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Are pultecs being used for mastering duties or more for tracking or mixdown? Equalisers (HW)
Old 21st March 2010
  #31
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herecomesyourman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cirrusboy7 View Post
I believe we went into manley m/p after i mentioned UAD pultec
but im not sure now that you mentioned manley pultec

also, so if i use the uad pultec as high cut on master
i should use the Que knob ?
Anything I posted about a Manley product was only on point about the Massive Passive. I brought it up because there are program style EQ's that are Pultec inspired, but different in function. And some of them are great, they're just all different sounds.

The Pultec clone that Manley released is a great piece, but I would never call it accurate to an original. It's just not.
Old 21st March 2010
  #32
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herecomesyourman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bgrotto View Post
Aha! OK, that makes sense now, glad that's cleared up. I was sitting here going, "man, I can't wait to get to work tomorrow to figure out those new features!"

haha...sorry man...but seriously, I do like those units too...I just got a decent deal on my MP so...I went for it.
Old 21st March 2010
  #33
Quote:
Originally Posted by herecomesyourman View Post
The Pultec clone that Manley released is a great piece, but I would never call it accurate to an original. It's just not.
Very true. Not even close, but great for its own thing.

We also have a Tube Tech PE1C; again, great unit, but not a Pultec.

And sorry for the Massive Passive/Pultec confusion. My reading comprehension is apparently handicapped this evening.
Old 21st March 2010
  #34
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bgrotto View Post
Q knob does not effect the high cut (remember, it's a shelf).
Aahh ok, well actually i do know what Q means but was getting confused with it all..
thought i was missing something. but thanks for clearing it up agian
Old 21st March 2010
  #35
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by herecomesyourman View Post
No. The Atten knob cuts freqs. The Boost pushes them.

The middle knob that has the words "Sharp" and "Broad" shortens / widens the Q on BOTH the High and Low Band.

It's a program EQ that does lows and Highs...the Manley works on all bands and has filters, so that's why it's really it's own thing to me and not a pultec clone so much as initially inspired by them.

That being said, real vintage one in good repair can sound magic. But like everything from that era there are tons of revisions.

I would still start with the plug versions to learn how the controls are supposed to interact. The bands are EXTREMELY interactive and it takes ear training to really get the most out of those units.
I heard when you boost the lows up along with the atten knob at same level. i.e manually sync them. its does some kinda money sweetening ? ive done it and it seems to work nicely at least on the low's.. im taking about the pultec of course ; )
Old 21st March 2010
  #36
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bgrotto View Post
Every Pultec EQP1A clone has that same high cut shelf, so Manley is not the only option (although I quite like it; the extra EQ points are very, very useful).

Trident won't sound anything like a Pultec (or any of its clones), nor should it sound much like a Neve (at least not any of the Neve modules I'm familiar with).

That said, the LPF on the Neves are quite nice, if that's what you're after. On the (much) cheaper end of things, Harrisons are well-regarded for their filters.

EDIT: oops, just realized you were talking about plugins. My bad.
I used an eddie kramer kick preset in trident, then roughly eq'ed my neve 1073 the same way and although there was C-hair color difference i got the same sound with the 1073.
Old 21st March 2010
  #37
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herecomesyourman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cirrusboy7 View Post
I used an eddie kramer kick preset in trident, then roughly eq'ed my neve 1073 the same way and although there was C-hair color difference i got the same sound with the 1073.
Are your Trident and Neve sounds all plugins?

None of that stuff really sounds all that close to the real strips.

And presets...that's mix by numbers stuff buddy. Similar curves on different digital models trying to emulate analog circuits won't provide the types of phase distortions you get from an actual transformer driven circuit.

digital distortions only get uglier the harder you drive them, because they're squarewave. I own vintage Neve Pres and have worked on several Trident desks, they are NOTHING alike in the flesh.
Old 21st March 2010
  #38
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by herecomesyourman View Post
Are your Trident and Neve sounds all plugins?

None of that stuff really sounds all that close to the real strips.

