The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
do i really need a PAIR of MC77 and a PAIR of LA3A for tracking?
Old 7th May 2006
  #1
Lives for gear
 
dubrichie's Avatar
do i really need a PAIR of MC77 and a PAIR of LA3A for tracking?

alrighty,

i'm trying to convince myself that more variety would be better, but a part of me insists that i'm much better off having these kinds of boxes in pairs for tracking. it just seems to make so much sense!

regards,

richie.
Old 8th May 2006
  #2
Lives for gear
 
dubrichie's Avatar
to clarify, in a location rig specifically tailored to tracking rock / roll bands. thus far to include 2 MC77, 2 LA3A, 1 distressor, 1 RND 5042, 1 RND 5043, 1 GR EQ2-NV, 2 API 550B, 1 Lil FreQ, 8 channels Wunder pre, 6 channels DAV pre, 2 Germs.

any thoughts?

i figure it would be wise to have 2 each of these workhorses so i can record multiple guitars/bass/drums simultaneously as well as possible without compromising on having them for each guitar/bass/etc. TONE boxes. TONE!

regards,

richie.
Old 8th May 2006
  #3
Lives for gear
 
GYang's Avatar
And no pair of LA2A?
1081, 1073 ?

You must be kidding, I think you'll never make good rock song



























































































































What I know, after all ???
Old 8th May 2006
  #4
Lives for gear
 
dubrichie's Avatar
the GAS is fecking my brain up no end these days.

the silly things i lose sleep over, in fairness.

regards,

richie.

ps i would dearly love an LA2A in the rig but am finding it very hard to justify the €3K+ price for one damn channel! that's the 2 LA3As out the window.
Old 8th May 2006
  #5
member no 666
 
Fletcher's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by dubrichie
to clarify, in a location rig specifically tailored to tracking rock / roll bands.
Whatever gets you through the day.

FWIW I generally don't find myself using more than one channel of MC-77 when tracking and/or mixing... but that's probably because I only have one channel in my rack. Either way, I've never really gone after another so, at least for me, one MC-77 would probably be sufficient... but two Distressors is something I doubt you would ever regret.

As for LA-3A's... the ones I wish I had are the ones from the 70's but I haven't heard the reissues so who knows... it could be the one thing UA dredged up from the "misquoted necrophilia" pile that is right. I'd say the odds are against it, but I've been wrong so many times before one more won't kill me.

In API world... 99 times out of 100 chances I prefer the 560 to the 550_ (favorite suffix letter)... but again, that's just one asshole's opinion.

...and with all of that said, the thing that grabbed my attention was the EQ-2NV without the MP-2NV. Now if you already have an MP-2NV you should stop reading this now as it will only get pedantic... if you don't have an MP-2NV you might want to reconsider that omission.

When you couple the two units, the sum is way greater than the sum of it's parts. You can use the mic-pre as a mic pre... no problem, you can also use it as a "line input" [+4 out of an analog console type 'line input'] amplifier on the way into the EQ. By going through the input stage of the MP-2NV you get the benefit of the "impedance" switch and the "loading" switch having an effect on the character of the tone of the signal passing through the device. You also have the option of a 1/2 dozen levels on the EQ-2NV [one of them being the input from the MP-2NV] so the potential for adding "color" from the Great River front end is an exceptionally wide spectrum [which over time can be used for all kinds of wonderful/subtle colors with which you can paint a detailed, yet varied image of the music].

The output permutations are equally insane. When you couple the MP-2NV to the EQ-2NV you now have a choice of a transformer based or transformerless output [with +32(!!!) headroom so it's way clear]. These variables will really allow you to focus on the texture you can achieve that will best compliment the music. You can go for a "rich" / euphonic front end sound with a pristine sounding backend... or vice versa, or a whole bunch of shades of gray inbetween. This was the original goal/purpose for including the insert point on the MP-2NV... we knew the EQ-2NV was around the corner.

You mentioned your rig was going to be for location work which could be recording a band live in a bar and then doing overdubs at their rehearsal space or just live stuff or just rehearsal space stuff [or both]. If you're going to be doing sessions with any degree of "recording control" then the added flexibility could be a difference that will take the product from "good" to "great"... or waste a bunch of your time and the client's time while you dick around with different settings [though you will learn more about the unit(s) the more you dick around with them... but that goes for any/everything].

One of the other really fun things I've found with the MP-2NV is that the DI should not be overlooked. If you use something like a Littlelabs "STD" and shoot the bass signal back to one of the DI's on the MP-2NV you should end up being very pleasantly surprised. With all the MP-2NV's other features the DI is often overlooked... but it is part of the unit on which a considerable amount of time was spent. The thing about the DI on the MP-2NV is that it uses the input transformer. Most DI's in a circuit like this skip the input transformer and go straight into the input amplifier... by going through the input transformer you will add a level of depth and dimension to a bass sound that is usually quite welcome.

