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neve gear is over-rated!!!
Old 7th December 2008
  #31
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by drtechno View Post
there is a little bit more that goes into making one of those boards....

its not really the game of "make pc boards and stuff it with parts" its more of "finding parts that work together and match componates across channels that really make the sonic difference"

now time factor does pay a role in manufacturing. man hours in assembly and quality control are much higher than the mass produced Allen and Heath, Midas, and others (behringer, makie, carvin, alto).

I think the only other board that does have just as much production overhead cost is the Toft Audio. I have wondered if anyone has A/B a Neve console against a Toft ATB console (remake of series 80 Trident)?
It would surpeise me if Alan has. He's a pretty on top of it guy.

I'll be on his phone for an A Range box as soon as there is one around.
Old 7th December 2008
  #32
Gear Guru
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia View Post
What's all the fuss about talent? It's completely over-rated.

I'm putting out a CD collection this fall of all the best and worst engineers in the business mixing the same song.

You'll notice that the difference is more subtle than you would think...

in fact, it is rumored that some of the mixes null 100%
Old 7th December 2008
  #33
Lives for gear
 
dualflip's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jjblair View Post
When I bought my 1073s, they were foir the outrageous prive of $2,000 each. $2,000? Are you kidding me? They were just $1,800 two months ago? Now I wish I could buy them for $2,000 each.

And I've got to tell you, I don't like when Vintage King and other people recap them. I've talked to many techs who all believe that part of the sound of a vintage Neve is the age of the caps. I have a couple of Shep SN8s, and while the mic pre is spot on with the 1073s, the EQ doesn't get that pleasant distortion. It's too clean. I think that's where the old caps come in. Any techs here disagree with that?

Part of buying old Neve gear, old Neumann mics or old Stratocasters is that it's like buying real estate. It will only go up in value. And we are so spoiled in this profession that some of our tools actually appreciate in value. That's what I hate about every time I sink money into something digital. And do you think a guy who drops a hundred grand in his wood shop is going to see the value of that stuff go up?
I agree with you that the original caps give Neve its own unique sound, but maaan, caps last like 15 years, after that they start to make a lot of noise or they create short circuits, so i prefeer changing the caps.
Old 7th December 2008
  #34
Gear Head
 
Rev. JimBo's Avatar
 

Wouldn't dream of tracking drums without Neve 1084's
And I am glad they cost so much --- anything worth doing is worth going
bankrupt for . If you're not up for that then stay home with the " Women Folk"
And guys be sure to put your Recapped Neves into an Industrial Microwave
to age the caps ---- very clever ---
--- I and the rest of your competition want you to suck and it bothers us that you have Neve Channels -- lets be honest .
As far as those old consoles full of 1073's and 1084's -- they suck for mixdown--- best to part them all out .
Old 7th December 2008
  #35
Deleted User
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rev. JimBo View Post
As far as those old consoles full of 1073's and 1084's -- they suck for mixdown--- best to part them all out .
I use an 8068 full of 1084's (31102) everday and it's perfect for mixdown.
Rick Rubin, Daniel Lanois, Rich Costey, Dave Sardy etc... seem to mix alright on these consoles..

Can't beat the headroom on these babies..
Old 8th December 2008
  #36
Gear Head
 
Rev. JimBo's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul EQ View Post
I use an 8068 full of 1084's (31102) everday and it's perfect for mixdown.
Rick Rubin, Daniel Lanois, Rich Costey, Dave Sardy etc... seem to mix alright on these consoles..

Can't beat the headroom on these babies..
Probably just my lack of talent but for my tin ears it was always best to track on an old Neve and mix on something else . Unless it is any model SSL which I always felt sucked even tho they became the industry standard for mixing against a lot of folks better judgment at the time . The explanation I was given for that happening had a name and it was " Mutt Lange ". So anyone care to take me to task on this opinion ? And yes I know that billions of records were sold mixed on the SSL and that even God himself still mixes on a 9000 which they discontinued therefore evoking God's wrath thus the current economic condition of the world .
The best combination I ever arrived at was tracking with 1084's & 1073's with some Demeter Pres
here and there --- then taking it to a Neotek Elite Room for final dubs and mix down .
But I am sure that no two of those old Neve desks are still alike so perhaps I haven't stumbled upon the right one . But I think I did try to look in all the right places but I didn't see Rick hanging out at the time so I guess I wasn't at a place with the Real Deal . Maybe they should have tried putting their Desks in an Industrial Microwave ( see prior post concerning aging the caps on this thread ) --- yeah that's the trick -- old worn out leaking capacitors .
But what I was getting at was " part them out " -- make more of the preamps/Eqs available .
And for God's sake --- recap them --- he's pissed off enough already .
And just remember -- it all ends up on Mp3 that no one pays for --- so what does it really matter anymore ?
Old 8th December 2008
  #37
Lives for gear
 
memphisindie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by RoundBadge View Post
That's happened ..
a guy about 11[the height of smackie mixer hype] years ago was hired to do an installation at a church..
they wanted a newer, more flexible sytsem..
Went to the place and found a mint condition BCM 10 and some old funky speakers/amps..
Put in a Mackie 8 buss,crest amps,JBL's ..they could'nt be happier..
took away that heavy old antique mixer as a favor..

