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A-Designs Hammer + Dual EMPEQ Vs. GML 8200 EQ? Equalisers (HW)
View Poll Results: Hammer + dual EM-PEQs vs. GML 8200 on the 2bus?
Hammer + dual EM-PEQs
20 Votes - 37.74%
GML 8200
28 Votes - 52.83%
I dont like EQ on the 2bus
5 Votes - 9.43%
Voters: 53. You may not vote on this poll

Old 28th December 2010
  #1
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YOHAMI's Avatar
 

A-Designs Hammer + Dual EMPEQ Vs. GML 8200 EQ?

Whats your opinion on these? Should I get a Hammer + a couple of EM-PEQs for mixing, tracking and 2bus, like my practical mind (and Ronan Chris Murphy) says? Or should I spend the same money on an GML 8200 EQ, like my inner slut (and George Massenbourg) says?


HAMMER







EM-PEQ







GML 8200





Old 28th December 2010
  #2
Lives for gear
The GML 8200 EQ is supposed to be very transparent. I own one and I won't sell it. Btw. I don't like how George Massenburg cuts the live out of the piano there in the video, but ok, to show what you can do, that's fine. I don't use it on the 2 bus, because there I use something else.

Of course I also want a Hammer and I guess it has a much more colored euphonic sound.

I don't know about the Dual EMPEQ but I guess you can look the EQ layout and it will be different to the Hammer. Looks like a Pultec style wide range EQ too me..

In general you want something for corrections on the 2 bus and something else to influence a wider frequency range. That's again 2 types of EQ. Or you could EQ subtracks and not EQ the 2 bus at all - also often said around here.

You should get them all and experiment.
Old 28th December 2010
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkyGoldstein View Post
I don't know about the Dual EMPEQ but I guess you can look the EQ layout and it will be different to the Hammer. Looks like a Pultec style wide range EQ too me.. You should get them all and experiment.
What do you use on the 2bus?

Yes the EM-PEQ is a pultec inspired, mono eq. It has got many praises for its low end, while the Hammer gets all of its praises for its high end. So a pair of EM-PEQs and a Hammer is what some guys are using for tracking/mixing/2bus and I drool about it.

But of course I want an 8200 too.
Old 29th December 2010
  #4
AB3
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I like the hammer on vocals. I like the em-peq on the 2 buss. And the high end of the em-peq is very nice on the 2 buss. I like to keep clarity on the 2 buss. The Hammer has too much of an imprint for the 2 buss to me. But it depends on what your music is. Mine has a lot of detail and transients.

I am sure others will disagree and they are probably correct for their music.

Suffice it to say, that a hammer and em-peqs and great items to have.
Old 29th December 2010
  #5
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YOHAMI's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by AB3 View Post
I like the hammer on vocals. I like the em-peq on the 2 buss. And the high end of the em-peq is very nice on the 2 buss. I like to keep clarity on the 2 buss. The Hammer has too much of an imprint for the 2 buss to me. But it depends on what your music is. Mine has a lot of detail and transients.
Im doing pop-rock-electro: Drum machine, bass, acoustic guitar, echoed electric guitar and voice. What is your music style?

I didnt expect the Hammer´s imprint would obfuscate clarity / transients?
Old 29th December 2010
  #6
Listen to your inner slut.
Old 29th December 2010
  #7
AB3
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Mine is very eclectic with lots of percussion.

I do not want to exaggerate the Hammer's "cloudiness." It is just not as clean on the high end as the em-peq. But for some mixes, it might be just the thing.

I just think the Em-peq's high end is sometimes underestimated. It is very natural and not brittle in any way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yohami View Post
Im doing pop-rock-electro: Drum machine, bass, acoustic guitar, echoed electric guitar and voice. What is your music style?

I didnt expect the Hammer´s imprint would obfuscate clarity / transients?
Old 29th December 2010
  #8
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Tony Shepperd's Avatar
Are you referring to the EM-PEQ or this...
Attached Thumbnails
A-Designs Hammer + Dual EMPEQ Vs. GML 8200 EQ?-em-peq2-front-800.jpg  
Old 29th December 2010
  #9
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I want this too
Old 29th December 2010
  #10
AB3
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Hi Tony. I was referring to the em-peq. But that new unit looks unbelievable!

I wonder if it is has more of the "Hammers" tonality than the Em-peq, which is solid state?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony Shepperd View Post
Are you referring to the EM-PEQ or this...
Old 29th December 2010
  #11
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exwel's Avatar
have a 8200 and had a hammer, sold it and bought a retro 2a3.
8200 on the master and for indv. instruments the 2a3

The Hammer did not the job for me.
Old 29th December 2010
  #12
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skybluerental's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony Shepperd View Post
Are you referring to the EM-PEQ or this...

cool!

whats the story with this?
is it 2 em peq's in one box??
is it different in any way from the 500 series em peq???
how much will it cost?
when is it on the market?

nice one.
Old 30th December 2010
  #13
Lives for gear
 

The 8200 is just sonically ridiculous. Its a truly amazing EQ which is why its still around without many changes to the original design.