Other than that I would probably suggest a Drawmer 1968 in your arsenal somewhere [possibly in lieu of the LA-3A's as they can do a "thick and rich" thing that can be similar to a good LA-3A among it's variety of other tricks]... but that's your business. I'd recommend you try driving it around the block once or twice... but that's your business, not mine.

Best of luck with your search.

Peace.
Old 8th May 2006
  #6
Lives for gear
 
dubrichie's Avatar
thanks very much for a good reply fletcher and in particular for a great run down of the whole GR MP/EQ combination; i did not realise that the concept was so complete. i will look into this to be sure, but have been trying to strip back the original wish-list of preamps for the rig to 6-8 channels of 2 different but excellent flavors and 2 channels of a third more "intense" / "vintage-y" flavour, for more particular effects, which is what the 2 germs are for. ending up with 2 channels of 6-8 different kinds of preamps would be too messy for where i am now and what i want to do with this rig; too many slight shades to dick around with forever without spending enough time working on getting the sounds i want to get and can get out of what i have less of. or something like that. but i'll think about the GR MP2-NV, i promise! (thing is, i'm banking on the Wunders for that Neve-esque thing)

2 distressors or 2 MC77s? well, i'm really trying to focus on boxes to give me TONE before everything gets turned into 1s and 0s. i see where you're coming from, but the 1 Distressor will give me the flexibility and consequent sheer power that it can offer and that i'm sure will be a life saver in many situations. the swiss army knife. as with the Lil FreQ. Vocals, very troublesome snares/kicks and such ya know. but the MC77 / 1176 is what rock n roll has been squished by since the beginning (or near as damn it) so i want to learn to be their daddy. whose their daddy? i'm their daddy... etc.

the LA3As, same story. i know you don't dig the modern UA, but through lots of research (particularly here on GS) i have come to the conclusion that the reissue does close enough to what it should to make it worth while so i'm willing to take the plunge.

the 1968 was actually in the spec til last week, but has been squeezed out by the 5042 and 5043. sorry fletch, i know she's one of your babies but i gotta check out these 2 new RND mojo machines... or so i'm led to believe. 1968 next year if i can afford, i promise! (partly in fact because of the sexy lady drawing in the adds. rock n roll eh?)

in fact, tell you what, depending on how/when/where i scrape together the funding and who/when/where i put the order in with and what kind of a deal they can cut me (approx. €50k spend is the plan) i'll try to sneak the 68 in on the pig's back. gotta have a T00B somewhere right? rock n roll eh?

i'm just contemplating that some day i'll be sorry i don't have 2 MC77s or 2 LA3As when i've got to record 2 guitars, a bass and drums all together. as opposed to a bit more variety like, say 1 of each and a 1968 or an ELOP. but sure what do i know? "your dreams are only in your head boy..."

thanks again though,

regards,

richie.
Old 8th May 2006
  #7
member no 666
 
Fletcher's Avatar
Richie, with all due respect... you seem to be under the mistaken contention that I somehow give a flying rat's ass what you do. Please allow me to correct that misconception. I really don't.

If you feel you've done your research and are going to be happy with the results... go for it. I don't make a penny if you decide to get the Great River combo or the Wunders.

But please... don't call the Great River stuff "Neeeeveeey"... I so fukking hate when people do that. The stuff started from a drawing... and ended at that drawing. Every part was selected on it's own merit, the output amplifier in the EQ-2NV has NOTHING to do with his Rupertness... the output amplifier design was all Dan Kennedy, the transformer selection was me [but I don't get a kickback/royalty from the transformer MFG. or from Great River and don't work for Mercenary Audio full time any more so really, I don't take any of this **** personally].

As for the Drawmer... again, I don't make squat so I really don't give a fukk what you decide... same with the LA-3A. The things could **** ice cream and I'll most likely never take the time to find out. If it works for you and your purposes that is all that is important.

Seriously, I wish you nothing but the best... but please allow me ask you one small favor. Before you come up with "what an asshole that guy is" lemme mention that you asked for advice and I took the time to lend you my opinion from the information presented. There is no bond here. I'm not insulting you, I'm not trying to flame you. I have nothing to sell and nothing to gain.

Please feel really good about doing what ever the fukk it is you have decided to do... when/if you have a client that would like to get his/her/its music on Napster, iTunes, etc., etc., etc. just shoot me an email at [email protected] for a free UPC number and barcode art and I'll be more than happy to have that arranged for you/your client... other than that, best of luck with all you do.

Peace.
Old 8th May 2006
  #8
Lives for gear
 
Mastering101's Avatar
WOW got to love the gearslut family


Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletcher
Richie, with all due respect... you seem to be under the mistaken contention that I somehow give a flying rat's ass what you do. Please allow me to correct that misconception. I really don't.

