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AD - Lavry black or API A2D
Old 13th May 2009
  #31
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Chris Wilson's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurricaneE View Post
The API's do a much better job of translating tape accurately. Now, maybe that's because they're adding tape-like harmonics, I dunno, but the API's just sound a lot closer to what's coming off my machine (MTR-90 MKII). The top end is a lot more articulate (the difference in cymbal depth was astonishing) and transients are crisper.

The Lavrys sounded nice and rich, but not accurate
This is interesting because it's about the opposite of my own experience. For location jobs, I usually feed a LavryBlue micpre into a LavryBlue A/D. Accurate is about all you get with this setup and that's the point.

Though I completely understand why one may prefer the API sound, I have never experienced an API sound as more accurate, or the LavryBlue as rich.

Perhaps I am missing something?
Old 14th May 2009
  #32
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TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Wilson View Post
This is interesting because it's about the opposite of my own experience. For location jobs, I usually feed a LavryBlue micpre into a LavryBlue A/D. Accurate is about all you get with this setup and that's the point.
Same here. I've got an AD10 and Lavry Blues and they are extremely accurate. If someone doesn't like the Lavry, it's because they want the converter to change the sound. I prefer uncolored in this scenario.
Old 14th May 2009
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBelmont View Post
Same here. I've got an AD10 and Lavry Blues and they are extremely accurate. If someone doesn't like the Lavry, it's because they want the converter to change the sound. I prefer uncolored in this scenario.
thumbsup thumbsup
Old 14th May 2009
  #34
Is this apples to apples? Can the pres in the A2D be taken out of the path so that it's purely an A/D converter?
Old 14th May 2009
  #35
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Fishmed's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by elambo View Post
Is this apples to apples? Can the pres in the A2D be taken out of the path so that it's purely an A/D converter?
According to manual you can.
Old 14th May 2009
  #36
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Thanks to all for the helpful and interesting replies. How about the emulation modes of the AD10? any opinions on them? Maybe one of them gets in the ballpark of the A2D converter sound? if so it would make my question moot except for price considerations.
Old 14th May 2009
  #37
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duvalle's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by elambo View Post
Is this apples to apples? Can the pres in the A2D be taken out of the path so that it's purely an A/D converter?
yes! i go lavry da-10 -> efx -> ad of the A2D on the 2bus.
the ad of the A2D is not as clean but works great for my taste ...
Old 15th May 2009
  #38
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KEYBEEETSSS's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by elambo View Post
Can the pres in the A2D be taken out of the path so that it's purely an A/D converter?
Yeah the pres have nuthing to do with the AD side actually...
Old 15th May 2009
  #39
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u b k's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by elambo View Post
Is this apples to apples? Can the pres in the A2D be taken out of the path so that it's purely an A/D converter?

yeah, but you have to go in via the inserts on the back. guys miss this info a lot and go into the line ins on the front, which don't go thru the pre but do go thru the 2520 line amp circuit, which is very colored and (imo) terrible for program material.

but the inserts are remarkably clean. the a2d has a rep for being colored, and it can be, but it doesn't have to be. it has 3 input paths, but most people only seem to be aware of two. this is, imo, equal parts design flaw and marketing flaw.


gregory scott - ubk
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Old 15th May 2009
  #40
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KEYBEEETSSS's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by u b k View Post
yeah, but you have to go in via the inserts on the back. guys miss this info a lot and go into the line ins on the front,

gregory scott - ubk
.
Rite...
Old 20th May 2009
  #41
Quote:
Originally Posted by u b k View Post
yeah, but you have to go in via the inserts on the back. guys miss this info a lot and go into the line ins on the front, which don't go thru the pre but do go thru the 2520 line amp circuit, which is very colored and (imo) terrible for program material.
That's an important element to understand. This is why API sends a manual, right? Of course you can't get everyone to read it. And now I can understand why people's opinions could vary so much - they may be using different inputs.

So when you're plugged into and using the pres they can be routed directly to the A/D? Perhaps by some sort of toggle switch that tells the box, "now listen to the pres instead of the line-in?" I can't believe those pres would HAVE to go to an analog out.
Old 20th May 2009
  #42
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TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

They make it pretty obvious, though:

Old 20th May 2009
  #43
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musicmatt's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBelmont View Post
They make it pretty obvious, though:

Tony's posts are oh so subtle but effective.

Old 20th May 2009
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBelmont View Post
They make it pretty obvious, though:

innit, how can people own one but not know this?
Old 20th May 2009
  #45
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duvalle's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta Heavy View Post
innit, how can people own one but not know this?
i don't believe anyone owning it is not knowing it!
it's one of it's main features ....
Old 20th May 2009
  #46
Gear Maniac
 

I think UBK said that (not knowing about the inserts) to one of my responses..i had used this unit more than year ago and that too i had rented one from mercenary to test it out...that time i had clearly read the manual and used it properly , i spoke to adam also and made sure that i do it right, but while responding here, i metioned "IIRC" ...but i definitely didn't remember correctly
Old 20th May 2009
  #47
Lives for gear
These pieces are really chalk and cheese. I've had an A2D here and now use the AD10 exclusively for mastering. Let me put it this way, I tracked extensively with the A2D and it's a great unit but the idea that I would then use it to master my mix? Well, I think tracking with the A2D and using the clarity of the AD10 (or something like it) for the mix is the ideal combination. Unless you're recording classical or acoustic music in which case I would use the AD10 for everything in more cases than not.

