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Lucas CS-1, let's talk
Old 29th June 2010
  #241
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Marcocet's Avatar
Sweet news. I'm number 107 (and 200) on the CS-1, plus 79 on the CS-4. Should have at least one of each before year end!
Old 29th June 2010
  #242
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Space Station's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyhavoc View Post

The first 100 CS-1's will finish delivery in the next couple of weeks.
So the first 100 CS-1's delivered by July 12th. We'll hold you to that. thumbsup
Old 29th June 2010
  #243
Gear nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcocet View Post
Sweet news. I'm number 107 (and 200) on the CS-1, plus 79 on the CS-4. Should have at least one of each before year end!
Hi Marc,

If all goes according to our plan, you should have all three before the end of the year.

But first we want to focus on getting the first 100 finished.

Sincerely,

Joe Hauck
EVP Sales and Marketing
AMI, Inc.
Old 10th July 2010
  #244
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Thread Starter
An update here from the OP. I have received my CS-1 #75 on Tuesday. Of course, I left for vacation on Wednesday and had no time to even turn it on . Oliver is great to talk to and I look forward to hearing the CS-1 next week.

By the way, the mic looks beautiful.
Old 13th July 2010
  #245
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Space Station's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyhavoc View Post
The first 100 CS-1's will finish delivery in the next couple of weeks.

So number 200 should be done before the end of the year. We're shooting for it to be done by the end of October.

Sincerely,

Joe Hauck
EVP Sales and Marketing
AMI, Inc.
So a couple of weeks has passed yesterday...first 100 delivered?
Old 13th July 2010
  #246
Gear nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Space Station View Post
So a couple of weeks has passed yesterday...first 100 delivered?
First 85 have been completed and tested. Five are in the final adjustment/burn-in/test phase. The folks from 90-100 are being contacted for final payments and confirmation of delivery details (voltage setting, shipping address, method of shipment, etc.).

Not completely done but close.

Joe Hauck
EVP Sales and Marketing
Lucas CS-X Project Manager
AMI, Inc.
Old 17th July 2010
  #247
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alexkemp's Avatar
 

hmm.

First session with CS-1 #76 doing some female vocals. Definitely not in love yet. The top seems a little unrealistic to me. True, I tend to like darker, almost syrupy sounds... But there's something to this mic that at first glance seems like its on the verge of distortion on all the time. And the 'air' has a sizzling quality to it. I kept looking at the meters to make sure I wasn't distorting, but the record levels were moderate.

Here's the same performance captured by the CS-1 and a Soundelux e47c. The CS-1 is in cardioid. The singer is about 10" away from the mics, using a standard pop screen. Both recorded through Shadow Hills preamps with the gain at 5 on nickel output transformer, into an AD16x.

I'm interested to hear your opinions. When I was trying to fit this vocal over a fairly full mix it started to disappear much more quickly than the soundelux version.
Attached Files
File Type: zip cs-1_ref_files.zip (5.68 MB, 93 views)
Old 17th July 2010
  #248
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RoundBadge's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexkemp View Post
First session with CS-1 #76 doing some female vocals. Definitely not in love yet. The top seems a little unrealistic to me. .
try backing off even more.try every pattern.that might help
had a CS 1 up on a female vocal.about two feet away, but it was a bit too bright/essy for her voice.switched to a C12.
using them for various sources I realized they weren't quite what I needed ..especially for drum overheads.

they are not of the meaty midrange Neumann camp.
I guess thats what the CS4 is for?
they were beautiful on some piano tracks and room ambience for some jazzy stuff.
Old 17th July 2010
  #249
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Space Station's Avatar
I had a quick listen on Beyer DT-150 headphones...to be honest I heard distortion on both mic tracks...also what sounded like a weird autotune artifact at 0.08.. I don't think the example is good enough to make a worthwhile judgement. Needs some properly sung lyrics.
Old 17th July 2010
  #250
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alexkemp's Avatar
 

roundbadge: thanks for the tips, I def. will try more. Again, these were first impressions while cranking out some bv's for a tv spot. Have to work fast!!

