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SSL Matrix and Patchbay setup.. Matrix users please help me! Dynamics Processors (HW)
Old 15th February 2015
  #31
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You only have 3 busses, REC MIX CUE. If you use the CUE bus for Fx than you loose the daw returns (channels 17/32) on the Matrix. You can use the direct out for each channel (post insert) going to some external hardware.. I use 2 Api 3124mb+ for 2 extra busses (4 channels) or 1 extra bus (linked, 8 channels). They can return to ext input 1 or 2. That way I can have 32 daw returns (using CUE BUS), REC BUS, MIX BUS and 1 or 2 API BUS. Hope this helps!
Old 16th February 2015
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Synchronia View Post
You only have 3 busses, REC MIX CUE. If you use the CUE bus for Fx than you loose the daw returns (channels 17/32) on the Matrix. You can use the direct out for each channel (post insert) going to some external hardware.. I use 2 Api 3124mb+ for 2 extra busses (4 channels) or 1 extra bus (linked, 8 channels). They can return to ext input 1 or 2. That way I can have 32 daw returns (using CUE BUS), REC BUS, MIX BUS and 1 or 2 API BUS. Hope this helps!
Hey Synchronia,

thank you very much for answering. I have never considered the as an actual bus but makes sense. I was always confused why there are so many master outputs but with your explanation it makes sense.

At the moment I believe that all my busses go to the Mix and I have the Master bus comp on there. Also I got it set up that I have all 32 (16 DAW and 16 lines) all coming in from the Avid HD converters so I can mix down 32 channels.

I have to draw down your flow so I really understand what you are doing.

Basically this is what I want to set up. I got all the hardware but not sure how this will work without giving up DAW or Line channels.

https://brauerizing.wordpress.com/20...-how-to-guide/

Last edited by HitzHits; 16th February 2015 at 03:55 PM.. Reason: added information
Old 17th February 2015
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HitzHits View Post
thank you very much on the feeback regarding the reverbs. That explains a lot now.

Regarding my question:

I would like to run 4 stereo groups (drum group, Guitar Group, etc.) into the Master stereo buss. On these individual groups I would like to use hardware. Actually it would be cool if you could assigne the 32 channels that come into the Matrix to 4 busses that go through the hardware and then to the main output. Does this make sense?


I get what you mean. I have the Matrix. I have also owned 8 stereo buss consoles that would give you 8 busses ...sub busses...groups what ever you want to call them....off of say 32 channels...



On the Matrix you have....the mix buss...with an insert....as second assignable buss called the recording buss with an insert and after tracking you have a 3rd buss called the cue buss with an insert . That is 3 stereo buss or 6 mono buss with inserts. The mix and cue are sent to the main mix out..then... at the push of a button.

So you can assign all your drum tracks and bass guitar say to the record buss and then have a compressor eq chain on the record buss insert..then send this all at the push of a button to the mix buss.
The same with the cue buss. All mid instruments like guitars and keys... All channels can be sent to Cue out...which has an insert which can also be sent to the mix buss.

So that is 3 busses... The only thing you have to remember is that everything goes through the mix buss inserts as well so you will be processing twice on some things but it shouldn't be too earth shattering on the mix buss anyway. You also have a sum button that can add a stereo source to the mix buss..

Now I am a freak for endless options so....
Here is what I do. Even with all the 16 Matrix busses.....

I come from my Daw channels 1-16 .. to my DA converter.....to a normalled patch bay..... to the Daw Inputs on the Matrix.

I come from my Daw channels 17-32 to my DA converter ....to a normalled patch bay.....to the Alternate or Line in inputs on the Matrix.

This way I can patch in any analogue on any of the ...between.outputs of the daw to the inputs of the Matrix..... and if I don't they are normalled or operate normally as if there were Daw outs connected at all times. Of course you need 32 channels IO.ADDA.. but the same applies regardless of your IO count.

I can also use any as an input if I want to add returns from a reverb or delay or if I want to bring in midi instruments, or say returns from a reamped guitar cabinet . Just remember that if it is in the line units it will have to be sent from the cue buss out to the cue buss and then to the mix buss. So it may be processed if you are doing so on the cue buss.

Right now I have my favourites on the Matrix busses but I have had them all open before so I can put whatever gear I want to the Matrix busses as well using the same methodology.


I also have a third patch bay for all the mix, record and cue busses.
and I normal like above a set of compressors and equalizers I most often use so I can also interupt those and add any other processing gear I wish to use.

Its simple really. Just look at every input and output and put a patchbay in between. I have a lot of outboard so this is why I do this.

