The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
Where is the world's best outboard selection?
Old 17th May 2003
  #1
Lives for gear
 
jazzius's Avatar
 

Where is the world's best outboard selection?

Just out of interest, i was wondering what is the best studio in the world outboard-wise?...

..i'm only talking about out-board....i don't care if they're mixing it thru a Behringer....

...i mean, are there any studios that have ALL the boutique pieces?....

......maybe some Arab oil-sheik home recordist?! .......any offers?
Old 17th May 2003
  #2
Lives for gear
 
atticus's Avatar
www.blackbirdstudio.com

They have at least two of everything, and ten of most things.
Old 18th May 2003
  #3
Lives for gear
 
jazzius's Avatar
 

Fucking hell!....what complete *****s!........
Old 18th May 2003
  #4
Motown legend
 
Bob Olhsson's Avatar
 

FWIW a huge amount of outboard gear is not a very good idea from a marketing viewpoint because most of the leading engineers earn half of their income from renting gear to the projects they do.
Old 18th May 2003
  #5
Re: Where is the world's best outboard selection?

Quote:
Originally posted by jazzius
Just out of interest, i was wondering what is the best studio in the world outboard-wise?...

..i'm only talking about out-board....i don't care if they're mixing it thru a Behringer....

...i mean, are there any studios that have ALL the boutique pieces?....

......maybe some Arab oil-sheik home recordist?! .......any offers?

Define "ALL" of the boutique pieces. When you say boutique I assume you are talking about new?
Old 18th May 2003
  #6
Re: Re: Where is the world's best outboard selection?

Quote:
Originally posted by NathanEldred
Define "ALL" of the boutique pieces. When you say boutique I assume you are talking about new?
I always think of 'boutique' as the smaller companies that only offer one or two products. Design lead and sometimes hand assembled.
Another benchmark would be availability. If you look around Europe, it's not that easy to find a Lawson, Soundelux or Korby mic. No chance of finding an Atomic Squeezebox. You have to look hard to find Millennia, Little Labs, even Al Smart etc....
The phenomenon of engineers carrying their own outboard is more of an American thing I think. I'm talking a few years ago, but I was astonished by how bare US control rooms were when I first encountered them. In the UK, studios like Air and Abbey Road are fully kitted out and that is something most engineers check on when booking a room.
Things have changed over the last ten years though. Because of 'boutique' pieces, engineers and producers do turn up with their own racks, often to avoid not being able to find an unusual bit of outboard either at the studio or from the hire companies.
Old 18th May 2003
  #7
"FWIW a huge amount of outboard gear is not a very good idea from a marketing viewpoint because most of the leading engineers earn half of their income from renting gear to the projects they do."

I am not sure this goes on on a global scale....

But an interesting point.

Jules
Old 18th May 2003
  #8
Moderator emeritus
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Jules

I am not sure this goes on on a global scale....
It's definitely here, at least when budgets are decent. And the only engineer that comes to mind that isn't US based is Mutt Lange; I remember hearing that when he did the last album for Shania (not the newest one), he sent down a Ryder truck filled with gear... (I was at an AES party, and overheard the studio manager arranging to have someone at the studio to meet the truck.)
Old 18th May 2003
  #9
Lives for gear
 

For years I rented some of my gear to the projects I was mixing. I tried to be fair about it, and never had a complaint.

There was a good deal of I carried that I did not charge for, but the gear I rented to the projects was generally leading edge technical gear that saved us time, that was unavailable generally and that I was still paying for. Hence the lack of hassle about them paying for it.

For instance, way back before any DAW was capable of dealing with this, I got tired of waiting for rewind. I was mixing from Studer/Sony 48 tracks all day every day for months at a time.

So I bought 7 EMU Darwins (1 for spare) and 2 Otari UFC-24. I would SDIF from the 48 track to the Darwin's lightpipe, xfer the mix songs over to HD, then SDIF back to the 48 track, left on input. The HDs would play back through the 48 track converters, so that any recalls could be done directly from the 48 track if necessary. No more wind time and the addition of instant looping and nonlinear editing. Nobody was mixing in, or even from, a DAW at that time.

It saved a couple of hours every day, mixing and printing, and every client was perfectly happy to pay me $200-300 a day for the setup. Win/win.

But I would never charge a client for gear of mine that was duplicated by the studio we were working in. That just didn't seem right. But that may explain why some guys would really want all of their gear modded in some way. Then it's "special" and ........well you see the point.


