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Mics for Recording Electric Guitar
Old 24th May 2006
  #31
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetgn
No no! put the iso cab awaytutt . use some of the room sound dude!
I wish I could but I am recording in my apartment so no way to play loud here..
Old 27th May 2006
  #32
Gear Addict
 

Hi guys,

Interesting thread.. and exactly what I was looking for... I'm pretty new to recording electric guitars... and I'm having phase problems because of trying to use 2 mics. Here's my setup.

VOX AC30CC2X (blue spkrs)
Fender Strat

I got a Shure 57 mic against the grill, but at a 45 degree angle (pointing towards the outside of the speaker).

I got a Neumann M149 mic about 6 feet away, facing the amp (at the same physical level of the speakers in the amp cabinet). Basically, I placed the Neumann mic at the same position that my ears would be, if I sat down on a chair and just played guitar for fun. I tweaked the settings on the amp so that I get a great tone when I'm sitting right there. That's where the mic went.

The 57 mic is going into a Brent Averill Neve 1084 (no EQ) and into a distressor (moderate compression)

The M149 is going into another Brent Averill Neve 1084 (no EQ) and a vintage LA-3A (with hardly any peak reduction)

Everything is going into an Apogee Rosetta 800, and straight into Pro Tools.

I tried to bring up both mics (while I'm playing guitar)... but I'm getting phase issues. I tried hitting the phase reverse switch on one of the Neve mic pres... but it still sounds phasey...

Any ideas? Am I doing something wrong? how do you guys mix the levels of the different mics? Do you usually bring them up at even levels? Or do you duck one a little?

Thanks for any Advice.
Old 27th May 2006
  #33
Lives for gear
 
stevetgn's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockman
Hi guys,

Interesting thread.. and exactly what I was looking for... I'm pretty new to recording electric guitars... and I'm having phase problems because of trying to use 2 mics. Here's my setup.

VOX AC30CC2X (blue spkrs)
Fender Strat

I got a Shure 57 mic against the grill, but at a 45 degree angle (pointing towards the outside of the speaker).

I got a Neumann M149 mic about 6 feet away, facing the amp (at the same physical level of the speakers in the amp cabinet). Basically, I placed the Neumann mic at the same position that my ears would be, if I sat down on a chair and just played guitar for fun. I tweaked the settings on the amp so that I get a great tone when I'm sitting right there. That's where the mic went.

The 57 mic is going into a Brent Averill Neve 1084 (no EQ) and into a distressor (moderate compression)

The M149 is going into another Brent Averill Neve 1084 (no EQ) and a vintage LA-3A (with hardly any peak reduction)

Everything is going into an Apogee Rosetta 800, and straight into Pro Tools.

I tried to bring up both mics (while I'm playing guitar)... but I'm getting phase issues. I tried hitting the phase reverse switch on one of the Neve mic pres... but it still sounds phasey...

Any ideas? Am I doing something wrong? how do you guys mix the levels of the different mics? Do you usually bring them up at even levels? Or do you duck one a little?

Thanks for any Advice.

lol welcome to the tricky world of mic placement!
You have to literaly move the M149 a centimetre at a time further away and keep checking until you are happy with the phase. The sound will always be out of phase at one frequency but you can use that as almost an eq! The other trick is to switch the M149 to omni, it'll give you more room sound but not the same phasing probs. You also want to be using more of the SM57 than the M149 in the mix. Try puttting the 57 more on axis too. Also try compressing one mic heavily & leave the other alone, but wait until mixdown to do it!

hope this helps

Steve
Old 27th May 2006
  #34
Gear Addict
 

Thanks Steve. I'll try that. I might also try simply using both mics close-up against the grill. It just occurred to me that I'm not necessarily trying to capture the room sound. I'm just trying to get a good, rock sound... and some "air" with it. Like I said, I'm really new to this. And it's kinda hard to do this on my own (with no one helping me move the mic around while I listen in the other room)...
Old 27th May 2006
  #35
Gear Maniac
 

Lawson

Check out Gene Lawson's mic's [email protected]#ckin killer....all around good large diaphram
Old 27th May 2006
  #36
Lives for gear
 
stevetgn's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockman
Thanks Steve. I'll try that. I might also try simply using both mics close-up against the grill. It just occurred to me that I'm not necessarily trying to capture the room sound. I'm just trying to get a good, rock sound... and some "air" with it. Like I said, I'm really new to this. And it's kinda hard to do this on my own (with no one helping me move the mic around while I listen in the other room)...
the learning is what makes all so much fun! I love it

If I'm looking for a tighter sound I use 3 mics right on the speaker (or speakers in the case of a 2 or 4x12 cab), 57 on axis, 57 or a 421 off axis and a large diaphragm on axis. Choose the balance on mix down.
Also try a mic behind the cab (reverse phase obviously) for more bass end.

BIG guitar sound though come from LOTS of tracking. For the main "rock" rhythm part I will offten use 6 tracks. Get the part played once and pan it left. Then copy the part to another track (I'm assumming you're using a DAW!) delay the track by about 20ms and pan it right. Get the part played again and pan it right. Copy it and pan left, delay for 25ms.... you can see where I'm going. If you've mic'ed the amp well enough it will sound massive.

Have fun experimenting

Steve

PS yes I have spent far too long pissing about with recording guitar (lol)
Old 27th May 2006
  #37
Gear Addict
 

Thanks Steve. Some good tips there. I'll definitely try that. Yes, I am using Pro Tools. And yes, I do normally double (and sometimes triple) guitar tracks. However, I don't think I've ever tried to delay the parts (20 ms, etc). Thanks for the tip.
Old 31st May 2006
  #38
Lives for gear
 
Pasta4lnch's Avatar
as well as the dynamic, I red somewhere to use a km184. I don;t kow why, but I would have never thought of that, but it definitely has a cool sound. much tighter than a 414 which is what I usually use. it's a great alternative sound ( actually I think I red that on mercenary's site somewhere. . . )

plus I use a tg2 through a marshall 4x12 w/ real vint greenbacks in an iso box (everything's close miced, no other choice) and some killer amps
Old 31st May 2006
  #39
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Jason Poulin's Avatar
 

AEA R84's here.

always


Jason
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