If you feel you've done your research and are going to be happy with the results... go for it. I don't make a penny if you decide to get the Great River combo or the Wunders.

But please... don't call the Great River stuff "Neeeeveeey"... I so fukking hate when people do that. The stuff started from a drawing... and ended at that drawing. Every part was selected on it's own merit, the output amplifier in the EQ-2NV has NOTHING to do with his Rupertness... the output amplifier design was all Dan Kennedy, the transformer selection was me [but I don't get a kickback/royalty from the transformer MFG. or from Great River and don't work for Mercenary Audio full time any more so really, I don't take any of this **** personally].

As for the Drawmer... again, I don't make squat so I really don't give a fukk what you decide... same with the LA-3A. The things could **** ice cream and I'll most likely never take the time to find out. If it works for you and your purposes that is all that is important.

Seriously, I wish you nothing but the best... but please allow me ask you one small favor. Before you come up with "what an asshole that guy is" lemme mention that you asked for advice and I took the time to lend you my opinion from the information presented. There is no bond here. I'm not insulting you, I'm not trying to flame you. I have nothing to sell and nothing to gain.

Please feel really good about doing what ever the fukk it is you have decided to do... when/if you have a client that would like to get his/her/its music on Napster, iTunes, etc., etc., etc. just shoot me an email at [email protected] for a free UPC number and barcode art and I'll be more than happy to have that arranged for you/your client... other than that, best of luck with all you do.

Peace.
Old 8th May 2006
  #9
Lives for gear
 
dubrichie's Avatar
absolutely fine fletcher.

i understand and respect everything in your last post. (whether or not i should is of course a matter of opinion in and of itself) i have no intentions of calling you an asshole. neither have i any misconceptions of a bond of any kind.

i am grateful for your time and opinions which i take into account as merely that, your opinions. what i do with them is up to me. and you don't give a ****. also perfectly fine by me.

i only called the GR Neve-esque because that is what many people here who have more experience in these matters than i have described it as in so far as its general style of tone or whatever they may call it is perceived to be, no offence intended.

i do know that you don't make a penny from the sale of any of your endorsed / advised-upon products. i did not imply this in any way. i just know that you dig them and are probably in some way proud of the fact that many great engineers use them to make many great sounds. fair play to you. seriously man, i'm not having a go. you should take a bit of pride in that and that's all i was alluding to.

chill out man. i'm just some dude on the internet asking about compressors and talking a bit of effusive nonsense about them in return. don't let me get to you.

on another note i will certainly be in touch with tunecore in the future. i completely dig the concept and sincerely hope that you guys can make it work the way that it could. the potential that the new communications technologies of the internet and its associated etceteras are opening up to us all are mind boggling. lets all hope that they can be put to better use than tv was; probably the greatest waste of an invention's potential in the history of humanity. if you guys are a part of that then my mojo is all with you.

Peace indeed.

regards,

richie.
Old 9th May 2006
  #10
Lives for gear
 
mu6gr8's Avatar
Scaled-back compession…

For tracking, a pair of Distressors would be very useful, as would a single MC77 and a single LA-3A. Mixing's a different story--I've been known to use all four of my Distressors, all four MC76/1176s, both LA-3As, and a pair of Avalon 2044s as creative tools or problem solvers--but for tracking, I'd keep the compression/limiting simple, and allocate more of your available resources to a variety of microphones and preamps.

Ironically, I believe that mixes can actually sound better with less use of compression and greater use of fader rides. When clients send me tracks to mix, I never wish they added more compression; in fact, overly baked transients can kill the life of a recording, so typically I wish they used less or no limiting.

In short, for your application, I'd go for a variety of micpres for tonal variety. Careful mic placement when tracking may make you really dig the dynamics of uncompressed tones, with the ultimate benefit of bigger sounding mixes. At the end of the day, if you still want to hear compression, most mix rooms have a variety of gear anyway.
Old 9th May 2006
  #11
member no 666
 
Fletcher's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by dubrichie
chill out man. i'm just some dude on the internet asking about compressors and talking a bit of effusive nonsense about them in return. don't let me get to you.
Totally chill... it's all good.

Old 9th May 2006
  #12
Lives for gear
 
Kris's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletcher
Richie, with all due respect... you seem to be under the mistaken contention that I somehow give a flying rat's ass what you do. Please allow me to correct that misconception. I really don't.
I don't believe you... fuuck
Old 9th May 2006
  #13
Lives for gear
 
Kris's Avatar
Meaning I think you do care... as long as the music's better for it right?
Old 10th May 2006
  #14
Lives for gear
 
dubrichie's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kris
... as long as the music's better for it right?
RIGHT ON KRIS!

dig on the quest for the most high tone!

regards,

richie.
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump
Forum Jump