And presets...that's mix by numbers stuff buddy. Similar curves on different digital models trying to emulate analog circuits won't provide the types of phase distortions you get from an actual transformer driven circuit.

digital distortions only get uglier the harder you drive them, because they're squarewave. I own vintage Neve Pres and have worked on several Trident desks, they are NOTHING alike in the flesh.
yeah i'm all ITB, ( I like my car, ha! ; ) no i was just saying that they can sound similar ITB. I understand what your saying, nothing beats the real thing thing, however for most of us plugs = Are the real thing. and so we need to keep asking you guys how this stuff is supposed to really sound..haha

i think with the sat plugs that are coming out fatso, decapitator, voxegen, psp.. + Knowledge, we can get close to the big warm sound.

thanks for the esoteric info, that rocks

also did you see my #35 question.. does that make any sense,
the guys from the IK clinic session told me that about a year ago
Old 21st March 2010
  #39
member no 666
 
Fletcher's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubbakron View Post
You guys still managed to put out more amazing music than we do today even with all this new technology.
We had some added advantages... like musicians that could play, writers that could write, arrangers who could arrange... and studios were paid well enough to be able to afford the best gear and the best maintenance... ALONG with a training program that took years and dedication where only a few who belonged in the industry survived [Darwinian concept ain't it... survival of the most competent].

Now any butt reaming asshole can waltz into a Banjo Mart, pick up a 002 and a Waves bundle with some SP mics and an ART pre-amp, walk out, hang up a shingle [after buying a ton or "Real Traps"] and call themself a studio.

Then... what could almost be music is crammed into a cookie cutter arrangement with all the guitar sounds sounding the same [because that's how its done dude] with the drums being all triggered samples from some bull**** library... with ungodly amounts of ****ty compression on what could be great vocals [see Green Day for details] and shoved out the door after having been "flatlined" in mastering. Who the fvck would actually pay for that? Right - that's why they download it off share sites on the internet... it ain't worth the money [not even the 99¢]

That said -- there are still a bunch of guys who do things the right way, a bunch of players who can play and a whole ton of records that get made every year that are absolutely fantastic!!! They're creative, they're magic... they just don't get played on the radio, don't show up at the Grammy®'s and end up flying so far under the radar its damn near impossible to find them.

Check out Justin Townes Earle's stuff... Swamp Cabbage... The Bottle Rockets latest released... the new Del Lords when its finally mixed... or on a closer to commercially viable level, The Black Keys &/or The Black Angels.

This isn't the same old regurgitated "hits of the 90's" that seemed to swill its ass across the last decade or aerosol pop nonsense that pulses like hip-hop meets the 1910 Fruitgum company.

There is a great band called "Bomb the Music Industry"... and they're fvcking right!!!

Peace.
Old 21st March 2010
  #40
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Sigma's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletcher View Post
Don't be.

Most of us are old, fat, gray & or losing or have lost our hair... are in ****ty health [as all those fun drugs we did before they became addictive are catching up to us].

In the past 30 days I've lost like 3 or 4 friends [in other words, our "generation" is starting to drop like flies]... we also got to watch an industry we loved better than family implode and rot before our eyes.

Better to listen to the war stories, define your own thing... and hopefully take better care of yourself than we did.

I'm on the trailing edge of that generation so I'm not quite as old, fat or bald as a lot of them... but if life expectancy for the "generation" I'm from is mid-50's to early 60's... its good I did my "mid-life crisis" in my early - mid 30's.

Peace.
HAHAHAh FLETCHER lol..may the unsacred harmonic vibration of the universe embrace you
Old 21st March 2010
  #41
Gear Nut
 

Thanks for bringing it back home again Sigma. we all need yo hear that.

However, I do think hard comp on EMO/punk type music is part of the sound.
i mean punkers never really thought they could sing, its more an
attitude and so adding all that compr adds to that in your face esthetic.
like using it as a musical device ( a sense of urgency ).
and the music is fast ( not always ) so there again it doesn't hurt..
opposed to say The Black Keys with big open slow to moderate tempos
and where the swells & dynamics are where they really shine.

also.. one last question about the pultec (uad here) so i should use the hi cut as a means to get rid of some shrill digital highs ? or use both Q and hi cut any suggestions on how i could use it on master out ?

again, i read to use a LPF for this purpose.. and it seems to work ok, buy i dont want to be missing something either

Thanks
Old 22nd March 2010
  #42
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cirrusboy7 View Post
Thanks for bringing it back home again Sigma. we all need yo hear that.

