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What's Hi-end these days? I'm not seeing it here. Consoles
Old 16th December 2002
  #31
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally posted by alphajerk
i lost a project this past year to someone who doesnt know what they are doing and didnt charge them ANYTHING... thats even more insulting.
Been there....
Old 16th December 2002
  #32
Quote:
Originally posted by mwagener
In the early 90s the music style went into a different direction and budgets for the music projects that I liked went from $ 600,000 down to $ 30,000. In order to still be able to do projects the way I wanted to, I had to get my own studio.

Joe Blow, who thinks he can make a quality recording in his bedroom with that cheap equipment and no experience in recording whatsoever?
The artist, who thinks Joe Blow is the sh*t, because he can fix anything that the artist can't perform well.
This all gets to the nub of the matter in my opinion. Don't always blame the Pro Tools guy.
I write film & TV music. The producers of programmes don't actually rate music that highly and are often quite happy to use library music or anything they can buy cheap off a club compilation. Therefore music budgets have been plummeting.
My average budget for a 1 hour programme is $4-$5,000 - which includes my wages. When you hear what the director has been using as temp music it can often be Radiohead or Coldplay - properly recorded over several months. I've usually got a few days to come up with something similar. Even if I could book a tracking room in less than a day, how would I ever be able to afford it.
I'd also like to write and record my own project. Am I expected to tour labels (as an over 40 yr old) with demos trying to get a deal big enough to afford a proper studio and producer? I'd LOVE it if that happened. The reality is no one is interested in me, or thousands like me. If I make my own music at home on Pro Tools I know I'm not a properly schooled engineer, I know the quality of the production isn't as good as it should be. What do you want me to do? Retire?
Things are a little different here than in the US. In the UK the music biz is split 3 ways (generally speaking).
1. Pop charts - usually very young, all dance routines etc.
2. Rock - again very young. Labels wont sign anything unless they've seen it is a true band who are willing to slog it out on the live circuit for a certain amount of time first.
3. The dance and indie market. Here a lot of records are homemade. It doesn't matter who you are, how old you are and what you look like. This is largely the only area left for the over 30yr old interested in songs (indie) or progressive electronics and computer software (dance).
Going back briefly to SM's original question (seems off topic now), the reason the Api Legacy and the Slam haven't cropped up very often is that I'm guessing most people on the forum don't own them. If they do they're too busy working to pay for them.
Old 16th December 2002
  #33
Lives for gear
 
Knox's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by slipperman
Hello fellas.

Holy Cow did this heat up in my absence!

Yay.

Uhm. I really wanna post tonight but I'm shotski from a MADHOUSE day of workee(I'll mail you a timestamped video of me working, Knox. HOHO) so I'm gonna pass until tommorrow when(hopefully) I'll get a break to think about it some and formulate a post.

Great to see you MW.

I have always been a big fan of your stuff.

Going home now.

Guten Abend.


SM.

Damn SM . . it's only 5:03 AM our time and you are going home?
What kind of short work days you working?
Old 16th December 2002
  #34
Morning!

"I think we all know, no one is ever going to get rich booking studio time. It's songwriting / publishing, finding acts, production deal, etc. that will allow us to make real money"

I belive this that statement to be true also IMHO.

---------------------------

Knox - I recomend diversify and that you get into the TRACK & GO business.

Market your studios accoustic spaces, mic locker & pre amps & compressors combined with your experience..

Set up bands to track

Then HELP them - transfer the sh!t to their preferred DAW format.. A native DAW rig (motu / rme hammerfall) will do ya..

Then wave them off with a teary smile, with a last word in their ear that they might want to concider mixing at your place once everything has been overdubbed, edited and tuned out of all recognition..

Presently I hire large rooms to do just that. You could market the service to all the guys with DAWs we've just been discussing. Dont resent these guys, try and 'bring em in' and make money off of em!
---------------------------------

I would dearly love a LARGE roomed tracking facility

With

Mics/stands/foldback/mic lines
Trident B 32 ch desk
Wired for 2"/PT/Radar/MOTU - rented in per project
Pool table
low budget decor - work or leave! - tracking only
Fun / cheap large monitors ? JBL
Midfields - rented in per project
Old 16th December 2002
  #35
Lives for gear
 
Knox's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by slipperman
Oh. It gets even better Knox. Just as I was ABOUT to leave(had my friggin' coat on) and the +5v rail on one of the power supplies for the desk in 'B' goes croaky in the middle of one of our infamous 'All niters'(You know. The guys who don't EVER sleep). session.... Great.

I knocked off my mix at about 4:30am. The chief tech blew outta here about 3:30. Guess who that leaves at the helm?

