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Why do you NOT use/need Pro Tools HD? Digital Converters
View Poll Results: Why do you NOT use/need Pro Tools HD?
I don't need PTHD for stability.
57 Votes - 38.51%
My preferred DAW is easy enough to use for me.
78 Votes - 52.70%
With direct monitoring I'll get with lower latencies than I would with TDM.
36 Votes - 24.32%
I use buffer sizes which allow effect inserts during record. Latency = no problem.
30 Votes - 20.27%
I don't need TDM plug-ins / I need plugs in other formats.
48 Votes - 32.43%
PTHD/TDM plug-ins are too expensive. I'll rather buy some other gear instead.
72 Votes - 48.65%
A system not needing a large computer or expansion chassis is more portable.
30 Votes - 20.27%
Compatibility with others using my preferred DAW.
20 Votes - 13.51%
I don't need PT HD for sound quality.
86 Votes - 58.11%
My DAW may or may not have a steeper learning curve, but it's 'deeper' than PT HD.
50 Votes - 33.78%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 148. You may not vote on this poll

Old 16th August 2007
  #1
Lives for gear
 
nativeaudio's Avatar
 

Why do you NOT use/need Pro Tools HD?

Instead of yet another pro/con TDM thread, this is intended to be a simple poll to see what people's reasons are for using their non-TDM systems. It's not an attempt of staring another DAW war!

You can vote for as many options you want.

I'm not claiming that all the answers are 'valid', but have included these 10 answers because these are among the most common reasons I've heard. I wanted to add more, but there's a limit of 10 reply options - this list doesn't intend to be complete.

There may be more non-TDM users in other sub-forums, but I still post it here (in the High End section) since I'm interested in how people evaluate non-TDM setups for professional work.
Old 16th August 2007
  #2
Gear Head
 

For me Logic has a more creative workflow. I have protools LE when i need to use beat detective when I have too, then import the results back into logic. Why Logic hasn't come up with a "beat det" program to edit multitrack drums is beyond me. Beat Det has been around for years.
People talk about the sound differences of the different softwares, after listening to Lyn Fustons summing CD i got bored trying to spot microscopic differences. I decided that the "creativity" of Logic trumped protools and that was way more important in the big picture. Also money was better spent elsewhere on hardware. However, i'll keep checking from time to time that i'm not missing out staying on Logic.

Cheers, btw the symphony /Apogee DA16x works great and sounds cool and the gang wih logic. Fresh, exciting, she's everything to me.
Old 16th August 2007
  #3
Lives for gear
 
Andrew Kinsey's Avatar
 

The one answer that you mised was:

I don't need HD because my converters are better than those found in Digi Hardware!

Old 16th August 2007
  #4
Lives for gear
 
Sugarnutz's Avatar
The one for me (not in the poll) is that I use PT Mix+ due to mostly economic factors. It does what I need and I didn't have to take a loan or raid the kid's college fund. All my stuff is paid for and that makes a huge difference in that if I don't want to work on a project, I don't have to, been there/done that with $300K in gear and a $8K/month nut to crack. Music is supposed to be "Fun", that's why I got into this in the first place. heh
Old 16th August 2007
  #5
Gear Guru
 
AllAboutTone's Avatar
 

none of the above....just don't need PT period to function on a high scale.
Old 16th August 2007
  #6
Lives for gear
 

Ummm, what about the obvious...mixing OTB?
Old 16th August 2007
  #7
File sharing has eliminated the need for a dedicated Pro Tools system. Everything here besides the HDR's is analog. I can still import any type of files into my system. I can still edit until I puke. Or not.

The best part is come mix time, it goes just like it has for 30 years, no computers. All the plugs are TRS and XLR. Sometimes I'll match up a mix in the computer just to show folks how inferior it sounds as a real time AB comparison is as easy as puching down the 2 track monitor button on the console.

Jim Williams
Audio Upgrades
Old 16th August 2007
  #8
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Kinsey View Post
The one answer that you mised was:

I don't need HD because my converters are better than those found in Digi Hardware!


