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Where are you sending you Main L-R Outs?
Old 10th April 2016
  #1
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Motoxxx's Avatar
 

Where are you sending you Main L-R Outs?

Allright...I have been messing around with this a bunch and trying different configurations on my desk/DAW/CR. My console has a Mix A and Mix B output section for monitoring each with their own level control. Both are fed from the main 2 Bus outs. I have been playing around with sending the main 2 bus outs from the XLRs on the back of the console back into the DAW, into a 2 channel AD converter, into my Dangerous Monitor ST, and just about every thing in my control room and taking notes of the differences in sound.

My question is to anyone that runs an analog desk, where are you sending your Main L-R outputs and how often do you change that up to something different?
Old 10th April 2016
  #2
Quote:
Originally Posted by Motoxxx View Post
Allright...I have been messing around with this a bunch and trying different configurations on my desk/DAW/CR. My console has a Mix A and Mix B output section for monitoring each with their own level control. Both are fed from the main 2 Bus outs. I have been playing around with sending the main 2 bus outs from the XLRs on the back of the console back into the DAW, into a 2 channel AD converter, into my Dangerous Monitor ST, and just about every thing in my control room and taking notes of the differences in sound.

My question is to anyone that runs an analog desk, where are you sending your Main L-R outputs and how often do you change that up to something different?
I send my main outs from the desk back into protools and then monitor out of that channel via my avocet. I found it gives me a clearer picture of the final mix.
Old 10th April 2016
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
I send my main outs from the desk back into protools and then monitor out of that channel via my avocet. I found it gives me a clearer picture of the final mix.
Thanks Trev! Do you ever change that up, as in possibly sending the L-R directly to a stand alone recorder, or an audio feed to something else?
Old 10th April 2016
  #4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Motoxxx View Post
Thanks Trev! Do you ever change that up, as in possibly sending the L-R directly to a stand alone recorder, or an audio feed to something else?
I used to send it to a masterlink but don't bother with that any more since I never cut cds nowadays.
Old 11th April 2016
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
I used to send it to a masterlink but don't bother with that any more since I never cut cds nowadays.
I actually seem to cut CDs and even DATs occasionally. That was again part of the reason I asked the question to begin with. Thinking I may just route the XLRs to the patchbay so I can easily put them where ever they need to go. Its funny because I sometimes think "This is the way I will leave them" (whichever way that happens to be) but then something comes up and I eventually end up having to reroute them. I was wondering if other owners and engineers do the same?
Old 11th April 2016
  #6
Quote:
Originally Posted by Motoxxx View Post
I actually seem to cut CDs and even DATs occasionally. That was again part of the reason I asked the question to begin with. Thinking I may just route the XLRs to the patchbay so I can easily put them where ever they need to go. Its funny because I sometimes think "This is the way I will leave them" (whichever way that happens to be) but then something comes up and I eventually end up having to reroute them. I was wondering if other owners and engineers do the same?
Ah. Yes. My outputs all go to the patchbay. I then patch them back into PT inputs. Thought that was what you meant!
Old 11th April 2016
  #7
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I used to go converter, console, monitor out, eq crossover, amp.. but I just got an Apogee Symphony. So I took the console out of the monitor path and go straight out from the Symphony and I use their maestro software to pick between which set of monitors the outs are going to. I believe the shortest path to the speakers as possible is best.
Old 11th April 2016
  #8
Less is more, more or less. I use a pair of 3 foot runs of Kimber AGSS pure silver/teflon cable from the console's output into a modified Burrbrown PCM/DSD4222 EVM.

That uses another run of AGSS with Canare 75 ohm RCA connectors as the S/PDIF out at 44.1k to the computer sound card digital input for CD prep.

I don't use global EQ or compression here. Limiting is done in mastering.
Old 11th April 2016
  #9
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JayTee4303's Avatar
Almost all I/O here runs thru patchbays. It addition to giving us unlimited patching and routing options, it saves wear and tear on I/O ports on expensive gear.

