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Massive Passive Tips Equalisers (HW)
Old 6th April 2003
  #1
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Renie's Avatar
 

Massive Passive Tips

I've had a short trial with it and was impressed.

We're buying one on the strength on the trial so if anyone has any advice about how to get the best out of this beast please chip in.

thank you

Old 6th April 2003
  #2
First tip would be: Try not to drop it!!!heh

I guess some others would be:

1) The different inputs give you different sounds. I normally use my MP for mixing vocals, so I may have the balanced input for lets say a male vocal( a little thicker) and a female vocal on the unbalanced in( a little clearer).

2) A common thing I do is I have the HP filter working in conjunction with the 1st stage.

So i might roll off some bottomn feeder freqs that are not necessary with the HP and tailor it some more with Ist stage. Maybe gently boost(to thicken the voice some) some low mids in shelving mode.

I use the 2nd Stage most of the time for cutting freqs that are troublesome in the vocal range.


The 3rd stage I use to for the vocal "bite". Usually for adding the freq's that make the vocal cut through.

The last and highest stage I use for the "air freqs". Sometimes you have to be careful though(at its highest setting in shelving mode) you may introduce unwanted artifacts(anti aliasing sounds) especially if you are working at 44.1K. This is where the LP comes in handy, you can gently roll off the highs to the point where it still has "the air and clarity" withoutthe whistling.

You can also do the Pultec thing with the first two stages in shelving mode(that way you don't over do the bass). This works great for the "two mix".

I've been experimenting lately on sending one channel into another for more control on the vocal. Its working pretty good.
Old 6th April 2003
  #3
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Renie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by thethrillfactor
First tip would be: Try not to drop it!!!heh
LOL!!!

That's a good one thrill...as for your other tips they look cool, can't wait to try.
If anyone else can out-thrill thrill please fire away.

You know the grill on the top, is it OK to keep chickens in there?
Old 6th April 2003
  #4
Quote:
Originally posted by Renie
LOL!!!

That's a good one thrill...as for your other tips they look cool, can't wait to try.
If anyone else can out-thrill thrill please fire away.

You know the grill on the top, is it OK to keep chickens in there?
If anyone else can out-thrill thrill

Is this possible?

I don't know about chickens...but you can make a mean grilled cheese sandwhich on it.heh
Old 7th April 2003
  #5
Jax
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Check out a mild bell dip at 580 on a whole mix that's sounding a little boxy. Amazing how it opens up.

Hi Renie
Old 7th April 2003
  #6
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Renie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by thethrillfactor
If anyone else can out-thrill thrill

Is this possible?

Of course.



Hi Jax

Thank you for that tip.

This boxiness, is it your mixes or ones coming in?
What do you think is causing the problem?

Cheers,
Old 8th April 2003
  #7
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faeflora's Avatar
 

That grill needs some modding! It buzzes with loud bass. Not good! tutt

You can be a lot more aggresive and radical with the MP. When you boost or cut lots with narrower Q you'll get resonance unlike traditional parametrics. You can use these resonances to make edits to the spectral content of sounds. Like make a bass sound more chesty instead of subby or bring out the exact part of a guitar lead needed to have a noticable presence in a mix.

The HPF and LPF are great. I use those switches all the time. The high and low shelves are also very useful. With a decent source, you can actually do large amounts of boosting without crappification.

Regarding the simultaneous boost/cut pultec thing described in the manual, I haven't messed around with that much. I do hear though, that when I do that, I can make the resonances I alluded to before much tighter.

If I reccomend one thing, it would be to pay attention to the overall volume gain or loss as you sweep the Q, both on shelf and parametric. You'll need to work both gain and Q knobs simultaneously to achieve consistant volumes with a full sweep. The Q can make the MP equalization very subtle, or very extreme. Both extremities are very useful!

The MP and my Distressors are the most powerful sound sculpters in my studio. They are amazing at mix and the HPF/LPF is useful at tracking.

I've never messed around with the balanced and unbalanced inputs. I've always done balanced. I'll patch in the unbalanced too, and give it a listen. I've noticed the MP thickens the sound a little, and I was kinda bugged that it was in the circuit design as a whole. I guess bypassing the transformer will clean things up a lot.
Old 9th April 2003
  #8
Jax
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Quote:
Originally posted by Renie

This boxiness, is it your mixes or ones coming in?
What do you think is causing the problem?

Cheers,
I'd like to be able to say it never happens on my mixes, but when you're in a hurry, that cardboard tone can sneak it's way in. When I have time to do everything justice, I generally am pretty good at avoiding the 'low wah' area.

I generally hear a buildup of low and high mid frequencies overall that contribute to boxiness, if we're talking about the root of the evil. If I had to pick an area, I'd say it ranges from 350-680 hz. To me, the most boxy-sounding region of that spectrum is in the upper 460-600 hz if frequencies are built up over too wide of a Q.

Have fun with the MP! I seriously doubt it will want for another home after you've gotten cozy with it.
Old 9th April 2003
  #9
Quote:
Originally posted by Jax
I'd like to be able to say it never happens on my mixes, but when you're in a hurry, that cardboard tone can sneak it's way in. When I have time to do everything justice, I generally am pretty good at avoiding the 'low wah' area.