You can also do the same with the inputs of your AD converter but I just go direct to a mic pre to a comp and/or eq of my choice and then to the AD Converter. Straight path. I never use the inputs of the Matrix to track. Only to monitor.


Alessandro is also correct. There are so many ways to play with the Matrix. The direct outputs are also a good way to feed a good multi input headphone monitor mix unit and all you have to do is turn up or turn down what track a person wants to hear. Or if you want to get crazy hey...at a patchbay from the direct out and voila. No bending over...and a perfect signal to send to wherever you like.
The best thing about the Matrix.
When I sold my coloured board....I began to hear my high end gear on their own for the first time. What they all actually sound like.
I wish I have 32 fully active faders though. That is about my only complaint to be honest.

Lou

Last edited by NoEgo; 17th February 2015 at 05:28 AM..
Old 17th February 2015
  #34
Gear Addict
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoEgo View Post

You can also do the same with the inputs of your AD converter but I just go direct to a mic pre to a comp and/or eq of my choice and then to the AD Converter. Straight path. I never use the inputs of the Matrix to track. Only to monitor.
Do you do this because of the way you have your I/O's using all of the in's on the matrix or do you not like to track through the board because of its sound? Just curious.

I add a Matrix to my studio next month so this thread is great for giving me further routing option ideas for all my outboard gear. Thanks to all.
Old 17th February 2015
  #35
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Thanks Lou for your explanation. I also added 2 Mini Shorti Db25 patchbays, patching most of the I/O to/from the Matrix so it's super easy to change the signal routing. Since I have lots of outboard I patched my 8 SSL E-series eqs after the daws out 1/8, so I can use them in mixing for the most important tracks. I have used all the 16 Matrix inserts so I didn't connect them to the patchbay. If I'm going to add more outboard I'll remove 2 ssl stereo eqs from the internal matrix and connect them straight from the daws out 9/12..leaving space for other comps (and still avoiding to patch them to the patchbay). It's incredible how versatile is this console. My only complain is the lack of more busses, but hey..it's not an Aws!
Old 18th February 2015
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDawg View Post
Do you do this because of the way you have your I/O's using all of the in's on the matrix or do you not like to track through the board because of its sound? Just curious.

I add a Matrix to my studio next month so this thread is great for giving me further routing option ideas for all my outboard gear. Thanks to all.
well my theory is the less wire if not needed right? The SSL sounds great no worries but in using it for its direct outs you can not have 16 faders in the works at all times for monitor because you are switching from input to daw all the time while tracking. If you are okay with monitoring a stereo output from your daw till you actually mix its fine but I like to grab any track on the fader of the board when I want to. At least up till 16. If that makes sense. This way I always have 32 ins from my daw hooked up that I can interupt or insert any time. Also the other way is really just making the board a glorified patchbay...why when you can go right to your AD from your analogue chain.
Old 18th February 2015
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Synchronia View Post
Thanks Lou for your explanation. I also added 2 Mini Shorti Db25 patchbays, patching most of the I/O to/from the Matrix so it's super easy to change the signal routing. Since I have lots of outboard I patched my 8 SSL E-series eqs after the daws out 1/8, so I can use them in mixing for the most important tracks. I have used all the 16 Matrix inserts so I didn't connect them to the patchbay. If I'm going to add more outboard I'll remove 2 ssl stereo eqs from the internal matrix and connect them straight from the daws out 9/12..leaving space for other comps (and still avoiding to patch them to the patchbay). It's incredible how versatile is this console. My only complain is the lack of more busses, but hey..it's not an Aws!
Yeah I have an xdesk too for live recording. The stuff is genious. I just wish the Matrix had 24 faders or even 32 but that us another budget haha.
Old 20th February 2015
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoEgo View Post
I get what you mean. I have the Matrix. I have also owned 8 stereo buss consoles that would give you 8 busses ...sub busses...groups what ever you want to call them....off of say 32 channels...



On the Matrix you have....the mix buss...with an insert....as second assignable buss called the recording buss with an insert and after tracking you have a 3rd buss called the cue buss with an insert . That is 3 stereo buss or 6 mono buss with inserts. The mix and cue are sent to the main mix out..then... at the push of a button.

So you can assign all your drum tracks and bass guitar say to the record buss and then have a compressor eq chain on the record buss insert..then send this all at the push of a button to the mix buss.
The same with the cue buss. All mid instruments like guitars and keys... All channels can be sent to Cue out...which has an insert which can also be sent to the mix buss.

So that is 3 busses... The only thing you have to remember is that everything goes through the mix buss inserts as well so you will be processing twice on some things but it shouldn't be too earth shattering on the mix buss anyway. You also have a sum button that can add a stereo source to the mix buss..