Some exceptions are units which use combo ports, especially those which select between preamps or line inputs depending on which port is used.

This requires labelling and disciplined documentation. We keep detailed wiring diagrams near each patchbay, we update them when patches change, and, since these diagrams tend to move around, becoming unavailable when really needed, we keep a full set of duplicates on file as well.

That's where the discipline comes in. It takes extra time to dig out the right dupe, update it, and change the version date. Having an all in one printer handy, helps a lot.

Main Outs tend to feed monitors in systems w DSP loopback capability.

Systems that don't have loopback, the Main Outs feed an input pair, while outputs 1 and 2 feed monitors.

PS...don't forget to close any insert loops you bring to a patchbay that aren't normalled or used. Chaos awaits!

:-)
Old 13th April 2016
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JayTee4303 View Post
Almost all I/O here runs thru patchbays. It addition to giving us unlimited patching and routing options, it saves wear and tear on I/O ports on expensive gear.

Some exceptions are units which use combo ports, especially those which select between preamps or line inputs depending on which port is used.

This requires labelling and disciplined documentation. We keep detailed wiring diagrams near each patchbay, we update them when patches change, and, since these diagrams tend to move around, becoming unavailable when really needed, we keep a full set of duplicates on file as well.

That's where the discipline comes in. It takes extra time to dig out the right dupe, update it, and change the version date. Having an all in one printer handy, helps a lot.

Main Outs tend to feed monitors in systems w DSP loopback capability.

Systems that don't have loopback, the Main Outs feed an input pair, while outputs 1 and 2 feed monitors.

PS...don't forget to close any insert loops you bring to a patchbay that aren't normalled or used. Chaos awaits!

:-)
Chaos indeed! I have been working on the patchbays and routing options for a bit now and keep coming back around to asking myself "where should the main outs live?". I kind of want them to feed straight into the DAW but not through my main interface which is an Antelope Orion 32. Putting them into the patchbay makes the most sense but I also want them to run through the least amount of cable/connectors/switching possible.

Kind of playing with the idea of sending them directly to a 2 channel recorder of some kind and then monitoring the output of that device via the Dangerous Monitor ST system as that bypasses the console/DAW completely for checking final mixes etc. Like to get more peoples thoughts on this. Thanks for everything so far!
Old 13th April 2016
  #11
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vernier's Avatar
My L-R go straight to ATR-102
Old 13th April 2016
  #12
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My desk´s L/R is normalled through the patchbay to two tapedecks, a Masterlink DAT and MD recorder. If I want to print to the computer then I can patch it in.
Old 13th April 2016
  #13
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Joao B.'s Avatar
 

Patchbay, normalled to a Studer A80.

if printing to pro tools i just patch it in.
Old 13th April 2016
  #14
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Beefyblue's Avatar
To the patchbay normalled to the Burl B2 which comes back into the DAW, sometimes with a Focusrite Red 3 patched in, sometimes not..
Old 14th April 2016
  #15
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Motoxxx's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by vernier View Post
My L-R go straight to ATR-102
Very cool! If I only had the space for an ATR!!!
Old 14th April 2016
  #16
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Motoxxx's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joao B. View Post
Patchbay, normalled to a Studer A80.

