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suggestions for a DIY 500 series based 16 channel desk?? 500 Series Preamps
Old 17th May 2012
  #1
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suggestions for a DIY 500 series based 16 channel desk??

Thinking I might try to build a 16 channel 500 series module desk

By desk I mean:

- something I can work with in terms of a physical layout similar to traditional mixing desk

- possibly having a summing option.

So far I'm only finding the Radial Workhorse 500 (8 slots) and the Tree audio desk (which is way out of my price range)

Is there anything else out there that exists?
Old 17th May 2012
  #2
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TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

Why does it have to be 500 series? Why not just buy a small semi-affordable console with pre's and EQ's...?
Old 17th May 2012
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBelmont View Post
Why does it have to be 500 series? Why not just buy a small semi-affordable console with pre's and EQ's...?
Thanks for the suggestion Tony, I'm thinking of the the ClassicAPI 500 series DIY pres. or something of the like...I'm sure I'm I make 16 or 20 of 'em I can save a bundle. It's kindly like build your own old school tracking desk (minus EQ & summing) no?
Old 17th May 2012
  #4
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TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by waxrecsstudo View Post
Thanks for the suggestion Tony, I'm thinking of the the ClassicAPI 500 series DIY pres. or something of the like...I'm sure I'm I make 16 or 20 of 'em I can save a bundle. It's kindly like build your own old school tracking desk (minus EQ & summing) no?
Good luck with that... I've seen countless guys try to do exactly what you would like to attempt and the project never gets finished. In fact, I don't think I've ever seen anybody finish a DIY console and actually have a working unit with pans and volume, etc. This is not like building a simple 312 copy.

DIY is a great thing for people interested in circuits and building stuff. But, I can't say this enough... It simply is NOT a way to actually "save" money.

When you factor in the amount of hours of your time, trial and error, testing, sourcing parts, etc.... it ends up costing WAY more for the non-expert tech types (which represent 90% of us) than just buying what you need. Plus, the fact that most people don't have access to the required test equipment makes it difficult to assess if you made a mistake.
Old 17th May 2012
  #5
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Thanks for advice Tony, In terms of audio flow etc.. that makes sense what you're saying.
To be honest I'm not that fussed about the audio side, in terms of build I am thinking more about running the modules as per usual, but laying them out in a desk like formate in terms of furniture / ergonomics.

I mean if I'm gonna have 16 -20 of them they should look like a desk!

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBelmont View Post
Good luck with that... I've seen countless guys try to do exactly what you would like to attempt and the project never gets finished. In fact, I don't think I've ever seen anybody finish a DIY console and actually have a working unit with pans and volume, etc. This is not like building a simple 312 copy.
Old 17th May 2012
  #6
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Seamus TM's Avatar
 

We "finished" one, once.
22x6 w/ panning.
12 pres and 22 eqs.
All modules from old consoles.

Unless you want to learn a lot as you go and have it take 8X longer than you think it will, don't do it.
It took years.

It did sound great, though!
Attached Thumbnails
suggestions for a DIY 500 series based 16 channel desk??-frankenboard.jpg  
Old 18th May 2012
  #7
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Hi
Get 2 or 3 radial frames and bolt them together nicely.
Matt S
Old 18th May 2012
  #8
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I'm not sure how much this has evolved yet but it's a start.
Classic Audio Products of Illinois
Old 18th May 2012
  #9
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Pliplo's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBelmont View Post
Why does it have to be 500 series? Why not just buy a small semi-affordable console with pre's and EQ's...?
Tony, in your opinion a semi-affordable console's pres would be on par with say a Classic Api or a 512c or 1073LB or MA5 or any good 500 serie's pre?

Question aside, i really admire the DIY world, not only you can get top-quality gear for less money, but you can learn a lot of interesting stuff in the process. And if it's too hard or stressful or you have a deadline and need everything assembled you can always call a tech friend (make tech friends, record them for free, lend them microphones for their silly projects, it'll be worth it)
Old 18th May 2012
  #10
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TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pliplo View Post
Tony, in your opinion a semi-affordable console's pres would be on par with say a Classic Api or a 512c or 1073LB or MA5 or any good 500 serie's pre?
For about the same money? ... this one is pretty easy.

