The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Reviews  Search Gear Database  Search Gear for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
Mercenary KM69s Condenser Microphones
Old 31st December 2010
  #31
Lives for gear
 
KevWind's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
I have a pair of these mice. I've used them on a number of sources from piano to strings, acoustic guitar to overheads, hi-hat, snare drum and even bbass. They are a truly high end product. They have detailed mids and unlike the harsh high end on many of their competitors they capture a beautiful sparkle.

If I had any criticism of them at all trhey are a bit hot and need padded down on louder sources. That's of course easily sorted.

As a slight aside I found it slightly ironic that someone publically and vociferously complaining about a lack of detail in respect of a product that they never even used should hide behind an anonymous user name and post no website address or in fact, any detail about themself or their background at all. Maybe I'm just old fashioned though...
Ya Maybe "just old fashioned" observant I'll say I once again for the pice point the mic is spectacular.
Old 31st December 2010
  #32
Gear Addict
 
BluegrassDan's Avatar
How do they compare to KM84s or KM184s?

I'm looking for a pair of something that sounds like KM84s, without the "vintage" price tag of KM84s.
Old 31st December 2010
  #33
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
As a slight aside I found it slightly ironic that someone publically and vociferously complaining about a lack of detail in respect of a product that they never even used should hide behind an anonymous user name and post no website address or in fact, any detail about themself or their background at all.
+1

The KM69 is an excellent mic and is (IMO) considerably better than most others of this type.
Old 31st December 2010
  #34
Lives for gear
 
KevWind's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by BluegrassDan View Post
How do they compare to KM84s or KM184s?

I'm looking for a pair of something that sounds like KM84s, without the "vintage" price tag of KM84s.
personally I preferred the 69 over the 84 in the shootout that I did. I thought it was slightly more detailed. But I am sure it's totally personal and subjective.
Old 31st December 2010
  #35
Lives for gear
 
Empty Planet's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletcher View Post

I have a twisted mind that goes to bad places when you insert the word "golden" in quotes in a sentence.

Love that.
heh heh



Old 1st January 2011
  #36
Quote:
Originally Posted by BluegrassDan View Post
How do they compare to KM84s or KM184s?

I'm looking for a pair of something that sounds like KM84s, without the "vintage" price tag of KM84s.
I'd say every bit as detailed but slightly more 'modern' (to coin a completely subjective phrase). I guess they areslightly brighter than my 84s (but not in.a harsh way like the 184.)
Old 1st January 2011
  #37
Here for the gear
 
Hung Lo's Avatar
 

I would love to know if anyone has any time in with the KM69

I would love to know if anyone has any time in with the KM69, the Schoeps, the Telefunken E LAM 260, the Geffel and The Josephson E22s, and the Peluso P-28? These would primarily be pointed to people with super dynamic Acoustic guitars. Not that Taylors are not fine guitars, but anyone here along the lines of Elambo that have guitars that have more of a sonic range and depth that could really evaluate these mics in a pro situation? Forgive me for mixing with tubes in with the KM69, but
I am trying to nail down a good direction to go short of a vintage KM54, or KM84 (Out of my price range and time line). I've got a Pendulum SPS1 pre, Averil 1073's and API's as well as a Great River MP2NV to evaluate through. The problem is finding the right tools for the job and that could be a few of these. Mainly doing Rock & Roll so I don't need the cleanest most pristine deal, or a spec sheet mic, just something that is going to deliver.

I am probably going to call up Mercenary on Monday and get one of these things for evaluation. It's been hard getting a straight answer this week cause every dealer who does not sell the KM69 will spin what they got and Poo-poo what they don't have. I think there is a lot of value to getting feedback from working pros but nothing can substitute putting your own ears on it..

I know there is also "Forum Fever" out there with gear, and that happened with the Retro 176. We demo'd it and found out it was not for us. I think that's the way to go. Any heads up on Mics coming at NAMM that we should check out?
Old 1st January 2011
  #38
Assuming your talking abou the gefell 295 I've used them all but the t-funk and peluso. Truth is they are all very good mics. What would work best to your ear isd a question none of us can answer. All that can be said of the km69 in this company is that it easily hangs with them and whether it one your shootout would depemd on the sound you were shooting for.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hung Lo View Post
I would love to know if anyone has any time in with the KM69, the Schoeps, the Telefunken E LAM 260, the Geffel and The Josephson E22s, and the Peluso P-28? These would primarily be pointed to people with super dynamic Acoustic guitars. Not that Taylors are not fine guitars, but anyone here along the lines of Elambo that have guitars that have more of a sonic range and depth that could really evaluate these mics in a pro situation? Forgive me for mixing with tubes in with the KM69, but
I am trying to nail down a good direction to go short of a vintage KM54, or KM84 (Out of my price range and time line). I've got a Pendulum SPS1 pre, Averil 1073's and API's as well as a Great River MP2NV to evaluate through. The problem is finding the right tools for the job and that could be a few of these. Mainly doing Rock & Roll so I don't need the cleanest most pristine deal, or a spec sheet mic, just something that is going to deliver.

