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Neve vs SSL
Old 8th December 2019
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquidaudio View Post
Belgian here (Anvers) I bought my 4000G from AES Pro Audio in the UK, They make cut down versions. I have a 16 channel without automation, planning to expand with more buckets, so I have a modular SSL as my budget grows over the years. Wish I could blow 50000 euros myself in one go!

If you want a Neve VR well that's their other speciality, they make 36 channel versions. Seems enough for me. They recap em clean em up, make them like new.

My SSL is like it's factory fresh, well at least on the inside, but I like a little wear.\

The SSL will give punch like nothing else, if you want the butter you get some Neve pres. It's the classic combo.
Yeah they have the mini ones or you could get a full
Sized one ready to go. Looks good
Old 8th December 2019
  #32
Gear Nut
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Youcef View Post
The Trident 88 sounds very good but there is no automation.
For the duo: ssl aws with x-desk is great combo, however I'll go with a Matrix with x-rack.
Actually they have tri mix for it. I’ve seen one studio beta testing it. Now when it actually comes to market is the quandary
Old 8th December 2019
  #33
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Would the Matrix give you enough inputs/ sends/ routing? It’s a 16 channel console with 16 extra inputs that, as far as I understand, don’t access the aux sends. It’s a main reason I didn’t go that route
Old 8th December 2019
  #34
Gear Head
 

I found a 4000g on vintage king.
I visited AES's website and I think i will buy two buckets of 8 faders.
Old 8th December 2019
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Youcef View Post
I found a 4000g on vintage king.
I visited AES's website and I think i will buy two buckets of 8 faders.
No doubt that’s a cool rig. I’d love one.
But the power ouch! I think I read that it’s like $15 per day on the stock power supplies and $5 per day on the Atomic. I’d definitely get an Atomic and Tangerine and pray to ride the rock n roll market if there is one.
Old 8th December 2019
  #36
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by elamberth View Post
Would the Matrix give you enough inputs/ sends/ routing? It’s a 16 channel console with 16 extra inputs that, as far as I understand, don’t access the aux sends. It’s a main reason I didn’t go that route
I'll go for the combo SSL AWS + SSL Matrix, that provides me enough i/o and great daw integration.
Old 8th December 2019
  #37
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Digiplex View Post
No doubt that’s a cool rig. I’d love one.
But the power ouch! I think I read that it’s like $15 per day on the stock power supplies and $5 per day on the Atomic. I’d definitely get an Atomic and Tangerine and pray to ride the rock n roll market if there is one.
What... 5k per day. I know the running costs are high, but...
Old 8th December 2019
  #38
Gear Maniac
 
Liquidaudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Youcef View Post
Very nice setup.
Record on an old Trident 70 series, mix on an SSL 4000.
Thanks man, hard work pays off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Digiplex View Post
Yeah they have the mini ones or you could get a full
Sized one ready to go. Looks good
I can only recommend, Michael Stockdale the owner is a great guy, really helpful. They also do full sized consoles, not just the baby SSL's.
Old 8th December 2019
  #39
Gear Maniac
 
Liquidaudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Digiplex View Post
No doubt that’s a cool rig. I’d love one.
But the power ouch! I think I read that it’s like $15 per day on the stock power supplies and $5 per day on the Atomic. I’d definitely get an Atomic and Tangerine and pray to ride the rock n roll market if there is one.
It's only how much current the console pulls, a 16 channel SSL isn't really that much of a sponge. I have one of those old original power supplies. The thing is overpowered where I'm able to feed double the channel count. It's not doing much when I power it up. I'm planning on getting 8 more channels from AES, saving up.

Why would you need so many channels when everything ends up in Pro Tools anyway, you can buss everything down anyway. Something to think about Youcef, trying to save you money.

We're not dealing with tape machines anymore, something these things were designed around in the first place.
Old 8th December 2019
  #40
Gear Nut
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquidaudio View Post
It's only how much current the console pulls, a 16 channel SSL isn't really that much of a sponge. I have one of those old original power supplies. The thing is overpowered where I'm able to feed double the channel count. It's not doing much when I power it up. I'm planning on getting 8 more channels from AES, saving up.
Yes I was looking at one of those from aes as well.
Since you can double the channel count and sum it all well that’s just cool. But that’s good to know it’s not a hog on the juice. Maybe that would work for me. I saw a video last week of a 4K and he just got the Atomic and mentioned the costs. Ymmv
Old 8th December 2019
  #41
Gear Maniac
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Youcef View Post
The Trident 88 sounds very good but there is no automation.
For the duo: ssl aws with x-desk is great combo, however I'll go with a Matrix with x-rack.
Matrix is nice, I mean a really nice beautiful smart little console. But a fully modular built analog console with separate channels is still a save bet for the future.

