The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
Why does a Prism ADA-8XR boast 105db D.R. and..
Old 20th November 2017
  #61
Lives for gear
 

I mix through an ADA8-xr and when switching between the desk and the Prism I hear no audible difference. That is what I look for in a convertor a very accurate
transportation of audio.
Old 21st November 2017
  #62
Quote:
Originally Posted by IanBSC View Post
It kind of makes me laugh, but a little depressing also, that people are shelling out huge sums of money for super high end DACs, when it's all recorded with Avid and Apogee ADCs, or sometimes 10 year old Prisms.
...and then in many cases sticking them in substandard rooms (on wooden pebbles or whatever).

The pricing is partly what’s expected though. At least one speaker manufacturer who makes both pro and audiophile speakers has told me that the audiophile stuff is exactly the same, just priced higher because that’s what the market expects.

I’m not saying that’s the case for high end DACs, I’ve not measured them. But it fits the pattern. And whether the end listener could tell the difference when the price tag is removed is anyone’s guess - I would hope that your average hi-fi buff listening in a lounge isn’t as tuned in as a working engineer in a purpose-designed room!
Old 2nd December 2017
  #63
Gear Nut
 
shamelesssounds's Avatar
 

take two converters with similar specs (there are many nowadays) and compare them:
you will hear significant differences, most likely.
exactly like mic preamps...
Old 3rd December 2017
  #64
Quote:
Originally Posted by shamelesssounds View Post
take two converters with similar specs (there are many nowadays) and compare them:
you will hear significant differences, most likely.
exactly like mic preamps...
“Significant” is what I’d call an exaggeration, but at least you didn’t say “night and day”..
Old 3rd December 2017
  #65
Gear Nut
 
shamelesssounds's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
“Significant” is what I’d call an exaggeration, but at least you didn’t say “night and day”..
it is subjective what ""significant"" would mean for every human being.
anyway...

take the Zen Tour (AD 124db) e.g. and compare it to something like AKD8DP (124db) in merging horus/hapi. This way we may have an inter-subjective notion of what i mean by "significant".


the samples i've heard from the ada-8xr: i would say, it is an absolutely fantastic converter. very hard to beat. no matter what the specs (try to) say.
Old 3rd December 2017
  #66
Quote:
Originally Posted by IanBSC View Post
It kind of makes me laugh, but a little depressing also, that people are shelling out huge sums of money for super high end DACs, when it's all recorded with Avid and Apogee ADCs, or sometimes 10 year old Prisms.
I've been in some very high end listening rooms filled with the best high end playback gear. Some of it is spectacular.

I recall saying once, "that's the best reproduction of a 25 cent TL072 opamp I've ever heard".
Old 13th August 2019
  #67
Lives for gear
 
lawrence_o's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by IanBSC View Post
ADA and Dream sound better than the Orpheus/Titan/Lyra. I think it's mostly to do with the quality of the components and analog stage.

However, even the "new" Prism converters are a decade old now. Compared to Merging, the new Cranesong, new Mytek, QES, all of Prisms stuff is long in the tooth, from a technical point of view. And these generally have better dynamic range, detail and clarity (can't speak for the Cranesong, is it isn't released). The Prisms have staying power because they really got the tone right, and the ADA8XR and Dream AD-2 are hard to beat in terms of the quality of the circuit. Same with Lavry.

I think it is a myth that converters stopped progressing a decade ago. A lot of the newer stuff sounds much better, and has better tech, better clocking, better chips in some cases, better analog stage, better power supplies, etc. I think the 2000s were a slow decade for converter development, and people just got really used to the gear they have. And the tech improvements have been obscured by the move towards prosumer quality interfaces. In the next few years, I think it is going to be apparent how much improvement is possible. It would be great if companies like Prism would get back in the game with modern, and truly high end converters.

Name me 1 converter that matches the crystal clear sound of the "old" ADA8-XR.
None. Not a Lavry, not a Benchmark, not a ....
Old 4 weeks ago
  #68
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by lawrence_o View Post
Name me 1 converter that matches the crystal clear sound of the "old" ADA8-XR.
None. Not a Lavry, not a Benchmark, not a ....
Sure, how about two?
DAD AX32
Sonosax SX-R4+ although a recorder but still

And at an arguably slightly lower level:
Lynx Hilo
Lynx Aurora(n)

Not to mention Stage Tec TrueMatch consoles.

