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Hardware Lexicon 224 emulator ? Reverb/Delay Processors (HW)
Old 7th May 2016
  #1
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wallyburger's Avatar
 

Hardware Lexicon 224 emulator ?

Hi all, it is with much regret that I've just sold my Lexicon 224, and I need something to replace it. I know about the UAD plug-in, but I want a hardware unit, I'm a bit of a traditionalist and I don't like to use the computer too much.
I'm thinking along the lines of the PCM series, but which one ? A PCM90/1 sprang to mind, I need something more modern and reliable.

WB.
Old 7th May 2016
  #2
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the fxs's Avatar
 

maybe buy a 224?
(sorry, couldn't resist)
Old 7th May 2016
  #3
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wallyburger's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by the fxs View Post
maybe buy a 224?
(sorry, couldn't resist)


The reason I don't want anymore older gear is reliability, I have a lot of older hardware and it's becoming a pain keeping it all going. I'm clearing out and replacing with more modern stuff.
Old 7th May 2016
  #4
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nednerd's Avatar
 

Sorry to hear you sold your 224.

The most recent hardware that sounds vaguely like a 224 is the PCM80/81.
But they are vintage too and will be much harder to repair than the 224 due to more highly integrated circuitry.
Other than that I don't think you will find a modern hardware replacement for the 224 that comes close to its sonic characteristics.

Your best bet is probably to go the software route.
But since you are accustomed to using the real thing, be prepared to be disappointed sooner or later.

I have been running well maintained 224/224x and other vintage reverbs for years now without any problems.
These units can be repaired well.
But since the hardware is of much higher build quality than that of more recent units, once properly brought up to scratch,
there won't be much need for repair.
Old 7th May 2016
  #5
Quote:
Originally Posted by wallyburger View Post
Hi all, it is with much regret that I've just sold my Lexicon 224, and I need something to replace it. I know about the UAD plug-in, but I want a hardware unit, I'm a bit of a traditionalist and I don't like to use the computer too much.
I'm thinking along the lines of the PCM series, but which one ? A PCM90/1 sprang to mind, I need something more modern and reliable.

WB.
You could also check out the Bricasti Design Model 7
Some of the guys at Briscasti are ex Lexicon.

Getting a 300, 90, 80, might put you in the same boat when it comes to repairs.
.. but if you need repairs for some of the older stuff, I'd recommend
Dane at Beamish Electronics in Cleveland. gl
Old 7th May 2016
  #6
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To be honest, the closest 224 Algos (and Remember their were only two with 8 variations in original NVRAM board) is to grab a 200/M or better, a great working PCM-60 which has the plate and Room sounds, the inverse is crap, then chain that thru a PCM 80 for SNR and bit length crushing of a PCM-80 (early 4 lid screw unit fully 18 bit at version 1.10x) and send it thru the Send/Return of the PCM-60. Cheap and serviceable and will last you with out nightmare repair cost fears etc! A PCM-41 or PrimeTime would jazz things up as well, though with a 60 + 80 in loop you'll get that sound as the 80's Algos are from the 224/X!

Cheers
TLB
Old 8th May 2016
  #7
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MickeyMassacre's Avatar
Playing devil's advocate....


You could buy a used apollo 16 and use the UA mixer with your computer to set up 4 stereo pairs of the Lexicon 224 on your 4 favorite settings and then unplug the apollo from the firewire bus and use it in stand alone mode forever on.
Old 8th May 2016
  #8
Quote:
Originally Posted by MickeyMassacre View Post
Playing devil's advocate....


You could buy a used apollo 16 and use the UA mixer with your computer to set up 4 stereo pairs of the Lexicon 224 on your 4 favorite settings and then unplug the apollo from the firewire bus and use it in stand alone mode forever on.
So funny you're also selling one Good point though.

I did a similar thing as I like new gear. Got UAD just for the verbs and also 2 Bricasti's and a cheap PCM60 for vintage fun.
Old 8th May 2016
  #9
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Thanks folks, I need to check out the Bricasti, it's an unknown quantity to me. Also, any opinions about the PCM92 ? My 224 was completely restored, but one of the boards is a really early one, and has bugs, these were ironed out on later models. It's been repaired before, but it still keeps malfunctioning, I really don't want to carry on with it, but I'm going to miss it terribly.
Old 8th May 2016
  #10
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The Bricasti has a completely different character to the 224. But it sounds so good it is extremely addicting. It's really unbelievable how good it sounds.

That said, if you want to keep the 224 sounds, the uad is very respectable. A small laptop with an Apollo or a uad satellite is a very good idea to keep it as "outboard" and it really does sound good.