The 2 big problems with it are-

1. The channels will NOT match- and when using it in stereo apps like the 2 bus, you will have to do a little calibration sine wave procedure to balance it closely- that is if you care to have left and right be the same (our ears sure don't care). You just have to trust your ears and not worry about it.

2. It can do as much damage as help if you aren't careful.

I personally wouldn't put the other EQs you listed in the same group. They are fine EQs but don't have the sonic class and functionality of the 8200.

You can do things with the 8200 the others can't even attempt to do. And the bottom on the 8200 is so HUGE its crazy- without muddling the mix. Everyone plugs the top end of the 8200 but man that bottom is great.

The hardcore A-designs fanboys will retort otherwise but theres really no comparison and I have nothing personal against the A-designs stuff. But beware- gearslutz has become the house of Montessi...
Old 30th December 2010
  #14
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Space Station's Avatar
Is there a stereo EQ with two seperate channels, independently controlled with potentiometers, that exactly match left to right with the controls in the same physical positions?

As far as i know it's not possible.

Even so as a regular user of the 8200 on mixes, i can say i've never come across this 'big problem'.
Old 30th December 2010
  #15
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BLueROom's Avatar
 

They are certainly different beasts, no question.

However, I love the crap out of my Hammer/EMPEQ combo. Truly fun to work with. thumbsup
Old 30th December 2010
  #16
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YOHAMI's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by McDingus View Post
The 8200 is just sonically ridiculous. Its a truly amazing EQ which is why its still around without many changes to the original design.... You can do things with the 8200 the others can't even attempt to do. And the bottom on the 8200 is so HUGE its crazy- without muddling the mix. Everyone plugs the top end of the 8200 but man that bottom is great.
Everyone who uses the 8200 seems to agree its the finest piece of EQ. When you add low end, does it behave like a pultec in the sense it compresses / makes the frequencies more focused?
Old 30th December 2010
  #17
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YOHAMI's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony Shepperd View Post
Are you referring to the EM-PEQ or this...
I was reffering to a couple of EM-PEQs in a 2 slots lunchbox, but this looks like... it.
Old 30th December 2010
  #18
Quote:
Originally Posted by Space Station View Post
Is there a stereo EQ with two seperate channels, independently controlled with potentiometers, that exactly match left to right with the controls in the same physical positions?

As far as i know it's not possible.
Maybe something along the lines of the GML 9500, Buzz 2.2, or Sontecs etc but they are stepped.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Space Station View Post
Even so as a regular user of the 8200 on mixes, i can say I've never come across this 'big problem'.
It might vary unit to unit. I have read that the mid and low mid bands can sometimes be suspect, but this hasn't been a problem for me either. Mine is calibrated pretty tight. The only thing I would replace it with is the 9500 or 2.2 at this point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by McDingus View Post
The 8200 is just sonically ridiculous. Its a truly amazing EQ which is why its still around without many changes to the original design.

I personally wouldn't put the other EQs you listed in the same group. They are fine EQs but don't have the sonic class and functionality of the 8200.

You can do things with the 8200 the others can't even attempt to do. And the bottom on the 8200 is so HUGE its crazy- without muddling the mix. Everyone plugs the top end of the 8200 but man that bottom is great.
+1
Old 30th December 2010
  #19
AB3
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I often wonder about the GML mic pres that come with 4 banks of parametric eq. Maybe not quite the 8200, but darn close, plus you get a great mic pre as well. I have forgotten the name of the pre/eq combo unit, but I remember they were going for a decent price used.'

later edit: I remember now - it is the 2032. Sometimes I have seen them for abuot $2000 used. That means for $4000, one would get two incredible mic pres and eqs. And I believe the eqs can be accessed by line level.

I bring this up, because if I had to start over, I would have bought a couple of those 2032s.
Old 31st December 2010
  #20
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Space Station's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Waltz Mastering View Post
Maybe something along the lines of the GML 9500, Buzz 2.2, or Sontecs etc but they are stepped.

It might vary unit to unit. I have read that the mid and low mid bands can sometimes be suspect, but this hasn't been a problem for me either. Mine is calibrated pretty tight. The only thing I would replace it with is the 9500 or 2.2 at this point.