However, I do think hard comp on EMO/punk type music is part of the sound.
i mean punkers never really thought they could sing, its more an
attitude and so adding all that compr adds to that in your face esthetic.
like using it as a musical device ( a sense of urgency ).
and the music is fast ( not always ) so there again it doesn't hurt..
opposed to say The Black Keys with big open slow to moderate tempos
and where the swells & dynamics are where they really shine.

also.. one last question about the pultec (uad here) so i should use the hi cut as a means to get rid of some shrill digital highs ? or use both Q and hi cut any suggestions on how i could use it on master out ?

again, i read to use a LPF for this purpose.. and it seems to work ok, buy i dont want to be missing something either

Thanks
I use the Pultec HF cut all the time on over bright fem voices - just a smidge goes a long way
Old 22nd March 2010
  #43
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Bubbakron's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletcher View Post
Check out Justin Townes Earle's stuff... Swamp Cabbage... The Bottle Rockets latest released... the new Del Lords when its finally mixed... or on a closer to commercially viable level, The Black Keys &/or The Black Angels.
.
Nice, Thanks!! I love the Justin Townes Earle's and Swamp Cabbage especially!! I'm gonna see Knopfler next month, until now I thought that was the only way to hear that deep style of music!!! I needed some new tunes!!
Old 22nd March 2010
  #44
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herecomesyourman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cirrusboy7 View Post
Thanks for bringing it back home again Sigma. we all need yo hear that.

However, I do think hard comp on EMO/punk type music is part of the sound.
i mean punkers never really thought they could sing, its more an
attitude and so adding all that compr adds to that in your face esthetic.
like using it as a musical device ( a sense of urgency ).
and the music is fast ( not always ) so there again it doesn't hurt..
opposed to say The Black Keys with big open slow to moderate tempos
and where the swells & dynamics are where they really shine.

also.. one last question about the pultec (uad here) so i should use the hi cut as a means to get rid of some shrill digital highs ? or use both Q and hi cut any suggestions on how i could use it on master out ?

again, i read to use a LPF for this purpose.. and it seems to work ok, buy i dont want to be missing something either

Thanks
Dude I cut my teeth playing CBGB's in the late 90's out of High School before they shut it down...right up until I was signed and touring in my early 20's...Punk Rock is not dictated by compression. And ****ty pop punk that relies on too many studio tricks to compensate for competency as a band is kind of like having sex with the woman of your dreams on Viagra.

You finally climb the mountain...and take it in...only YOU didn't do it. It was all smoke and mirrors. It has nothing to do with who you actually are as a person.

The Ramones kicked out 10+ songs a day live when they first started...with minimal gear, and their music is still more socially relevant, lyrically provocative, and sonically interesting than anything Green Day will ever do.

Using compression to add some spice is fine, but mutilating music to make it sound like a so-called "hit" in a market that is completely controlled by the musical equivalent of the Coke and Pepsi war...I mean...saying it's part of the "sound" is kind of a sick joke my friend.

Talent is the sound. The gear is just paint to capture the essence.


And push the Low band a bit too...that sometimes smooths the highs as they are again, EXTREMELY interactive. Even in plugin form.

But seriously man, rent one or rent a studio that has one....run some tracks...a few hours of time to understand things intimately will train your ear better than this thread.
Old 22nd March 2010
  #45
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Knox's Avatar
 

Holy ****zki! I used to do shows at CBGB's in the 70s! I need an AARA card! btw . . I remember in NYC when studios / radio stations were actually / literally throwing Pultecs away!

Not to compare the Pultec with the TT, but when I ordered a bunch of Tube Techs in the late 80s . . engineers I knew were actually laughing at me and saying "why in God's name would you want that tube crap?" Then they ended up trying to rent them from me all the time. *smile*

The more things change, the more they stay the same. As far as Pultecs go on the mix buss . . . for certain things they can be wonderful, but of course like anything, they are not the right sound for everything. Tracking / mixing of course they can be magic. I'm not offering anything new here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by herecomesyourman View Post
Dude I cut my teeth playing CBGB's in the late 90's out of High School before they shut it down....
Old 22nd March 2010
  #46
Gear Guru
 
RoundBadge's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cirrusboy7 View Post
also.. one last question about the pultec (uad here) so i should use the hi cut as a means to get rid of some shrill digital highs ? or use both Q and hi cut any suggestions on how i could use it on master out ?

again, i read to use a LPF for this purpose.. and it seems to work ok, buy i dont want to be missing something either

Thanks
if you can,try renting a real one sometime.
the cartoons aren't even in the ballpark of what the real thing does.

blow up doll vs. real girl.
Old 22nd March 2010
  #47
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by herecomesyourman View Post
Dude I cut my teeth playing CBGB's in the late 90's out of High School before they shut it down...right up until I was signed and touring in my early 20's...Punk Rock is not dictated by compression. And ****ty pop punk that relies on too many studio tricks to compensate for competency as a band is kind of like having sex with the woman of your dreams on Viagra.