25 minutes of frantic work later... They're back up and running.(I swapped it out for a back up, as far as my tech knowlege will carry me) Now I'm kinda paranoid to go home. Looks like the old office couch again tonight. My session in 'A' starts at 1pm. tomorrow. Why bother leaving. Good thing we've got a shower. HOHO.

Madness.

Now it's about 6:10am. Why I'm sitting here typing on this thing is totally beyond me....

OK. Time to stop.

SM.

Come on now SM . . . . get back to work! You have had too much time these days . . . . . it's 9:35 AM (you going to sleep your damn life away?) . . . you could be listening to different dolby settiings and the effect triplet delays have on them, as opposed to sleeping. You aren't serious about this business!
Old 16th December 2002
  #36
Lives for gear
 
Kris's Avatar
Quote:
Originally posted by Bob Olhsson
Hang in there Knox! I sincerely believe that music will swing back to being performance-centric as opposed to production-centric. I think this is true simply because great performances will be the only thing that can stand out from the sea of overproduced mediocrity that has resulted from the rapid decline in the cost of production. Production as an end in itself must fail financially because we all only buy entertainment that we consider to be exceptional. This came crashing home to me the first time I saw a kid putting a track together in Acid. There is no longer any need to pay for competent but mediocre music. The bar for music that can earn a living has been raised dramatically by the "home studio revolution."

I'm with you Mr. Olhsson...

I know a good bunch of killer bands/musicians who are fully dedicated to making it in this business, and will, based firstly on their live performance. North Florida must not be such a bad place to be these days... I've seen many great live performances lately put on by people with huge talent and potential.

I've got some web links to prove it. dfegad
Old 17th December 2002
  #37
There is only one
 
alphajerk's Avatar
 

keep flaming... we dont want those pricks over here anyway.
Old 17th December 2002
  #38
Gear Maniac
 
RSMITH123's Avatar
 

Well, I must say... SM, you are either getting comfortable here and letting your guard down or you are suffering from extreme MPD. (Multiple personality disorder).

Whatever the case, I have to say I like the kinder gentler SM. Gives me a chance to see what it's really like to run a place.
Old 17th December 2002
  #39
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
It's all work hat for me here. I promise. You can hold me to it.
... so how bout that reply about 'heavily distorted guitars' and that "chugga-chugga" sound you were gonna post about?

Old 17th December 2002
  #40
Lives for gear
 
Knox's Avatar
 

I was thinking that SM was schizophrenic, now I see how wrong I was . . . . he's frikkin' quadraphenic. Which could actually make for some good posts.

1. PSW Slipperman (that doesn't actually work in the business . . just types long winded bull**** and needs to get laid . . hopefully by a human, but I don't think he really cares)

2. GS SM (it's killing him that his PSW friends now think he is a GS puss but he actually likes being here but will probably go back over there when they bust him too hard about it . . . . as he has very little self esteem. We will miss him like we would a bad set of eyeball cancer)

3. Betty SM (the SM that wears dresses on Saturday evenings and works 8th Ave. . . . she is well known during AES when it is in NYC)

4. Normal SM who seems like he MIGHT know a couple of things and might be alright despite his breath.
********************

SM . . . . the scene in this town is ok to fair . . . hip hop and rap IS predominant. I don't do it. As stated, I'm a live tracking guy. I get several independent releases in here a year (small labels) and more band releases. I would like to attract more REAL album projects.

Glad to have you here . . enjoyed your post. I almost believe it!
Old 17th December 2002
  #41
FWIW, I know who 'slipperman' is and can vouch for him - he owns a really kewl place that most all of us have heard of...

You can learn from this guy.
Old 17th December 2002
  #42
Gear Maniac
 
cram's Avatar
 

Quote:
FWIW, I know who 'slipperman' is and can vouch for him - he owns a really kewl place that most all of us have heard of...
Ditto.

Old 17th December 2002
  #43
Gear Maniac
 
RSMITH123's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Brad Blackwood
... You can learn from this guy.

That was my point. Well my 2nd point. The first being that it is nice seeing him a little more laid back here at GS.
Old 17th December 2002
  #44
Lives for gear
 
Knox's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Brad Blackwood
FWIW, I know who 'slipperman' is and can vouch for him - he owns a really kewl place that most all of us have heard of...