But yea these old consoles are classics which are easy to maintain if parts are still available. I would be sure to buy some extra channels for parts, because buying the separate parts is probably going to cost more than buying a full channel you can stock somewhere, AES sells G channels for 325 pounds sterling.

The value on the Matrix is gonna drop like crazy because they just get outdated after a while, there's too much digital hocus pocus in these things which is already outdated as soon as these things get out the factory because it's all constantly evolving digital technology. Look at the old Digidesign C24 console, those things were selling like hot cakes, look at it now.
The Matrix is China built prosumer, which means they cut costs, and it's aimed at the serious project studio. Same with the SiX, beautiful products however.

Think of it like smartphones.
Old 8th December 2019
  #42
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquidaudio View Post
Matrix is nice, I mean a really nice beautiful smart little console. But a fully modular built analog console with separate channels is still a save bet for the future.

But yea these old consoles are classics which are easy to maintain if parts are still available. I would be sure to buy some extra channels for parts, because buying the separate parts is probably going to cost more than buying a full channel you can stock somewhere, AES sells G channels for 325 pounds sterling.

The value on the Matrix is gonna drop like crazy because they just get outdated after a while, there's too much digital hocus pocus in these things which is already outdated as soon as these things get out the factory because it's all constantly evolving digital technology. Look at the old Digidesign C24 console, those things were selling like hot cakes, look at it now.
The Matrix is China built prosumer, which means they cut costs, and it's aimed at the serious project studio. Same with the SiX, beautiful products however.

Think of it like smartphones.
Do you think old SSL will always be a great mixing desk in 10 or 20 years.
Old 8th December 2019
  #43
Gear Maniac
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Youcef View Post
Do you think old SSL will always be a great mixing desk in 10 or 20 years.
Matrix hasn't made Nevermind, The Queen is Dead, or Master of Puppets possible.
Old 8th December 2019
  #44
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquidaudio View Post
Matrix hasn't made Nevermind, The Queen is Dead, or Master of Puppets possible.
I understood, SSL 4000 is a tool wich definds mixing and it will always be a great console. But will it be easy to maintain and what about the aviability of spare parts.
Old 8th December 2019
  #45
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elamberth's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Youcef View Post
I found a 4000g on vintage king.
I visited AES's website and I think i will buy two buckets of 8 faders.
If 16 channels of an inline console is enough for you, that opens up other options- Neve Genesys.
Old 8th December 2019
  #46
Gear Maniac
 
Liquidaudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Youcef View Post
I understood, SSL 4000 is a tool wich definds mixing and it will always be a great console. But will it be easy to maintain and what about the aviability of spare parts.
With the right tech it will be easy to maintain, they made a lot of these because they were really popular consoles at the time. I would not worry about spare parts, a lot of it is generally off the shelf.
Old 8th December 2019
  #47
I second the Neve Genesys for a contender.
I was recently in the same boat as you and the thought of the (possible) headaches involved in maintaining an old console swung me towards the Genesys. I now have everything needed for a fully live recording straight to tape , fully analog and fully recall able and very high quality. Best decision I ever made and all usable from the sweet spot. I ain’t a shill for Neve , it just really is that good.
Old 9th December 2019
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquidaudio View Post
The value on the Matrix is gonna drop like crazy because they just get outdated after a while, there's too much digital hocus pocus in these things which is already outdated as soon as these things get out the factory because it's all constantly evolving digital technology. Look at the old Digidesign C24 console, those things were selling like hot cakes, look at it now.
The Matrix is China built prosumer, which means they cut costs, and it's aimed at the serious project studio. Same with the SiX, beautiful products however.

Think of it like smartphones.


Totally clueless

Last edited by jindrich; 9th December 2019 at 05:20 AM..
Old 9th December 2019
  #49
Gear Nut
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Youcef View Post
Do you think old SSL will always be a great mixing desk in 10 or 20 years.
I think if you did the upgrades to the power and automation yes. It’s gonna just be more modern and efficient that way. Plus you have that 4K sound which is pretty much classic. I’d go that route if I knew how to sell it. Heck I have trouble booking the room I have now.
So many bands are diy it’s just a hard thing to book.
I like the 9k too. I’ve seen those occasionally on Facebook.
I think I saw a 9040 last year for not a mint.
Old 9th December 2019
  #50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Youcef View Post
Do you think old SSL will always be a great mixing desk in 10 or 20 years.
Possibly, but no one will actually be using one for mixing in 20 years. People are barely using them now!

FWIW, if you absolutely have to buy a desk out of these 2, I’d go for the ssl. The VR was a bad design to start with, runs very hot, and some of the parts aren’t available anymore. If you want an AMS Neve, look at the 88R.

