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E47-E49-E47-E49-E47-E49-E47-E49...
Old 19th July 2005
  #1
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SparkyCanada's Avatar
E47-E49-E47-E49-E47-E49-E47-E49...

Hey there.

Well - I think I've narrowed my search for a new mic down to the Soundelux E47 or the E49.

I'm the guy who had the probelms with a local studio & their U67. I wasn't sure if I wanted to rent a mic from somewhere in the world - or take off to another studio to do my vocal tracks. After a bit of humming & hawing - I decided I should just spend the cash & get myself a reasonable microphone.

So now it's down to these 2 mics.

I've done the searches here on GS as well as Klause Heine's Mic Lab & just a general Google search & spent hours reading reviews & threads. Each time I read something - my mic choice changes. Then just when I think I know what I want - someone says - "Hey - what about a U99?" aaaaagggghhhhhh....

My current vocal mic at home is a Neumann TLM 193. It's not the best - but it was the best I could afford when I bought the thing - when they came out. It's served me well over the years.

I'll be running this thing into my new Great River MP2NV (thanks Mercenary!).

My primary use for this mic is vocals. I sing stuff like James Taylor, Elton John etc., nothing too edgy.

I think my voice needs a bit of body - and am looking for mic that might help me with this.

As an afterthought - it would be nice if this mic could serve double duty as an acoustic guitar mic or general room mic - but I really want it to shine as a vocal mic first.

So this has to be my final appeal for info - if I keep putting this purchase off - I may get too old to remember the lyrics to my tunes - or even remember why I need a microphone at all... heh

Thanks,

SparkyCanada
Old 19th July 2005
  #2
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DigitMus's Avatar
 

You already know the answer, of course - get 'em both in the studio and see which one trips your trigger! Personally, I chose both, that's why the credit card companies love me.

Scott
Old 19th July 2005
  #3
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jjblair's Avatar
Between those two, I'd choose the E49. However, I think you'd like the Brauner Valvet more on vocals and acoustic.
Old 19th July 2005
  #4
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SparkyCanada's Avatar
Thanks for the replies - I was just on the Soundelux site (again).

Yeah - I'd be afraid to bring both in to my studio - 'cause sure as hell I'd like something in each of them - and I'd want both of them....and then I'd have to figure out how to pay for my next meals for the next couple of months ...

That Brauner name keeps resurfacing - why not - this wasn't supposed to be straight forward... - I better take a look at the Brauner site (again). I did a quick look at the Mercenary site & they just seem to have 1 Brauner on the site at this time.

Thanks,

SparkyCanada
Old 19th July 2005
  #5
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themaidsroom's Avatar
 

i'd say its really about the upper transients / high frequencies in your voice ..........
if they need taming or rounding - if you would find yourself cutting highs or
high mids , go with the e47..........


- jack
Old 19th July 2005
  #6
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SparkyCanada's Avatar
Can't really say I need to cut highs - just moreso add some body...


SparkyCanada
Old 19th July 2005
  #8
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Ruudman's Avatar
 

You may want to check out MicrotechGefell (UM92.1s, UM75)

Also at Mercenary, I believe..




ruudman
Old 19th July 2005
  #9
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Zarathustra's Avatar
 

If you're singing rock, the e47 is the clear choice, it's got BIG BALLS.
The e49 sounds timid in comparison, sort of like an e47 before puberty.

Z
Old 19th July 2005
  #10
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I had the same dilema. Had em both sent over and neither left...

They each have their strengths, and they're both great vocal mics (albeit for different vocalists). Timid is not an adjective that I'd use to describe the E49.
Old 19th July 2005
  #11
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SparkyCanada's Avatar
Jan:

Would you mind elaborating on the different strengths?...

For a second I was ready to drop the cash on the E47 - then you came along... heh

Thanks,

SparkyCanada
Old 19th July 2005
  #12
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SparkyCanada's Avatar
Mind you - my first instinct was to go with the E49....