I generally hear a buildup of low and high mid frequencies overall that contribute to boxiness, if we're talking about the root of the evil. If I had to pick an area, I'd say it ranges from 350-680 hz. To me, the most boxy-sounding region of that spectrum is in the upper 460-600 hz if frequencies are built up over too wide of a Q.

Have fun with the MP! I seriously doubt it will want for another home after you've gotten cozy with it.
Hey Jax are you still using the JBL's LSR series?

This maybe why.
Old 10th April 2003
  #10
Jax
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Good memory, thrill. I'm still using the 28's. I see your point, but if the low mid cloudiness happened on every mix, I'd be more inclined to blame the JBL's. The Massive adds a little thickening even without processing applied, but not enough that it would be the root of the problem. The problem is the mixes themselves (again, not necessarily my mixes heh) moreso than the monitoring. I'm fairly certain about that, otherwise I'd usually be cutting out too much low mid and end up with either smiley-faced or cold, pale mixes. I've gotten used to the JBL's weakspots. After awhile, I learned to compensate.

I wanted to point out that it's raw recordings more than mixes, because I'm not doing much actual (attempted) mastering.
Old 12th April 2003
  #11
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Renie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Jax
I'd like to be able to say it never happens on my mixes, but when you're in a hurry, that cardboard tone can sneak it's way in. When I have time to do everything justice, I generally am pretty good at avoiding the 'low wah' area.

I generally hear a buildup of low and high mid frequencies overall that contribute to boxiness, if we're talking about the root of the evil. If I had to pick an area, I'd say it ranges from 350-680 hz. To me, the most boxy-sounding region of that spectrum is in the upper 460-600 hz if frequencies are built up over too wide of a Q.

Have fun with the MP! I seriously doubt it will want for another home after you've gotten cozy with it.
thanks Jax, that's interesting...boxy has always meant a lack of open ambience to me so your view of what it is and why it's there is interesting..
as far as me and MP being cosy...well I hope so!!!heh

cheers!
Old 4th October 2006
  #12
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mixerguy's Avatar
bump to a WAY old thread



any new tips anyone?

Old 19th June 2013
  #13
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thetalkinghead's Avatar
 

10 year bump! (instead of starting a new thread)

who's still using the Massivo? what for? any other tips or cool things youve noticed?
Old 20th June 2013
  #14
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Use the Mp as a fixed filter bank, by turning up the bandwidth all the way and boosting a bell on each band. Start with the band gain all the way down and shape the sound using just the gain controls on each band. Amazing for synth patches and electronic drums, or to make drum kit sound more electronic.

There is a THD patch in the manual which is great. It boosts and cuts 2 shelves against each other.

For bass, use both channels in series for an 8 band eq, or a 4 band and the THD setting on one channel. The MP on bass is the most valuable to me, and the first time I used it, I was able to dial in the best bass sound I have ever heard, repeatedly. It has BALLS like nothing else. I know the word "balls" as it relates to audio usually has to do with distortion or loudness, but the MP does it without either per se. It's more the curves and how they interact with each other that gives the sound so much weight.

I have a trick where I actively change the settings in rhythm that sounds amazing, but I will not reveal anymore, because it is totally unique sounding.

It has a somewhat modern sound to it when used to the extreme, but can be very transparent in moderation. I am not into moderation. I like being able to push the hell out of it, because it still sounds great. Very difficult to make it sound harsh.

What i don't understand is why people obsess about converters and wires and such, when just a tiny adjustment of a setting on something like the MP has far more of an effect than any difference between 2 modern AD converters.
Old 20th June 2013
  #15
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The MP is always used in my studio whether on mixbuss, vocals, guitars, drums, synths, etc.
On mixbuss I always have the HP (38hz or 68hz) and LP (18k) filters in operation. I generally boost 330 hz, cut 820hz, and boost the 5-12k. I generally only use it in Bell mode.
It is an EQ you can really boost without it sounding harsh. It is very smooth and pleasing to the ear.
Old 21st June 2013
  #16
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very cool stuff.

i started another thread recently about this... do you guys use your massivo in a chain with other tube gear? im wondering if adding a massivo to my vocal chain (manley ref c mic > great river pre > cl1b comp) could be too much coloration and 'tubeyness'. that would be 3 tube devices in one chain.
Old 21st June 2013
  #17
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I use a Massive Passive in the chain before a VariMu on 2 Buss. The two are inseparable lovers.

I have a Manley Cardioid Ref mic, which I connect to a Buzz Audio MA.2.2 mic pre. I often will insert the MP and VariMu on vocal tracks. The results are astonishing. Again very smooth and pleasing to the ear.
Old 21st June 2013
  #18
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thetalkinghead's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by waldie wave View Post
I use a Massive Passive in the chain before a VariMu on 2 Buss. The two are inseparable lovers.