2 x Aurora Audio GTP8's and 2 x Absolute 8x2's would be better than most of the options you listed.. and, give you 16 channels of awesome preamps, volume, pan.

Plus, you would have a bunch of expansion options...

And you could build a little piece of furniture around it and it would look like a cool little vintage Neve console.

Quote:
Question aside, i really admire the DIY world, not only you can get top-quality gear for less money, but you can learn a lot of interesting stuff in the process. And if it's too hard or stressful or you have a deadline and need everything assembled you can always call a tech friend (make tech friends, record them for free, lend them microphones for their silly projects, it'll be worth it)
Yeah, because everyone has a dozen tech guy friends that can't wait to spend the weekend putting together gear for their friends... Some of these projects are a lot of work. And in my experience, the guys that could really help don't want to work on DIY projects for friends.

DIY is awesome for a select few... but, most will waste a bunch of money and have nothing "working" in the end to show for it. I think most people just want to make music... but, it's not hard to get caught up in all this side stuff trying to save money... and end up wasting a bunch of time, money and effort.
Old 19th May 2012
  #11
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adam_f's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by waxrecsstudo View Post
Thinking I might try to build a 16 channel 500 series module desk

By desk I mean:

- something I can work with in terms of a physical layout similar to traditional mixing desk

- possibly having a summing option.

So far I'm only finding the Radial Workhorse 500 (8 slots) and the Tree audio desk (which is way out of my price range)

Is there anything else out there that exists?
Why not look at the Pete's Place Audio Mark VIII 500 series frame as a basis, fill it with what you want? Here's my Realios Helios Dream boat mock up...

Old 19th May 2012
  #12
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TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tubehead View Post
Why not look at the Pete's Place Audio Mark VIII 500 series frame as a basis, fill it with what you want? Here's my Realios Helios Dream boat mock up...
Did they ever get that thing in production? Last I heard the empty frame was $9000 (yes, that's right NINE THOUSAND).... that's a lot of money don't you think?
Old 19th May 2012
  #13
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Pliplo's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tubehead View Post
Why not look at the Pete's Place Audio Mark VIII 500 series frame as a basis, fill it with what you want? Here's my Realios Helios Dream boat mock up...
that must cost a few doubloons
Old 19th May 2012
  #14
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adam_f's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBelmont View Post
Did they ever get that thing in production? Last I heard the empty frame was $9000 (yes, that's right NINE THOUSAND).... that's a lot of money don't you think?
I thought it was around 7k-ish... Great concept though. I'm not sure how much traction it's had.
Old 19th May 2012
  #15
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TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tubehead View Post
I thought it was around 7k-ish... Great concept though. I'm not sure how much traction it's had.
I heard that was the "introductory price", maybe they extended it. Either way.. $7k or $9k.... that's a ton of money.
Old 19th May 2012
  #16
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adam_f's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBelmont View Post
I heard that was the "introductory price", but it was a few years ago. It was posted here on GS somewhere... either way.. 7k or 9k.... that's a ton of money.
Maybe it would have more traction if the pricing was in the 4k range. Who knows; I still love the concept though.

I can see the market for it... If your'e in a sort of in-between state where someone can't afford an API 1608, but could use something now that they can grow into over time. Start with one bucket now and grow it like a chia pet lol...
Old 19th May 2012
  #17
I've always wanted to gut into sumpin' like a Harrison/Showco SM-4/SM-5, or maybe a DDA Monitor console for giggles.
Old 19th May 2012
  #18
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Cathedral Guitar's Avatar
Tonelux V Rack lets you build a console, and add modules as you go:

<Tonelux Designs, Ltd. Professional Recording Consoles and Modules>
Old 19th May 2012
  #19
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Pliplo's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cathedral Guitar View Post
Tonelux V Rack lets you build a console, and add modules as you go:

<Tonelux Designs, Ltd. Professional Recording Consoles and Modules>
yeah, it is pretty beautiful and the tonelux modules surely kick ass, but that's waaaaay more expensive... For that kind of money you could get a great traditional console.

all my hopes are placed on Classic Audio Products of Illinois, go Jeff! Shock the world with an awesome DIY console design and show all these non-believers and pimps that dont want you to learn anything.