You can learn from this guy.
I know Brad . . . I'm just giving him a rough time.
I'm sure he looks good in a dress.
Old 17th December 2002
  #45
Lives for gear
 
C.Lambrechts's Avatar
 

I hate it when everyone knows stuff and I run around going huh what who where what why is it my fault ????


madd
Old 17th December 2002
  #46
Lives for gear
 
Knox's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by C.Lambrechts
I hate it when everyone knows stuff and I run around going huh what who where what why is it my fault ????
madd
How do you think you ended up with Pro Tools and not have tape machine?
Old 17th December 2002
  #47
Gear Maniac
 
cram's Avatar
 

Quote:
Got about 400 words in and hadn't hit the tip of the iceberg. Gave up in disgust.
It took you 400 words to say, "EQ it out????"

Brevity.
Old 17th December 2002
  #48
Lives for gear
 
C.Lambrechts's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Knox
How do you think you ended up with Pro Tools and not have tape machine?


LOL, but I do have a tape machine ... a nice sounding 16 track MCI 2 inch.
Old 17th December 2002
  #49
Lives for gear
 
C.Lambrechts's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by cram
It took you 400 words to say, "EQ it out????"

Brevity.

heh heh
Old 17th December 2002
  #50
Slipperman,

Are you aware of the following handy forums?, I think you can make good use of them.

The Moan Zone
The Good News Channel

I think folks will folow you there, topics raised will be flagged in a regular View new Posts search..

They really are a free for all designed for 'venting'.

Old 17th December 2002
  #51
Lives for gear
 
Knox's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Jules
Slipperman,

Are you aware of the following handy forums?, I think you can make good use of them.

The Moan Zone
The Good News Channel

I think folks will folow you there, topics raised will be flagged in a regular View new Posts search..

They really are a free for all designed for 'venting'.

LOLOL! That's PERFECT Jules.

I think there is also a "Multiple Personality Disorder Forum" at yahoo as well.
He can yell at his self, taunt his self, even cry with himself. He can post how he hates GS, then answer his self about how he likes GS.
Old 17th December 2002
  #52
Lives for gear
 
Fibes's Avatar
 

So you say you like the 827 better huh? I thought I liked you but now I'm not sure.:eek:

I covered part of that whoomp guitar thing for you SM. No need to give out too much useful information to the weak sponge brigade too quickly.

SM,

I hope you keep up the new leaf. I think it's already providing the answer you seek...
Old 17th December 2002
  #53
Gear Maniac
 
cram's Avatar
 

Punch Drunk?

Awwwww, man...

Slippy, I hit you with a good-un and it didn't even register? I must've caught you on the top of your head or sumthin.
Old 18th December 2002
  #54
Gear Maniac
 
cram's Avatar
 

Quote:
Did you design that 'sexy' looking blue Dbx compressor(model # escapes me, sorry)? I havn't heard it, but it looks mean as all git-out. That thing's gotta cost a few piasters huh? I see your title says TechSupp, but sometimes you guys wear a lotta hats.
We do wear a lot of hats around here, but alas, I had no hand in the design of the Blue Series. The only thing I can take credit for is keeping the hope alive. I bugged the crap out of our President about Blue Series visibility, pricing, possible model additions etc. I'd like to think that some sunk in, but I doubt it. I'm only a peon after all.
Old 18th December 2002
  #55
Lives for gear
 
Renie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by C.Lambrechts
I hate it when everyone knows stuff and I run around going huh what who where what why is it my fault ????


madd
This is exactly what I like about you!!
oooh, except the fault bit!!!! it's none of your fault....
Old 18th December 2002
  #56
Lives for gear
 
Knox's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by slipperman
PS. I'm still waiting for somebody to post about the 'large frame analog' equipment discussions/issues I raised at the top of the thread. Happy to use the forum for these type of exchanges. It's really more of what I was hoping for here anyway.
I don't work at outside studios like I used to as I am pretty happy here in my place.

I have had horrible SSL experiences in the past. Now, that said . . it was years ago . . though it left a bitter taste in my mouth, as the experiences I had were really bad. I hate the way they sound. Though I realize . . . people are really used to that sound now. From what I hear on the streets, they do sound much better now. I don't care . . I wouldn't work on one. SSL stands for Sure Sounds Lousy in my book.

I love 80 series Neves . . . . I used to fly to Sigma in Philly to work on their old 80 series Neve for soul stuff (great sounding old board with a zillion hits) and there was a studio here (Triclops) that had an old 80 series that was a great rock and roll room that I used to work in. Daniel Lanois now has it.

I did a big string section on a Euphonix a couple of years ago and it didn't move me at all. I have a friend that has one at another studio and it doesn't excite me in the least. (as far as mixes I hear)

API desks . . . I dig em. I guess if I had the choice and the money . . I would either buy a 80 series or an API. Of course API is not for everything, nor does it give you the ability to NOT screw up like a Neve. (I think you know what I mean). Sometimes the Neve seems slow or squishy compared to an API. I know some that feel it's the other way around.

