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My total list of protools delays Reverb & Delay Plugins
Old 10th January 2003
  #1
no ssl yet 
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My total list of protools delays

I know that this is a concern for many around these parts, so I decided to post my list here in hopes that it will help someone. If you have stickies on your computer it may help to copy this list there and use it as a note

Please notice I have included the RTAS delays also (at least those I found significant) Some of the RTAS plugs that I have not listed did not totally sum to silence when one track of a pair was phase reversed. However I didn't list them because according to my observations they didnt completely dissapear at all frequency's because the plugin had some effect on the signal that couldn't be attributed to plugin delay. Examples of this would be Analog Channel or the Bombfactory compressors/pultec.

Also I don't know if these delays are constant across RTAS only systems because I tested on my mix system only (may reload in PTools LE and test though)

Please feel free to post any that I have left out.

Here it is:

Plug-in: latency in samples
ChannelStrip: 42
Amp Farm: 3
Aural Exiter: 3
Auto-Tune: 33
Big Bottom Pro: 3
DINR (BMR): 1538
Bruno: 3
CompressorBank: 2
D-verb: 3
Dither: 5
de-esser: 5
Compressor: 5
Limiter: 5
Expander: 5
Gate: 5
1-BandEQII: 5
4-BandEQII: 5
Filterbank: 2
ƒƒd2: 5
ƒƒd3: 5
LexiVerb: 3
Maxim: 1027
Mic Modeler: 3
short delay: 4
slap-delay: 4
medium-delay: 4
Long-delay: 4
Reso: 3
SansAmp: 3
Signal Generator: 5
TC|Chorus: 3
TC|MegaVerb: 2
TC|VoiceStrip: 3
Time Adjuster: 3
Audio Track: 3
C1c/g: 343
C1comp/sidechain: 343
C1comp: 3
C1gate: 3
C4 Multiband Param: 67
Doppler Auto: 3
Enigma: 3
IDR: 3
R-Compressor: 67
Renaissance EQ: 3
Renaissance Reverb: 3
SuperTap: 3
TrueVerb: 3
UltraPitch: 3600
DeEsser: 3
DLA: 3
C1-DLA: 343
UltraPitch-DLA: 3600
L1-DLA: 67
PAZ Frequency: 3
PAZ Meters: 3
PS22 Spread: 5
PS22 Split: 7
PS22 Spread (10): 5
PS22 X-split: 7
Q1-Q10: 3
L1: 67
MaxxBass: 3
MetaFlanger: 3
MondoMod: 3
ProTools Bus latency: 10

RTAS (only significant delays listed as others are about zero)


C4 70
Ren Comp 64
Ren Desser 70
Ren Vox 64
Channel Strip 16
T racks Suite 64
--------------------

------------------------------------------------------------------------
combinations
Bounce to Disk 0
Bus Based Bounce 10
Insert =(2 + plugin delay)
888 A/D/A 81 = (2 for insert + 79 for 888)
1622 A/D/A 75 = (2 for insert + 73 for 1622
Digital I/O Digi producs 17


Individuals
Insert 2
Post Fader Send 6
Pre Fader Send 3

Track routed to bus 2
Through Bus 1&2 mixer to TDM 5
Record to track with input set to bus 1&2 3





Example 3, Pro Tools 24 MIX System
A bus-based TDM bounce with no plug-ins adds
10 samples of delay:
Track 1 routed to Bus 1-2, with pan set <100 =
2 samples
Through Bus 1-2 Mixer and back out to TDM
= 5 samples
Record to Track 2 with input set to Bus 1 = 3
samples
Total: 10 samples

Example 2, Pro Tools 24 MIX System
A slightly different bounce adds 14 samples of
delay because it involves use of a Send:
Track 1/Send 1 (post-fader) routed to Bus 1 = 6
samples
Through Bus 1-2 Mixer and back out to TDM
= 5 samples
Record to Track 2 with input set to Bus 1 = 3
samples
Total: 14 samples
Old 12th January 2003
  #2
Lives for gear
 
Saucyjack's Avatar
 

Never worked with Pro Tools... but damn having to think/consider/account for all that seems about as far away from "making music" as you can get.
Old 12th January 2003
  #3
V kind of you to put this list up...

I have one thing to say,

RE- Auto Tune

Auto Tune doesn't have a fixed delay... it varies. 33 might be the BASIC delay of it 'just sitting there' but as it works harder, the delay get longer ... DEPENDING ON THE PROSSESSING IT IS DOING. If it is shifting the pitch a long way, the delay is greater than a small pitch correction

A trick folks use to put the vocal back EXACTLY where it was sung in the first place, is to use the VocAlign plug in..

This puts all the vocal segments that suffer from varying delay (as mentioned above) back in exactly the same place as they were in the first place...

I find Autotuneing can mess with vocal timing - and the above work-around to be very successful.