Now I am a freak for endless options so....
Here is what I do. Even with all the 16 Matrix busses.....

I come from my Daw channels 1-16 .. to my DA converter.....to a normalled patch bay..... to the Daw Inputs on the Matrix.

I come from my Daw channels 17-32 to my DA converter ....to a normalled patch bay.....to the Alternate or Line in inputs on the Matrix.

This way I can patch in any analogue on any of the ...between.outputs of the daw to the inputs of the Matrix..... and if I don't they are normalled or operate normally as if there were Daw outs connected at all times. Of course you need 32 channels IO.ADDA.. but the same applies regardless of your IO count.

I can also use any as an input if I want to add returns from a reverb or delay or if I want to bring in midi instruments, or say returns from a reamped guitar cabinet . Just remember that if it is in the line units it will have to be sent from the cue buss out to the cue buss and then to the mix buss. So it may be processed if you are doing so on the cue buss.

Right now I have my favourites on the Matrix busses but I have had them all open before so I can put whatever gear I want to the Matrix busses as well using the same methodology.


I also have a third patch bay for all the mix, record and cue busses.
and I normal like above a set of compressors and equalizers I most often use so I can also interupt those and add any other processing gear I wish to use.

Its simple really. Just look at every input and output and put a patchbay in between. I have a lot of outboard so this is why I do this.

You can also do the same with the inputs of your AD converter but I just go direct to a mic pre to a comp and/or eq of my choice and then to the AD Converter. Straight path. I never use the inputs of the Matrix to track. Only to monitor.


Alessandro is also correct. There are so many ways to play with the Matrix. The direct outputs are also a good way to feed a good multi input headphone monitor mix unit and all you have to do is turn up or turn down what track a person wants to hear. Or if you want to get crazy hey...at a patchbay from the direct out and voila. No bending over...and a perfect signal to send to wherever you like.
The best thing about the Matrix.
When I sold my coloured board....I began to hear my high end gear on their own for the first time. What they all actually sound like.
I wish I have 32 fully active faders though. That is about my only complaint to be honest.

Lou
Hey Lou,

thank you so much for your in depth explanation. Helped me to understand the whole concept. There is still 2 things I don't understand.

1. Direct outs - I love this idea and never thought about it. So I make another 2 busses via the DO (CHOP) and come back into the External ins. Where will the EX INS be added? Mix / Recording or Cue bus?

2. The other thing I still don't understand: Which is the Main out? I have the Mix bus / Recording bus and the Cue bus? Is the Mix bus the main bus? Sorry, about the stupid questions. So if I want a Master Buss Comp / EQ I put it on the Mix bus? Then go from the Mix bus out to the AD to record the main mix in the DAW?

The Monitor out makes sense - that's what I'm hearing. But somehow I'm missing the Main out from the Matrix to record in the DAW what I'm hearing on the monitors.... I'm sure some of you guys are like

But I am starting to dig the Matrix...

Thanks a bunch
HH

PS: I was spending so much time about how to handle the mic ins through the Matrix but going direct is much easier - thanks for the valuable tip.

Last edited by HitzHits; 20th February 2015 at 04:23 AM.. Reason: added info
Old 20th February 2015
  #39
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1. To add the external ins you have to press the sum switch located in the monitor section of the console just near the external monitor switches. Then print your mix from the Follow monitor out, not from the mix bus out.

2. The mix bus is the main, but remember to print the main mix from the follow monitor out if you add other sources like the external ins, digital in etc.. to the mix bus. I usually use the rec bus for parallel compression, the cue bus for stereo fx (or 16 more inputs), ext ins as api3124 returns. You could use the digital in for digital fx return too. Hope this helps!

Last edited by Synchronia; 20th February 2015 at 04:03 PM..
Old 21st February 2015
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Synchronia View Post
1. To add the external ins you have to press the sum switch located in the monitor section of the console just near the external monitor switches. Then print your mix from the Follow monitor out, not from the mix bus out.

2. The mix bus is the main, but remember to print the main mix from the follow monitor out if you add other sources like the external ins, digital in etc.. to the mix bus. I usually use the rec bus for parallel compression, the cue bus for stereo fx (or 16 more inputs), ext ins as api3124 returns. You could use the digital in for digital fx return too. Hope this helps!

@ Synchronia - thanks man, really helpful information.

I am not sure if I understand the direct out's correctly (CHOP). So if I use them the signal will go out of the Matrix...let's say through comp etc. and come back through the EXT1 or EXT2 (which are both stereo). If I send the signal "direct out" it will still go through the channel and to the assigned bus? In this case I would have the signal double? Coming back through the regular channel (of which I take the direct out) and then again through EXT1 or EXT2).