I dont see DIY as merely "a cheaper way"... Its a message, a way of thinking, that we wont dance to their song, we wont measure to their standards. Our knowledge shall be our limit, not our wallets...
Old 19th May 2012
  #20
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Cathedral Guitar's Avatar
Yeah, Tonelux is pricey if you go 100% Tonelux, but they are reasonable on faders and mixing and summing, and if you went DIY / 500 Series for EQ, Pre, and Comps you could have a great console for a lot less cash. Plus the DIY x 16 pretty much gives you wholesale prices on your DIY modules.
Old 19th May 2012
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cathedral Guitar View Post
Yeah, Tonelux is pricey if you go 100% Tonelux, but they are reasonable on faders and mixing and summing, and if you went DIY / 500 Series for EQ, Pre, and Comps you could have a great console for a lot less cash. Plus the DIY x 16 pretty much gives you wholesale prices on your DIY modules.
Best suggestion yet thank you - wow this is EXACTLY what I have been searching for but could not find. What an idea! Thank you kindly/ I have contacted Tonelux for pricing
Old 19th May 2012
  #22
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adam_f's Avatar
If Toneluxe is too expensive for your budget... Even though the Pete's Place Audio is $$ too, I think it might be less so.

Let us know what you do in the end.
Old 19th May 2012
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tubehead View Post
If Toneluxe is too expensive for your budget... Even though the Pete's Place Audio is $$ too, I think it might be less so.

Let us know what you do in the end.
thanks very much - I've just messaged them also to get q price quote :>)
Old 19th May 2012
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pliplo View Post
yeah, it is pretty beautiful and the tonelux modules surely kick ass, but that's waaaaay more expensive... For that kind of money you could get a great traditional console.

all my hopes are placed on Classic Audio Products of Illinois, go Jeff! Shock the world with an awesome DIY console design and show all these non-believers and pimps that dont want you to learn anything.

I dont see DIY as merely "a cheaper way"... Its a message, a way of thinking, that we wont dance to their song, we wont measure to their standards. Our knowledge shall be our limit, not our wallets...
Funny as I am thinking of packing it with the CAPI VP26's...
Guess great minds think alike -

Did jeff let on that he was working on something?
Old 19th May 2012
  #25
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Rusted Vacuum's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by waxrecsstudo View Post
Thinking I might try to build a 16 channel 500 series module desk

By desk I mean:

- something I can work with in terms of a physical layout similar to traditional mixing desk

- possibly having a summing option.

So far I'm only finding the Radial Workhorse 500 (8 slots) and the Tree audio desk (which is way out of my price range)

Is there anything else out there that exists?
If you like the DIY thing, you can get a chassi of a nice console, and with it, the summing, you can use it as a base desk for all your DIY modules, you can have independient ins and outs for every module, the summing, vu´s, etc.. Take out all the wiring, connections etc... out of the console chassi, and make a custom made chassi for your needs. This is some thing that i also want to do, i´m going to use this chassi from a Langevin AM4A console, and i have some modules to fit, some time in the future i´ll finish it. Hope so....
Attached Thumbnails
suggestions for a DIY 500 series based 16 channel desk??-esqueleto.jpg  
Old 19th May 2012
  #26
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ScumBum's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pliplo View Post

show all these non-believers and pimps that dont want you to learn anything.
You forgot negative green homers ..


I wouldn't use only VP26's , I'd have all of them , VP312's and VP25's . VP312's are better on overheads .

The EQ's are out too . So you have the VPpre , capiEQ , Missing Link .

The Missing Link has the fader knob , but instead of using that knob you could wire in some real faders , maybe from an old console and use the frame of the console too .
Old 19th May 2012
  #27
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Pliplo's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by waxrecsstudo View Post
Funny as I am thinking of packing it with the CAPI VP26's...
Guess great minds think alike -

Did jeff let on that he was working on something?
He did a podcast recently, it was very interesting. If i remeber correctly he said the console project is taking a lot of his time.