Spacestation: no, no autotune, just the foibles of the human voice! She just have a very 'dusty, smokey' quality to her voice though, and she'd been singing for a while that day before she worked with me, so some of that 'distortion' may be tired vocal chords.
Old 17th July 2010
  #251
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Space Station's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexkemp View Post
Spacestation: no, no autotune, just the foibles of the human voice! She just have a very 'dusty, smokey' quality to her voice though, and she'd been singing for a while that day before she worked with me, so some of that 'distortion' may be tired vocal chords.
ha...cool..but no I definitely hear distortion on the tracks..not vocal chord distortion.
Old 18th July 2010
  #252
Gear interested
 

humans make noise

Quote:
Originally Posted by alexkemp View Post
First session with CS-1 #76 doing some female vocals. Definitely not in love yet. The top seems a little unrealistic to me. True, I tend to like darker, almost syrupy sounds... But there's something to this mic that at first glance seems like its on the verge of distortion on all the time. And the 'air' has a sizzling quality to it. I kept looking at the meters to make sure I wasn't distorting, but the record levels were moderate.

Here's the same performance captured by the CS-1 and a Soundelux e47c. The CS-1 is in cardioid. The singer is about 10" away from the mics, using a standard pop screen. Both recorded through Shadow Hills preamps with the gain at 5 on nickel output transformer, into an AD16x.

I'm interested to hear your opinions. When I was trying to fit this vocal over a fairly full mix it started to disappear much more quickly than the soundelux version.

Yes, there may be some (harmonic) distortion on both clips, but I don't think that's the main issue here. There are a lot of overtones in the singer's voice as well as throat/air noise that combined can sound a bit weird. Since the CS1 is a much brighter mic, these unpleasant sounds are obviously more accentuated than with the E47. But I guess EQing the 47 for a modern sounding mix might result pretty much in what the CS1 already sounds like...

I don't own a CS1 but have listened to most of the clips posted here and over at PSW. Judging from that, I don't believe the CS1's main strenght is lead vocals (unless we're thinking classical). If you want a cleaner and softer sound for the CS1, maybe try a different pre (or the discrete setting on the SH-pre) and go one tick towards omni on the CS1.. maybe that helps.
Old 18th July 2010
  #253
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As already mentioned, don't miss out on the other polar patterns for vocals. I've found that full on figure 8 can really tame the high end when needed and bring the mids out in a very nice way; maybe just the syrup you're looking for.
Old 18th July 2010
  #254
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thanks all for chiming in.

definitely need to properly put the mic through its paces, this was merely a 'first date.' (And trust me, I picked up the tab- we didn't go dutch).

As far as mic pre's go, I quickly tried the mic through an Inward Connections 820, a LaChapell 583e and then the Shadow Hills. I heard that somewhat euphonic distortion on all three (which is why I ended up staying away from a tube pre for the recording).

FWIW those files were exported, not bounced, so they should represent exactly what went into the rig after the apogee converter.

Going to try it as a mono room mic on drums on monday morning. I'll let you know how it goes!
Old 20th July 2010
  #255
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Sui_City's Avatar
 

Lucas CS-1, let's talk

It's Tuesday.
Old 20th July 2010
  #256
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WunderBro Flo's Avatar
To me the vocal clips sound exactly what I would expect when setting up a CK12 capsule type of mic next to a U47 type of mic. The 47 sounds midforward with a lean bass and medium highs whereas the CS1 sounds midscooped in comparison which makes the bass and highs pop out. Two pretty opposite camps, none is better or worse, both have their applications. I´d choose the E47 when I want the voice to sound "in" the mix at a distance and the CS1 when I want it closer, more in front of the music than tucked in.
Rock on!
Pat

ps - I do not think there is distortion from the gear, it sounds like the artifacts of her voice to me.
Old 21st July 2010
  #257
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alexkemp's Avatar
 

mono room mic on kit

here's the CS-1 as a mono room mic. Very sparkly, a little scooped in the 750-1kHz zone. Smooth down below.

The mic was about six feet back from the kit in a medium sized around (24 x 16 or so) and it was recorded through a LaChapell 583e with no EQ straight into an AD16x.

I have thoughts, but I'd like to hear yours!
Attached Files
File Type: aif Mono-08.aif (3.98 MB, 128 views)
Old 21st July 2010
  #258
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Not crazy about the sound of the kit or the room. How unhelpful is that? I suppose I apologize but I would say that it gets in the way of my commenting on the mic.
Old 21st July 2010
  #259
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syra's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexkemp View Post
The top seems a little unrealistic to me. True, I tend to like darker, almost syrupy sounds... But there's something to this mic that at first glance seems like its on the verge of distortion on all the time. And the 'air' has a sizzling quality to it.
What are you talking about?! Your observations don't make any sense. Either your source is bad or the mic placement is totally wrong.


Old 21st July 2010
  #260
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RoundBadge's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by syra View Post
What are you talking about?! Your observations don't make any sense. Either your source is bad or the mic placement is totally wrong.


hehheh
Old 21st July 2010
  #261
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alexkemp's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by syra View Post
What are you talking about?! Your observations don't make any sense. Either your source is bad or the mic placement is totally wrong.