How do I define which "direct out" goes where? Or is it per channel? Like if I use the DO on channel 8 it will go out to the Channel out 8 on the DB25 (back)? and then back through the EXT1 and EXT2? I guess I am missing somewhere the connection.

Thanks so far for everyone walking me through this - seriously you guys are awesome. I appreciate your help.
Old 21st February 2015
  #41
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Your welcome!
Firstly..my suggestion is take the time to read the manual.. I read it 3 times to understand the signal flow and the routing possibility.

You can configure the CHOP 3 ways:
Pre-fader post-insert (default)
From the line-in pre-gain
Post-fader

It's very handy to have such options, so you can decide where the Direct Out signal comes from.
Direct out is always active in the signal path, so a double signal could be present if you return it to the console.
You can send the direct out to the external bus / outboard equipment directly from the channel Matrix Channel Out, but it's essential to patch all the Direct Outs to a patchbay, otherwise you have to change the routing of the DB25 connections from the back of the console.
Sometimes I send the direct out post fader (from a snare track for example) to a daw input in my Daw (channel input monitor enabled) and process it with a virtual fx.. it can be useful when I need a different snare reverb in the chorus, taking advantage of the daw automation too.
With 32 inputs you have lots of tracks for fx returns, but if you need the Matrix Stereo Cue bus for an additional stereo fx (or 2 mono), you loose the 17/32 channels, so you should use the ext 1 - 2 and digital returns to insert the processed signal back into the mix.. obviously printing the final mix from the Follow monitor out!
If you need further informations feel free to ask.. I remember how I felt when I first bought the console!! :D

Last edited by Synchronia; 21st February 2015 at 02:49 PM..
Old 21st February 2015
  #42
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Thank you so much

Quote:
Originally Posted by Synchronia View Post
Your welcome!
Firstly..my suggestion is take the time to read the manual.. I read it 3 times to understand the signal flow and the routing possibility.

You can configure the CHOP 3 ways:
Pre-fader post-insert (default)
From the line-in pre-gain
Post-fader

It's very handy to have such options, so you can decide where the Direct Out signal comes from.
Direct out is always active in the signal path, so a double signal could be present if you return it to the console.
You can send the direct out to the external bus / outboard equipment directly from the channel Matrix Channel Out, but it's essential to patch all the Direct Outs to a patchbay, otherwise you have to change the routing of the DB25 connections from the back of the console.
Sometimes I send the direct out post fader (from a snare track for example) to a daw input in my Daw (channel input monitor enabled) and process it with a virtual fx.. it can be useful when I need a different snare reverb in the chorus, taking advantage of the daw automation too.
With 32 inputs you have lots of tracks for fx returns, but if you need the Matrix Stereo Cue bus for an additional stereo fx (or 2 mono), you loose the 17/32 channels, so you should use the ext 1 - 2 and digital returns to insert the processed signal back into the mix.. obviously printing the final mix from the Follow monitor out!
If you need further informations feel free to ask.. I remember how I felt when I first bought the console!! :D
Thanks Synchronia,

You know, the first thing I thought that people would answer: Hey Motherflipping HH, read the freaking manual. I'm in my second round and it's not that I can't read. As you mentioned, when dealing with hardware mixers the first time it's more than a couple of buttons like in logic.

To my defense I also spend significant time drawing the whole flow on paper to avoid crawling under the desk 1000 times :-). I rather redo the drawing 1000 times heh

If I may, I would like to ask you for guidance in my set up. My focus is Producing ITB and Mixing 32 Channels (Avid HD 32 Analog out) through the Matrix. The 32 Channels I would like to bundle in 4 Busses.

A, B, C, D - the system Michael Brauer uses.

I will use the hardware MAINLY for the Bus configuration. I have no patch bay and don't intend to get one. Also I don't plan to get hardware FX at this point. I love my expensive Lexicon bundle (software) to much :-).

If this doesn't belong into this thread please let me know. I don't want anyone to start hating on me.
Attached Thumbnails
SSL Matrix and Patchbay setup.. Matrix users please help me!-itb-abcd-configuration1.jpg   SSL Matrix and Patchbay setup.. Matrix users please help me!-matrix.jpg  

Last edited by HitzHits; 21st February 2015 at 06:05 PM.. Reason: change picture
Old 21st February 2015
  #43
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In my opinion if you don't need the patchbay you could track and record directly into the AD converter, bypassing the console. Your daw returns 17/32 will be connected to the Matrix Line input, for 32 channels in mixdown (cue bus is gone). Than send the channels 1/16 (with hardware inserts) to either mix or rec bus (both have inserts). Rec bus has the To mix button, so it could be summed into the mix bus (the main bus).
Now for the 2 extra busses: send the direct out from channels 1/16 (post fader) to 2 external mixers (like the api 3124mb+ I use, which has inserts and sends), process the tracks (I imagine with comps and eq) and return either to the 4 stereo fx returns (they are free if you don't use the console's send), channel line ins 1/16 or ext 1 - 2. You could also process the daw outs 17/32 before hitting the console as explained above.
If you give me more info about your hardware and mix technique I can try to help you better.