I am probably going to call up Mercenary on Monday and get one of these things for evaluation. It's been hard getting a straight answer this week cause every dealer who does not sell the KM69 will spin what they got and Poo-poo what they don't have. I think there is a lot of value to getting feedback from working pros but nothing can substitute putting your own ears on it..

I know there is also "Forum Fever" out there with gear, and that happened with the Retro 176. We demo'd it and found out it was not for us. I think that's the way to go. Any heads up on Mics coming at NAMM that we should check out?
Old 2nd January 2011
  #39
Lives for gear
 
elambo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hung Lo View Post
I think there is a lot of value to getting feedback from working pros but nothing can substitute putting your own ears on it.
Keep that in mind and you'll do well. As you found out with the Retro, the words of other people will never predict how YOU would feel about a product. These are good starting point, but you'll need to plug in and hit record.

fwiw, if the 69 is being referred to as a KM84 or better then it's worth a listen.

The Schoeps (CMC6/MK4) are too articulate for complex guitars imo. Very clinical. Of course it depends on the specific guitar, the preamp, the type of playing and the genre, but that's my general experience. On guitars with less harmonics and softer pickin' they can be great. Strummin'... not so much.
Old 2nd January 2011
  #40
Lives for gear
 
KevWind's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by elambo View Post
Keep that in mind and you'll do well. As you found out with the Retro, the words of other people will never predict how YOU would feel about a product. These are good starting point, but you'll need to plug in and hit record.

fwiw, if the 69 is being referred to as a KM84 or better then it's worth a listen.

The Schoeps (CMC6/MK4) are too articulate for complex guitars imo. Very clinical. Of course it depends on the specific guitar, the preamp, the type of playing and the genre, but that's my general experience. On guitars with less harmonics and softer pickin' they can be great. Strummin'... not so much.
Define "complex guitars" if you dont mind.
Old 2nd January 2011
  #41
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by KevWind View Post
Define "complex guitars" if you dont mind.
Yeah. I think what he meant to say was, "The Schoeps are good because they don't allow the players I record to hide behind slow and distorted mics."
Old 2nd January 2011
  #42
Gear Maniac
 
Pliplo's Avatar
 

maybe the specs didnt do justice to the mic's sound, so they shredded them :D

there's actually some samples in the product's page... maybe they really dont give a **** about the specs cause they're THAT sure it sounds amazing

http://www.ma-mfg.com/audio/audio.html
Old 2nd January 2011
  #43
Lives for gear
 
andreaeffe's Avatar
Hmmmmm...

Personally, I only heard a pair of these 69s (already recorded multitrack) on one mixing occasion, and used one of these 69s on another recording occasion, and found that they sounded very good - indeed, KM84ish with a bit of a "modern", subjectively more forward top edge, as the sales description implies.
So, honestly, all good.

That said, however, and WITHOUT wanting to enter in any argument with anyone and certainly NOT implying that anyone is "hiding" anything or trying to sell crap product, I have to equally honestly say that I agree 1000% with Salty James that

Quote:
i do agree though that there should be specs. It is a standard with quality mics and hold the manufacturers to a type of standard.
and with Justin Long that
Quote:
however, it makes me nervous when a common consensus on a website made for gear fanatics (with many 'professionals') don't embrace, understand, or maybe just simply not care about the specs for different pieces of equipment. knowing why things work should be a close second in importance to knowing if they work; it's the difference between making something great once or making things great always.
even ignoring the uses or benefits one can get from a spec sheet, doesn't it seem like manufacturers should include them just to show they put in their due diligence in creating the product?
(regardless of the name and reputation of the brand, I would add),
and with Ludovico that

Quote:
my opinion is that if Mercenary wanted to have access to an anechoic chamber, they would sure have the means to find one and publish the specs.
Even more so because these quotes & claims like this one taken from the ma-mfg website

put the proto-types through the same rigorous testing and development procedures as any other Mercenary Edition product…

don't exactly match up well or look terribly good against e.g. these two here by the venerable Fletcher

Quote:
why there is no published specifications...
There was no way to generate them.
There is nothing to hide [that anyone knows about] - there is nothing sinister or disrespectful lurking about - just the lack of availability to get proper test data generated.
Quote:
The mic is not built in Foxboro, MA [home of Mercenary Audio]. It is built in the United States at a facility that does have most of the proper test equipment - though no anechoic chamber - but the great majority of the proper test equipment.
...at least to my thinking & underdstanding, they don't.