Old Trident stuff . . . it's cool, even Quad 8.

Sadly, there was a 9098 in town that was yanked because people wanted SSLs and he couldn't keep the room booked with the 9098. I never had a chance to work on it. I would imagine that is a hell of a desk.
Old 18th December 2002
  #57
Lives for gear
 
sonic dogg's Avatar
ahhhh paaaa (jules) let him stay an say where he wants ta...hes funny.....course over at the udder place hes mean....so to speak...course if you leave out the right cookies in the right place i spose the mice 'll find em anyway........
Old 18th December 2002
  #58
Quote:
Originally posted by Knox
I don't work at outside studios like I used to as I am pretty happy here in my place.

I have had horrible SSL experiences in the past. Now, that said . . it was years ago . . though it left a bitter taste in my mouth, as the experiences I had were really bad. I hate the way they sound. Though I realize . . . people are really used to that sound now. From what I hear on the streets, they do sound much better now. I don't care . . I wouldn't work on one. SSL stands for Sure Sounds Lousy in my book.

I love 80 series Neves . . . . I used to fly to Sigma in Philly to work on their old 80 series Neve for soul stuff (great sounding old board with a zillion hits) and there was a studio here (Triclops) that had an old 80 series that was a great rock and roll room that I used to work in. Daniel Lanois now has it.

I did a big string section on a Euphonix a couple of years ago and it didn't move me at all. I have a friend that has one at another studio and it doesn't excite me in the least. (as far as mixes I hear)

API desks . . . I dig em. I guess if I had the choice and the money . . I would either buy a 80 series or an API. Of course API is not for everything, nor does it give you the ability to NOT screw up like a Neve. (I think you know what I mean). Sometimes the Neve seems slow or squishy compared to an API. I know some that feel it's the other way around.

Old Trident stuff . . . it's cool, even Quad 8.

Sadly, there was a 9098 in town that was yanked because people wanted SSLs and he couldn't keep the room booked with the 9098. I never had a chance to work on it. I would imagine that is a hell of a desk.
Hey Knox,

Its funny with me it was totally the opposite. I have a lot bad experiences working on un kept Neve's and Api's(Late 80's-mid 90's). Sure I've worked on tempermental SSL's(especially in rooms that weren't ventilated right it was a freaking nightmare).

The last Api I tried to mix on here in the city was over at the Pyramid Studio(It was bought from the Bad Animals studio in Seattle). I'll go on record and saying that I would choose an SSL to mix on anyday than Api. I think certain styles of music lend itself better, and the lack of functions is a big drawback. I know most guys like the simplicity, but when you have to go to extremes to give people a sound, the SSL is better.

There are only 2 9098I's in town that I know of. The one over at the Wu Tang studio(formerly Skyline) and the one in NJ Big Blue Meenie. I've used the one over at the Wu's place(its really a split 9098), and i thought about purchasing it from them before I acquired my SSL. Its just there were too many politics behind it, so I walked away.

I know Fletcher has used the one over at Big Blue Meenie. They are great consoles. There are things the 9000J does better. Its a different sound. The comps are much better on 9000J. The 9000J is more sterile sounding, while the 9098I has a sound.

By the way Slipperman, next year I will be mixing a Ballywood record on one of the K's at the Hit Factory. I will be able to kick its tires and give it a test run.
Old 18th December 2002
  #59
Got to say I concur with Knox although I'm always on the other side of the control room window. Producers and engineers I've spoken to have always regarded the SSL as a neccesary evil. Better the devil you know and all that. I was amazed on a recent thread when people were discussing trying to find outboard SSL eq's.
Anyway I love the compressor.
IMO the really top studios in London have always gone with Neve. SSL is more regarded as a jobbing console. Did you know the largest ever Api console installation was at a London studios: RAK. Funny thing is the owner specialised in trashy glam rock at the time.
It amazes me that so many studios have thrown out superb sounding Neve's in favour of an upgrade. I guess it makes business sense. I did a session on a Capricorn once. Can't say it thrilled me. The vibe was opitomised by me asking the engineer to dial a tiny bit of top on to the vocal. 3 or 4 page scrolls later and a lot of fussing with edit buttons and knobs..........
Old 18th December 2002
  #60
All the cool old Neves in the UK were sold to the US.

grudge

Bands and managers mostly dont know the diff between a new or an old Neve so the 'cachet' of the Neve brand sadly lives on with the V series..



It's either them or SSL's here..

dfegad
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