if printing to pro tools i just patch it in.
Very cool. Really wish I had the room for a big ol 2 track!
Old 14th April 2016
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jensenmann View Post
My desk´s L/R is normalled through the patchbay to two tapedecks, a Masterlink DAT and MD recorder. If I want to print to the computer then I can patch it in.
Are you running it split to all of these devices at the same time? Curious as to how you are doing that.
Old 14th April 2016
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motoxxx View Post
Are you running it split to all of these devices at the same time? Curious as to how you are doing that.
All recorderes are wired parallel, but each one has it´s own patchpoints, of course. There´s no splitting amp between the desk out and the 2tracks. That´s optional for my desk, but has not been installed.
Old 14th April 2016
  #19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Motoxxx View Post
Very cool. Really wish I had the room for a big ol 2 track!
I had one. It was sold off as I found out that major lable cassette tapes are no longer sold. I had also stopped cutting laquers. Mixing is sent to CD prep and that requires a great ADC.
Old 14th April 2016
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Williams View Post
I had one. It was sold off as I found out that major lable cassette tapes are no longer sold. I had also stopped cutting laquers. Mixing is sent to CD prep and that requires a great ADC.
Technology marches on. Funny how that happens even if what is new isn't necessarily better!
Old 14th April 2016
  #21
Quote:
Originally Posted by jensenmann View Post
My desk´s L/R is normalled through the patchbay to two tapedecks, a Masterlink DAT and MD recorder. If I want to print to the computer then I can patch it in.
+1 Same here. My Harrison has tons of outs from the 2 buss so I have various 2 track recorders connected as well as a 2 track back in to Pro Tools to print stems back in.
Old 15th April 2016
  #22
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Plush's Avatar
I plug straight in to the tape machine.
Old 15th April 2016
  #23
Quote:
Originally Posted by Motoxxx View Post
Technology marches on. Funny how that happens even if what is new isn't necessarily better!
I like the ADC sound better than my old 1/2". It's closer to the mix I hear before printing. The top end is pretty dirty with 30 IPS 1/2" tape. It's around 4% THD above 5k hz, a little too crunchy on cymbals for my tired ears.
Old 15th April 2016
  #24
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vernier's Avatar
CTR-102 (only requires one input)

Old 19th April 2016
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vernier View Post
SAWWWEEEEEEEET! So what do you do with the other output of your desk?
Old 19th April 2016
  #26
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burns46824's Avatar
Straight into a Lynx Hilo from my console outs. No buss EQ or compression. 3 foot cables, Mogami 2549. May be installing an A80 1/2" soon, though...
Old 22nd April 2016
  #27
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Originally Posted by burns46824 View Post
Straight into a Lynx Hilo from my console outs. No buss EQ or compression. 3 foot cables, Mogami 2549. May be installing an A80 1/2" soon, though...
That is pretty sweet right there!

Was thinking of getting a DSD recorder to send my L/R to. Anyone using something like that? I was sort of looking at the Tascam DA3000 but sort of read some mixed reviews.
Old 22nd April 2016
  #28
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re

Croockwood or Studer b62
Old 22nd April 2016
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motoxxx View Post
That is pretty sweet right there!

Was thinking of getting a DSD recorder to send my L/R to. Anyone using something like that? I was sort of looking at the Tascam DA3000 but sort of read some mixed reviews.
I asked Bruce Brown (a mastering engineer on this forum who mastered my most recent project) and he said he thought the Hilo sounded slightly better than a DA-3000 in DSD mode. He said that, although it sounded very good, Tascam had to cut some corners in order to be able to get it to that price point. He recommends the Merging Technologies converters for DSD...but those will run you $6k bare minimum.
Old 22nd April 2016
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by burns46824 View Post
I asked Bruce Brown (a mastering engineer on this forum who mastered my most recent project) and he said he thought the Hilo sounded slightly better than a DA-3000 in DSD mode. He said that, although it sounded very good, Tascam had to cut some corners in order to be able to get it to that price point. He recommends the Merging Technologies converters for DSD...but those will run you $6k bare minimum.
Thanks Burns! I think the Merging Tech is a bit more than what I need but I will still appreciate the recommendation. I think the Hilo is really intriguing. Love the Lynx stuff but the DA3000 may fit into my racks better.

I was wondering if anyone ever sends L/R out through a monitor controller? I was messing around with my Dangerous Monitor ST the other day and I thought "Wouldn't it be great if there was a buffered/balanced pass through for running L/R through the controller then straight to whatever 2 track you were using."
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