Not discussing the quality or the product, just the pragmatic (documentation) and semantic (wording) side of things, which I guess is what set off Confusionator and his somewhat altered tone/overheated initial post, here, perhaps a bit understandably especially faced with a product that is much coveted, and not exactly "budget gear".

To avoid confusion I'll say it again - the mic DID sound very good, to me.

All of the above, of course, in my opinion & experience.

Happy New Year & peace,

A
F
Old 2nd January 2011
  #44
Lives for gear
 
elambo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by PDC View Post
Yeah. I think what he meant to say was, "The Schoeps are good because they don't allow the players I record to hide behind slow and distorted mics."
I'm typically the one playing, and I could certainly stand to use a veil to cover my loose tracks (so to speak), but what I meant was that a guitar with a lot of character (harmonics, overtones), if strummed, can overpower your ears when capturing it with a mic like the Schoeps. It's a great mic, no question, but not ideal in these situations, in my experience. I do like them for finger picking, and with classical guitars in particular.
Old 2nd January 2011
  #45
Lives for gear
 
elambo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevWind View Post
Define "complex guitars" if you dont mind.
See above. In addition to over and undertones, a guitar that's very dynamic fits into this category.
Old 2nd January 2011
  #46
Lives for gear
 
KevWind's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by elambo View Post
See above. In addition to over and undertones, a guitar that's very dynamic fits into this category.
Oh, OK. Thanks, I do understand overtones etc and dynamics I have a Breedlove that falls into that category and It's my experience that the opposite is the case. The more "complex" and dynamic, that more "articulate" is desirable and just the ticket, I guess one mans "clinical" is another's detailed smoothness . But I would suggest it may be much more a matter of mic placement and the player, pre etc. etc... After all the Schoeps is one of most used mics for string sections of orchestras which one would think to be somewhat complex and dynamic. Of course different strokes Makes the world go round, does it not?
Old 2nd January 2011
  #47
Gear Nut
 
Beowulf's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by PDC View Post
Has anyone here purchased and used Mercenary MFG KM69s? Still happy with them?
Bought a pair in July to use as drum OHs. Still happy. Flew out to Boston in September and visited Mercenary Audio with a good friend who also picked up a pair to use as drum overheads, based on recordings done with mine. He is also still happy. Listen for yourself, return them if you don't like them, but you can't have mine!


https://www.gearslutz.com/board/photo...t-project.html
Old 2nd January 2011
  #48
Lives for gear
 
elambo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevWind View Post
The more "complex" and dynamic, that more "articulate" is desirable and just the ticket, I guess one mans "clinical" is another's detailed smoothness .
I think of it as too much information. Pick a couple strings at a time and you're in no trouble, but start hammering away at the strings of an already complex guitar and it's just too much information. Like a Pollack painting under a microscope -- sometimes a little distance is necessary. The Schoeps doesn't provide that distance.

Also, clinical and detail are too different shades of the same apple to me. And if it's smooth it's probably not an issue. But smooth, under a guitar like a Collings, a Schoeps is not.

My de facto for most acoustic gtrs is a KM54. I won't try to describe it - it's just magic.
Old 2nd January 2011
  #49
Lives for gear
 
KevWind's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by elambo View Post
I think of it as too much information. Pick a couple strings at a time and you're in no trouble, but start hammering away at the strings of an already complex guitar and it's just too much information. Like a Pollack painting under a microscope -- sometimes a little distance is necessary. The Schoeps doesn't provide that distance.

Also, clinical and detail are too different shades of the same apple to me. And if it's smooth it's probably not an issue. But smooth, under a guitar like a Collings, a Schoeps is not.

My de facto for most acoustic gtrs is a KM54. I won't try to describe it - it's just magic.
I guess all one can say is, in the end it boils down to a matter of different strokes. Haven't tried the Schoeps or any mic on a Collings I've played a number of Collings but own Breedlove and Taylor.
Old 2nd January 2011
  #50
Here for the gear
 
Hung Lo's Avatar
 

Your right..

Quote:
Originally Posted by elambo View Post
I think of it as too much information. Pick a couple strings at a time and you're in no trouble, but start hammering away at the strings of an already complex guitar and it's just too much information. Like a Pollack painting under a microscope -- sometimes a little distance is necessary. The Schoeps doesn't provide that distance.

Also, clinical and detail are too different shades of the same apple to me. And if it's smooth it's probably not an issue. But smooth, under a guitar like a Collings, a Schoeps is not.

My de facto for most acoustic gtrs is a KM54. I won't try to describe it - it's just magic.
E, It's odd, though understandable that Fletcher would not jump into this one, He's got a mic that he helped design KM69 and a mic that his company sells, and obviously he could be at odds with one over the other here, but I'd like to hear his un-varnished truth about those Telefunken 260's, (how they really compare etc). Thing is I can't really find anything definitive on the 260. Seems like the KM69 is more like something classic that we all know and some love, a KM84 with some more mojo. I wonder if the Tfunk is closer to the KM54? So anyone out in studio land has an idea, chime in. As for Elambo he has some real dynamic and special guitars as do I and probably a few more people on this forum, but he also has a KM54, and if he says it is the business in capturing some or all of his guitars, I'm going to give that a look. I know exactly what your saying with capturing those guitars, The Collings especially.

