is nowhere to be seen!.… I could not claim I can make a 660 unless I'd have that key element, so I could not help you there at this moment in time, I am sorry...

I personally prefer the low end from the 670, it is much better down to 10 Hz, and the phase linearity completely nails it, it's incredible!… I know that there is a big fashion going round that says : "The 660 is better than the 670", but that is complete "bullocks" in technical terms anyway, I am sorry to say!...
The real reason is that, being a mono compressor, people use it more across mono signals like Vocals or Guitar where the 10Hz to 30Hz quite frankly is not the most important part, especially in a typical mix situation, and that the phase is more tuned around 880Hz on the FAIRCHILD 660 (better for speech and vocals) and lower for the 670...
Just look at the way an ALTEC "speaks" to you when recording vocals or a mono overhead drums(listen to the Beatles) and you will realise how much phase is important in recordings, that is where the soul of every machine is!

You can email me if you'd like to talk about some options I could do for you, and if you are interested: [email protected]

Take care.

POM
informative.
Old 30th June 2014
  #87
I picked mine up from POM on Friday and it's a thing of beauty. I have yet to really put it through it's paces but it looks, feels, and sounds great so far.
Thanks POM!
I'm very happy. The Boiler MK2 is killer too!
Attached Thumbnails
Fairchild 670...Reborn!!-fairchild.jpg  
Old 13th August 2014
  #88
Lives for gear
 
monkeyxx's Avatar
That is the most beautiful Fairchild clone I have ever seen. The front panel is perfect, and the internals are so perfectly clean. Honestly, I think this is an improvement. I don't like the idea of that many tubes in a power supply.

The only disappointing part to me is the word "FAIRCHILD" on the front panel. A design of this caliber deserves to have its own name printed on the front.

I am just glad that Rein Narma's classic design still has life in it. It's like the holy grail for me for some reason. I would almost want to invest in one of these more than a console for the same money.

I couldn't find the price on the website, what are these going for?
Old 13th August 2014
  #89
Lives for gear
 

More Details and Price List

FAIRCHILD mkI : £4990

FAIRCHILD mkII : £5990

Cheers
Old 22nd August 2014
  #90
Lives for gear
 
Gravity8058's Avatar
 

Any user feedback?
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