Last edited by Synchronia; 22nd February 2015 at 12:20 AM..
Old 22nd February 2015
  #44
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Lost in the Matrix

Quote:
Originally Posted by Synchronia View Post
In my opinion if you don't need the patchbay you could track and record directly into the AD converter, bypassing the console. Your daw returns 17/32 will be connected to the Matrix Line input, for 32 channels in mixdown (cue bus is gone).
- this is how I have set it up right now. I have 32 channels coming from my converters into the Matrix.


Than send the channels 1/16 (with hardware inserts) to either mix or rec bus (both have inserts). Rec bus has the To mix button, so it could be summed into the mix bus (the main bus).

- 16 DAW going to Rec bus
- 16 Inserts going to Cue bus

If I understand correctly the Rec and Cue have separate sends / returns. So that would be the 2 busses you spoke about.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Synchronia View Post
Now for the 2 extra busses: send the direct out from channels 1/16 (post fader) to 2 external mixers (like the api 3124mb+ I use, which has inserts and sends), process the tracks (I imagine with comps and eq) and return either to the 4 stereo fx returns (they are free if you don't use the console's send), channel line ins 1/16 or ext 1 - 2. You could also process the daw outs 17/32 before hitting the console as explained above.
If you give me more info about your hardware and mix technique I can try to help you better.
I appreciate your help so much. But the more I look at it the more I understand that my 32 channel mix down won't work the way I want - or it starts getting complicated / or expensive. The API is like 3K.

The main reason I spent 24K for a Matrix was that I can do everything there :-)

The way I see it I have to Use 8 of my DAW channels for the busses - so I can use the "matrix" hardware routing.

That won't kill me but I actually wanted the routing AFTER they the 32 channels come out of the DA converter into the Matrix and not within Logic. Even if I got from the DA into the Comp / EQ and then in to Matrix - it wont be the same.

Does what I am writing make sense to you?

Thanks bro,

HH
Attached Thumbnails
SSL Matrix and Patchbay setup.. Matrix users please help me!-matrix.jpg  
Old 22nd February 2015
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HitzHits View Post
-
If I understand correctly the Rec and Cue have separate sends / returns. So that would be the 2 busses you spoke about.

HH
Yes, but when you use the CUE BUS for the extra channels (17/32) the CUE is gone. You can insert a compressor in the CUE bus, processing all the 16 channels. It could be a solution using only use 8 channels (17/24)..

1/8 -> mix bus
9/16 -> rec bus
17/24 -> cue bus

So now you only need a 4th bus for channels 25/32

Quote:
Originally Posted by HitzHits View Post
-
I appreciate your help so much. But the more I look at it the more I understand that my 32 channel mix down won't work the way I want - or it starts getting complicated / or expensive. The API is like 3K.

The main reason I spent 24K for a Matrix was that I can do everything there :-)

The way I see it I have to Use 8 of my DAW channels for the busses - so I can use the "matrix" hardware routing.

That won't kill me but I actually wanted the routing AFTER they the 32 channels come out of the DA converter into the Matrix and not within Logic. Even if I got from the DA into the Comp / EQ and then in to Matrix - it wont be the same.

Does what I am writing make sense to you?

Thanks bro,

HH
You are welcome!

Yes I understand how you feel about the lack of busses..
Regarding the 3124mb+, I bought the Api because I needed 8 pres, so I choose that version with the internal mixer to expand the console. Check past threads in the forums regarding the Matrix..If you don't need preamps there are cheaper solutions, maybe expanding the Matrix with an X-rack/mynx could be interesting. Try to contact Jim and see if he can help you too. I'm also interested now into this topic, hope someone could comment too! let me know!
Old 22nd February 2015
  #46
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Grazie

Quote:
Originally Posted by Synchronia View Post
Yes, but when you use the CUE BUS for the extra channels (17/32) the CUE is gone. You can insert a compressor in the CUE bus, processing all the 16 channels. It could be a solution using only use 8 channels (17/24)..