The problem is sourcing tubes, and Mics that are in good shape. Everything is Fantasy priced. So an affordable alternative is in order.
No Josephson or Beyer lovers? I guess If I can narrow it down to a couple
I'm good. I'll be at NAMM, so i will see who's putting what up and try to report back, but sometimes stuff won't ship for months. I got a chance to pick up a pair of 260's used for even money with the KM69's but my gut is telling me to put it off and try the KM69s..
Old 2nd January 2011
  #51
Lives for gear
 
elambo's Avatar
Maybe Fletcher hasn't yet seen your post, or maybe he's just staying out of it. He did explain some things about the KM69, which was helpful, and certainly necessary in this thread.

Differences between a KM69 and Telefunken 260... Good question. I don't know anything about the 260 except that it uses an EF732 tube. Does that give it an advantage over the 69? In the words of "Sex" Ed Vincent, "who's ta say?"
Old 2nd January 2011
  #52
Here for the gear
 
Hung Lo's Avatar
 

Pete H's mic..

Quote:
Originally Posted by elambo View Post
Maybe Fletcher hasn't yet seen your post, or maybe he's just staying out of it. He did explain some things about the KM69, which was helpful, and certainly necessary in this thread.

Differences between a KM69 and Telefunken 260... Good question. I don't know anything about the 260 except that it uses an EF732 tube. Does that give it an advantage over the 69? In the words of "Sex" Ed Vincent, "who's ta say?"
Elambo, remember when Pete Huntlinger recorded a few demos for Collings demoing his 0M and an 0, and a hog OM? Looks like That was a with one of his 70's KM84's. I loved his tone, I know that was quick and dirty, but man it sounded great. Pete always sounds great, but wow!
Old 3rd January 2011
  #53
member no 666
 
Fletcher's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hung Lo View Post
I wonder if the Tfunk is closer to the KM54?
No - an ELA M 260 (cardioid) 261 (Onmi) & 262 (hyper-cardioid) all sound quite different than a KM-54... not better, not worse, just different. As with all microphone purchases, it will be best for you to listen to the product and compare the product to other products before you commit to a decision... as your purposes / sense of aesthetic will be different than every other poster on this [and every other] board.

Peace.
Old 3rd January 2011
  #54
Lives for gear
 
bassjam's Avatar
 

Hey Confusionator, check out the specs on my arse!

Old 3rd January 2011
  #55
Lives for gear
 
elambo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bassjam View Post
Hey Confusionator, check out the specs on my arse!
LOL!

But how does it SOUND?
Old 3rd January 2011
  #56
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by elambo View Post
LOL!

But how does it SOUND?

Well, I doubt it's flat !
Old 3rd January 2011
  #57
Quote:
Originally Posted by bassjam View Post
Hey Confusionator, check out the specs on my arse!

Ha! That just made me spit tea on my macbook! Glad to see you are in good spirits at least. You out of hospital yet?
Old 3rd January 2011
  #58
Lives for gear
 
KevWind's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bassjam View Post
Hey Confusionator, check out the specs on my arse!

That's the first curvliner wave form I've ever seen, black too very dramatic! or is that dynamic ?
Old 3rd January 2011
  #59
Lives for gear
 
Schaap's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bassjam View Post
Hey Confusionator, check out the specs on my arse!

What is the S/N ratio? heh
Old 3rd January 2011
  #60
Here for the gear
 
Hung Lo's Avatar
 

Hi Fletch

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletcher View Post
No - an ELA M 260 (cardioid) 261 (Onmi) & 262 (hyper-cardioid) all sound quite different than a KM-54... not better, not worse, just different. As with all microphone purchases, it will be best for you to listen to the product and compare the product to other products before you commit to a decision... as your purposes / sense of aesthetic will be different than every other poster on this [and every other] board.

Peace.
Hi Fletch, the first part of my question was finding a "SDAGM" Super Duty Acoustic Guitar Mic. KM69 vs Elam 260 vs KM84/54 ?

Trying to get close and in the zone before I start running Adam around.

I realize it would be best to audition first..

Aesthetic optional..

Danka/Thx
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Similar Threads
Thread
Thread Starter / Forum
Replies
Doc Mixwell / Gearslutz Secondhand Gear Classifieds
1
Fibes / Gearslutz Secondhand Gear Classifieds
0
hey_mavis / So much gear, so little time
3
AC Long / The Good News Channel
7
Dog_Chao_Chao / High end
39

Forum Jump
Forum Jump