Hmm. Ok. Thanks for chiming in. I'm trying to say that the very top end of the frequencies that mic is reproducing seem a little forward or exaggerated to me, and that it may be a matter of taste because I prefer sounds/mics that run in neutral-to-dark territory. A C-12 (for instance) is a great mic to a lot of people, but I don't own one because they don't work for my tastes.

Is that any clearer? Either way, to each his/her own.
Old 21st July 2010
  #262
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dbjp's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by alexkemp View Post
Hmm. Ok. Thanks for chiming in. I'm trying to say that the very top end of the frequencies that mic is reproducing seem a little forward or exaggerated to me, and that it may be a matter of taste because I prefer sounds/mics that run in neutral-to-dark territory. A C-12 (for instance) is a great mic to a lot of people, but I don't own one because they don't work for my tastes.

Is that any clearer? Either way, to each his/her own.
Don't worry about it. Syra's just being sarcastic due to the amount of abuse he got from the CS1 brigade when he criticized the CS1.
He's probably actually happy to see someone that agrees with him!
Old 21st July 2010
  #263
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RoundBadge's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexkemp View Post
Hmm. Ok. Thanks for chiming in. I'm trying to say that the very top end of the frequencies that mic is reproducing seem a little forward or exaggerated to me, and that it may be a matter of taste because I prefer sounds/mics that run in neutral-to-dark territory. A C-12 (for instance) is a great mic to a lot of people, but I don't own one because they don't work for my tastes.

Is that any clearer? Either way, to each his/her own.
Yeah he's just havin a little fun.
seems anyone who doesn't freak/cream over the Cs1 gets flack..lol
Old 21st July 2010
  #264
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bigbone's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by RoundBadge View Post
Yeah he's just havin a little fun.
seems anyone who doesn't freak/cream over the Cs1 gets flack..lol
I wonder why...........
Old 21st July 2010
  #265
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syra's Avatar
heh

As RB and dbjp said I'm just having a little fun. Regarding your observations... I couldn't have said it better myself. Bingo!
Old 21st July 2010
  #266
Gear interested
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by alexkemp View Post
here's the CS-1 as a mono room mic. Very sparkly, a little scooped in the 750-1kHz zone. Smooth down below.

The mic was about six feet back from the kit in a medium sized around (24 x 16 or so) and it was recorded through a LaChapell 583e with no EQ straight into an AD16x.

I have thoughts, but I'd like to hear yours!

Sounds very realistic to me, maybe a bit too realistic. I had to use a bit of EQ (which it took very well) and a lot of compression to make it sound usable. But everything's there and it's quite easy to sculpt a punchy sound from this not very exciting recording, even without bringing any nasty frequencies up (well, the hihat is always a bit of a problem, but that's another story...).
So, not a big surprise here, apart from the file being 48kHz...
Old 21st July 2010
  #267
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RoundBadge's Avatar
I think some guys[not necessarily you Alex] buying these mic's w/ out hearing first expecting some sort of holy grail.
they are simply put,a unique/different recording tool for the locker.
they won't replace my 67' 47's C12's etc.
Old 21st July 2010
  #268
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Space Station's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexkemp View Post
I prefer sounds/mics that run in neutral-to-dark territory. A C-12 (for instance) is a great mic to a lot of people, but I don't own one because they don't work for my tastes.
With that in mind I wonder what made you purchase a CS-1?
Old 21st July 2010
  #269
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RoundBadge's Avatar
Yeah if you like the darker sounds, the CS might not be the right mic for you
Old 22nd July 2010
  #270
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alexkemp's Avatar
 

I bought the mic based on discussions with Terry about the design philosophy, and based on both Terry and Oliver's reputations.

I also have an adventurous spirit!

And I am looking for another flavor of LDC besides the 47 clone/derivative group.

And also, FWIW, it takes me a while to learn a piece of gear-- its not just about a single EQ graph, its about how it works 'over time,' how it sits in the mix, how it reacts to different SPL's and spaces, and whether it helps me get the most out of performers. That last one is important-- the performance is what I'm after, the mic should inspire as well as capture.

So I'm not slagging or praising. I'm just feeling this mic out, see if it helps me do what I need to do. There's no doubt its a good microphone, beautifully made, with a point of view and an sense of purpose to its design. Now its a question of whether it and I are a good match.

ok that was far too level headed for GS. I feel the need to just start slaggin' on someone or something straight away!
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