You finally climb the mountain...and take it in...only YOU didn't do it. It was all smoke and mirrors. It has nothing to do with who you actually are as a person.

The Ramones kicked out 10+ songs a day live when they first started...with minimal gear, and their music is still more socially relevant, lyrically provocative, and sonically interesting than anything Green Day will ever do.

Using compression to add some spice is fine, but mutilating music to make it sound like a so-called "hit" in a market that is completely controlled by the musical equivalent of the Coke and Pepsi war...I mean...saying it's part of the "sound" is kind of a sick joke my friend.

Talent is the sound. The gear is just paint to capture the essence.


And push the Low band a bit too...that sometimes smooths the highs as they are again, EXTREMELY interactive. Even in plugin form.

But seriously man, rent one or rent a studio that has one....run some tracks...a few hours of time to understand things intimately will train your ear better than this thread.
I hear ya, i was being objective in those notes, opposed to subjective.
I played CBGB's too. in late 80's . I was probably talking more about emo rather than punk.
but the sound did changed quite a bit post ramones. maybe you could say early punk...
anyway don't get me wrong Im not into emo or that over compressed sound.
and i know what your saying. " that sound " is worse than cats fighting for most of us audiophiles.
I guess none of what i said has any relevance and makes no objective sense at all.

I could rent one sure.. but that's one less cartoon plugin i could buy. got uad manley ? and beside didnt you guys get the memo.. we're living in a cartoon world now ( see obove ). hahaha, seriously just kidding.. dont rip my head off please ; ) i would borrow one for sure.
Old 22nd March 2010
  #48
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dayo View Post
I use the Pultec HF cut all the time on over bright fem voices - just a smidge goes a long way
Thats what i was looking for.. thanks alot
also.. logic 9 has a nice filter pass plug that you can mix with original sound
really cool
Old 22nd March 2010
  #49
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by herecomesyourman View Post
I tend to favor keeping the Bandwidths on "Broad" because of how the interact, but they can get pretty surgical when you slim the Q up.
Are you talking about the Pultec EQP-1A? I wouldn't call it surgical, even at "sharp" the reactance is fairly low. Maybe thats why we love it. Hard to make it sound unnatural...
Old 22nd March 2010
  #50
Probably wouldn't hurt to mention that narrowing the Q on a Pultec (or one of its offspring) also increases the gain. In other words, a wide-Q boost of "5" will be adding less gain than a narrow-Q boost of "5" at the same frequency.
Old 22nd March 2010
  #51
Here for the gear
 

Correct. The circuit uses a pot in series with the inductor do simulate the Q.
Old 23rd March 2010
  #52
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herecomesyourman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cape Zoloh View Post
Are you talking about the Pultec EQP-1A? I wouldn't call it surgical, even at "sharp" the reactance is fairly low. Maybe thats why we love it. Hard to make it sound unnatural...
Well....MORE surgical. Surgical by comparison with those kinds of tones helps.

That being said...I'd still rather use a real one than a plug...
Old 11th March 2018
  #53
Gear Addict
 
Peter Stengaard's Avatar
 

Having not tried a blow up doll I can’t say exactly if the metaphor is accurate but I did just get a set of the new mastering Pultecs to try out and no software emu comes close. Wow !!!


QUOTE=RoundBadge;5229666]if you can,try renting a real one sometime.
the cartoons aren't even in the ballpark of what the real thing does.

blow up doll vs. real girl.[/QUOTE]
Old 11th March 2018
  #54
Gear Addict
 
bzone's Avatar
 

[QUOTE=Peter Stengaard;13192703]Having not tried a blow up doll I can’t say exactly if the metaphor is accurate but I did just get a set of the new mastering Pultecs to try out and no software emu comes close. Wow !!!

I agree ! Have had a pair I think for a couple years already, congratulations!
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