What converters are you using?
Old 16th August 2007
  #9
Gear Maniac
 

Hello,
We use Nuendo instead of PTHD because -
I get better, faster results with Nuendo.
- editing speed
- conforming speed
I get higher track count for a given amount of RU.
I'm not limited to specific hardware.
I can do absurdly large projects on a laptop.
Sound quality, although HD is much better than the old stuff.
More stable.

We can use any platform we like, at any price. Nuendo does it for us.
H
Old 16th August 2007
  #10
Lives for gear
 
taturana's Avatar
i am a very satisfied sonar user myself....no use for PT at all
Old 16th August 2007
  #11
Moderator
 
TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

Here is my post from this thread's sister thread.. I thought it was relevant to post this here as well:

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/1439987-post40.html
Old 17th August 2007
  #12
Gear Maniac
 
hurd300403's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by taturana View Post
i am a very satisfied sonar user myself....no use for PT at all

+1
Old 17th August 2007
  #13
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBelmont View Post
Here is my post from this thread's sister thread.. I thought it was relevant to post this here as well:

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/1439987-post40.html
good post tony.
Old 17th August 2007
  #14
Lives for gear
 
bexarametric's Avatar
 

Who said PT had better sound quality? This poll suggests it does. Without getting into 2 inch and Radar, I would go as far as to say that PT isn't even the best sounding DAW (if there's a way to measure it). I find it unacceptable that one of the poll choices suggests that PT sound quality is superior to other formats. I actually find it rather ignorant.

EDIT - I see that you said that all your answers were not "valid". My bad.
Old 17th August 2007
  #15
Gear Addict
 
dillweed's Avatar
good one

Nuendo through 48ch Apogee converters- SSl 4056 for me

Way cheaper than p.t HD and an Icon.
(i think.. hard to find concrete prices on all this digi stuff.. it seems really over priced to me though.. feel free to flame me on this one.)

I love Nuendo. Pro-tools looks and feels so stone age comparitively.
can't wait till Nuendo 4.
Old 17th August 2007
  #16
Gear Guru
 
AllAboutTone's Avatar
 

The artist that i have heard that recorded their CD of PT just seems Sterile to me. That market has not impressed me yet,
Old 17th August 2007
  #17
Gear Maniac
 
antonbuys's Avatar
 

What about the simple cost of an HD System?

Oops, nothing like "simple cost" for an HD system. Too expensive for what I need. Logic Pro, Apogee Ensemble and Mackie HUI does what I need. PowerCore and Duende takes care of most plug-in needs. thumbsup

Would I like to use an HD system? I have to admit, the ICON is one sexy "mouse"... If it was about 50% cheaper for an HD2/HD3 system, then, yeah, I just might be tempted.

US$13,995 (list) for 3 "aging" DSP cards and just the DAW software is steep in my books.tutt
Old 17th August 2007
  #18
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Andrew Kinsey's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by pikapikapi View Post
What converters are you using?
Im using Nuendo with Lavry Gold converters.

The Gold's arn't cheap but still more economical compared to getting an HD rig which doesn't have the same level of sound quality.

Also the other advantage with using native DAW's like Nuendo is that most computers now have CPU performance that exceed's the capabilities of HD3.

So by using Nuendo + Lavry im getting more processing power, and better conversion at a much lower price point than HD3!

Old 17th August 2007
  #19
Lives for gear
 

1st: price by given performance and quality

i´m using nuendo + rosetta 200 and have equal to better results than with the HD3 in my mate´s studio.

sure it´s nice to have an HD3 cause of the popularity and it´s "name", but i´m more oriented on the best result than penis-enlargement.
Old 17th August 2007
  #20
no ssl yet
Guest
What's the purpose of the ? Do digi haters simply need somewhere to unite?

I don't see a thread here saying why you do NOT use any other DAW.

(Is it really this serious?)
Old 17th August 2007
  #21
Lives for gear
 
nativeaudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
I don't see a thread here saying why you do NOT use any other DAW.
The thread was created after some people not using PT participated in another thread called 'Why do you need/use Po Tools?' to explain why they they did not need or use it. A separate thread seemed like a better solution.