Steve
Old 20th May 2009
  #48
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KEYBEEETSSS's Avatar
 

^^^^Where did mastering with the A2D come from
Old 20th May 2009
  #49
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Fishmed's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by KEYBEEETSSS View Post
^^^^Where did mastering with the A2D come from
I may have let that cat out of the bag by asking how the two units were for my mix track AD, but I would not think this would be the same as mastering. If the A2D (AD only) colors or messes with a frequency in a negative way, I would hope it is clean enough that I can compensate some by making adjustments to the tracks in the mix. Since I would be mixing through this unit, I would make the EQ sound like it should from the get go anyways.

I've always seen "mastering" as something done to a final mix where you cannot touch the individual tracks.
Old 21st May 2009
  #50
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u b k's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by duvalle View Post
i don't believe anyone owning it is not knowing it!
it's one of it's main features ....

you might think, but I've pointed it out to at least three people on this board who own one. try to remember the experience level of a large chunk of the the primary demographic this unit was designed for and marketed to.

one of the primary effects of the internet and sites like this is that guys are spending thousands of bucks on equipment yet they don't have the first notion about the most basic concepts like signal flow and gain staging. you wouldn't believe some of the questions I get asked when people call me about my compressor, recording 101 kinda stuff.

I would imagine Tony of all people knows what I'm talking about. thumbsup


Gregory Scott - ubk
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Old 19th June 2009
  #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by u b k View Post
but do go thru the 2520 line amp circuit, which is very colored and (imo) terrible for program material.
I find this statement very interesting. Obviously, this thread is about the A2D, but isn't the whole point of API's 7800/8200A/DSM series to pass your mix through 2520's?

Can you expand a bit, Gregory?

John
Old 19th June 2009
  #52
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once a roadie's Avatar
 

I heard or read somewhere the converters in the API were made by Trosi design...these seem to have a really good reputation...

Has anyone opened their A2D up to see?
Old 19th June 2009
  #53
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Fishmed's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrChang View Post
I find this statement very interesting. Obviously, this thread is about the A2D, but isn't the whole point of API's 7800/8200A/DSM series to pass your mix through 2520's?

Can you expand a bit, Gregory?

John
I was just looking for a good AD, I saw the Mic Pres as frosting on the cake (VERY THICK Frosting).
Old 19th June 2009
  #54
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MrChang's Avatar
 

Owning a 3124, I don't think I'd ever describe their sound as very thick. But to each his own ear.

I was just wondering if UBK had ever used the API line mixer series. And, if so, his thoughts on perhaps the differences/similarities in running signal through it versus the A2D, used in a similar function. (Just based on his comment that running the signal through the 2520's on the A2D sounded poor on program material.)

I've often thought of using my API as the back-end for a passive summer, but I'm too busy (maybe lazy, too) to build one... and too cheap to spend $600 on $20 worth of components.

Sorry to derail the thread.




John
Old 19th June 2009
  #55
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mejon's Avatar
Love my API A2D for drums, and so many other things.

I sometimes mix in stems with my Folcrom, using the A2D as my make up gain back into Pro Tools. Works best when mixing a track from the beginning this way, as opposed to taking a finished mix, stemming it out, and running it through the Folcrom.

Speaking of master clocks, I too use a Mytek 192cx which keeps everything rock solid and sounds amazing.

Jon
Old 19th June 2009
  #56
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u b k's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrChang View Post
I find this statement very interesting. Obviously, this thread is about the A2D, but isn't the whole point of API's 7800/8200A/DSM series to pass your mix through 2520's?

I should clarify: the 2520 is simply an op-amp, it does something to the tone but it is only one part of any given circuit. What I referred to the was the 2520 line amp circuit in the A2D, it has a sound, it's on the bright side, almost sizzly.

But the 2500 has 2520's in it too, and not only is it not bright, it's a hair soft and silky on top. Same op-amp, different circuit. Likewise for a 525, nice and fat.

The API line mixers are closer to the 2500, but not as meaty. API preamps are their own beasts, I'm not a fan of them when used straight to digital but when followed with some API compression first, and especially if also tracked to tape --- in other words, when used the way they were intended to by the original designers --- their pokey transients and forward top are mitigated beautifully and the result is one of my favorite sounds in the world. You know it instantly once you hear it, it's quintessential classic 70's hi-fi.


Gregory Scott - ubk
.
Old 19th June 2009
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grockvt View Post
I heard or read somewhere the converters in the API were made by Trosi design...these seem to have a really good reputation...

Has anyone opened their A2D up to see?

I've opened up my A2D and I saw Cirrus Logic CS5381 converter
Old 19th June 2009
  #58
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Fishmed's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrChang View Post
Owning a 3124, I don't think I'd ever describe their sound as very thick. But to each his own ear.

I was just wondering if UBK had ever used the API line mixer series. And, if so, his thoughts on perhaps the differences/similarities in running signal through it versus the A2D, used in a similar function. (Just based on his comment that running the signal through the 2520's on the A2D sounded poor on program material.)

I've often thought of using my API as the back-end for a passive summer, but I'm too busy (maybe lazy, too) to build one... and too cheap to spend $600 on $20 worth of components.

Sorry to derail the thread.




John
Sorry, I did not mean the sound was thick, just the frosting. I used the term thick frosting to differentiate it as something above "normal" frosting since the pre is more coveted than the AD of this unit.
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