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Lynx Aurora 16 with and without BIG BEN Digital Converters
Old 17th November 2008
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roc Mixwell View Post
What he is saying [I think, based on my observations] is that the Aurora has a ruler flat response until you use the BB clock with Aurora PLL off, and then you'll get a +/- 3 DB amount of harmonic content added pretty much over the entire spectrum. The bottom is brought up and it comes closer to the Rosetta's bottom and the top is certainly "de-shrilled" and more controlled. Cymbals seem to feel larger as they have a more fluid like response.

Well said!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bang View Post
When clocking the Aurora to the Lavry, I used AES. I turned off Syncrolock on the hardware and in the software (they make it tricky to completely turn it off). The Lynx AES 16 got clock from AES also, aka "DIGITAL IN" setting.

Big Ben is a great box, its hard to describe what it does to the audio but I can't duplicate it with eqs, compression, or anything else. I wish I had the effect as a plugin.

I agree with Bang on his statement. I can't find any other device that does what the BB does. If so, I would sell it or not have upgraded my converters to the AD/DA 16x series from Apogee, which uses the same BB clock.

It would be cool to have a plug that does what the Apogee Big Ben does 100%.
Old 17th November 2008
  #32
Gear Nut
 

Exactly, a null does tell you some things, and in this case what it's telling me is that there is more going on here than meets the ears.

The reason I'm asking about how the straight lynx version is clocked is because there seems to be an odd time-based anomaly happening in the straight lynx transfer that isn't present in the BB clocked version. Specifically, both transfers seem sonically roughly identical to each other (at least down to around -66db) but the lynx transfer drops out of sync with the source file for a consistent period every 0.58 seconds. The question is, why? And does it imply an actual audible difference, or is this just a shift in sub-millisecond timing and the natural side effect of using the Aurora's syncrolock?

Just to be clear - was the Aurora sync source (on the front panel) set to "AES A" and the AES 16 (on the adapter page) set to "Internal" as Lynx suggests in the manual, or the other way around?

Thanks Again,
Graeme

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bang View Post
I think its pretty straightforward actually. BB affects the low end quite obviously, and the extreme high end too. A null test tells you some things but ultimately its your ears which make the final determinations.

The Aurora on its own clock used Syncrolock, then AES to the AES16, slaved to Digital In. Simple stuff.
Old 17th November 2008
  #33
Quote:
Originally Posted by six_wax View Post
However, "reputable" is frequently defined by your words...



Thanks for the clarification. Fwiw, you're the one who trotted out your made-up numbers.

Just a chip off the old block there, aren't we buddy?
Old-Block? Reputable? Trotted? Not sure I understand what you mean. I hear a 1-3 DB raise in harmonic distortion.....what's the big deal with my estimation and how have I offended you?
Old 17th November 2008
  #34
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Someone said the Aurora sounded worse when clocked via the AES16 (vs internally). As for the "break of sync" - that's probably due to the syncrolock. It might be similar to RMEs steadyclock which is restarted every second or so.
Old 18th November 2008
  #35
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I ran the loopback test at my place through a couple other converters using the original source file, reduced from 32 to 24 bit, no dither.

Conversion was performed with:

1. Stock 192, self-sync'd
2. Rosetta 800, connected via AES, self-sync'd
3. Rosetta 800, sync'd from 192 via WC

"Loopback" through homemade Mogami 2932 Dsub snakes and a relatively new patchbay. Resultant files were POWr Type 1 Dithered to 16bit.

Hopefully the attachments worked...
Attached Files

Rosetta-SelfSync16bit.wav (5.72 MB, 284 views)

Rosetta-192Sync16bit.wav (5.72 MB, 259 views)

192io-SelfSync16bit.wav (5.72 MB, 336 views)

Old 18th November 2008
  #36
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my ears say yes
Old 18th November 2008
  #37
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roc Mixwell View Post
Old-Block? Reputable? Trotted? Not sure I understand what you mean. I hear a 1-3 DB raise in harmonic distortion.....what's the big deal with my estimation and how have I offended you?
You are a gear dealer so we should assume you know what you are talking about when you quote a figure like a 3 DB increase. You make it clear that you don't know what you are talking about.
Old 18th November 2008
  #38
Gear Nut
 
WinterSun's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by six_wax View Post
Conversion was performed with:

1. Stock 192, self-sync'd
2. Rosetta 800, connected via AES, self-sync'd
3. Rosetta 800, sync'd from 192 via WC
The Rosetta 800 by itself has similar attributes to the Lynx w/ BB file. Must be an apogee thing. I think the file with the Lynx by itself had the most "crack" on the snare, but I didn't like how it brought the cymbals a little forward. It would probably sound great on vocals though.

I think I like the fluidity of the cymbals on the Lynx w/ BB and the snare and bottom end of the Lynx. I don't care for the hyped low end on the apogee units.

I don't think you could go wrong with either, to be honest.
Old 18th November 2008
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cato View Post
You are a gear dealer so we should assume you know what you are talking about


Old 19th November 2008
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by living sounds View Post
Someone said the Aurora sounded worse when clocked via the AES16 (vs internally). As for the "break of sync" - that's probably due to the syncrolock. It might be similar to RMEs steadyclock which is restarted every second or so.
Yes the aurora sounds worse when clocked from the aes16. I use the aurora as master and two aes16 slaved. Sounds a lot better/ more open.
Old 7th December 2008
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Græmatter Audio View Post
I'd suggest to anyone reading that you may want to subject the material to a null test before going to wild with posting subjective observations... there appears to be a difference between the internal and the BB clocked versions; but it's not what you think.

In fact it's really weird.
Exactly!
Listening to the nulled files (original vs lynx) I get the feeling that the Lynx is scanning for a a clock that is not there or is totally off.
-It is clearly clocking that is not working properly.
Old 11th December 2008
  #42
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by RogerJoensson View Post
Exactly!
Listening to the nulled files (original vs lynx) I get the feeling that the Lynx is scanning for a a clock that is not there or is totally off.
-It is clearly clocking that is not working properly.
Was this ever worked out?
Old 10th February 2009
  #43
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I think the idea of subjectively choosing clocks for different timbre qualities is a weird idea.

Suppose that an interface has a poor clock and compensates by filtering off some high end frequency. Then, when you connect a good clock to it, somebody would say "wow, this clock sucks, adds too much high end".



Why not run the D/A/D conversion 16+ times, recursively (if you have the time). Then the errors will be more pronounced.
Old 13th April 2009
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bang View Post
When clocking the Aurora to the Lavry, I used AES. I turned off Syncrolock on the hardware and in the software (they make it tricky to completely turn it off).
So if I turn SynchroLock off from the hardware it isn't completely off?

One more doubt: when clocking the Aurora to the Big Ben do you turned SynchroLock off also?
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