The other thread is here:
Why do you need/use Pro Tools HD?
Old 19th August 2007
  #22
I expect this thread will soon need to be included in the computer models of global warming.

For the kind of production I do, ProTools would be a step down from my current DAW. There are a number of things that ProTools does better (complex routing is one), but for my work, I have to prioritize sonic quality and features for complex editing. My audio production is now done almost entirely in this environment. I also like the fact that more and more mastering engineers are switching to my DAW, so I have fewer and fewer worries about file compatibility.

I don't mean this to be an advertisement, so I won't mention which DAW I use -- readers who are truly interested can do a search to find out.

David L. Rick
Seventh String Recording
Old 19th August 2007
  #23
Gear Head
 

Purely a cost issue for me, at the moment im doing music purely for passion and as such logic is the only system that is really within my financial grasp.
However from the times i have used pro tools (however limited they are) i have throughly enjoyed the experience, hopefully soon i'll start making money from my music and i'll be able to afford a pro tools rig :D

baybud
Old 19th August 2007
  #24
Lives for gear
 
T_R_S's Avatar
[QUOTE=Andrew Kinsey;1442314
Also the other advantage with using native DAW's like Nuendo is that most computers now have CPU performance that exceed's the capabilities of HD3.
[/QUOTE]
That is not true because with DSP cards you have outboard DSP AND CPU DSP.
Plus I don't know too many native systems that can support 96 channels of I/O like HD3
Old 19th August 2007
  #25
Lives for gear
 
Andrew Kinsey's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by T_R_S View Post
That is not true because with DSP cards you have outboard DSP AND CPU DSP.
Plus I don't know too many native systems that can support 96 channels of I/O like HD3
Pyramix
Nuendo

Im sure there are quite a few others than will do 96 channels.

Also with regards to DSP cards, the same applies to Native DAW's.
UAD-1 card, Powercore, Duende, Creamware cards, etc..

Personally i never usually come close to running out of CPU power as i dont like the sound of soft synths and most of my signal processing is done with outboard.

Old 19th August 2007
  #26
Lives for gear
 
sonicdefault's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Rick View Post
I expect this thread will soon need to be included in the computer models of global warming.

For the kind of production I do, ProTools would be a step down from my current DAW. There are a number of things that ProTools does better (complex routing is one), but for my work, I have to prioritize sonic quality and features for complex editing. My audio production is now done almost entirely in this environment. I also like the fact that more and more mastering engineers are switching to my DAW, so I have fewer and fewer worries about file compatibility.

I don't mean this to be an advertisement, so I won't mention which DAW I use -- readers who are truly interested can do a search to find out.

David L. Rick
Seventh String Recording

David, what kind of SDCs are those in your avatar? Are they by chance MA-100s?
Old 19th August 2007
  #27
Lives for gear
 
sonicdefault's Avatar
IMO, unless ProTools opens up, it's going down.
Old 19th August 2007
  #28
Lives for gear
 
abit's Avatar
 

Been there.
Did that.
I'm not milking cow.
Thanx
tutt
Old 19th August 2007
  #29
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DSD_Mastering's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Kinsey View Post
I don't need HD because my converters are better than those found in Digi Hardware!
Same here... Besides.. PT doesn't do DSD.

Regards,
Bruce
Old 19th August 2007
  #30
Lives for gear
 
T_R_S's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Kinsey View Post
Also with regards to DSP cards, the same applies to Native DAW's.
UAD-1 card, Powercore, Duende, Creamware cards, etc..
What 3rd party Plug-ins do those support?
Latency? Can you record and Live mix at the same time with all of those?
Can you record through all of those as you track?
Do they have the same abount of PDSP power of an accel?
Can I run a system with 7 cards?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Kinsey View Post
Pyramix
Nuendo

Im sure there are quite a few others than will do 96 channels.
Do you have to buy and use 3rd party interfaces?
Do you have to use 3rd part Drivers?
Lantency? Stablilty? Industry Standards?
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