1/8 -> mix bus
9/16 -> rec bus
17/24 -> cue bus

So now you only need a 4th bus for channels 25/32
Hey Alessandro,

I was thinking about this solution but if I understand your earlier explanations the routing is as follows:

rec bus -> comp / EQ -> mix bus
cue bus -> comp / EQ -> mix bus

mix bus -> comp / EQ -> Monitor

so you can't use the mix bus as separate bus, can you? Whatever is on CUE and REC would automatically be also influenced whatever you put on the mix bus. The mix bus would be used for the Master buss comp / EQ.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Synchronia View Post
Yes I understand how you feel about the lack of busses..
Regarding the 3124mb+, I bought the Api because I needed 8 pres, so I choose that version with the internal mixer to expand the console. Check past threads in the forums regarding the Matrix..If you don't need preamps there are cheaper solutions, maybe expanding the Matrix with an X-rack/mynx could be interesting. Try to contact Jim and see if he can help you too. I'm also interested now into this topic, hope someone could comment too! let me know!
Old 22nd February 2015
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HitzHits View Post
Hey Alessandro,

I was thinking about this solution but if I understand your earlier explanations the routing is as follows:

rec bus -> comp / EQ -> mix bus
cue bus -> comp / EQ -> mix bus

mix bus -> comp / EQ -> Monitor

so you can't use the mix bus as separate bus, can you? Whatever is on CUE and REC would automatically be also influenced whatever you put on the mix bus. The mix bus would be used for the Master buss comp / EQ.
Yes you're right.
At this point I think it's not possible to use 3 independent busses and 32 channels in mixdown.

The console's REC and MIX bus can be routed independently to the Main Monitor (as explained your main bus becomes the Follow Monitor Out), just by pressing the sum button in the centre monitor section. Remember NOT TO assign the Rec bus to the Mix bus. However if your planning is to use 32 channels, the CUE bus must be routed to the Mix bus, otherwise you can't monitor those extra channels.

I read the manual and I can't find a solution..but hey! I also have another idea for the Cue bus..Why not routing the signal as follow:

Cue Send > comp/EQ > returning to Ext 1/2 and not to the Cue return

This way you should have 3 independent buss, each one summed in the monitor section. Just remember that the FOLLOW MONITOR OUT, which is the final printed mix, doesn't have a master insert. I don't know if it works, if you can monitor the extra channels because I'm not in the studio now..however let me know! Cheers!
Old 23rd February 2015
  #48
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Gracias

Quote:
Originally Posted by Synchronia View Post
Yes you're right.
At this point I think it's not possible to use 3 independent busses and 32 channels in mixdown.

The console's REC and MIX bus can be routed independently to the Main Monitor (as explained your main bus becomes the Follow Monitor Out), just by pressing the sum button in the centre monitor section. Remember NOT TO assign the Rec bus to the Mix bus. However if your planning is to use 32 channels, the CUE bus must be routed to the Mix bus, otherwise you can't monitor those extra channels.

I read the manual and I can't find a solution..but hey! I also have another idea for the Cue bus..Why not routing the signal as follow:

Cue Send > comp/EQ > returning to Ext 1/2 and not to the Cue return

This way you should have 3 independent buss, each one summed in the monitor section. Just remember that the FOLLOW MONITOR OUT, which is the final printed mix, doesn't have a master insert. I don't know if it works, if you can monitor the extra channels because I'm not in the studio now..however let me know! Cheers!
Thanks for all your help. I think I will go with the following configuration:

1. Mix Bus direct (4 stereo channels : 2 busses)
2. Rec Bus (4 stereo channels : 1 bus)
3. Cue Bus (8 stereo channels : 1 bus)

And then I can use the Master Comp / EQ on the Mix buss before going out the Monitor.

If I understand the Rec and Mix bus correctly this should work. I can define if I want to send the DAW ins either to the Mix bus directly or the Rec bus and then to the Mix bus.

It would really be great if someone from SSL could share some insight. I mean we are only talking about a Console that cost more than a car
Old 23rd February 2015
  #49
Lives for gear
 
NoEgo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by HitzHits View Post
Thanks for all your help. I think I will go with the following configuration:

1. Mix Bus direct (4 stereo channels : 2 busses)
2. Rec Bus (4 stereo channels : 1 bus)
3. Cue Bus (8 stereo channels : 1 bus)

And then I can use the Master Comp / EQ on the Mix buss before going out the Monitor.

If I understand the Rec and Mix bus correctly this should work. I can define if I want to send the DAW ins either to the Mix bus directly or the Rec bus and then to the Mix bus.

