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I'm running an A/B/Y/etc. test for pro cable RE: Belden, Canare, Mogami, Zaolla, etc. Dynamics Plugins
Old 29th August 2018
  #61
Here for the gear
 

Vovox is dope

Hi there

I just want to quickly share my recent experience about my new Vovox Sonorus direct S cables for my main speakers.
I didn't have bad cables (Neutrik) and always thought, there is no need to spend that much more on this part of the chain...

But yesterday I made the A/B and its day and night! Huge difference! It's like an upgrade from a cheap Interface to the pro ones!
The Sound is wider, deeper, much clearer. I immediately had to adjust my mix...

So... this cabling is not nerd stuff. It's really important and makes a big difference.

Think about it.
Tschüss
Old 29th August 2018
  #62
Lives for gear
What was your method for the test?

I'm of the view that if you can't switch instantly between differing cables then it's diffficult/impossible to make a judgement but I can't say I've ever tried to compare different speaker cables in any kind of test.
Old 29th August 2018
  #63
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Active or passive speakers?
Old 30th August 2018
  #64
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uruxon View Post
Hi there

I just want to quickly share my recent experience about my new Vovox Sonorus direct S cables for my main speakers.
I didn't have bad cables (Neutrik) and always thought, there is no need to spend that much more on this part of the chain...

But yesterday I made the A/B and its day and night! Huge difference! It's like an upgrade from a cheap Interface to the pro ones!
The Sound is wider, deeper, much clearer. I immediately had to adjust my mix...

So... this cabling is not nerd stuff. It's really important and makes a big difference.

Think about it.
Tschüss
Sorry. I don't believe any of this. When you are talking about speaker cables, the only variable is gauge. Doesn't matter who makes them, if the copper is oxygen-free or any of that other nonsense, speaker cables are speaker cables.

12 gauge speaker wire from Walmart sounds the same as thousand euro boutique speaker wire.
Old 30th August 2018
  #65
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whippoorwill's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffw5555 View Post
Sorry. I don't believe any of this. When you are talking about speaker cables, the only variable is gauge. Doesn't matter who makes them, if the copper is oxygen-free or any of that other nonsense, speaker cables are speaker cables.

12 gauge speaker wire from Walmart sounds the same as thousand euro boutique speaker wire.
Not true, shielding is a factor as is a lot of other things.
What about silver or carbon instead of copper? Or an alloy? What about solid core vs stranded. What about making the ground a separate cable instead of part of the shielding? These all effect capacitance. Make your connectors good and your cables short because that affects the resistance.

It's complex to understand completely about capacitance, resistance and inductance once real-world components come into play; try and design anything and you realise that the supposed answer often precedes the right questions and that both are usually off the mark. On the mark is a long, demanding, often costly answer. Most things made are usually somewhere in the middle of the marks.

A transformer is just metal wrapped around metal. So is a cable but with some insulator materials. Are all transformers the same? Are all tubes the same? All amplifiers? These hyperobjects change by the second skidding away from each other and themselves.

Here are some well put together listening tests.
Sonodore Microphones
Old 30th August 2018
  #66
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by whippoorwill View Post
Not true, shielding is a factor as is a lot of other things.
What about silver or carbon instead of copper? Or an alloy? What about solid core vs stranded. What about making the ground a separate cable instead of part of the shielding? These all effect capacitance. Make your connectors good and your cables short because that affects the resistance.

It's complex to understand completely about capacitance, resistance and inductance once real-world components come into play; try and design anything and you realise that the supposed answer often precedes the right questions and that both are usually off the mark. On the mark is a long, demanding, often costly answer. Most things made are usually somewhere in the middle of the marks.

A transformer is just metal wrapped around metal. So is a cable but with some insulator materials. Are all transformers the same? Are all tubes the same? All amplifiers? These hyperobjects change by the second skidding away from each other and themselves.

Here are some well put together listening tests.
Sonodore Microphones
Total nonsense, doesn't seem like you understand the concept of impedance. Speaker lines are low impedance, and shielding, capacitance are irrelevant.

Now when you talk about high impedance circuits, yes, the factors you list can affect sound. But not speaker cables, which is what I am talking about.

The other thing that rarely gets talked about; "what is better?" You can have a cheap cable sound better than an expensive one, as the cheap one may attenuate some harsh frequencies.

Again, in a low impedance circuit, wire is wire. No sonic differences.
Old 30th August 2018
  #67
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffw5555 View Post
Total nonsense, doesn't seem like you understand the concept of impedance. Speaker lines are low impedance, and shielding, capacitance are irrelevant.

Now when you talk about high impedance circuits, yes, the factors you list can affect sound. But not speaker cables, which is what I am talking about.

The other thing that rarely gets talked about; "what is better?" You can have a cheap cable sound better than an expensive one, as the cheap one may attenuate some harsh frequencies.

Again, in a low impedance circuit, wire is wire. No sonic differences.
Amp to speaker would be high impedance though, right?
Old 30th August 2018
  #68
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by lespritdescalier View Post
Amp to speaker would be high impedance though, right?
No, it's low impedance.
Old 30th August 2018
  #69
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Earcatcher's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffw5555 View Post
Total nonsense, doesn't seem like you understand the concept of impedance. Speaker lines are low impedance, and shielding, capacitance are irrelevant.

Now when you talk about high impedance circuits, yes, the factors you list can affect sound. But not speaker cables, which is what I am talking about.

The other thing that rarely gets talked about; "what is better?" You can have a cheap cable sound better than an expensive one, as the cheap one may attenuate some harsh frequencies.