Regards,
Brian T
Old 18th May 2003
  #10
Lives for gear
 
Roland's Avatar
Quote:
Originally posted by Dave Martin
It's definitely here, at least when budgets are decent. And the only engineer that comes to mind that isn't US based is Mutt Lange; I remember hearing that when he did the last album for Shania (not the newest one), he sent down a Ryder truck filled with gear... (I was at an AES party, and overheard the studio manager arranging to have someone at the studio to meet the truck.)
Yeah, but Mutt is on such a good screw that earning money off the gear is pretty irrelevant. Not only is he co-writting he has points deals on so many major classic albums together with his truly awsome fee's money is not really a problem for him.

All that being said he's a really nice guy to boot.


Regards


Roland
Old 28th May 2003
  #12
Moderator emeritus
 

Quote:
Originally posted by fox
or how about
http://www.sue-davis.net/mixsuite/index.html
It's nice, but Michael Wagener has more cool toys than that.
Old 28th May 2003
  #13
member no 666
 
Fletcher's Avatar
Quote:
Originally posted by Dave Martin
It's definitely here, at least when budgets are decent. And the only engineer that comes to mind that isn't US based is Mutt Lange
Mutt isn't an "engineer" per se... and don't forget that before they sold the Zomba group to the "Big Mean Germans" [BMG], the Zomba group owned Dreamhire... so between the tonnage of equipment the guy owns on a personal level... and the hire companies he owned on a corporate level [along with half a dozen or so commercial studios around the world]... I'd have to say he may qualify to be the world's biggest Gearslut!!!!
Old 28th May 2003
  #14
Moderator emeritus
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher
Mutt isn't an "engineer" per se... and don't forget that before they sold the Zomba group to the "Big Mean Germans" [BMG], the Zomba group owned Dreamhire... so between the tonnage of equipment the guy owns on a personal level... and the hire companies he owned on a corporate level [along with half a dozen or so commercial studios around the world]... I'd have to say he may qualify to be the world's biggest Gearslut!!!!
Excellent! I remember the picture from his home studio in Switzerland that was in Mix a couple of years ago; based on that alone, do you think he'd be interested in adopting me? I'd even say nice things about Shania's songs...
Old 28th May 2003
  #15
Quote:
Originally posted by Dave Martin
I'd even say nice things about Shania's songs...
OK Dave, now you've gone too far.

Even gearsluts have to have limits.

You crossed the line. That means you have to give me a cool toy.
Old 28th May 2003
  #16
Moderator emeritus
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Brad Blackwood
OK Dave, now you've gone too far.

Even gearsluts have to have limits.

You crossed the line. That means you have to give me a cool toy.
But Brad, THINK about the gear - there's very little that's over the line for that kind of haul; even my dignity and self respect would grow back eventually.
Old 29th May 2003
  #17
Lives for gear
 
dave-G's Avatar
Howbout this place?



It's really obscene when the outboard racks are stacked so high and wide that the gear effectively becomes the rear-wall diffusor!

Mr. Puig's room at Mr Sides' place must certainly be one of the sluttiest collections out there, no?

-dave
Old 29th May 2003
  #18
Quote:
Originally posted by dave-G
It's really obscene when the outboard racks are stacked so high and wide that the gear effectively becomes the rear-wall diffusor!
More of a reflector. And the mixes that come out of there tend to sound like it.

But still, it is fairly slutty...
Old 29th May 2003
  #19
Quote:
Originally posted by Dave Martin
But Brad, THINK about the gear - there's very little that's over the line for that kind of haul; even my dignity and self respect would grow back eventually.
Yeah, you're right. Not sure what I was thinking.


Oh yeah, I remember now. I love the gear, but Shania? Really? I think I'd rather take my chances robbing a bank...
Old 29th May 2003
  #20
Lives for gear
 
dave-G's Avatar
Quote:
Originally posted by Brad Blackwood
More of a reflector. And the mixes that come out of there tend to sound like it.
I suppose the knobs and meter-bezels don't stagger enough for a true quadratic diffusion effect.... Whatareyougonnado? I think I could find a way to live with it. heh

-dave

ps: As to the mixes that come out of there, the only ones I've actually scrutinized (listened to in my studio on my Klein + Hummels) were some of the mixes on the John Mayer record, which I found rather screechy, sibilant and otherwise unpleasantly congested in the upper mids. I suppose it goes to show once again, that it's entirely possible to make things sound bad, even with oodles of spectacular gear.
Old 29th May 2003
  #21
Moderator emeritus
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Brad Blackwood

Oh yeah, I remember now. I love the gear, but Shania? Really? I think I'd rather take my chances robbing a bank...
Look at it the right way and you'l be fine. Shania is in her own category; she doesn't do country records, and she doesn't do pop records - She does Shania records, and does them better than anyone else - despite the lame attempts made by some Nashville producers to duplicate her.