So to summarize: AX32, Hilo, Aurora(n).

Oops that was three, sorry my bad.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #69
Lives for gear
 
shelterr's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dfghdhr View Post
Sure, how about two?
DAD AX32
Sonosax SX-R4+ although a recorder but still

And at an arguably slightly lower level:
Lynx Hilo
Lynx Aurora(n)

Not to mention Stage Tec TrueMatch consoles.

So to summarize: AX32, Hilo, Aurora(n).

Oops that was three, sorry my bad.
I demoed and tested the DAD AX32 for 10 days next to my Prism and the Prism was better. And neither Lynx offering is as good either.

I had someone run some files through a StageTech years ago and it did have a very nice sound. Not as linear as the Prism, but I liked it.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #70
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by shelterr View Post
I demoed and tested the DAD AX32 for 10 days next to my Prism and the Prism was better. And neither Lynx offering is as good either.
Tell me what’s wrong with this picture:

Person A (lawrence_o) challenges (IanBSC) to prove him wrong, (about something that’s completely subjective mind you).

Person B (me) tries to make a point by using his own subjective opinion to “prove person A wrong”.

Person C (you) (shelterr) has his own subjective opinion and experience, therefore he disagrees with person B.

The reality is, although the specs of a converter can be measured, they aren’t *necessarily* indicative of its superiority. And just because person A finds the sound of ADA-8XR “crystal clear” (whatever that means) doesn’t mean he is right, or wrong for that matter.

The point I was trying to make by replying to his post was to show that, it’s preposterous to challenge other people’s opinions and experience about something so subjective and think you’ve dropped the mic and found the right answer for everyone and feel so righteous about it too. :D

Because at the end of the day, we’re talking about something that cannot be proven right or wrong.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #71
Lives for gear
 
shelterr's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dfghdhr View Post
Tell me what’s wrong with this picture:

Person A (lawrence_o) challenges (IanBSC) to prove him wrong, (about something that’s completely subjective mind you).

Person B (me) tries to make a point by using his own subjective opinion to “prove person A wrong”.

Person C (you) (shelterr) has his own subjective opinion and experience, therefore he disagrees with person B.

The reality is, although the specs of a converter can be measured, they aren’t *necessarily* indicative of its superiority. And just because person A finds the sound of ADA-8XR “crystal clear” (whatever that means) doesn’t mean he is right, or wrong for that matter.

The point I was trying to make by replying to his post was to show that, it’s preposterous to challenge other people’s opinions and experience about something so subjective and think you’ve dropped the mic and found the right answer for everyone and feel so righteous about it too. :D

Because at the end of the day, we’re talking about something that cannot be proven right or wrong.
I definitely understand what you are getting at. This forum is full of this and it can seem very pointless reading random people’s opinions on sound, which is in and of itself subjective.

In this case, I not only paid shipping both ways and took the time to demo the AX32 extensively, but was also very interested in switching to it in the hopes I could have an all in one Pro Tools compatible modular system that I could expand more cost effectively than the Prism. And no one was more dismayed than meto find that it would have been foolish to switch away from the Prism. I just couldn’t figure out a way to justify it. There was a vague and veiled quality to the AX32 I couldn’t escape and I ended my demo period with a new found respect for the objective quality of the Prism, which I had clearly been trying to replace.

I also ran many tests that affirm my feelings and if anyone would like them, I will gladly send them over. So I’m not sure what these A and B folks are basing their opinion on, but I feel like I’m on pretty solid ground with my findings here.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #72
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by shelterr View Post
I definitely understand what you are getting at. This forum is full of this and it can seem very pointless reading random people’s opinions on sound, which is in and of itself subjective.

In this case, I not only paid shipping both ways and took the time to demo the AX32 extensively, but was also very interested in switching to it in the hopes I could have an all in one Pro Tools compatible modular system that I could expand more cost effectively than the Prism. And no one was more dismayed than meto find that it would have been foolish to switch away from the Prism. I just couldn’t figure out a way to justify it. There was a vague and veiled quality to the AX32 I couldn’t escape and I ended my demo period with a new found respect for the objective quality of the Prism, which I had clearly been trying to replace.