I have a Manley Cardioid Ref mic, which I connect to a Buzz Audio MA.2.2 mic pre. I often will insert the MP and VariMu on vocal tracks. The results are astonishing. Again very smooth and pleasing to the ear.
cool man thats what i wanted to hear! thanks for the input.
Old 21st June 2013
  #19
Gear Addict
 

One of the reasons the MP is smooth is that, even if you boost the same freq on 2 channels, it'll never boost more than a certain amount. I remember reading in the manual that they advice to cut on at least one band to avoid simply boosting the signal. I find that's very true and really helpful.
I love the resonant shelves too. There are 2 specific applications where it really does it for me:
1) Some condensers have a nasty boost around 7k. If you boost that freq with the Q to the max, you're actually cutting there and boosting up in the air region. Perfect for adding air to sibilant vocals.
2) On the 2 bus or in mastering sometimes you want a bigger bottom (and who doesn't?). I like boosting at 330Hz or so, then moving the Q up and down until I find a spot where the bottom is big but it's not making the track muddy.

Anyway, my 2 cents. Cheers!

J.
Old 21st June 2013
  #20
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herecomesyourman's Avatar
It's high band boosting at 10K, 12K and 27K are all amazing frequencies for mastering application as well as vocals.

I can't really name an EQ with deeper controls but it's just amazing. And the filters are incredible.
Old 21st June 2013
  #21
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The other good thing about getting an Manly gear is that they will be your family members for life. They are very loyal, well behaved and seldom need repairs (none of my Manley gear has) unlike actual family members who, from time to time, need time out, counselling and behavioural modification. I replaced all the tubes recently in my Manley units (even though there was no need to). I have had an MP & VoxBox since 1999. I have had a VariMu since 2004 and a Manley Cardioid Ref since 2008. Even the VoxBox mic pre works in the MP and VariMu chain (especially with a U87).
Old 22nd June 2013
  #22
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can you guys explain to me why people love to poop on the massivo's low and high end? it seems everybody agrees that the mids are great, and that its one of if not the best mid eq out there. but i consistently see people saying the lows are mushy or not tight and the highs arent that great. whats the dillyo?
Old 22nd June 2013
  #23
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herecomesyourman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by thetalkinghead View Post
can you guys explain to me why people love to poop on the massivo's low and high end? it seems everybody agrees that the mids are great, and that its one of if not the best mid eq out there. but i consistently see people saying the lows are mushy or not tight and the highs arent that great. whats the dillyo?
The highs are great I'm not sure what people are complaining about.

The Lows are HUGE...so I think people mistake that for flabby...with the filters you can control that though. It's not the best EQ to sculpt a hard sounding tight bottom. It's more of a big pillow of tube awesome in that regard.
Old 22nd June 2013
  #24
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I second that the highs are great on the MP. I hear people say the highs and lows are great on an Adesigns Hammer. I have a Hammer and, while I like it, I prefer the MP. The MP is in another league altogether. I personally do not find the MP lows are mushy. They may become mushy if you boost the crap out of them. If you use the HP filter and low end in moderation you can get some tight punchy low end.
Old 22nd June 2013
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thetalkinghead View Post
can you guys explain to me why people love to poop on the massivo's low and high end? it seems everybody agrees that the mids are great, and that its one of if not the best mid eq out there. but i consistently see people saying the lows are mushy or not tight and the highs arent that great. whats the dillyo?
Some people are just poop people. To try to characterize a tool with so much versatility as mushy or not tight is absurd. If you are getting bass or treble you don't like, that is what the eq is for. The reverse bell on the shelves at high resonance can be used very effectively, and the extreme 2 bands on the high and low shelves have a built in filter that is almost impossible to get "mush" out of unless you are trying.

I definitely have owner's bias, but i realize it, and i am sure there are other eq's that can hang with the MP, but anyone who denies that it is a great tool is in denial or simply has never used one.
Old 22nd June 2013
  #26
Gear Addict
used to wonder about the bottom end effectiveness, myself, compared to others here along the way (pultec, summit, retro 2a3) - but much less so now since i started actively using the unbal in outs for tracks where i'm looking for more of a pultec thing.
i've had MP for maybe 15-20 years now (?!!) - it has held in beautifully while more than a few others have come and gone.
certainly not going anywhere.
Old 22nd June 2013
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tree View Post
used to wonder about the bottom end effectiveness, myself, compared to others here along the way (pultec, summit, retro 2a3) - but much less so now since i started actively using the unbal in outs for tracks where i'm looking for more of a pultec thing.
i've had MP for maybe 15-20 years now (?!!) - it has held in beautifully while more than a few others have come and gone.
certainly not going anywhere.
It has been around that long?
Old 22nd June 2013
  #28
Gear Addict
ha ... good question.
98 or 99 ??
my bad - aging addled mind!!
Old 22nd June 2013
  #29
Gear Head
 

quick question. by unbalanced in outs are you referring to the jack i/o? cause the manual states that they can receive a balanced signal as well. so what do you do? short pin3 to ground? do the jack i/o bypass the transformers or are they just parallel to the xlrs?
Old 22nd June 2013
  #30
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herecomesyourman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by unfiltered420 View Post
It has been around that long?
Yes it has. And it's been on countless hits. It's not a flavor of the week.
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