See?
Old 29th May 2003
  #22
Gear Addict
 
mdbeh's Avatar
 

That Barbarella getup at the Superbowl was beyond silly. But you're right--she is good at what she does.

I'd rather listen to Julie Miller, though.
Old 29th May 2003
  #23
Moderator emeritus
 

Quote:
Originally posted by mdbeh
That Barbarella getup at the Superbowl was beyond silly. But you're right--she is good at what she does.

I'd rather listen to Julie Miller, though.
I'd even rather listen to Julie Andrews...
"The hills are alive, with the sound of music..."
Old 29th May 2003
  #24
Lives for gear
 

ugh... Shania... sure, she creates Shania records, and then lip synchs them at the Super Bowl while looking like a somewhat healthier version of the Borg Queen with more hair. She pisses me off tremendously.

heh heh
Old 29th May 2003
  #25
Lives for gear
 
paterno's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Bob Olhsson
FWIW a huge amount of outboard gear is not a very good idea from a marketing viewpoint because most of the leading engineers earn half of their income from renting gear to the projects they do.
I bring a lot of stuff with me to sessions: outboard, guitar pedals, amps, instruments, etc., but the only thing I ever charge for is the ProTools rig [and I have the client pay the cartage to get the stuff there]. I have always felt that these are my tools to help me get my job done better, faster, and more efficiently. And most of it is stuff you won't find in a regular studio situation. For me, it would be like a mechanic charging me extra so he could use his tools.


Cheers,
john
Old 29th May 2003
  #26
Quote:
Originally posted by Dave Martin
Look at it the right way and you'l be fine. Shania is in her own category; she doesn't do country records, and she doesn't do pop records - She does Shania records, and does them better than anyone else - despite the lame attempts made by some Nashville producers to duplicate her.

See?
OK, that makes sense. I can rationalize that for the gear.

You're excused.

I still want the kewl toy, though...
Old 29th May 2003
  #27
Paterno - "For me, it would be like a mechanic charging me extra so he could use his tools." (Re charging for the outboard you bring to sessions....)

I agree 99% but probably, if I worked in a climate where producer managers were rat fink enough to earn me money from it I probably WOULD be doing it myself if I could get away from it, but it DOES seem a rip off...

Bands just seem to get fleeced these days in 'big budget' senarios from what I can tell...
Old 29th May 2003
  #28
Lives for gear
 
paterno's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Jules

I agree 99% but probably, if I worked in a climate where producer managers were rat fink enough to earn me money from it I probably WOULD be doing it myself if I could get away from it, but it DOES seem a rip off...

Bands just seem to get fleeced these days in 'big budget' senarios from what I can tell...
If I had a manager (I'm kinda ambivalent about the idea), I could see how the rental would offset my commision to him/her, but I think it is still a bit of a rip off in the end.

As far as ProTools goes, though, I see it as saving the band money in the end, because the band is not hiring an editor and a rig for the day, and I take on an extra 'job' in the process.

As far as the fleecing of the bands, I've seen it go both ways: they shoot themselves in the foot when they pay huge sums for one phase of the project [read: we'll record it cheap and get XYZ to mix it] and neglect the costs of the whole process. Or they are so cheap [fleecing their own record, so to speak] that they hord the advance and complain about the costs of getting the quality they are demanding on a daily basis. You know, the cost-quality-time triangle...

Cheers,
John
Old 29th May 2003
  #29
Moderator emeritus
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Brad Blackwood


I still want the kewl toy, though...
I understand. But you already have the kewl toy - the mastering version of the Ibis. And a cool logo.

And while I'm thinking about it, I think we're coming up to Memphis in the next couple or three weeks; got time for a tour? I promise I won't try to sneak out with any or YOUR kewl toys under my coat...
Old 30th May 2003
  #30
Motown legend
 
Bob Olhsson's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by paterno
... For me, it would be like a mechanic charging me extra so he could use his tools.
It comes down like this, there's a budget for an engineers's day rate, there's a budget for the studio's day rate and there's a budget for gear. A common strategy is holding one's day rate down in order to be competitive and then making up at least part of the difference in gear rental income because nobody's playing hard-ball on those rates like they are on the day rates.

Obviously an owner-operator studio is a completely different situation.
📝 Reply
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
🖨️ Show Printable Version
✉️ Email this Page
🔍 Search thread
♾️ Similar Threads
🎙️ View mentioned gear
Forum Jump
Forum Jump