It would really be great if someone from SSL could share some insight. I mean we are only talking about a Console that cost more than a car
hey HitzHitz

Sounds like a plan. That is what I do. Only I use a DVD mastering recorder from the mix outputs of the SSL not the monitoring setup. I run 3 sets of monitors for different reasons and I use the mix out so as to keep everything the way it was intended.
You are right that if you send the record and cue busses to mix out (or have them merge as it were) you will again go through processing. You can print stems if you really want to get involved, directly from your busses....but that's just task creating and as you said....why this board if it creates all these work related options.

I don't know why "ext ins" come into play in others methods, (then yes you are forced to mix through the monitoring system) but each to his own.
I have the playback of my mix down DVD recorder and an old tape deck connected to these. They way they were intended to be used.

Sounds to me a little part of your problem may be that you want to go back into the computer (DAW) with your mix. I used to do that but then you have to set up a track, and make sure no outputs are encroaching etc. It's much easier to have a mix down deck and feed it off the end result of the Matrix...done.... I know it costs but hey...no more then a decent compressor. The model I have is the Tascam unit, can't remember what the catalogue number is....DVRA something....up to DSD quality...anyway, it has a USB function so it just becomes another hard drive and all your mixes are off on a safe place away from your operating drive. Then you can burn to DVD, DVD Audio, archive whatever...right from the machine.

One other thing I want to mention...If you send things out busses and bring them back in somewhere watch out for feedback loops. They can be nasty to your monitors. And finally. I have enough gear to patch the Matrix 3 times with compressors and eqs. Only when you need them. Listening first. We tend to want to hook up things before we have heard the "virgin" sound. I love to record acoustic music, and player,instrument, vocal, mic placement, all come first. The least amount of all the effects. The better the recording has always been with this in mind. After all you bought an SSL Matrix....first for the sound. Get used to it at first. It's amazing. Try a mix of your work without and processing. Get it close. Then start looking for solutions to make it better. I am sure many will argue my suggestions. I have been recording for many years back to reel to reel and not computers...except midi sync. Nothing is always best. I don't care what anyone says. It's just not always feasible.
More important then I/Os.....sound quality is number one . That's why the Matrix cost the price of a car.

Last edited by NoEgo; 23rd February 2015 at 06:41 PM..
Old 24th February 2015
  #50
Gear Maniac
 
HitzHits's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by NoEgo View Post
hey HitzHitz

Sounds like a plan. That is what I do. Only I use a DVD mastering recorder from the mix outputs of the SSL not the monitoring setup. I run 3 sets of monitors for different reasons and I use the mix out so as to keep everything the way it was intended.
You are right that if you send the record and cue busses to mix out (or have them merge as it were) you will again go through processing. You can print stems if you really want to get involved, directly from your busses....but that's just task creating and as you said....why this board if it creates all these work related options.

I don't know why "ext ins" come into play in others methods, (then yes you are forced to mix through the monitoring system) but each to his own.
I have the playback of my mix down DVD recorder and an old tape deck connected to these. They way they were intended to be used.

Sounds to me a little part of your problem may be that you want to go back into the computer (DAW) with your mix. I used to do that but then you have to set up a track, and make sure no outputs are encroaching etc. It's much easier to have a mix down deck and feed it off the end result of the Matrix...done.... I know it costs but hey...no more then a decent compressor. The model I have is the Tascam unit, can't remember what the catalogue number is....DVRA something....up to DSD quality...anyway, it has a USB function so it just becomes another hard drive and all your mixes are off on a safe place away from your operating drive. Then you can burn to DVD, DVD Audio, archive whatever...right from the machine.

One other thing I want to mention...If you send things out busses and bring them back in somewhere watch out for feedback loops. They can be nasty to your monitors. And finally. I have enough gear to patch the Matrix 3 times with compressors and eqs. Only when you need them. Listening first. We tend to want to hook up things before we have heard the "virgin" sound. I love to record acoustic music, and player,instrument, vocal, mic placement, all come first. The least amount of all the effects. The better the recording has always been with this in mind. After all you bought an SSL Matrix....first for the sound. Get used to it at first. It's amazing. Try a mix of your work without and processing. Get it close. Then start looking for solutions to make it better. I am sure many will argue my suggestions. I have been recording for many years back to reel to reel and not computers...except midi sync. Nothing is always best. I don't care what anyone says. It's just not always feasible.
More important then I/Os.....sound quality is number one . That's why the Matrix cost the price of a car.
Wow, awesome feedback - thanks. I never thought about the recorder possibility. I was looking at the Tascam DA-3000 which seems a good deal to me. This way I have another 2 tracks to use (I had 1 + 2 blocked for DAW) but this way I can use them for mixdown.