I also ran many tests that affirm my feelings and if anyone would like them, I will gladly send them over. So I’m not sure what these A and B folks are basing their opinion on, but I feel like I’m on pretty solid ground with my findings here.
And I respect your opinion, because at the end of the day, the only one that matters is the person listening to a particular piece of gear.

Also it would be so cool if you could share your test results here. I understand if you’re not comfortable sharing them publicly though.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #73
Lives for gear
 
Emanuel23's Avatar
 

If only Prism would update the ADA-8XR to be compatible with Dante, MADI, and the likes. Prism released that interface with bravado regarding its modular approach to assure futureproofness .. fastforward to 2020 and none of that futureproofness was delivered.

Also, more channels from a single Prism box at the pro level of the ADA-8XR should have been possible by now; a solution not unlike the DAD AX32 platform from Prism would be nice.

Have Prism abandoned further development of the ADA-8XR line alltogether?

At least their Titan and Atlas have Dante modules now. MADI options would be even better imo.

I am currently looking at an RME M32 PRO + MADI PCIe combo for my setup. I don't feel like investing lots of money into a conglomerate of dated AES-EBU interfaces, D-subs, and switchboxes, sacrificing at least 2 PCIe slots in my computer, to get 40+ channels of Prism ADDA, with an open upgrade path to more channels.

But ADA-8XR converters do sound great.

Last edited by Emanuel23; 4 weeks ago at 02:26 PM.. Reason: Typos, and some slight changes
Old 4 weeks ago
  #74
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by BarcelonaMusic View Post
your average interface, lets say 1/10th- 1/15th the cost, will say 120db all day long? Misleading? Prism overpriced?
i wouldn't pay much attention to specs ... in today's market they are mostly meaningless but more importantly they have little to do with the qualitative experience of listening.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #75
Lives for gear
 
shelterr's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emanuel23 View Post
If only Prism would update the ADA-8XR to be compatible with Dante, MADI, and the likes. Prism released that interface with a lot of bravado and so called futureproofness .. fastforward to 2020 and none of that futureproofness in terms of connectivity was delivered.

Also more channels from a single box at the pro level of ADA-8XR should have been possible by now; a solution not unlike the DAD AX32 platform from Prism would be nice.

Have Prism abandoned further development of the ADA-8XR line alltogether?

At least their Titan and Atlas have Dante modules now. MADI optiuons would be even better imo.

I am looking at an RME M32 PRO and a MADI card at the moment. I don't feel like investing lots of money into a conglomerate of AES-EBU interfaces, D-subs, and switchboxes, sacrificing at least 2 PCI-e cards in my computer, to get 40+ channels of Prism, with an open upgrade path to more channels in mind.

But ADA-8XR converters do sound great.
I definitely am surprised at the lack of some future-proof upgrades as well. I run my Pro Tools system via Digilink so everything is very seamless.

I’ve never really understood Prism from a business sense. Lots of missed opportunities to use technology they already have. I’ve been saying it for YEARS but I can’t understand why they never made a monitor controller with the features of an Avocet but with the DA convertor in the ADA-8XR. It’s a wonderful monitoring DA and I assume they would be able make a stellar monitor controller that would sell well. I have the Avocet IIa and everyone raves about the DA in it...but the Prism DA is better. The Titan line of DA is very good and very real world sounding but I can understand why people would prefer the higher detail of the Cranesong DAC. But the DA in the ADA-8XR is just better all around.

I also haven’t been able understand why they don’t make a Lynx Hilo like product using the ADA-8XR conversion for mastering. I think it would be a big hit to have a mastering AD/DA plus an extra monitor DA with updated connectivity options. I’m aware the Lyra2 has these features, but the conversion just isn’t the same. It’s great in its own right but I think the ADA-8XR conversion is a more professional option that people would prefer.