+1
Yes the 9500 and Buzz(i think) use discrete resistor switching rather than potentiometers hence the increase in accuracy.
Old 31st December 2010
  #21
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mixerguy's Avatar
I have spent a LOT of time with all the units you are asking about - using them on the mix buss (and other places too)

and I'd totally go for the Hammer & EMP-EQs.

why?

the GML 8200 is very clean, and doesnt make things big and open and ballsy..... it is just (good, clean) EQ.

How about you buy the MDW eq plugin for good, clean EQ (i got the native version plugin "used" for $200) and then use the Hammer / EM-PEQ for vibe, balls and open-ness.

plus then you'd have 4 channels of high end EQ - use them on parallel, or in some situations you could use them separately.

Old 31st December 2010
  #22
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YOHAMI's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mixerguy View Post
How about you buy the MDW eq plugin for good.
LOL. So how is the MDW plugin compared to the real thing?

I get it, having different flavors is what I need now. The EM PEQs are ballsy / focused and the Hammer makes stuff sound more 3D. But you know, before spending 5K at once on EQ alone, I have to consider options.

About using EQ plugins, I have sonalskis, Roger Nichols frequalizer and a few others, I have uad2 but didnt try eqs other than the pultec. Is the MDW good enough to ditch the others?
Old 31st December 2010
  #23
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Tony Shepperd's Avatar
All three of the units you have chosen are completely different boxes with completely different characteristics. The EQ's were designed with different jobs/task in mind. I think you should define what your audio task is and the buy the EQ based on that.
Old 31st December 2010
  #24
Gear Maniac
 
tobias schuch's Avatar
 

What about hammer + empeqs VS Retro 2a3?
I've heard very positive things about the 2a3 and its cheaper than buying the a designs combo. Anyone compared them?
[don't mean to thread jack..]
Old 31st December 2010
  #25
Gear Guru
 
u b k's Avatar
 

I think you should skip all the eq's and cover your walls with 2d diffusion instead. My guess is it'd have a more dramatic effect on your mixes.

I'm kidding, but not really. The more I do this, the more I realize that every hundred bucks spent on improving my room is worth ten times that in signal processing improvements.





Gregory Scott - ubk
Old 31st December 2010
  #26
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YOHAMI's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by u b k View Post
I think you should skip all the eq's and cover your walls with 2d diffusion instead. My guess is it'd have a more dramatic effect on your mixes.
WOW, such a beautiful room, makes me dream about unicorns and such.

Im going to spend some or a lot of moolah treating my room, then go to a studio to fine tuning eq there.

That said, would you go for character eq or clean if you were in my position? This is all the EQ gear Im going to buy for now and cant stretch my budget much more since I have to get the compressors too
Old 1st January 2011
  #27
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YOHAMI's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tobias schuch View Post
What about hammer + empeqs VS Retro 2a3?
I've heard very positive things about the 2a3 and its cheaper than buying the a designs combo. Anyone compared them?
[don't mean to thread jack..]
Checking the retro https://www.gearslutz.com/board/old-n...retro-2a3.html
Old 1st January 2011
  #28
500 series nutjob
 
pan60's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by McDingus View Post
The hardcore A-designs fanboys will retort otherwise but theres really no comparison and I have nothing personal against the A-designs stuff. But beware- gearslutz has become the house of Montessi...
and for good reason!
the A-Designs HAMMER and the EM-PEQ are bar none just smokin units!
Old 1st January 2011
  #29
Gear Guru
 
u b k's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by yohami View Post
That said, would you go for character eq or clean if you were in my position?

It's really impossible to say, as I have no idea what 'your position' is.

That said, none of the units you've mentioned are, imo, character eq's. They're all on the clean side of things, with the Hammer having just the faintest hint of sparkle.

Me, I look to compressors and other harmonic juicing pieces to help augment the character of my tracks; saturation, envelope shaping, and distortion are all capable of hefty vibe. EQ's are there to clean stuff up or tilt things in one direction or the other so they fit better, and while I often like the personality of a given eq, I don't look to eq's to add personality. Does that make sense?

If you're intent on keeping your list of candidates as-is (no reason not to), I'd look more to how they interface, what they're best suited for, and what the experience is of using the tool rather than any subjective assessments of their character.

The a-designs stuff is more of a click-a-few-knobs-until-it-sounds-right thing, useful for broader shaping. The GML is a do-it-all tweaker box, the sound is pristine, there's no eq task it can't accomplish but you gotta know what you're doing. It's not forgiving like the a-designs stuff, but it's capable of more should you need it, especially serious carving and problem correction.

If you look at them more for 'what they do' rather than 'how they sound', the choice might be easier.


Gregory Scott - ubk
Old 1st January 2011
  #30
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The MPCist's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Waltz Mastering View Post
Listen to your inner slut.
+1

Best advice that can be given.
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