I will do some research on the Tascam - never used such a device. Need to figure out how this will work.

Thank you all for making this thread so freaking awesome.

HH - mastering the Matrix...lol
Old 2nd March 2015
  #51
Lives for gear
 
NoEgo's Avatar
well then the board is used as it is intended. Out the digital outs or analogue outs to the mix down recorder which has input level settings. I mix to -12db and peaks have headroom.
Then mastering. Those who can afford it. Or I will master it afterwards. I recommend a mastering house though. They are not attached to the music and have tuned rooms specifically for the task. That's a whole new topic. :-)
IMHO
Old 8th May 2015
  #52
Rea
Lives for gear
 
Rea's Avatar
 

A great way to use more then only 16 devices inside the matrix patch is:

Connect the Matrix' inserts to an external patch bay and on that patch bay have your favorite 16 outboard devices normally connected to the tarix' insert I/O points.
So now you still have those 16 devices inside the Matrix without the need for a patch cord as intended, but now you can always replace or add more devices by a quick patch on the external patch bay since you kept it open like that.
Old 9th May 2015
  #53
Rea
Lives for gear
 
Rea's Avatar
 

I have noticed that people talk about the inputs 17-32 at mixdown as if they were"equal" to channels 1-16. But they do not have volume automation and no aux sends, no involvement in the "Matrix patch" section and other functions that they lose to the corresponding "Fader" input of that channel. So those are very "lesser" channels.

How do you treat them? what type of stuff do you send to them with all that limitation? its almost hard to even consider them proper mix channels... unless you have stuff thats is just processed and automated ITB...?
Old 9th May 2015
  #54
Rea
Lives for gear
 
Rea's Avatar
 

I have noticed that people talk about the inputs 17-32 at mixdown as if they were"equal" to channels 1-16. But they do not have volume automation and no aux sends, no involvement in the "Matrix patch" section and other functions that they lose to the corresponding "Fader" input of that channel. So those are very "lesser" channels.

How do you treat them? what type of stuff do you send to them with all that limitation? its almost hard to even consider them proper mix channels... unless you have stuff thats is just processed and automated ITB...?
Old 9th May 2015
  #55
Rea
Lives for gear
 
Rea's Avatar
 

I have noticed that people talk about the inputs 17-32 at mixdown as if they were"equal" to channels 1-16. But they do not have volume automation and no aux sends, no involvement in the "Matrix patch" section and other functions that they lose to the corresponding "Fader" input of that channel. So those are very "lesser" channels.

How do you treat them? what type of stuff do you send to them with all that limitation? its almost hard to even consider them proper mix channels... unless you have stuff thats is just processed and automated ITB...?
Old 16th May 2015
  #56
Gear Maniac
 
Synchronia's Avatar
 

I usually use them as 8 stereo pair channels, hard panned and with the volume at unity gain. Automation and processing is ITB. In the future I could always patch those 17/32 channels to some X-Rack stereo eq/comps for analog processing. With an analog summing box like the Api 3124mb+ they could be used as analog returns to the console.
Old 10th January 2016
  #57
Lives for gear
 
NoEgo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rea View Post
I have noticed that people talk about the inputs 17-32 at mixdown as if they were"equal" to channels 1-16. But they do not have volume automation and no aux sends, no involvement in the "Matrix patch" section and other functions that they lose to the corresponding "Fader" input of that channel. So those are very "lesser" channels.

How do you treat them? what type of stuff do you send to them with all that limitation? its almost hard to even consider them proper mix channels... unless you have stuff thats is just processed and automated ITB...?



Yeah I discussed or suggested the patchbay earlier that you are mentioning. To answer your question here though you can also have a patchy for channels 17-32 why not. That way you can process them. Even with verbs if you like. Your dry mix has to be set on the reverb device is all.

I do wish the Ext in 1 and 2 could be assignable to the Mix buss though. Without using the monitor system for mixing down. I now use a x Desk cascaded to my Matrix as I have 24 channels of IZ Technology conversion.
Old 7th March 2016
  #58
I am having trouble with my DAW track names, and Counter showing up. I have connected my DAW (Studio One 3.2) and all the soft keys work, I can move the faders from the Matrix. When I move the faders on the DAW, they don't move on the matrix. There are no track name on the scribble strip and nothing in the counter. Any idea what I might be missing? Cheers and Thank you.
Old 7th March 2016
  #59
Solid State Logic
 
Jim@SSL's Avatar
 

Probably handshaking - check the "Loop Back" setting on your iPMidi setup page.

Perhaps go here to check things http://www.solidstatelogic.com/docs/...rt%20Guide.pdf
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