If anyone knows the fine people over at Prism, feel free to let them know! 🤣🤣🤣
Old 4 weeks ago
  #76
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by shelterr View Post
... I also haven’t been able understand why they don’t make a Lynx Hilo like product using the ADA-8XR conversion for mastering. ...
Why not use the HiLo ... is it that much different ("inferior") than the Prism, or Crane Song for that matter?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #77
Lives for gear
 
shelterr's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by aremos View Post
Why not use the HiLo ... is it that much different ("inferior") than the Prism, or Crane Song for that matter?
Well I personally run a full production studio and have two Prism ADA-8XR's, so for me there would be no point. However even if I was in the market for just a mastering AD/DA I wouldn't pick the Hilo. There is a processed sound in the high end that I have blind picked many times and I don't care for it. I'm aware people use it, and I'm aware that people like it. That is fine for them, but it adds things I don't want and subtracts things I do want maintained from source material run through it. The Prism changes the source material much less, and generally the very slight change in a net positive. You would think this was true about most convertors, but if you've ever tested them you would be surprised to realize that more convertors than not degrade and fundamentally alter the sound of the music run through them. Loss of low end, gutting of the center power, adding artifacts in the high end, flattening of front to back depth...any number of things.

Conversion is going to do SOMETHING to the source. You just have to comfortable with what it does and you will be fine. But just blindly asserting something is good because you own it or that conversion isn't a big deal is amateur hour. Do the research, make a decision, do the work, make sure it's working in your favor.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #78
Lives for gear
 
Emanuel23's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by shelterr View Post
If anyone knows the fine people over at Prism, feel free to let them know! 🤣🤣🤣
Call me crazy but I have written to them on this subject before. No response whatsoever. I hope they are secretly working on that new hi-end, modular, MADI- / Dante- / AVB- / USB-friendly conversion platform .. time will tell.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #79
Lives for gear
 
Plush's Avatar
Prism is a brand new company now. The converter company and the SADiE editor company were purchased by Audio Squadron in summer 2019.

Audio Squadron is an innovative company and I do hope that they continue new development.

Recently there have been new developments with Prism as well as with SADiE V.6 software.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #80
Lives for gear
 
Emanuel23's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Plush View Post
Prism is a brand new company now. The converter company and the SADiE editor company were purchased by Audio Squadron in summer 2019.

Audio Squadron is an innovative company and I do hope that they continue new development.

Recently there have been new developments with Prism as well as with SADiE V.6 software.
What about the techicians and engineers though, the R&D department?
Is the team still intact, do you happen to know that?

Last edited by Emanuel23; 4 weeks ago at 03:38 PM..
Old 3 weeks ago
  #81
Gear Head
 
Erik Guevara's Avatar
 

I recently hear the big mastering converter shootout from Tan Tan and the Prism ADA8XR is one of my favorites, big sounding low end. What AD chip use it? The Cirrus Logic CS5381 or other chip?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #82
Lives for gear
 
Plush's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Emanuel23 View Post
What about the techicians and engineers though, the R&D department?
Is the team still intact, do you happen to know that?
Sorry I do not know anything about personnel. I know that the sales team is partly old and partly new. Lab crew I don't know about.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #83
Lives for gear
 
MIKEHARRIS's Avatar
Prism currently is running a sale on ADA8 s both complete and components.
i do believe we should see a updated platform
Old 3 weeks ago
  #84
Lives for gear
 
Emanuel23's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by MIKEHARRIS View Post
Prism currently is running a sale on ADA8 s both complete and components.
i do believe we should see a updated platform
Interesting!

One of the biggest studio's in the Netherlands recently sold a lot of their ADA-8XR's, perhaps something is up indeed. Although it might just be a shift of focus on their behalf, or a change of gear for who knows what reason.

Last edited by Emanuel23; 3 weeks ago at 11:29 PM..
📝 Reply

Similar Threads

Thread / Thread Starter Replies / Views Last Post
replies: 81 views: 8922
Avatar for NathanEldred
NathanEldred 11th September 2008
replies: 1248 views: 109168
Avatar for Seras
Seras 7th November 2017
replies: 211 views: 78783
Avatar for Atlas Stands
Atlas Stands 13th March 2017
replies: 4066 views: 669776
Avatar for ben.juodvalkis
ben.juodvalkis 3 weeks ago
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
🖨️ Show Printable Version
✉️ Email this Page
🔍 Search thread
🎙️ View mentioned gear
Forum Jump
Forum Jump