***************************

BTW the Sony EQ plug in has a delay of 3 samples

***************************
Old 12th January 2003
  #4
Gear Addict
 
mplancke's Avatar
Quote:
Originally posted by Saucyjack
Never worked with Pro Tools... but damn having to think/consider/account for all that seems about as far away from "making music" as you can get.
I'd suggest getting into something like Samplitude 7.0, which has built in latency compensation and sounds very good on top of it.

Good bye latency lists.

Mark
Old 12th January 2003
  #5
Motown legend
 
Bob Olhsson's Avatar
 

All RTAS plugs have the same delay except for those that have some kind of built in delay or a "look-ahead" feature as part of their processing. The delays that are shown in Pro-Tools are derived from numbers supplied by the plug-in developers which in most cases are for TDM.
Old 12th January 2003
  #6
Quote:
Originally posted by mplancke
I'd suggest getting into something like Samplitude 7.0, which has built in latency compensation and sounds very good on top of it.

Good bye latency lists.
I'm with Mark. I've been a Samplitude user for quite a while and it's always sounded great. The only thing it suffers from is bad marketing and funding which is getting better. XVision Audio (RME USA) is now carrying Samp 7.0 and their support (tech and marketing) is excellent. The only thing is that it's PC only, so it may be a jump for Mac only users.
Old 13th January 2003
  #7
Gear Head
 
Dogbreath's Avatar
Thanks, no ssl yet! Very useful!
Old 13th January 2003
  #8
Lives for gear
 
Alécio Costa's Avatar
 

TC Master X has variable delay. It depends if you use 3 or 5 band mode, and at your setiing of Look ahead...


Just one thing:
Very funny thing...
I had recorded drums, the bottom mic was with the phase flippedso as to keep phase coerency. I did that at my 02R eq channel.
hen I inserted Q4/Q10´s at all tracks inside my pt Session, I had to re-reinvert the phase of the bottom snre mic. the delay recompensated the phase
LOL

Hugs
alécio
Old 13th January 2003
  #9
Lives for gear
 
Mike Jasper's Avatar
Good thread.

The biggest delay I've encountered so far is the release of Pro Tools 6.0.

Jasper
Old 13th January 2003
  #10
Gear Head
 

"The biggest delay I've encountered so far is the release of Pro Tools 6.0."

Speaking of that, do anyone have info about if Pro tool 6.0 can be run on OS 9 or if its just OS X
Old 13th January 2003
  #11
Lives for gear
 
Mike Jasper's Avatar
While there will be a couple of changes with 6.0, I think the main point is that it's designed to work with OSX. And I understand that means OSX only.

http://www.digidesign.com

Jasper
Old 14th January 2003
  #12
s2n
Gear Nut
 

Pro Tools 6 is OS X only. When you try to lauch PT 6 in OS 9 you get a message stating "This version of Pro Tools does not support OS 9."
Old 15th January 2003
  #13
jho
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jho's Avatar
 

Thanks for the info.

How do you folks make up for this? TA plug or do you slide over 'early' in samples..? Just curious.
Old 15th January 2003
  #14
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groundcontrol's Avatar
 

Usually I make a copy of the track to a new playlist and shift it earlier.
Old 15th January 2003
  #15
Old 16th January 2003
  #16
jho
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jho's Avatar
 

I've been either not doing it or sliding if it sounded like it needed it. tut tut

So Jules (or whomever) with TA, do you insert it following the plug in's on the channel in question? And is the bottom slider 'moving it forward' that many samples? sorry for the ingorance...I'd been following the Dye method for no compensation for delays heh heh
Old 16th January 2003
  #17
Lives for gear
 
Mike Jasper's Avatar
Quote:
Never worked with Pro Tools... but damn having to think/consider/account for all that seems about as far away from "making music" as you can get.
It is. And it's the one thing they should fix as soon as possible because everyone knows it's broken.

People can argue digital sterility vs. analog warmth, whether the mix bus is flawed or not, and hot vs. safe tracking levels all day long. And they'll get many opinions on either side of the issue.

But everyone knows plug-in and general latency delay sucks. There might be discussions as to how much delay there is, but everyone knows it's there.

I think automatic delay compensation should be Digidesign's number one priority. I can't think of a better gift to their sales and marketing departments, let alone endusers.

Jasper
Old 17th January 2003
  #18
Here for the gear
 

no low-latency yet

Quote:
I think automatic delay compensation should be Digidesign's number one priority. I can't think of a better gift to their sales and marketing departments, let alone endusers.
Hearhear.

I think latency times are greater using PTLE. Can someone verify this?

Thanks no ssl ---- sticky note that!
Old 29th January 2003
  #19
mml
Gear Addict
 
mml's Avatar
 

delay

I just want to clarify that you're using the number given when you apple click on the volume display in PT? Also, the number is in samples, correct? Thanks for the info! I think it is longer in LE, but I'll let you know once I get an answer.
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