SparkyCanada
Old 19th July 2005
  #13
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Jose Mrochek's Avatar
 

Just on reading alone (never heard the e47 or e49) purely on instinct, I would go for the e47.

Was this a helpful reply or what ? hahaha.. (I mean it though)
Old 19th July 2005
  #14
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The 47 had a strong midrange presence, while the 49 has a more natural sound with a very nice top end. You're not going to find one mic that will suit all vocalists (I've got lotsa mics and I'm looking at getting more). If you're looking for a mic for a specific vocalists than you should get a bunch of different mics into your room with your vocalist and choose the one that's best suited.

Even then, you'll find that the material may dictate a change in mic even with the same singer. This is one of the reasons why pro studios have large mic collections. Your 193 and either of these choices will make a good start.
Old 19th July 2005
  #15
Lek
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Lek's Avatar
 

Sparky, dumb question but, have you actually tried either? I was looking for exactly what you are - primarily vocals but also acoustic guitar.
I did hours of research on the forums, and website.

I decided on an E47, found someone selling one secondhand here on the gearslutz classifieds for a good price. Somehow slipped through my fingers even though I pm'd first.

Then I went to a studio and compared all the soundelux mics, a couple gefells and others.
Thank god I didn't buy that E47 (sounded honky/boxy on my voice and on acoustic guitar).

Ended up falling in love with the E250 (for vocals and acoustic) and ended up getting that.

Not that it will work for you, but you should definitely try them out for yourself and stop reading (which I did and is great for initial information)
Old 19th July 2005
  #16
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oceantracks's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jan Folkson
The 47 had a strong midrange presence, while the 49 has a more natural sound with a very nice top end. You're not going to find one mic that will suit all vocalists (I've got lotsa mics and I'm looking at getting more). If you're looking for a mic for a specific vocalists than you should get a bunch of different mics into your room with your vocalist and choose the one that's best suited.

Even then, you'll find that the material may dictate a change in mic even with the same singer. This is one of the reasons why pro studios have large mic collections. Your 193 and either of these choices will make a good start.

I would have to disagree about needing a bunch of mics for ONE singer.

I am always amazed when I listen to the differences in sound of The Beatles voices throughout their career....you listen to some early stuff, and then later material, and realize that 99.9 per cent of the time they were singing through the same mics in the same studio (U47/48) it shows you how versatile one good mic can be, despite varying material.

TH
Old 19th July 2005
  #17
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Jose Mrochek's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gp71

Not that it will work for you, but you should definitely try them out for yourself and stop reading (which I did and is great for initial information)
this is a good point. I always had to buy gear based on instinct and reports, because in Bolivia.. finding a 57 can be hard. (no kidding)

If you are in Canada, and you can rent these things, or demo them before that.. by all means I think you should do it before droping 3k + on a mic : )
Old 19th July 2005
  #18
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larry zip's Avatar
 

we tried the brauner mics when we were mic shopping last month. the valvet and the vm-1 not the khe but the switchable one both sounded really hard ane bittle wiht no personality we ended up wtih the horch mic and a coles 4040. of the soundelux mics we tried the m49 was the best of them we tried the 47 the 250 and the 49 but in the end the horch was better sounding on every vocie we tried it
Old 19th July 2005
  #19
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Actually, Canada might just as well be Bolivia in many cases ... for pro audio ...

I can attest that to rent is not possible 99% of the time up here (unless you are in Toronto - even then )-: )... and to demo two means buying two and paying 15% tax and broker fees at the border - then sending one back and trying to get the taxes back (shipping and brokers fees will not be refundable)... very very time consuming and costly since the taxes on ONE $4000 mic is $600+ bucks.