I'm not hatin on you, but, that is about one of the most dishonest things I've ever heard of other than the guy who took 6 KM84's out of a church in the same manner. You should have told them what they were worth so they could have made an informed decision about what to do with THEIR MONEY they could have used it to buy more stuff, or you could have offered them money. Taking it away as a favor is THEFT, don't fool yourself into thinking you're clever, you aren't. That's very dishonest business.
Sorry. That just really hit me wrong. Someone was bragging about that in my face a few months ago, I got them too.
Old 8th December 2008
  #38
Lives for gear
 

Think about this....

In 1992 I was considering taking on a silent partner who would buy out my existing partner.
He was bringing in enough extra cash to buy a Neve 8608 mkII I was looking at.
The asking price?
$65K

I was also considering a Neve BCM10... $10K.

Two years earlier another friend bought a short-loaded (24 channel) 8058.
The price?
$18K

I was thinking, "That's too much money."
What?
Old 8th December 2008
  #39
Gear Guru
 
AllAboutTone's Avatar
 

Mixed feelings on overrated Neve gear, however i think the clones are somewhat, Neve can be to soft for some things. I'm leaning more toward clean preamps the more im around them.
Old 8th December 2008
  #40
Gear Maniac
 
BIGT-1's Avatar
 

I definitely think that Neve gear is overrated. It's been rated for years and years by countless engineers. I think we have a consensus that it's great. No more rating. Stop.
Old 8th December 2008
  #41
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjblair View Post
When I bought my 1073s, they were foir the outrageous prive of $2,000 each. $2,000? Are you kidding me? They were just $1,800 two months ago? Now I wish I could buy them for $2,000 each.

And I've got to tell you, I don't like when Vintage King and other people recap them. I've talked to many techs who all believe that part of the sound of a vintage Neve is the age of the caps. I have a couple of Shep SN8s, and while the mic pre is spot on with the 1073s, the EQ doesn't get that pleasant distortion. It's too clean. I think that's where the old caps come in. Any techs here disagree with that?
i'm no tech and only have old 1073/84s and 1272s, so i can't comment on the sound of the new ones; but when 8068/78s were new, plenty of good records were recorded on them weren't they? i frankly can't see why the AMS stuff shouldn't be just as good as the vintage modules if the parts are the same (including the carnhill transformers, which are supposed to spec out like the old ones from what i've heard).

again, i haven't A/Bd so i can't comment on the sound of the new ones but if i were buying now and wanted the neve thing i for one wouldn't hesitate to get the new stuff which i still think is overpriced but at least it's not going for $7>8K a channel.

Quote:
Part of buying old Neve gear, old Neumann mics or old Stratocasters is that it's like buying real estate. It will only go up in value. And we are so spoiled in this profession that some of our tools actually appreciate in value. That's what I hate about every time I sink money into something digital. And do you think a guy who drops a hundred grand in his wood shop is going to see the value of that stuff go up?
thumbsup

for this reason the old stuff is starting to be considered an 'investment'. vintage gear is now going at collectors' prices. a working musician would never grab a '69 les paul and take i to the club. do old strats and les pauls sound better than the new ones? i doubt it.

i really can't see pultecs and the like going up much more, but i said that when EQP1As were at $3500 so anything's possible i guess.
Old 8th December 2008
  #42
Lives for gear
 
tamasdragon's Avatar
 

I think it's not overrated nor overpriced. It depends on what you want. Buy something so-so for a few years, or buy some top for 30 or more years.
Tamas Dragon
Old 8th December 2008
  #43
Lives for gear
 

I have a really nice BCM-10 for sale in Australia, fully flight cased with a breakout rack custom made by the Audio Toystore for individual channel outs with 10 genuine Neve line amps inside the rack. 6 x 1066's and 4 x 1073's in the console. Second rack case has 2 genuine Neve PSU's, (1 main, 1 spare) and a phantom supply.

Probably in the wrong place, but topical I guess... been waiting for the dollar to be more favorable to sell.

http://moonpony.net/neve/neve1.JPG
http://moonpony.net/neve/neve2.JPG
http://moonpony.net/neve/neve3.JPG
Old 14th December 2008
  #44
Gear Maniac
 

Neve preamps are over rated..okay?, just like the albums that have been

recorded with them! Just bought a 4081(1081X4) AMS NEVE pre's and they sound

great @$3225.00 US that's $806.25 a channel.It's a good deal for these pre's.

+ added features.


TT
Old 14th December 2008
  #45
Lives for gear
 
Geoff_T's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dbbubba View Post
Think about this....

In 1992 I was considering taking on a silent partner who would buy out my existing partner.
He was bringing in enough extra cash to buy a Neve 8608 mkII I was looking at.
The asking price?
$65K

I was also considering a Neve BCM10... $10K.

Two years earlier another friend bought a short-loaded (24 channel) 8058.
The price?
$18K

I was thinking, "That's too much money."
What?
Hi

Back in the old days, like 15 - 20 years ago, TV, Radio and Film companies wrote off the value of their Neve consoles and I know for a fact that consoles full of 1073's were sold to dealers for around 2,000 UK pounds (with a little palm greasing I expect).

They were then put on the market for 10 or more times that price.

That's was the Golden Goose Age when dealers/brokers could make a killing.

It's not so easy now.....
Old 14th December 2008
  #46
Gear Head
 

I manage a room in which we have a TON of outboard, inner machine studios, including a Neve BCM10 console with (10) 1073s in it. It is one of the few pieces of gear I couldn't live without. The new NEVE reissues are like 4k a piece, but are worth every penny.
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