But honestly - I wouldn’t buy a mixing desk at this point. If you need a desk for tracking purposes (which I do like), I’d look at things like the Daking, and build it around a control surface. Track on the desk, mix itb and if you want sum through the desk, hardware as you see fit.

Best of both worlds. No clunky automation systems to deal with. Quick recall. Sonics as you want them.

I’d love to replace the VR at my studio with a Daking or RND console split around an S3 or something.
Old 9th December 2019
  #51
Gear Maniac
 
Liquidaudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jindrich View Post


Totally clueless
I don't really think I am.
Old 9th December 2019
  #52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquidaudio View Post
I don't really think I am.
not clueless. But a C24 is a controller, the matrix is a desk.

The Duality relies on the same tech; the Matrix won't be abandoned. I get what you're saying about being a tool for the smaller studio (and the six definitely) but it's also a tool for a different workflow. I don't think I'd want an AWS in my personal mix room; I might want a Matrix though, primarily as a controller with tracking abilities. Does that make me less of a pro? I don't think so...I just need different facilities!

It's still got the pro level of support.
Old 9th December 2019
  #53
Gear Addict
 

Neve VS SSL console ? So eighties Question !
Old 9th December 2019
  #54
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by elamberth View Post
If 16 channels of an inline console is enough for you, that opens up other options- Neve Genesys.
I'm going to buy SSL 48 channels, then add 2 channel buckets.
Old 9th December 2019
  #55
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
not clueless. But a C24 is a controller, the matrix is a desk.

The Duality relies on the same tech; the Matrix won't be abandoned. I get what you're saying about being a tool for the smaller studio (and the six definitely) but it's also a tool for a different workflow. I don't think I'd want an AWS in my personal mix room; I might want a Matrix though, primarily as a controller with tracking abilities. Does that make me less of a pro? I don't think so...I just need different facilities!

It's still got the pro level of support.
The Matrix is great but it's far from my actual workflow and needs.
Old 9th December 2019
  #56
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Digiplex View Post
I think if you did the upgrades to the power and automation yes. It’s gonna just be more modern and efficient that way. Plus you have that 4K sound which is pretty much classic. I’d go that route if I knew how to sell it. Heck I have trouble booking the room I have now.
So many bands are diy it’s just a hard thing to book.
I like the 9k too. I’ve seen those occasionally on Facebook.
I think I saw a 9040 last year for not a mint.
I love the 4k sound, the sound of the 9k is so clean it's great for surround mixing or post production but not for music mixing ( rock, pop, hip-hop )
Old 9th December 2019
  #57
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
Possibly, but no one will actually be using one for mixing in 20 years. People are barely using them now!

FWIW, if you absolutely have to buy a desk out of these 2, I’d go for the ssl. The VR was a bad design to start with, runs very hot, and some of the parts aren’t available anymore. If you want an AMS Neve, look at the 88R.

But honestly - I wouldn’t buy a mixing desk at this point. If you need a desk for tracking purposes (which I do like), I’d look at things like the Daking, and build it around a control surface. Track on the desk, mix itb and if you want sum through the desk, hardware as you see fit.

Best of both worlds. No clunky automation systems to deal with. Quick recall. Sonics as you want them.

I’d love to replace the VR at my studio with a Daking or RND console split around an S3 or something.
I still using a multitrack recorder and I mix on a trident.
The workflow that I want to put in place:
1\-Tracking through a Neve BMC 10
2\-Record on a computer
3\-Mix with an ssl 4k.
Old 9th December 2019
  #58
Quote:
Originally Posted by Youcef View Post
The Matrix is great but it's far from my actual workflow and needs.
Sure - it was more a defence of the product than a suggestion for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Youcef View Post
I still using a multitrack recorder and I mix on a trident.
The workflow that I want to put in place:
1\-Tracking through a Neve BMC 10
2\-Record on a computer
3\-Mix with an ssl 4k.
well - you do you! What's the problem with the trident though?
Old 9th December 2019
  #59
Gear Maniac
 
Liquidaudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Youcef View Post
I love the 4k sound, the sound of the 9k is so clean it's great for surround mixing or post production but not for music mixing ( rock, pop, hip-hop )
I`ve heard some rock projects through a 9k, sounded great to me. I never worked on one but people keep saying it's more of a pop console. Awesome desk though, wish I had the cash. Stay away from the Axiom.

4k kicks!

I wasn't bashing the Matrix either, it's great. I know it's a digitally controlled analog mixer and not a controller.

The Neotek Elite comes to mind, very SSL'ish sound.
Old 9th December 2019
  #60
Gear Nut
 
Digiplex's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Youcef View Post
I found a 4000g on vintage king.
I visited AES's website and I think i will buy two buckets of 8 faders.
When you get it invite me over to check it out! Lol
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