All major things to consider for Canadians ... thats why Neil, Joni and Robbie moved south ... it wasn't for the weather (-;

jls.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jose Mrochek
this is a good point. I always had to buy gear based on instinct and reports, because in Bolivia.. finding a 57 can be hard. (no kidding)

If you are in Canada, and you can rent these things, or demo them before that.. by all means I think you should do it before droping 3k + on a mic : )
Old 19th July 2005
  #20
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mtstudios@charter's Avatar
 

Own an E47, love it most the time. Have used the 193, great mic for the money.
I have bought gear (mics) that I been disapointed with later in applications, especially when it has not been on the market for decades and thoroughly tested. Old Neumanns and other industry standards come with a high price, so sometimes we save a little and purchase the newer gear and end up regretting it later, or loving it. I have done that with foot pedals, compressors, mics, ect. In general I always like the old stuff. An E47 does not sound like the Neumanns U47's I have used, and if I were to sell an E47 today, I would not get what I paid for it, unlike the vintage Neumann. Whatever you purchase E47 or E49, Soundeluxe is a great company, and you can tell they have a high standard when building Microphones, so I don't think you can go wrong there.

The key of a song or register one sings can dictate whether you like or dislike the sound of a Microphone. Also what you run it through, settings. That being said, it might take several weeks, months of usage before you can honestly have an opinion. Good luck!


www.bluethumbproductions.com
Old 19th July 2005
  #21
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SparkyCanada's Avatar
Yeah - shipping/duty/brokerage fees & whatever other fees that creep up really slow a guy like me down in terms of trying to get a bunch of different mics up here to try out.

Plus - living in the prairies - there are not a lot of high end studios around - for me to access to try out existing inventory.

Thanks for everyones assistance so far - your opinions are valuable and appreciated.

BTW - I'm now back to the E49 (for now...)

SparkyCanada
Old 19th July 2005
  #22
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Jose Mrochek's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by SparkyCanada

Thanks for everyones assistance so far - your opinions are valuable and appreciated.

BTW - I'm now back to the E49 (for now...)

SparkyCanada
Again, only from reading .. I don't think you will go wrong with any of these mics. If I had the cash I would probably get one of these blindfolded cause nobody I recall said they suck. : ) Good luck!
Old 20th July 2005
  #23
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scott petito's Avatar
 

I have the e47 I have mixed feelings about it... it can be the best mic in some situations but it can down right suck on other voices... I can't say that about 90% of my other go to vocal choices... for example my 67 's almost alway sound great and they never sound bad ... same with my 87's kiwi's etc..where as the e47 can sound just awful on some singers....I think this is the most hit or miss mic I have ever used...... and a really weird thing I have noticed...I am really bugged by the sound of breath on the e47... it sounds very harsh even when the vocal itself sounds good...very odd mid boost i think...I actually think it might be more versatile as a percussion and acoustic guitar mic much more forgiving and often the best choice... so it's an oddball for me.. I would not reccommend it as someones only vocal mic....

cheers
SP
Old 20th July 2005
  #24
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I've experienced that with lots of mics Scott. Recently I had an artist (alto player) come in and I put up my royer 122. Usually love it on alto...it sounded thin and bad for lack of a better term. Moved it around, checked pre, cable etc, still no good. So I put up my E49 on the exact same signal chain and it sounded wonderful. The 122 sounded amazing on trumpet the next day.

I can't tell you how many times I've taken down great mics because they weren't right for a particular singer, on a particular song on a particular day. I'd agree that 67's usually sound pretty great, but I've taken em down too.

I've had pretty good experiences with my E47, it wins some it loses some.

If you haven't done so, I'd suggest taking it out of cardiod only mode. The tone of the mic changes pretty significantly when you change the pattern.
Old 20th July 2005
  #25
Gear Maniac
 

I was not in a position to audition mics because of availabliity in my area. Like you, I was dissappointed in the results from a local studio for tracking vocals.

For the first time from my home studio, I started on a project with the goal of master quality- competitive sounding product. I am working with top notch singers from a nearby music consevatory (very well known), in order to complete the project. I plan to travel to Nashville to mix to get all the outboard goodies I don't have, so what I need to do is get the tracking right. I do most instruments Midi, GIGA etc. So all i really need to get recorded right is the vocals.