Podcast #2: What Makes API Gear Sound So Good? With Jeff Steiger of ClassicAPI - D.I.Y. Recording Equipment

I cant say enough good things about Jeff Steiger, and i haven't even gotten my kits yet... The way he addressed my inquiries and deadlines... that kind of people makes you wanna keep doing business with them.

I think we just have to be a little patient, the DIY world is growing fast, i know someday soon we'll have great options to make our perfect desk.

And another thing about him is that you don't see him pimping his gear and saying other stuff doesn't compare to what he sells. You see these guys around that go on and on and on about a preamp, and then you click their signature and VOILAAA! there it is, their shop and a big picture of THAT preamp... Just sickens me... Identifying these characters and ignoring everything they say i think is key.

Not to go completely off-topic, i was day dreaming today about mixing a 500 rack with capi preamps with some of Geoff's stuff... the master module and 8 channel eq and those beautiful fader pacs... We just gotta hope for compatibility between these awesome brands, imagine if you could mix Aurora Audio's stuff with DIY Pres and Eqs and Tonelux modules at will...

Old 20th May 2012
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScumBum View Post
You forgot negative green homers ..


I wouldn't use only VP26's , I'd have all of them , VP312's and VP25's . VP312's are better on overheads .

The EQ's are out too . So you have the VPpre , capiEQ , Missing Link .

The Missing Link has the fader knob , but instead of using that knob you could wire in some real faders , maybe from an old console and use the frame of the console too .
Yes this sounds HOT, and insanely affordable (provided I assemble the 500 modules myself...

Wow... not I need is a chasis price (waiting to hear back)

I'm trying to do the whole thing even steven once I sell my nicely reconditioned fleximix 12 x 2
Old 20th May 2012
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pliplo View Post
He did a podcast recently, it was very interesting. If i remeber correctly he said the console project is taking a lot of his time.

Podcast #2: What Makes API Gear Sound So Good? With Jeff Steiger of ClassicAPI - D.I.Y. Recording Equipment

I cant say enough good things about Jeff Steiger, and i haven't even gotten my kits yet... The way he addressed my inquiries and deadlines... that kind of people makes you wanna keep doing business with them.

I think we just have to be a little patient, the DIY world is growing fast, i know someday soon we'll have great options to make our perfect desk.

And another thing about him is that you don't see him pimping his gear and saying other stuff doesn't compare to what he sells. You see these guys around that go on and on and on about a preamp, and then you click their signature and VOILAAA! there it is, their shop and a big picture of THAT preamp... Just sickens me... Identifying these characters and ignoring everything they say i think is key.

Not to go completely off-topic, i was day dreaming today about mixing a 500 rack with capi preamps with some of Geoff's stuff... the master module and 8 channel eq and those beautiful fader pacs... We just gotta hope for compatibility between these awesome brands, imagine if you could mix Aurora Audio's stuff with DIY Pres and Eqs and Tonelux modules at will...

deffo! DIY is the future of what's going on definitely...
I'm thinking Jeff maybe was talking about restoring his orig. API desk (as opposed to building a chasis), which is taking forever - but no idea...

Regardless I will keep my ears peeled and super thanks for all that useful information. I had not correspondance with Jeff yet so good to know!
Old 20th May 2012
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atomicohm View Post
If you like the DIY thing, you can get a chassi of a nice console, and with it, the summing, you can use it as a base desk for all your DIY modules, you can have independient ins and outs for every module, the summing, vu´s, etc.. Take out all the wiring, connections etc... out of the console chassi, and make a custom made chassi for your needs. This is some thing that i also want to do, i´m going to use this chassi from a Langevin AM4A console, and i have some modules to fit, some time in the future i´ll finish it. Hope so....
killer project, over my head knowledge wise though - I'm just barely getting by at soldering regardless sounds like you're up to something special and unique - WAY TO GO!!
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