Pcm 60's are super cheap too and the room on them is a classic lex sound from the 224. I love my 60's, but they're noisy as hell and not true stereo. Once you get to the 90's you've basically lost all classic lex lineage. So my vote is still uad but you do owe it to yourself to try a Bricasti and see if the character is good for you. It's a stunning box.
Old 8th May 2016
  #11
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Brickman's Avatar
 

Worth a listen...

BAM | Oto Machines
Old 9th May 2016
  #12
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wallyburger's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brickman View Post
Worth a listen...

BAM | Oto Machines
This is amazing !!!!!!! Sorted, unbelievable ! Thank you !



WB.
Old 9th May 2016
  #13
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Brickman's Avatar
 

Old 9th May 2016
  #14
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Whoa!

Now let's hear it on real drums. Then we'll know more.

.
Old 9th May 2016
  #15
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noiseflaw's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brickman View Post
Worth a listen...

BAM | Oto Machines
Damn - That's nice. I went all Tangerine Dream for a moment on that Ambient setting.

Lovely little unit - sounds great!
Old 10th May 2016
  #16
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Wiggy Neve Slut's Avatar
 

Very nice!!!
Old 10th May 2016
  #17
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MickeyMassacre's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul_G View Post
So funny you're also selling one Good point though.

I did a similar thing as I like new gear. Got UAD just for the verbs and also 2 Bricasti's and a cheap PCM60 for vintage fun.
At least I didn't say to buy mine!
Old 11th May 2016
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nnajar View Post
The Bricasti has a completely different character to the 224. But it sounds so good it is extremely addicting. It's really unbelievable how good it sounds.

That said, if you want to keep the 224 sounds, the uad is very respectable. A small laptop with an Apollo or a uad satellite is a very good idea to keep it as "outboard" and it really does sound good.

Pcm 60's are super cheap too and the room on them is a classic lex sound from the 224. I love my 60's, but they're noisy as hell and not true stereo. Once you get to the 90's you've basically lost all classic lex lineage. So my vote is still uad but you do owe it to yourself to try a Bricasti and see if the character is good for you. It's a stunning box.
Nope, if you've got a Noisy PCM 60 it's the op amps or some other component, and I wouldn't call $400 in now compared to $50 bucks in 2012, just don't get one from evilbay, those get sold on, on, and on, all full of noisy crap! As for the Bricasti, I'd now wait for version 3 software as it could indeed change the whole line up – Also Quantec and the PCM 92/96 are much cleaner and clinical sounding units then these old 20 bits and 24 internal etc, maybe think Princeton SP2016 for that total colour change at under $1800, and as for Bricasti, I'd wait either for the new version or padded down version or.....version 3 as one us due very soon and the jump on it rate will be huge!

More so if you do acoustic recording with real Air....otherwise, the UAD will nit fill your needs after a 224 and anything else might feel compromised etc. Thus....save a PCM-80 & 60, by using the send/return balanced on the PCM 60 makes an 80 sound totally Authentic though with 20,000 more options! I'd wait Wally, as I doubt the PCM 92 will strike your Electronica, save a decent Bit Crusher and 12-15kHz limited bandwidth @ 12-16 Bit Delta Sigma!
Old 11th May 2016
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wallyburger View Post
Thanks folks, I need to check out the Bricasti, it's an unknown quantity to me. Also, any opinions about the PCM92 ? My 224 was completely restored, but one of the boards is a really early one, and has bugs, these were ironed out on later models. It's been repaired before, but it still keeps malfunctioning, I really don't want to carry on with it, but I'm going to miss it terribly.
Lol.....if the 224 is pure Molasses - Then the Quantec, Bricasti and Lex 92 have to be pure refined cane suger Juice! Sweet, though on Electronic stuff, almost too much, on Acoustic stuff....stunning!
Old 11th May 2016
  #20
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nednerd's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by wallyburger View Post
This is amazing !!!!!!! Sorted, unbelievable ! Thank you !



WB.
Please let us know if you think the BAM is a worthy 224 replacement once you've got it.
Thanks
Old 11th May 2016
  #21
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Crazy4Jazz's Avatar
 

I have a UAD 224 which I love on acoustic instruments. BAM Space Generator demo was nice but I'm wondering if it is more like the Eventide Space than a 224. Seems sort of like a different kind of reverb than those classic Lexicons. I had a PCM 91 that had all sorts of complex FX capabilities which seems like where the Space Generator is coming from.
Old 14th May 2016
  #22
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wallyburger's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy4Jazz View Post
I have a UAD 224 which I love on acoustic instruments. BAM Space Generator demo was nice but I'm wondering if it is more like the Eventide Space than a 224. Seems sort of like a different kind of reverb than those classic Lexicons. I had a PCM 91 that had all sorts of complex FX capabilities which seems like where the Space Generator is coming from.
Yeah, I won't be able to check out the OTO until mid June, that's when they arrive here. I hope it is capable of a Lexicon type vibe, I already have the Eventide side of things covered.
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