So, I went to work building an area in the room reflection free for setting up the vocal mic. Moved all the computers to another room, then went searching for a couple of good mics, pres, and a top notch converter. Picked up a Rosetta 200, a great river pre with 4-5K left to buy mics.

After reading and reading I settled on a Brauner Valvet and AEA R84 to use with the great river pre. Thought that would give me some variety. I had a Rode NTK that I put a NOS tube in ...and it sounds OK for some things but certainly not great.

So, I called one of the music sellers who carries both the Brauner mics and the AEA. I asked to talk to someone who knew mics. They put the fellow on the phone and we began to discuss what I was doing. I told him my budget was 4-5K. You can buy a lot of mic for that money. We talked, and talked. He finally said to try either a rebuilt U87 (vintage modified) or a Soundelux U99. He told me they would be the most versatile mics for a varity of vocalists.

I never really liked U87 for my voice so I had a negative feeling about the U87. I know it is a widely used mic. Long and short of it is a bought the U99 (less than 3K).

The results: The great river pre adds much color the more input gain you dial in. Without much gain on the pre, the U99 kicked ass on a male vocalist tenor (very gutsy voice) This guy is a really good singer, and the recording seemed to capture what he sounded like without a mic.

I used it on some female singers and did not think the mic was great for them. It was OK though. For one female who was a bit thin sounding, I pumped up the input on the great river and got more fullness from the mic. But it did not sound great. I'm tying to deside now if its the vocalist and not the mic.

Anyway. this guy I bought the mic from was a retailer and I told him my budget. I also told him that my favorite mic for vox in the past was a C12. He could have taken 5K off of me. But he did not. He also said I could send the mic back if I didn't like it.

I'm going to keep it. U99 Soundelux for gutsy male tenor with GR pre-very good sound!

Santo
Old 20th July 2005
  #26
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SparkyCanada's Avatar
Santo:

Hey there.

Who did you talk to & at which store? If the guy you spoke to is still in the business - I'd sure like to talk to him - maybe he can help me sort this out.

This is a lot of money for me to drop on a mic - and I'm the kind of guy who likes to do his research so that when it comes time to cut the cheque - the odds are in my favour that it is a good decision.

Thanks,

SparkyCanada
Old 20th July 2005
  #27
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jjblair's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by larry zip
we tried the brauner mics when we were mic shopping last month. the valvet and the vm-1 not the khe but the switchable one both sounded really hard ane bittle wiht no personality
Larry, not only was that not my experience at all, you are the only person I have ever heard say that. I personally found the Valvet to be very silky.
Old 20th July 2005
  #28
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scott petito's Avatar
 

hey Jan

yeah I agree with everything you said...no one mic is the best solution for every vocal...i think the odd thing about the e47 for me is the extremes...I've never experienced this with a good u47 or 251... they are not always the best mi cfor the job but it rarely flat out sucks....don't get me wrong I've changed out a mic and I don't care whos name is on it but if I had to I could have in almost all instances gotten a usable vocal I just can't say that about the e47...and although i mostly agree with william wittman about the optimal preamp/mic combo thing...(except maybe with ribbons) the e47 does some weird things with certain pres... just an observation.. i do like the mic, but i would not want be on the proverbial desert island with it alone ....

cheers
SP
ps I have used the other patterns helps in some situations...
Old 20th July 2005
  #29
Gear Maniac
 

Sparky,


http://www.vintageking.com/

Mike is the mic guy.


Let us know what he says about your situation.


Santo
Old 20th July 2005
  #30
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mtstudios@charter's Avatar
 

Just reading all these posts, which confirms, no mic is the perfect mic. I wish that was not true, for all us. The good news is, while searching for the perfect mic, sometimes purchasing and thinking it is, ten years from now you will have an array of mics to choose from.

www.bluethumbproductions.com
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