Again, in a low impedance circuit, wire is wire. No sonic differences.
The poster speaks about Vovox Sonorus direct S, which is a balanced cable, suggesting that we are speaking about active speakers. So this is line level high impedance signal, not amplified for passive speakers. Cables will make a difference.
Old 30th August 2018
  #70
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whippoorwill's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffw5555 View Post
Total nonsense, doesn't seem like you understand the concept of impedance. Speaker lines are low impedance, and shielding, capacitance are irrelevant.

Now when you talk about high impedance circuits, yes, the factors you list can affect sound. But not speaker cables, which is what I am talking about.

The other thing that rarely gets talked about; "what is better?" You can have a cheap cable sound better than an expensive one, as the cheap one may attenuate some harsh frequencies.

Again, in a low impedance circuit, wire is wire. No sonic differences.
You aren't correct, as Earcatcher has pointed out.

"Sounds better" is useful for microphone, line, etc. I choose cables for the application at hand for those things, but I use the most neutral cables I have (nothing uber expensive - for example, my headphone interconnects are Grimm TPR - $6 total for the 2 x 1 foot each cables plus <$20 for neutrik connectors, I do have some vovox on order and have heard vovox firsthand) for monitoring. I want my headphone/speaker interconnects to help me see what's going on.
Vovox > Wallmart in that respect.

Try some unshielded cabling as interconnects, the high end is obviously different, more open; it's obvious. You start hearing a lot more mouth sounds on some cables. Same with unbalanced often.

A lot of people, I'm sure, can't hear cable difference because their monitor cables and entire monitoring systems are the bottleneck.

You have to put the microphone in the right place first and then you can focus the sound in a selection of ways, arrays, preamps, gain stages, cables, AD, interconnects, clocking, etc. I run tests and then try and apply my tasting notes to my professional work by planning setups ahead of time.
Old 30th August 2018
  #71
Lives for gear
 

For active speakers, balanced line level cable, any low capacitance spec’ed cable from any one of the companies that actually make the cable will work fantastic and not cost much per foot. Use standard Neutrik or Switchcraft XLR or TRS connectors as needed by your specific gear. Now do a proper blind test which you probably have to take notes as said above, it takes a few seconds to switch between test candidates.

Lots of marketing in the cable threads here so apply an extra helping of “buyer beware”.
Old 1st September 2018
  #72
Gear Maniac
 

My bad, I stand corrected as I thought he was speaking about passive cables. However, as it was pointed out, line-level cables are not as sensitive to capacitance as high impedance applications like mics, and you should not hear any difference in cables that are a low cap construction as Bassmankr aptly stated.
Old 17th September 2018
  #73
Lives for gear
So, any news regarding the A/B/X comparison? Interest to see how TPR fares with the rest. Thanks!
Old 10th December 2018
  #74
Quote:
Originally Posted by raal View Post
So, any news regarding the A/B/X comparison? Interest to see how TPR fares with the rest. Thanks!
Ditto.
Old 11th December 2018
  #75
2 cents

Just my 2 cents:

I'm mostly using Mogami as my patchbays came with plenty of it.
Now, I'm moving to a Ghielmetti patchbay system and they have that blue (Belden?) cable attached.
I find this cable to sound pretty close to Mogami, with maybe a tiny bit more energy, it that means anything.

I've also made a few TPR instrument, microphone and line cables, and I must say that they sound truly different.
We tested them against VoVox guitar cables, as well.
At first, I was under the impression that they were low-mids shy but then realized how practical this actually is (as this frequency range must be kept under control anyway). They sound detailed without sounding harsh or hyped in the highs.
But most of all, I like their 3D-ness and their punch/definition in the mids.

So, here I am ordering more and contemplating using the TPR8 multipair cable for some crucial patchbay connections (converters, mic tie-lines).

TPR for instrument cable is shockingly good for anything that needs punch. Last week, we compared it against your regular instrument jack cable on a client's MusicMan active bass and he said that he had never gotten such a great sound.
On electric guitars, we all liked it more than the VoVox for anything disto and/or rhythm (solid mids, punch).
For fingerpicking, the VoVox reacted with more dynamics (what the guitarist said), and the TPR had more punch.

Alright, so that's already pretty long-winded... ;-)
Old 11th December 2018
  #76
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Sigma's Avatar
Coat hangers work great
Old 12th December 2018
  #77
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bowzin's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigma View Post
Coat hangers work great
Dat gauge...

Old 13th December 2018
  #78
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigma View Post
Coat hangers work great
AES had an article a couple decades ago testing various speaker cables. They didn't use coat hangers but they did test lamp cords and even 10 gauge car battery cables.

Yes, the car battery cables tested and sounded awful. The winner was a multi stranded computer cable, similar in construction to Ray Kimber's renowned 8TC speaker cables, I still use those here.
Old 13th December 2018
  #79
Lives for gear
No, with speakers we can plug the cable directly.

In modulation, without connector en or, there aren't sound.
Astound
Old 14th December 2018
  #80
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Sigma's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Williams View Post
AES had an article a couple decades ago testing various speaker cables. They didn't use coat hangers but they did test lamp cords and even 10 gauge car battery cables.

Yes, the car battery cables tested and sounded awful. The winner was a multi stranded computer cable, similar in construction to Ray Kimber's renowned 8TC speaker cables, I still use those here.
I go on some sites and they are shilling 600 + dollar pair of speaker cables ..a sucker is born every minute..cool that they did that test
Old 14th December 2018
  #81
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Williams View Post
AES had an article a couple decades ago testing various speaker cables. They didn't use coat hangers but they did test lamp cords and even 10 gauge car battery cables.

Yes, the car battery cables tested and sounded awful.
Damn, I'm about to try this for a color option, haha.
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